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[Onceuponatime]

I have a question.....

 

I buy regular 2% Milk at either Trader Joes or Whole Foods, whoever is cheaper that week :)

 

I want to know what the ACTUAL difference is between regular milk from there and Organic milk. Is it what the cows eat? Does it have to do with hormones? I'm sure the regular milk at Whole Foods doesn't have hormones, right?

 

Please help me figure this out. I do not drink milk, just use it for cooking, but my 6 year old son drinks 3-4 gallons of milk a WEEK! I'm CONVINCED that all that milk + lack of soda drinking, is what enabled him to jump out of his second story window without so much as a sprain or fracture! He's as healthy as a horse, NEVER gets colds or anything.

 

I'm just wondering if it would be better to get Organic b/c he drinks SO much of it.... it's just SO expensive! I would be spending $70-$80 a MONTH on Milk!!

 

So what do you guys think??

 

Just popping in to say that I have read in multiple places that there is not much difference between organic milk and regular milk that has no hormones. I'm sure you could google it and find out. I've got to pop back out of here. :-)

[Parrothead]

I have not idea since I don't have to option to buy organic milk. I mean, there is some at the store, but it is cost prohibitive. It isn't even from our local dairy.

 

I buy our local dairy's products at the market and try not to worry about it not being organic. It is hormone free and all that good jazz. ;)

[Whereneverever]

We buy local, hormone free, non homogenized milk. It's not organic, though. I don't like that our only organic choices are really costly and shipping in. I think it's generally better to have local milk. I think.

[wapiti]

I don't know the answer to OP's question, but MIL says that if I fed the kids organic milk, they'd only need to drink half as much (sorry, I couldn't help myself :lol:).

 

(ETA: FWIW, our generic grocery store-brand milk is from cows not treated with hormones, so I guess fertilizer would be the difference.)

Edited December 20, 2010 by wapiti

[Crimson Wife]

I'd like to give my kids organic milk but can't afford to pay twice as much. So I go with hormone-free regular milk. The cows are not fed organic grain/grass so there may be some residual pesticide exposure. It's still much healthier than standard conventional milk.

[fairytalemama]

I'd like to give my kids organic milk but can't afford to pay twice as much. So I go with hormone-free regular milk. The cows are not fed organic grain/grass so there may be some residual pesticide exposure. It's still much healthier than standard conventional milk.

 

I buy organic because we drink so little (i.e. my kids drink one gallon every 1-2 weeks). If I were in your shoes with the high milk consumption, I would check the label for hormone free or ask your grocer which milks if any are hormone free. One of our local chains requires farmers that provide their milk pledge to not use hormones on their cows.

 

I got the following passage about organic milk vs. regular milk from here:

 

"Organic milk is obtained from cows that feed on grass that is not sprayed with fertilizers or other harmful chemicals. Organic milk is also gained from cows who are not injected with hormones to increase their production of milk. On the other hand, the cows producing organic milk are left in the pastures to feed themselves in the natural environment.

 

Contrary to organic milk, regular milk is obtained from cows that are fed on grass sprayed with fertilizers or chemicals. These cows are also treated with hormones to increase production of milk. Regular milk is obtained from cows that are kept in sheds and are fed on grain. Regular milk contains antibiotics and synthetic hormones and it has a lower shelf life as compared to organic milk."

[Ellie]

I have a question.....

 

I buy regular 2% Milk at either Trader Joes or Whole Foods, whoever is cheaper that week :)

 

I want to know what the ACTUAL difference is between regular milk from there and Organic milk. Is it what the cows eat? Does it have to do with hormones? I'm sure the regular milk at Whole Foods doesn't have hormones, right?

 

Please help me figure this out. I do not drink milk, just use it for cooking, but my 6 year old son drinks 3-4 gallons of milk a WEEK! I'm CONVINCED that all that milk + lack of soda drinking, is what enabled him to jump out of his second story window without so much as a sprain or fracture! He's as healthy as a horse, NEVER gets colds or anything.

