Florida bill would let teachers grade parents

[Margo out of lurking]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/01/26/florida.grading.parents/index.html?hpt=Sbin

 

Why then wouldn't there be a bill allowing parents to grade teachers?:glare:

[AngelBee]

Just your title made me say swear words. :001_huh:

[ThatCyndiGirl]

I would absolutely REFUSE to be judged OR graded by a person who creates a sentence like this:

 

"I think a lot of parents understand that is something that is critical," she said. "On the other hand, you have some parents that don't realize they are not providing the needs."

 

:001_huh:

[goldberry]

Parents already have the authority to "grade" teachers, by discussion with the principal.

 

If I'm not mistaken, I think it was Florida teachers that legislators were trying to get their salaries tied to the kids academic grades. But teachers don't start with a level playing field, meaning that some kids have parents supporting and MANY have parents not supporting. At least this way, the teacher would get to document some of the other factors involved.

 

The grading system is based on threecriteria that Stargel wrote in the legislation:

• A child should be at school on time, prepared to learn after a good night's sleep, and have eaten a meal.

• A child should have the homework done and prepared for examinations.

• There should be regular communication between the parent and teacher.

 

Those are pretty basic things a responsible parent shouldn't be worried about. But I do agree with this point:

 

"I think those parents that are not going to show up or not do anything," said Francis, who teaches students from primarily poor homes, "it's not going to faze them, whether you put 'unsatisfactory.' "

 

Unfortunately for the kids, true.

[BakersDozen]

I would love to see something that would shake up parents big time, force them to get more involved in not only their dc's education but just take care of their dc's basic needs (food, sleep, etc.). However giving parents a "grade" would accomplish what exactly?

[Laurie4b]

Oy. I guess this was well-intentioned, but really, I see no good coming of it and lots of negatives:

 

1.How much change does she think is realistic by "grading" parents?

2. A boatload of parenting authors tell parents *not* to take responsibility for their kids' homework. If the parents is suddenly responsible, it shifts the dynamic and the parent gets graded on something they must make their kid do, rather than the kid accepting responsibility for their own work.

3. Should K-3rd kids even *get* homework? That is one of my pet peeves. I'm a tutor to low-income kids. It is busy work if they already understand it and if they don't understand it, they need tutors to teach what the teacher was not able to. If they don't have tutors, many of their parents couldn't help them.

4. Suppose a parent was motivated by avoiding the shame of getting a low grade? Would you expect the incidence of parents doing kids' work for them to go up? A rise in the heat of parent-child conflicts? I would expect both and when shame is involved, the conflicts could get ugly.

5. I assume the parents' grade stays on the transcript. What does the teacher have to do to justify the grade? What if she gives you "needs improvement" because you allowed your child to skip a homework assignment on an afternoon when she wasn't feeling well, or your child told the teacher she went to bed late, or you have a kid who won't eat breakfast? What if the parent has been an advocate for their child--could a teacher retaliate for a "pushy" parent? Could a "needs improvement" or "unsatisfactory" be reportable to CPS? The first time? Twice in a row? Could a parent get a bad rep from a ridiculous teacher that followed them and their child throughout school?

 

I see almost no chance of a grading system for parents producing any positive change and I see many potential problems.

[CoastalGal]

Just your title made me say swear words. :001_huh:

 

:iagree:

 

I would absolutely REFUSE to be judged OR graded by a person who creates a sentence like this:

 

"I think a lot of parents understand that is something that is critical," she said. "On the other hand, you have some parents that don't realize they are not providing the needs."

 

:001_huh:

 

:iagree: :glare: - WOW

[Mommy22alyns]

Wow. I'm cursing inside too. :glare:

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

I can see teachers' concern over parents not doing their part in their kids' education. OTOH I have gotten the impression that many schools and teachers don't want involved parents. For example, I have heard of them not sending corrected work home or allowing textbooks to go home. I have also heard of many parents not finding out a child is having problems until the report card:001_huh:. I am not sure what the answer is but I would be concerned about them evaluating parents. I also think that parental or student factor needs to be taken into consideration when evaluating teachers. As to how to do this I am clueless.

