S/O Catholic/Orthodox/Protestant - Families?

[asta]

The indulgences, the Inquisition, the falling off the true path. And Mary - Lord help us, Mary. They worship her, you know, and her more than Jesus, who isn't really acknowledged as our Savior (insert pause and shake of the head with wry, sorry smile). And Catholics don't read the Bible - they're not really allowed to without a priest to "interpret" for them. And you can't pray to God without a priest. You can't do anything without a priest. So they're not really Christians. And they actually believe the bread and wine become the actual body and blood of Christ. How terrible! Our Lord NEVER intended us to become cannibals! It's just symbolism, people!

 

Why does it happen? To justify the Reformation, the "rightness" of the denomination. Because some people have to have a boogeyman.

 

 

The Scott Hahn conversion story linked above does a great job of dispelling most of the common myths (never read it before).

 

When DS and I went on a "Luther Pilgrimage", we were stunned by the depth of anti-Catholic dogma being spewed. I call it a pilgrimage because it was a bus tour to Luther's old monastery & original church (when he was Catholic), the "95 theses church", the museum of all of his stuff, etc. Even though he had (obviously) been a Catholic priest, that aspect of his life has essentially been ERASED from the Wittemburg history. His life is presented as if he was a tabula rasa monk (I mean, what kind of monk would he have been? Buddhist?) who suddenly rose up in opposition against the Catholic Church.

 

Don't even get me started on the glaring absence of Mary art from everything - even the Catholic church in that city. It's like they had a Mary purge. And Wittemburg was originally RC, so it was there...

[simka2]

Well, I know that. Where does it come from? I can tell you that, as a life-long Catholic who traveled and moved the world over, I've never ever ever heard a Catholic priest bash any Protestant denomination. Yet, it seems, according to Littlebug, to have happened the other way 'round in at least one Baptist church.

 

Hence my question. Why would a minister/priest of any Christian denomination from the pulpit where he/she should be teaching and preaching Christ's Word be bashing another denomination. What is the motivation for that?

 

 

I think (and could very well be wrong) that it has a lot to do with how the services/mass is structured. It is my limited understanding that there is a specific order to a RC "service," I think that structure helps prevent the other denom bashing.

 

Some protestant churches have less structure and more one man's teaching. I don't know if that made any sense, but to paraphrase...I think the RC's structure may actually not afford very much oppurtunity for "bashing" other belife's.

[angela in ohio]

Well, I know that. Where does it come from? I can tell you that, as a life-long Catholic who traveled and moved the world over, I've never ever ever heard a Catholic priest bash any Protestant denomination. Yet, it seems, according to Littlebug, to have happened the other way 'round in at least one Baptist church.

 

Hence my question. Why would a minister/priest of any Christian denomination from the pulpit where he/she should be teaching and preaching Christ's Word be bashing another denomination. What is the motivation for that?

 

No, I really do think that is where it comes from. I think we underestimate the amount of... I don't know the right word, bias, I guess... we inherit. Some of use are only a generation or two from Irish immigration, for example. We see it now as a simple matter of theological disagreement, when in fact it was about life and death at times. I have talked to Chinese students here who have very strong feelings about the Japanese still today, which I think is similar.

 

Now, as far as preaching or teaching fallacies about Catholicism... that bugs me. I used to correct many wrong-headed notions in my little Sunday School students. Many of their parents had been raised Catholic or were from Catholic families, but not catechized well. They didn't know what or why they believed, so they picked up misconceptions and passed them on to their children.

 

But if we are talking about just refuting actual teachings of the Catholic or any other church during sermons... Why did the Founding Fathers talk about problems in English government? Why do homeschoolers talk about what is wrong with the public schools (not a great example, but as far as most people think, public school has been around forever and homeschooling is "new")? If your movement or cause is a reaction to something else, you talk about that something else. The Protestant faith is a reaction to the Catholic Church.

 

I think it is a failing in a religious upbringing not to explain the other side and why we don't believe it. For exaple, we discuss creationist parents who don't explain evolution to their children as lacking. We're a long way from the days of a good catechism in many churches, so it seems odd to some to have beliefs actually explained so openly. It would be refreshing for a church to teach the views of communion and why we believe one as opposed to another.

Edited December 30, 2010 by angela in ohio
typo

[asta]

I think that perhaps the catholic church doesn't bother to attack other churches because it doesn't feel it needs to.

 

People who are very secure in themselves don't belittle others.

[LG Gone Wild]

I think (and could very well be wrong) that it has a lot to do with how the services/mass is structured. It is my limited understanding that there is a specific order to a RC "service," I think that structure helps prevent the other denom bashing.

