Maths & Physics enrichment

[Lucy in Australia]

For those of you with children that are interested in these subjects and good at them, what do you do to extend them? I'm specifically looking for texts or online stuff. TIA! :)

[regentrude]

For math, we are using The Art of Problem Solving

http://www.artofproblemsolving.com/index.php

 

and are extremely happy with it.

 

For Physics:

I like the College Physics textbook by Knight, Jones and Fields which my DD is using (algebra and trigonometry based),

and Conceptual Physics by Hewitt for DS.

[Lucy in Australia]

Thanks! I'll be checking them out :)

[Julie in MN]

Well, we don't do a ton of extra texts, as ds much prefers videos and people-groups :)

 

But a few things I like for math include word problem books such as even Singapore Primary 6 Challenging Word Problems or Critical Thinking Press's Algebra Word Problems.

 

Online, you can find some math puzzles that my ds's math team coach uses, such as here:

http://amc.maa.org/e-exams/e4-amc08/amc8.shtml

 

They also do ACT prep book math problems for a challenge.

[Michelle in AL]

My dd chooses and takes classes each yr that are in a field she might be interested in. In the past she's taken CADD mechanical and CADD architecture. This yr she's taking Aviation Science. All the classes are from Potters School. She wants to go into aviation engineering at this point. She's had a wonderful experience with all the classes.

[MyThreeSons]

I really like to use Paul Hewitt's NTQs (Next Time Questions). They are thought provoking, often counter-intuitive puzzlers. You can find them here:

 

http://www.arborsci.com/Labs/CP_NTQ.aspx

 

Print them out, but only give your student the question sheets at first. Allow him to wrestle with the problem for at least a full day before having him review the answer.

 

HTH

[Teachin'Mine]

Well, we don't do a ton of extra texts, as ds much prefers videos and people-groups :)

 

But a few things I like for math include word problem books such as even Singapore Primary 6 Challenging Word Problems or Critical Thinking Press's Algebra Word Problems.

 

Online, you can find some math puzzles that my ds's math team coach uses, such as here:

http://amc.maa.org/e-exams/e4-amc08/amc8.shtml

 

They also do ACT prep book math problems for a challenge.

 

Julie I followed your link - very interesting! I've never heard of these math contest and I see that registration ends soon. Is this test open to homeschoolers? On the site, they list colleges which offer the exam, but not high schools. I read through the FAQ, but homeschooling wasn't mentioned. They do say it needs to be proctored by someone other than a relative and given in a public building. This is doable, but the cost is for 10 tests, so doing it solo is much more expensive than going to a school.

 

How hard are the AMC 10 and 12s???

 

Thank you for any info!!! :)

[Julie in MN]

Julie I followed your link - very interesting! I've never heard of these math contest and I see that registration ends soon. Is this test open to homeschoolers? On the site' date=' they list colleges which offer the exam, but not high schools. I read through the FAQ, but homeschooling wasn't mentioned. They do say it needs to be proctored by someone other than a relative and given in a public building. This is doable, but the cost is for 10 tests, so doing it solo is much more expensive than going to a school.

 

How hard are the AMC 10 and 12s???

 

Thank you for any info!!! :)[/quote']

 

You know, I'd have to ask the coach. I know the Math Counts competitions recently were severely restricting homeschoolers. Here's a discussion: http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222028

I can only give info on our experiences last year, since the high school team he's on now hasn't been in a formal competition yet this year.

 

Math Counts was a more interactive competition, with teams all in a room. The folks who administered it were volunteers from companies and colleges.

 

I think the AMC was the one that my son's coach gave at the library. He's just a tutor, and it was for homeschoolers. It was just a paper test. That was the kind of test my oldest, public schooled, took for entry into a special math program.

 

When I want to know something, I just ask ask ask. Homeschool co-op teachers, public school teachers, websites, etc.

 

Julie

[Belacqua]

I'll throw in with everybody who has recommended the AMC exams. The Art of Problem Solving website has every AMC question from about the beginning of time, along with excruciatingly detailed analysis and argument.

 

As Julie said, the AMCs are timed, multiple choice exams. Homeschoolers can take them, though they have to be proctored by a teacher or librarian or somebody like that (we have a teacher friend who proctors for our son). You asked how difficult they are, and I'd say that they're hard enough that a student might feel discouraged until he or she learns what the average score was. And, like any exam, the difficulty varies from one year to the next; last year's AMC12, for example, was roundly described as a "bloodbath."

 

Scoring well on the AMC10 or AMC12 will qualify a student for the AIME, which in turn leads to the USAMO or USAJMO. Those last exams are two days of difficult, proof-based problems. Homeschoolers can sit any of these, though finding a proctor can be challenging.