[FO4UR]

This train is going backwards...:auto:

[teamturner]

I'd like to see the after school care become more of a tutoring session and a place for kids to do their homework rather than the free-for-all it seems to be now. Kids getting picked up from after school care @6-7 pm are too tired to do their homework and working parents may be too tired to help them. I think they are missing a big opportunity to use that time to help those kids with their schooling. They could certainly balance in some play and exercise time in there as well.

[FaithManor]

Here's my big question: Florida Legislators Don't Have Better Things TO DO WITH THEIR TIME?

 

They have one of the highest foreclosure rates in the US plus a whole host of other problems and THIS is what some representative is spending her time on????? Somebody needs a wedgie right quick!!!!

 

 

Faith

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

Here's my big question: Florida Legislators Don't Have Better Things TO DO WITH THEIR TIME?

 

They have one of the highest foreclosure rates in the US plus a whole host of other problems and THIS is what some representative is spending her time on????? Somebody needs a wedgie right quick!!!!

 

 

Faith

 

:iagree: Also, don't teachers have better things to do with their time? Let's put the shoe on the other foot for a minute. Can you imagine being a ps 2nd grade teacher and finding out that you now have to grade 30 sets of parents every grading period?

 

That would suck.

[Mama Geek]

I am not sure what the answer is

 

I know, home school:D

[Dawn in OH]

This seems a bit ridiculous to me. First of all, parents that are already active in their child's education don't need to be graded. The parents that are not active, aren't suddenly going to become active because they are being graded. If they cared, they would already be active. Getting a grade isn't going change those parents.

 

"A child should be at school on time, prepared to learn after a good night's sleep, and have eaten a meal."

 

I think we all agree that good parents already see to this to the best of their ability. I have one child that stays up late reading. I can send him to bed, turn off the lights, take away the books and toys, but I CANNOT make him sleep. I think most parents strive to get their children school on time too. But sometimes things just go wrong in the morning. Lost book bag, missing shoes, the alarm didn't go off. It happens. Maybe mom's tired because she was up all night with a fussing nursing baby and she overslept.

 

"A child should have the homework done and prepared for examinations."

 

 

I don't know what school is like today, but I can tell you from experience as a child that my parents often didn't know what homework I had, if any. Sure, they asked me, "Did you finish your homework?", but I wasn't always honest about the answer. Will the teachers email each parent daily with the list of homework assignments? How can you expect a parent to be accountable for that which they are not aware of? My parents also didn't know when I had tests unless I told them. Will the teachers advise parents of the testing schedule?

 

 

"There should be regular communication between the parent and teacher."

 

 

Indeed there should be. Good parents contact their children's teachers when there is a concern. Will the teachers do the same? Do you get a weekly progress report? Do the teachers want thirty parents calling them daily for a status report? I doubt it.

 

 

 

Yes, parents should be involved in their children's education, but I don't think legislation or grades for parents is reasonable or going to help. There are parents out there that don't want to be involved. There are parents that don't know how to be involved because their parents weren't involved. There are parents out there that didn't actually want to be parents, but ended up with a child anyway. They feed them, clothe them and send them to school, but don't do anything extra. Legislation is not going to make those parents step up to the plate and change their ways.

[meggie]

"Stargel acknowledges that not everyone agrees with her legislation, which she said is still under revision. The bill was not intended to tell parents how to raise their kids, she says.

 

 

 

'We want to make sure parents are involved in the education of their children,' Stargel said."

 

 

Wouldn't that be telling them they HAVE to be involved in their kids' education?

[Gratia271]

I would absolutely REFUSE to be judged OR graded by a person who creates a sentence like this:

 

"I think a lot of parents understand that is something that is critical," she said. "On the other hand, you have some parents that don't realize they are not providing the needs."

 

:001_huh:

:iagree:

[Donna]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/01/26/florida.grading.parents/index.html?hpt=Sbin

 

Why then wouldn't there be a bill allowing parents to grade teachers?:glare:

 

That was my exact thought when I first heard about this bill on talk radio the other day. :lol:

[stephanier.1765]

Unfortunately for people like me who have a contrary nature, that as soon as you tell me I have to do something is when I won't. I'm a "buck the system" kind of person and I'd probably do whatever I could to throw a wrench in the works. I'm not saying that it's a good thing, just acknowledging my nature. It's a good thing I homeschool. I just feel bad for those like me who would have to deal with it.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Hmmmm .... who works for whom?!?!