 

Some protestant churches have less structure and more one man's teaching. I don't know if that made any sense, but to paraphrase...I think the RC's structure may actually not afford very much oppurtunity for "bashing" other belife's.

 

Yes, no. There is order and structure but the priest has the homily to instruct. The only restriction is time. The priest gets the homily to say his piece, not the entire 50-60 minutes of the mass.

[LG Gone Wild]

I think that perhaps the catholic church doesn't bother to attack other churches because it doesn't feel it needs to.

 

People who are very secure in themselves don't belittle others.

 

I also think it's because the Church look on the Protestant denominations as a siblings who are away from home.

[asta]

I also think it's because the Church look on the Protestant denominations as a siblings who are away from home.

 

I wish I could find the quote - I once read something by the current pope that was something to the effect of "everyone is Catholic, but not everyone has made their way back home yet."

 

Of course, the person I read it to got so offended they huffed out of the room...

[Parrothead]

I think (and could very well be wrong) that it has a lot to do with how the services/mass is structured. It is my limited understanding that there is a specific order to a RC "service," I think that structure helps prevent the other denom bashing.

 

Some protestant churches have less structure and more one man's teaching. I don't know if that made any sense, but to paraphrase...I think the RC's structure may actually not afford very much oppurtunity for "bashing" other belife's.

I know you too well to believe that you said what it comes across as. I know you'll tell me that I'm wrong. Maybe it is badly worded or I'm reading it horribly wrong because I have so very little experience with Protestant churches. To me it reads like you are saying if a Catholic priest had more time for his homily other than the usual 10-20 minutes any given Catholic priest would eventually start bashing other Christians or other religions.

[KristineinKS]

I've put my responses below in bold:

 

For those who have converted to/from RCC/EO/Protestant - how did you deal with your families and how did they deal with you?

 

I have been felt pulled towards RCC for a long time but have resisted for a number of reasons, one of which is my family. My family, my mom in particular, are convinced Catholics are not Christians, worship statues, worship Mary, and don't worship Christ as the Son of God.

 

My biggest problem has been with my grandparents (who are like parents, in a way, since they raised me). They are lifelong Presbyterians and took it very personally when I began the RCIA process last year. My grandmother, in particular, believes all of the things that your mom does and has challenged me throughout the entire process. She has also been especially bad about trying to turn my kids against the Church (because in her mind, Catholics aren't Christians).

 

Several things have helped me in dealing with her. First, prayer -- for well over a year now I've been praying for her, in the hopes that she might see (at the very least!) that Catholics are not "evil." Also, I've made it a point to educate myself as much as possible. When she starts talking about how Catholics do this or Catholics do that, I'm able to correct her misconceptions and/or tell her why things are done a certain way. Scott Hahn's books have been extremely helpful (in particular, Rome Sweet Home about his journey to the Catholic Church, and Signs of Life: 40 Catholic Customs and Their Biblical Roots).

 

Last night I was *finally* able to join the Church (my annullment paperwork didn't go through in time for the Easter vigil last year). Much to my surprise, my grandparents did attend the service, though it's the last thing I would've expected from them a year ago. They have become much more accepting in the past few months and in fact have been encouraging me to put my PS son into Catholic school.

 

It's incredibly difficult for me to think of how I'm going to address my possible conversion with them. They just might ostracize me, something I really don't want. They will blame DH for leading me astray (not true).

 

It will take time. How much time, no one can predict, but be patient, pray, and give them time. The process will likely be incredibly difficult, but in the end you will be a stronger person for it.

 

My MIL will go off the deep end - she's Muslim and has a very strong distrust of Christians, Catholics in particular. The priest scandals have not helped at all.

 

So any advice?

Last night our priest gave me this piece of advice. Firmly and respectfully ask your MIL to refrain from speaking negatively of your decision. Just as she would not appreciate someone bashing her faith, you do not appreciate her bashing yours. Also, pray for her.

Edited December 30, 2010 by KristineinKS

[Parrothead]

The Scott Hahn conversion story linked above does a great job of dispelling most of the common myths (never read it before).

 

When DS and I went on a "Luther Pilgrimage", we were stunned by the depth of anti-Catholic dogma being spewed. I call it a pilgrimage because it was a bus tour to Luther's old monastery & original church (when he was Catholic), the "95 theses church", the museum of all of his stuff, etc. Even though he had (obviously) been a Catholic priest, that aspect of his life has essentially been ERASED from the Wittemburg history. His life is presented as if he was a tabula rasa monk (I mean, what kind of monk would he have been? Buddhist?) who suddenly rose up in opposition against the Catholic Church.

 

Don't even get me started on the glaring absence of Mary art from everything - even the Catholic church in that city. It's like they had a Mary purge. And Wittemburg was originally RC, so it was there...

This saddens me deeply.