[Laura in CA]

We've had good luck taking the AMCs (8, 10, and 12) at nearby public schools. This year my son will take the AMC 12A at a middle school (!) (yes, they have *very* bright kids ...) in the next town over, and the AMC 10B at our local high school. You just have to find out who the math teachers are, and ask if they're offering the tests and if a homeschooler can come. One of the two high schools in town is not offering any AMCs this year owing to budget cuts, but the other one is -- but on only one day, so to take both the 10 and the 12 I had to find another test site (you can't take both the 10 and the 12 on the same day). It's worth it to me to do all this legwork, because, as a PP says, good scores lead to AIME, USAMO, etc.

 

Homeschoolers can offer these AMC tests, and I did last year, but got few takers (OK, no one except my son :tongue_smilie:), and it was a fair amount of work to arrange a room at the library, a neutral proctor, mail the tests in, etc. AND my son did quite a bit better taking it at a school, in a room with 30 or so very serious kids. I think it helped him focus better. Which was the opposite of what I'd expected. Anyway, that made it worth it to me to scrounge around and find local schools where he can take them this year!

 

Oh, and as a PP said, you can find all the old AMC questions at AoPS, to get a sense of the difficulty level. They're good questions using creative, multistep problem-solving techniques -- well worth the investment of time. As Richard Rusczyk said in his talk on math education that Kathy in Richmond linked to (at last year's Math Prize for Girls), kids who do well in high-level math contests will ace the AP Calculus exam; the reverse is not necessarily true.

 

~Laura

[Julie in MN]

You asked how difficult they are, and I'd say that they're hard enough that a student might feel discouraged until he or she learns what the average score was. And, like any exam, the difficulty varies from one year to the next; last year's AMC12, for example, was roundly described as a "bloodbath."

 

My son's coach says that you learn something different in these types of situations that you will never learn in math class: You learn how to evaluate a problem and decide if it is too hard :)

 

Good to know about last year. My ds did well compared to his team, but not as well as he had hoped :tongue_smilie:

 

Julie

[Belacqua]

My son's coach says that you learn something different in these types of situations that you will never learn in math class: You learn how to evaluate a problem and decide if it is too hard :)

 

Good to know about last year. My ds did well compared to his team, but not as well as he had hoped :tongue_smilie:

 

Julie

 

Apparently, it was pretty dreadful. Kids calculated their scores and were despairing, until they found out how remarkably low the AIME qualifying mark was compared to other years. The USA(J)MO index was also kind of weird, but that may be partly because it was the first year for the JMO and they were still working out the kinks.

[Kathy in Richmond]

And, like any exam, the difficulty varies from one year to the next; last year's AMC12, for example, was roundly described as a "bloodbath."

 

 

My daughter would heartily agree about last year!:tongue_smilie:

[Kathy in Richmond]

We've greatly enjoyed participating in AMC contests over the past decade as homeschoolers. I'd heartily recommend them for kids who want to see some creative, non-traditional problem-solving methods.

 

As others mentioned above, AoPS has a listing of most past AMC exams online here for practice. Their traditional problem-solving books (two volumes) are terrific for kids who are planning on taking these tests.

 

We talked about homeschoolers' experiences with AMC exams last fall in this thread. The official AMC position on homeschoolers is spelled out here.

 

Yes, exams must be purchased in bundles of ten.

 

If anyone is in the Richmond area, feel free to contact me. I've ordered the 10A, 12A, and 12B for my math club this year. We don't have ten kids, so we have extra.:)

[MBM]

Besides everything else mentioned, you might want to look at Awesome Math Year-round (AMY) as well. If your child is interested in math competitions, they would be a good choice.

 

http://awesomemath.org/year-round-program/

 

A few others:

 

http://www.eimacs.com/

http://epgy.stanford.edu/courses/math/

 

HTH. :)

[Teachin'Mine]

Julie and all who followed, thank you so much for all the great info! :)

[memphispeg]

Off topic here - this seems to be the best place to start this discussion. Is there a way to teach/learn calculus AND physics at the same time? Meaning, since calculus was "invented" for physics, are there some textbooks or curricula that incorporate both topics into one "subject"?

I am investigating this idea for next year. My dd is doing Foerster pre-calc. on her own. I am merely a facilitator for that course. She would like to be able to continue being "independent" next year with math/physics. I would like some "critical thinking" (buzz word of the week!!!!) to go on as she does these subjects. She would like to take the AP calc. exam in order to get possible placement in college. I am not absolutely sure that she will do this. If I came up with a non-teach-to-the-test curriculum for both subjects, she would probably have to take them again in college. She wants to do marine science so, physics and math are called for. It would be nice to have these subjects "fun" this time through.

I am hoping that I am not just dreaming here. Also, do the college physics texts that claim to be calc.-based use calculus right away or could we use that sort of book while learning calc.? Old threads seem to indicate that having calc. under your belt before tackling these texts is advisable.

[MyThreeSons]

When I was in college (Mechanical Engineering major), I took Calculus I concurrently with the first semester of Physics. They meshed rather nicely. I think that high school level calc-based Physics texts assume the two are being done concurrently.