[Sparkle]

I can't imagine what good grading a parent is going to do. What are the consequences for getting a "bad" grade? Will the parents even care? I don't think I would.

 

Plus, what do the teachers do when you have parents who are divorced and possibly have different ideas about what it means to be involved in their child's school? Yikes. How is the teacher going to figure out who is responsible for what?

[goldberry]

What I'm thinking though is that this is coming out of the move to tie grade performance to teacher salary. If your pay was going to be based on the student's performance, but you knew the performance was seriously affected by factors outside your control (such as parent involvement) than wouldn't you fight to have some way to document that?

 

One ineffective process just leads to more ineffective processes to combat the original.

[ScoutTN]

Whatever the fundamental problems are, extending the reach or authority of government (or government schools in this case) is not the answer!

 

We have voted on the public school system, by not subjecting our family to it!

[sheryl]

Yikes! I'm not for this. IF we lived in an unbiased world and teachers were there to "support" homeschoolers, and provide UNbiased constructive criticism, then maybe....but, such is not the case with all of their biases. Still, I would not like having to "prove" myself to any other educator, no matter how unbiased they may be.

 

There are many retired educators on my side of the family, from superintendent to principal to teacher and all are pro-homeschooling.

 

I hope this does not pass and that it just goes away w/o any other state getting the same idea.

 

Sheryl <><

[Barry Goldwater]

Many of the PS teachers I had as a kid were bad parents...I knew their kids...what then? Can they grade themselves? Is it an infinite loop? :lol:

 

The whole thing is utterly ridiculous and insulting to our intelligence. The electorate should recall every one of these so-called legislators and prosecute them for dereliction of duty.

 

Fire them...fire them all...

[wapiti]

I'd like to see the after school care become more of a tutoring session and a place for kids to do their homework rather than the free-for-all it seems to be now. Kids getting picked up from after school care @6-7 pm are too tired to do their homework and working parents may be too tired to help them. I think they are missing a big opportunity to use that time to help those kids with their schooling.

 

:iagree:I vaguely recall that this approach is being taken by the KIPP charter schools, with some success (most or all of the KIPP schools serve low-income, minority populations, etc.).

[babysparkler]

I would absolutely REFUSE to be judged OR graded by a person who creates a sentence like this:

 

"I think a lot of parents understand that is something that is critical," she said. "On the other hand, you have some parents that don't realize they are not providing the needs."

 

:001_huh:

 

Wow... :iagree:

[SonshineLearner]

I TOTALLY think we should be able to grade teachers :) (Well, at least if they can grade us) I also think we should start "voting" them in and out. Well, if there was a way for us to do that. All public school teachers are "our employees" and there should be some way to have them remember that. Sometimes it's like they think that they are self-employed with the way they treat parents...

[WTMCassandra]

Besides all of the valid points others have brought up, public school systems can't have it both ways. They have pushed successfully for the concept that parents' rights end at the school threshold, that parents should leave things for the professionals, that parents should stay away and out of school business. The only "involvement" they wanted was PTA fundraisers. Now they want parents involved and want to grade it? Nuh-uh. They created the nanny state--it's their problem.

 

That having said, I teach at a for-pay co-op, where I WELCOME and encourage parent involvement and input. But sadly, there is a STRONG correlation between children who are not doing well and failure of repeated attempts to get parents involved. The parents I most want to see or talk to, well, those are exactly the parents I can't seem to contact/meet. The parents of children I have no concerns? They are Right. There. Even though I don't really "need" to talk to them, it's enjoyable, but it's very frustrating not to be able to communicate real concerns to other parents.

 

But I am talking about a totally different environment, one where I make clear that a parent is welcome in my classroom anytime, and one where I hope the parent is involved throughout the week.

[Parrothead]

We should be able to grade legislators as well. :glare:

You already can. Voting for means they are making As. Voting against means they have failed at their job.

 

As for the teachers grading parents, well, I haven't polite words.

[celticmom]

If I were not already homeschooling, something like this would definitely inspire me to start.

 

Maybe that is the idea. If enough parents pull their children that is less the state has to spend on educating them.