[Renee in NC]

I often wonder where this type thing comes from. Is it to instill fear so people "don't go there?" Is that for money?

 

Not too long ago someone here posted about how she heard often in her Southern Baptist church how the Catholics are bad/wrong/evil/whatever. Why does this type of "brainwashing" happen? Does it happen regularly with other denominations being bashed from the pulpit or is it just the Catholics?

 

That is what led me *to* the Catholic Church. My baptist preacher was anti-Catholic from the pulpit and my very good friend was Catholic. I read up on Catholicism and ended up converting because of what I learned.

[Renee in NC]

I think (and could very well be wrong) that it has a lot to do with how the services/mass is structured. It is my limited understanding that there is a specific order to a RC "service," I think that structure helps prevent the other denom bashing.

 

Some protestant churches have less structure and more one man's teaching. I don't know if that made any sense, but to paraphrase...I think the RC's structure may actually not afford very much oppurtunity for "bashing" other belife's.

 

The priest offers a homily that is no different than the sermon at a Baptist church (except maybe shorter!:D) Priests say all kinds of things during the homily.

[simka2]

I know you too well to believe that you said what it comes across as. I know you'll tell me that I'm wrong. Maybe it is badly worded or I'm reading it horribly wrong because I have so very little experience with Protestant churches. To me it reads like you are saying if a Catholic priest had more time for his homily other than the usual 10-20 minutes any given Catholic priest would eventually start bashing other Christians or other religions.

 

 

Hmmmm...I had to ponder this a second. At first I wanted to say "No way! that's not what I was saying :D."

 

On the other hand, I think there is great wisdom in structure (and that structure has been developed over far more time than the protestant structure has, it's had a lot more time to work thru what works and doesn't work.)

 

I think priests and pastors alike, given enough time "could" hang themselves with their own words (both are human.) Something from Proverbs comes to mind....where many words are present, sin is not absent.

 

But, I do think I did a poor job of wording only one "possible" factor, my no means...the only factor.

 

Sorry, if I offended. ;)

[Parrothead]

Hmmmm...I had to ponder this a second. At first I wanted to say "No way! that's not what I was saying :D."

 

On the other hand, I think there is great wisdom in structure (and that structure has been developed over far more time than the protestant structure has, it's had a lot more time to work thru what works and doesn't work.)

 

I think priests and pastors alike, given enough time "could" hang themselves with their own words (both are human.) Something from Proverbs comes to mind....where many words are present, sin is not absent.

 

But, I do think I did a poor job of wording only one "possible" factor, my no means...the only factor.

 

Sorry, if I offended. ;)

:D No, not offended. I was a bit confused - I wondered who had signed in on your account. :lol:

 

I do agree with you where I bolded, though. And it clarifies what you said earlier.

[simka2]

:D No, not offended. I was a bit confused - I wondered who had signed in on your account. :lol:

 

I do agree with you where I bolded, though. And it clarifies what you said earlier.

 

 

I probly shouldn't have posted the first thought that came to mind! :D

 

I'm about to leave on another 14 hr drive to KC and will miss all these wonderful conversations. On the otherhand....I'll get some good reading in!!!!

[Giraffe]

I'm about to leave on another 14 hr drive to KC and will miss all these wonderful conversations. On the otherhand....I'll get some good reading in!!!!

 

No, don't leave! I'm enjoying this conversation and everyone's opinions!

 

And I'm learning a lot!

 

Seriously - have a safe trip - and enjoy the reading! (Jealous! ;))

[MrsBasil]

My family isn't anti religious, so much as just not religious. I don't know how to explain it, other then they are fine with people being religious....if it's not them and if people aren't in their faces about it.

 

I am considered odd for going to church weekly and sometimes more than that. They are polite about it to me though. My mom has said ONCE she thinks raising a child to be any one religion is abusive, but she hasn't said anything further because she knows that I'm not the type who will listen to that with no reaction. She knows if she pushes it or takes up that train of thought with DS someday her access to him will be limited. My dad is politely baffled and my brother is politely interested, but also baffled.

 

My FIL is fine with it, but likes to try an argue that Catholicism would be better than Orthodoxy. DH, who is not fully on board for himself but super supportive for me and DS, tells him to can it. My MIL is hostile to organized religion, but again, knows to not push it with me.

 

I'm just of the opinion that certain choices aren't up for family discussion(outside of myself and DS) and have proven that I just won't deal with it.

 

We all get along fine and people are almost never rude or pushy...anymore.

[milovany]

My family isn't anti religious, so much as just not religious. I don't know how to explain it, other then they are fine with people being religious....if it's not them and if people aren't in their faces about it.

 

I am considered odd for going to church weekly and sometimes more than that. They are polite about it to me though...

