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I'm asking, so feel free to give it!

 

My twin boy are 13. They have had a best buddy since they were five. He's a good boy - we spend time with him, have taken him on vacation. His parents have done the same with my boys. The boy has had a lot of conflict with his mom recently and I know she feels really hurt and confused by it. He is their only child.

 

The mother is also a friend of mine. She's a very sensitive person. She has a lot going on in her personal life and her health life, so I want to be very gentle about this, but I have sort of reached the end of my patience.

 

Three time in the last two months, my boys have made plans with the son only to have him dump them when a better plan came along. One time of those times, it might have been an honest miscommunication (though I don't really think so). The other times, it's been pretty clear. Yesterday the Mom invited my boys down to spend the night. I said we could do an "almost" sleepover, meaning, I pick the kids up really late. The boys texted about this In the afternoon, the boy called our house to see when my kids could come down. They went down and played a couple of hours, and the Mom and I actually walked our dogs together.

 

As I was leaving, I heard the Mom say something about ordering pizza and the son say, "I'm going to Bryson's house." Bryson was another kid who was there with the kids playing.

 

Next thing I know, she calls and says there was a miscommunication and the boys are coming up because her son is going to Bryson's. Which is fine. I can feed my kids dinner and spend the evening with them, but of course they were confused and upset.

 

I just don't know what to do. I feel like after three times, I need to talk to my friend. I don't want to be aggressive or angry. I also don't want to be all "Mama bear" about it. If this weren't close neighborhood friends, I would let my boys work this out themselves, and maybe I still should. But this boy is really part of our lives and so is his Mama and Dad. These adults are closer to my sons than any adult outside of our families. They have been very very good to my boys - both parents. Genuinely loving and always positive - like the aunt your wish your kids have. I'm not sure she clearly sees what is happening. I could just make a boundary and not mention it to the Mom, but it doesn't seem like the way close friends should operate.

 

I know it's easy to say, "A kid who acts like that isn't a friend" and "A Mom who allows it isn't a friend" but we have a lot of years invested in this friendship, and I tend to err on the side of overlooking the faults of friends if I really care about them. I try to shrug off these things because no one is perfect and it feels better to give the benefit of the doubt. But I do think that after 3 times, there needs to be some discussion about this.

 

What do you think? What would you say? Would you set some kind of policy about future plans? Talk to the parents? Talk to your kids? Just back out and see what happens?

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Guest CarolineUK

I think I would probably try to cool the relationship a bit, if your boys were OK with that. I understand that she's having problems with DS, and of course the teenage years are difficult, but I wouldn't let my children be continually walked over because she can't set boundaries with her child. I would talk to her about it if the issue came up, but I feel it might be a difficult conversation, I don't know because I don't know her and I don't know exactly what your friendship with her is like. I might try to be open-minded and non-judgmental, but quite honestly I think she needs to teach her son some values and principles, I would certainly never let any of my children treat anyone the way her son treated your boys, least of all a good friend of long-standing.

 

:grouphug: I'm sorry you're having to deal with this, you must feel very sad and let down.

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I would probably talk to her (keeping the inner mama bear in check.) Ask if there is something more going on that maybe you and dh could help with. It sounds like she is struggling with her son.

 

My guess is she doesn't like how your kids are being treated by her son either.

 

would be to ask her if the boys are getting along okay when they are down at her house, and then sort of use that to introduce my reason for asking.

 

Our boys are really busy - all three are in different sports, and we travel a lot. So it's not like they spend every afternoon playing. They can do for a couple of weeks without seeing each other. But they have vacationed together for years, and have just been long term friends. I really love this boy. I don't love the way he is acting, but I don't always love the way my own kids act either.

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:grouphug: I'm sorry you're having to deal with this, you must feel very sad and let down.