[theYoungerMrsWarde]

" Perry insists that a good education is based on what a child learns in the classroom and not what a parent might know that could help their child." :blink::scared::cursing::banghead::thumbdown:

[Tammyla]

Classroom teachers need to focus on teaching the kids entrusted to them, and they should be accountable for teaching them.

[Renee in NC]

Oy. I guess this was well-intentioned, but really, I see no good coming of it and lots of negatives:

 

1.How much change does she think is realistic by "grading" parents?

2. A boatload of parenting authors tell parents *not* to take responsibility for their kids' homework. If the parents is suddenly responsible, it shifts the dynamic and the parent gets graded on something they must make their kid do, rather than the kid accepting responsibility for their own work.

3. Should K-3rd kids even *get* homework? That is one of my pet peeves. I'm a tutor to low-income kids. It is busy work if they already understand it and if they don't understand it, they need tutors to teach what the teacher was not able to. If they don't have tutors, many of their parents couldn't help them.

4. Suppose a parent was motivated by avoiding the shame of getting a low grade? Would you expect the incidence of parents doing kids' work for them to go up? A rise in the heat of parent-child conflicts? I would expect both and when shame is involved, the conflicts could get ugly.

5. I assume the parents' grade stays on the transcript. What does the teacher have to do to justify the grade? What if she gives you "needs improvement" because you allowed your child to skip a homework assignment on an afternoon when she wasn't feeling well, or your child told the teacher she went to bed late, or you have a kid who won't eat breakfast? What if the parent has been an advocate for their child--could a teacher retaliate for a "pushy" parent? Could a "needs improvement" or "unsatisfactory" be reportable to CPS? The first time? Twice in a row? Could a parent get a bad rep from a ridiculous teacher that followed them and their child throughout school?

 

I see almost no chance of a grading system for parents producing any positive change and I see many potential problems.

 

:iagree:

[QueenCat]

I'd like to see the after school care become more of a tutoring session and a place for kids to do their homework rather than the free-for-all it seems to be now. Kids getting picked up from after school care @6-7 pm are too tired to do their homework and working parents may be too tired to help them. I think they are missing a big opportunity to use that time to help those kids with their schooling. They could certainly balance in some play and exercise time in there as well.

 

The after school program where my kids went (pre-homeschooling) had tutoring/homework help if the parents signed them up for it. No extra cost. The parents could choose to allow the kids to go to the play area or to the tutoring/homework area. All kids had snack and a short outside time first though. The kids had to go to the area where the parents signed them up for. If they finished their hw, they were sent to the play area.

[QueenCat]

Not all parents have their childrens best interest at heart. We're a unique group here on WTM, where our children are our focus. I can't tell you how many parents I've met while volunteering, subbing and teaching who are not involved. Teachers at the kids elementary school kept good documentation on parent interaction, which helped if a parent came back later and tried to blame them for not keeping them informed. Same school was very good about keeping parents informed but you can't make them show up for conferences, answer the phone/email/note, etc. I can understand why some teachers get frustrated. Their blamed for a child not learning when the child shows up hungry, tired and/or sick. Sorry, but that is not the teacher's fault.

[Cricket]

"This is the real world. You don't always get a superior rating if you're not doing a superior job. That's life," she said. "We grade our children based on their performance. Why should the parents be any different?"

Uh, maybe because teachers aren't in a position of authority over parents. Teachers are welcomed to their opinion about a parent and are free to discuss it with that parent. Anything beyond that is ridiculous.

"We have student accountability, we have teacher accountability, and we have administration accountability," Stargel said. "This was the missing link, which was, look at the parent and making sure the parents are held accountable." ..... Stargel acknowledges that not everyone agrees with her legislation, which she said is still under revision. The bill was not intended to tell parents how to raise their kids, she says.

Famous last words. Once teachers begin to think they have a right to grade parents, consequences will soon follow for low grades. Otherwise, what is the point?

 

Quit requiring unnecessary work for teachers and just let them teach.

[QueenCat]

Report cards on parents, no. Keeping documentation on parental contact or lack of contact, and issues the child brings to school, yes. Teachers need to be able to back up their efforts of parental involvement, and things that get in the way of teaching.