 

This is me, too. Except I would substitute "parents" for "family" -- my parents aren't religious and have nothing negative to say about those who are. My sisters are Protestants and I don't know what they think about our conversion to the Orthodox church; they're fine with people making their own choices. I think we're probably considered a bit odd for our lives become circled around our faith in the way it has -- a lot of services, the regular fasting, crossing ourselves when we pray, kissing icons and our priest's right hand, etc -- but no one says anything about it. If anyone did, I'd hope we'd be able to respectfully address it while maintaining firmness in the practice of our faith.

[Wayfaring Stranger]

My dad is a Disciples of Christ pastor with a doctorate in divinity. When I told him we were converting he said that he thinks the Orthodox have it right on Icons. That was a little surprising to say the least. The big problem he has is with infant baptism. My mom was just curious but that is about all the reaction I got. My wife's family just ignores the fact that we are Orthodox (although celebrating Easter has become more important for them). They see that we are still raising our children to live Christian lives and that we take them to church. My MIL has also been pushed to think about things like: Is the Word of God the Bible or Jesus?

[ktgrok]

When I went through RCIA I was terrified of my mom's reaction. We were Episcopalian, so not that much different, but still...it was out of her comfort zone a lot. I finally told her and she was fascinated and totally fine with it!!! Although, I didn't ask her to my confirmation and I wish I had..my dh at the time (now ex) didn't come so I had no one there.

 

Anyway, I now am back at the Episcopal church simply because my new husband is Episcopalian, and is not comfortable at the R.Catholic church as much. He would attend, but not convert or participate. I decided it was more important to me to have my whole family participating together, and my childen seeing their father take communion with us, then to be at the "right" church. I am free to believe all the same things at my current church that I did at the R. Catholic, with the difference that the Priest is a woman :)

[iwka]

I was raised Catholic and have experienced heart conversion, baptism of the HS within it, but slowly drifted away toward Evangelical Charismatic Protestants. I married Charismatic Evangelical Baptist from the South, who was baptized Catholic at infancy.

 

We were missionaries in Eastern Europe and Middle East for a decade. Seeing a lot of churches, being in different cultures, living within the contest of different faiths, political and philosophical systems (countries with dominant Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Protestantism and Islam) provoked us to search and rethink everything.

 

Last Easter we joined the Catholic Church - for both of us it was reverting rather than converting, but practically for me it was coming back after 19 years, and for my dh converting.

 

The family thing is quite hard, but in our case Catholics were much more understanding and rational during our Protestant years, than Protestants are now (since we stopped protesting, as we like to say). Some family and friends were furious and steamed their anger, called us names, tried to psychologically explain our decisions etc. Some are having good apologetic discussions with us. Our kids' friends rejected them. We moved in August, so this helps in forming new relationships.

[unsinkable]

I was raised Catholic and have experienced heart conversion, baptism of the HS within it, but slowly drifted away toward Evangelical Charismatic Protestants. I married Charismatic Evangelical Baptist from the South, who was baptized Catholic at infancy.

 

We were missionaries in Eastern Europe and Middle East for a decade. Seeing a lot of churches, being in different cultures, living within the contest of different faiths, political and philosophical systems (countries with dominant Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Protestantism and Islam) provoked us to search and rethink everything.

 

Last Easter we joined the Catholic Church - for both of us it was reverting rather than converting, but practically for me it was coming back after 19 years, and for my dh converting.

 

The family thing is quite hard, but in our case Catholics were much more understanding and rational during our Protestant years, than Protestants are now (since we stopped protesting, as we like to say). Some family and friends were furious and steamed their anger, called us names, tried to psychologically explain our decisions etc. Some are having good apologetic discussions with us. Our kids' friends rejected them. We moved in August, so this helps in forming new relationships.

 

thank you for this post!

 

I looked on your blog and read about Irena Sendler. What a wonderful woman!

[HRAAB]

my hubby and i were cradle catholics. We left the church and started attending a non- denominational church where we both soon accepted Christ as our Savior. Every single one of our "friends" in the catholic church abandoned us. As have they with other people who have left. BIL was po'ed we didn't ask him first. haha MIL was concerned, but it actually pushed her to start reading up on what catholicism is really about and she is closer to God now and accepting of us, as she has seen all the wonderful changes in our life. My poor Grandma cried and knew we'd go to hell. well, our family priest explained to her that we wouldn't g to hell. and that it doesn't matter where we worship, as long as we worshipped Christ. So, she is better with it.

 

all this to say, after the initial shock wheres off, i imagine your family will be ok. pray about it. don't throw it in their face. eventually, your actions will speak about your choice. Good luck and :grouphug:s.

 

And I can assure you the opposite happens very frequently. Anyway, this is much more about human nature than about religious denomination.