 

I do. I'm surprised the Mom has let him do this. I really think kids need mentoring even in their teens on how to treat people. But mostly, I just feel scared that if I do nothing, the relationship will suffer and if I do something, the relationship will suffer. I am okay with him sort of outgrowing my kids and choosing to spend time with other. My children have other friends, and they have each other. It seems normal and acceptable to me that he might have a period where he wants to hang with school friends. I just want him not to jerk my children around this way.

 

And I also think that kids go through this stuff in junior high, and later, sometimes those old friendships are comfortable and close again, so while I am okay with the relationship cooling, I don't want it to rupture, you know?

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Guest CarolineUK
And I also think that kids go through this stuff in junior high, and later, sometimes those old friendships are comfortable and close again, so while I am okay with the relationship cooling, I don't want it to rupture, you know?

 

I'm sure right that he'll come back to his old friends, childhood friendships hold a very special bond. I hope he and his mother also come to their senses and realise that you shouldn't treat people this way. That you care so much not to break off the friendship, despite being treated poorly, makes you a very special person, also you saying that in friendships you overlook some things and focus on the positive; I can't believe that your friends don't realise what a lovely person you are too, and I imagine that they'll be as keen as you are not to end the friendship.

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Bottom line, that is a parenting issue, pure and simple. She needs to teach her son to treat friends with respect. You just do not ditch guests you invited over because something "better" came along. If that is not inherent to the child, then it becomes the parent's responsibility to teach that.

 

I would not let my children be treated like that repeatedly, when it is is VERY obvious (since you heard it yourself) the friend is NOT being a friend.

 

If you do not think the mother can handle a conversation, or change her son's attitude, then I would pull my children back from the relationship. I wouldn't allow them to go over (try to offer something "better" to do if they get an invite).

 

Two things I would consider:

1. You would want to be teaching your children that how they were treated was NOT okay. So they would understand when you say no, next time there was an invite.

 

2. I don't think that children have to be friends because parents are. If you value your relationship with the parents, you can always still have "adult dates" where it is just you and the parents getting together. You can still even do "family dates' where the whole families get together.

 

But I would not be putting my children in a situation knowing there is a 50% chance they would get kicked to the curb if something "better" comes along.

 

If the Mom asks why your children can never come over anymore, that is a perfect chance to have a friendly conversation about her child's choices and how it affects your children.

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I agree there needs to be some discussion about this, but I don't think it has to be between you and the mom. With the conflict already present in their relationship, I doubt your friend's son will welcome his mom getting involved in his friendship issues. However, when the same message comes from his friends themselves, it may have more impact. Have your boys said anything to him about how he's treating them? When my ds was having trouble with a friend doing similar things a couple of years ago, ds simply told him that he would be happy to hang out together, but that if the friend was going to dump him like that again, he shouldn't bother asking ds to be there. Ds's friend immediately apologized, and it hasn't happened again.

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Another thought - encourage your boys to handle it and if they are open to it coach them on what to say. I can imagine encouraging my boy to be honest with his friend, saying something like "Dude, when you invite me over and then bail to hang with Joe, it really...(fill in the blank) stinks, bites, it's not cool...

I'm always big on empowering my kids to solve their own issues.

 

If you aren't comfortable with that and given the situation you describe, I would consider just having a loving but frank conversation with the boy, because if he's like a nephew to you, you should have permission to speak into his life, and also because he's a 13 yo boy. Um...they can be rather clueless. LOL

Edited by JustGin
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I would probably talk to her (keeping the inner mama bear in check.) Ask if there is something more going on that maybe you and dh could help with. It sounds like she is struggling with her son.

 

My guess is she doesn't like how your kids are being treated by her son either.

 

:iagree:

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I really agree with the people who said you should talk to your boys about what's going on. How are they feeling? How can they advocate for themselves with their friend? Questions like that.

 

If you have a really good friendship with the mom, then you could bring it up with her. But I wouldn't be accusatory. After all, they're 13, not 3 - they have their own friendship and she's not the one making this happen. If her son is being a jerk to your kids, there's a good chance that she's really embarrassed and doesn't know what to do about it either. In my opinion, it would be really wrong of her to force her son to hang out with your sons and she's probably trying to figure out how to navigate her new rocky relationship with him, let him grow and make his own decisions about friendships and yet still make him honor his commitments and be a decent kid. That's all tough. Be sympathetic... if you can. Because that's hard to do when your kids are being mistreated!

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I would let your children try to work it out with this boy. It's been my experience (I have a 20 yo son, a 17 yo dd, and a 10 yo son) that kids can work something out in ten minutes that adults will make a mess of. Let them try first. The next time this boy (and make sure it is the boy doing the asking, not the mother) invites them to do something, have your sons say, "Fine, we'd like to come, but if you ditch us again, we're not doing anything with you for a long time." Then if the boy says something to his mother about this, you can step in. Otherwise, I would not interfere at your sons' age.

 

If the invitations are constantly being offered by the mother and not the boys, I would pull back on the friendship. It truly may be that the son isn't interested and the mother is trying to force the friendship on him. Sometimes a little time and space is the best thing. My youngest has just now renewed a friendship with a boy in the neighborhood after they quit playing with each other for about nine months. No problems in the friendship...they just needed a break from each other.

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If the invitations are constantly being offered by the mother and not the boys, I would pull back on the friendship. It truly may be that the son isn't interested and the mother is trying to force the friendship on him. Sometimes a little time and space is the best thing. My youngest has just now renewed a friendship with a boy in the neighborhood after they quit playing with each other for about nine months. No problems in the friendship...they just needed a break from each other.

 

 

The boy is definitely more likely to call my boys than they are to call him, just because my boys are busy with sports, and also because they have each other. They do call him some, but he probably make more attempts to create plans than they do.

 

The reason the Mom calls about sleep overs is that I think she's trying to make sure that it's okay with me for them to ask, because I am not the biggest sleepover fan. So I think she calls me to say, "Is this okay" before she tells her son it's okay to invite. But I do feel confident that he's the one trying to make it happen - it's just that later when something "better" comes along that he backs out.

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Bottom line, that is a parenting issue, pure and simple. She needs to teach her son to treat friends with respect. You just do not ditch guests you invited over because something "better" came along. If that is not inherent to the child, then it becomes the parent's responsibility to teach that.

 

I would not let my children be treated like that repeatedly, when it is is VERY obvious (since you heard it yourself) the friend is NOT being a friend.

 

If you do not think the mother can handle a conversation, or change her son's attitude, then I would pull my children back from the relationship. I wouldn't allow them to go over (try to offer something "better" to do if they get an invite).

 

Two things I would consider:

1. You would want to be teaching your children that how they were treated was NOT okay. So they would understand when you say no, next time there was an invite.

 

2. I don't think that children have to be friends because parents are. If you value your relationship with the parents, you can always still have "adult dates" where it is just you and the parents getting together. You can still even do "family dates' where the whole families get together.

 

But I would not be putting my children in a situation knowing there is a 50% chance they would get kicked to the curb if something "better" comes along.

 

If the Mom asks why your children can never come over anymore, that is a perfect chance to have a friendly conversation about her child's choices and how it affects your children.

 

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I think you need to ask yourself which is more important -- your sons' feelings, or your relationship with this other family.

 

My feeling is that you should speak with the other mom and let her know that it is not acceptable for her son to make plans with your son and then ditch them as soon as he gets a better offer -- and he most certainly may not ditch them in the middle of a visit to go to another friend's house. The other mom needs to set rules about that sort of thing for her son, and if she doesn't do that, I think it's time to cool off that friendship in a big way. I know these kids are 13 years old, but poor behavior is poor behavior, and that boy is going to grow up into a selfish jerk if he isn't taught how to treat others -- particularly lifelong friends.

 

It's unfortunate that the other mom has personal and health issues, but that does not excuse her from being a decent parent, nor does it excuse her for allowing her son to treat your boys like dirt. She is condoning his behavior by not putting a stop to it, and in all honesty, how much could she really care about your boys if she permits them to be treated so poorly?

 

It sounds to me like you're uncomfortable about confronting the mom because you don't want to damage your friendship with her, but if it were me, I wouldn't want to be friends with a mom who allowed her kid to be so rude and inconsiderate to my ds. Maybe you don't like confrontation, but you're a mom, so sometimes you're stuck with it. You can be polite about it, and approach it as something you need to work on together, but I think the issue has to be addressed.

 

Cat

 

PS. Why haven't your boys said anything to this kid? My ds11 would have said something the first time it happened, and if it happened again, he would have told the kid he wasn't going to hang out with him anymore if he kept ditching him. (My ds is pretty assertive, but I would think your kids would be comfortable enough with a longtime friend to have no problem telling him what they think about the inconsiderate behavior.)

Edited by Catwoman
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I agree there needs to be some discussion about this, but I don't think it has to be between you and the mom. With the conflict already present in their relationship, I doubt your friend's son will welcome his mom getting involved in his friendship issues. However, when the same message comes from his friends themselves, it may have more impact. Have your boys said anything to him about how he's treating them? When my ds was having trouble with a friend doing similar things a couple of years ago, ds simply told him that he would be happy to hang out together, but that if the friend was going to dump him like that again, he shouldn't bother asking ds to be there. Ds's friend immediately apologized, and it hasn't happened again.

 

 

:iagree: I would start with this. If the problem persists, then you can decide whether or not to discuss it with the mom. But I would definitely let the boys try to sort it out between themselves first.

 

Anne

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I know a lot of people are of the "let them work it out" school, and there is some wisdom there. But I do think sometimes adults have to teach kids how to be better people and better friends. Sometimes 13 year old boys don't do a great job of teaching each other how to be good adults - although sometimes they do. Either way, I figured that if I talk to her, she can still decide whether she wants to talk to him or let them work it out.

 

So anyway, the discussion was fine. I was tactful. She was excessively apologetic. I know she's upset about it now - she's very anxious anyway and worries that people are mad at her, so now this is probably going to be something we have to sort of get past, but at least I got it out.

 

Thanks for your advice, ladies. It helped just to articulate the problem and get feedback.

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I would let your children try to work it out with this boy. It's been my experience (I have a 20 yo son, a 17 yo dd, and a 10 yo son) that kids can work something out in ten minutes that adults will make a mess of. Let them try first. The next time this boy (and make sure it is the boy doing the asking, not the mother) invites them to do something, have your sons say, "Fine, we'd like to come, but if you ditch us again, we're not doing anything with you for a long time." Then if the boy says something to his mother about this, you can step in. Otherwise, I would not interfere at your sons' age.

 

:iagree: and if the mother said anything about it, I'd just lay out the facts. Her son is ditching your kids on a regular basis and they are tired of being treated so rudely.

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So anyway, the discussion was fine. I was tactful. She was excessively apologetic. I know she's upset about it now - she's very anxious anyway and worries that people are mad at her, so now this is probably going to be something we have to sort of get past, but at least I got it out.

 

Thanks for your advice, ladies. It helped just to articulate the problem and get feedback.

 

I think you did the right thing. And she should be upset about it. She allowed her son to behave very poorly -- and we're not talking about a one-time thing.

 

I'm sure everything will work out between the two of you, and you probably feel better after talking about the problem. Now, the ball is in her court and she will either take action or she won't. I get the feeling that she'll say something to her ds, though, as it sounds like she was embarrassed about his actions.

 

I think you should tell your sons, in no uncertain terms, that it is not ok to accept poor treatment from others, and that they are too good to play second banana every time this other kid gets what he perceives to be a better offer.

 

I'm glad you talked with the mom, and that she didn't get defensive.

 

Cat

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