 

I'm just wondering if it would be better to get Organic b/c he drinks SO much of it.... it's just SO expensive! I would be spending $70-$80 a MONTH on Milk!!

 

So what do you guys think??

3-4 gallons A WEEK??? ::falls over in a dead faint::

 

Well, the less any food is messed with, the better. That just makes sense to me. I prefer to buy milk that comes from dairies that don't use all the hormones and antibiotics and whatnot.

 

I *really* prefer to buy raw milk products, but Texas law prohibits raw milk products from being sold in stores. There's a way around that--co-ops, for example--but you can't find raw milk products easily. And raw milk is twice as expensive as h/p milk; "organic" milk isn't.

[danybug]

I buy regular whole milk from WFM. My dh is a store manager at Whole Foods. Per the company standards their regular milk is from cows not treated with hormones or antibiotics, etc. He said the milk is basically the same as organic, but it is just not certified organic. The vendor that produces most of their store brand milk is actually an organic dairy that is just not certified. Now I am not sure if that last fact is specific for our local region only.

 

Hope that helps some.

[Ali in OR]

No organic here, but I do prefer to get the hormone-free. I believe that the regular TJ's milk is hormone-free.

[justamouse]

I have 7 kids and we go through 8 gallons a week. :001_smile: I fully support milk drinking.

[Tammyla]

I buy local milk that is hormone & antibiotic free. Organic here doesn't mean much as there is no real consistency or oversight.

[Crimson Wife]

And raw milk is twice as expensive as h/p milk; "organic" milk isn't.

 

A half-gallon of organic milk here costs roughly the same as a gallon of the regular hormone-free. I'm not sure the current price of raw milk since WF pulled it from their shelves but it was quite a bit higher than pasteurized organic.

 

ETA: My local Safeway is currently selling a half-gallon of organic for $3.29 and a gallon of organic for $6.39. Regular hormone-free is $2.19 for a half-gallon and $3.29 for a gallon.

Edited December 20, 2010 by Crimson Wife

[silver]

I got the following passage about organic milk vs. regular milk from here:

 

"Regular milk is obtained from cows that are kept in sheds and are fed on grain. Regular milk contains antibiotics and synthetic hormones and it has a lower shelf life as compared to organic milk."

 

I wanted to address this part in specific. Although it's true that cows on organic dairy farms do not get antibiotics it is not true that milk from a non-organic farm has antibiotics in the milk. By law, farmers are required to dump the milk of a cow while she is being treated with antibiotics. So the real difference here is that if a cow gets a bacterial infection on a non-organic farm, the farmer can treat that cow. If a cow on an organic dairy farm gets any bacterial infection, the farmer does not have antibiotics as an option for treating the cow if he wants to keep it in his herd.

 

As for the longer shelf life, the only reason organic milk has a longer shelf life is because it is pasteurized at a higher temperature than non-organic milk. Some people can taste the difference and don't like ultra-pasteurized milk. And the reason they ultra-pasteurize organic milk is because demand is so much lower that it tends to sit in the grocery store for longer before it sells (and thus, organic milk is not as fresh). Once the milk is opened and exposed to the air, both types of milk have the same shelf life.

 

And for what it's worth, cows on organic dairy farms produce more methane gas than cows on non-organic farms. It also takes more cows to produce the same volume of milk. So if the environment is a factor in your decision making, you need to weigh pesticide use against more green house gasses.

 

If hormones are a concern, you could get non-organic milk from cows not treated with the hormone. It's more expensive, but only by about $1/gallon vs $3+ more for organic milk. I don't worry about it, because there is no way to tell the difference in the milk of a cow treated growth hormones vs a cow not treated with hormones. Because of that, some states don't even allow dairy produces to label milk as from cows not treated with rBGH.

 

In case you can't tell, I buy the cheap milk and have no guilt over giving it to my children.

[momto2Cs]

All this makes me very glad I live in Clover milk country!

 

Just a sidenote - not ALL organic milk is ultra-pasteurized. Clover does not do this to their organic products, although Horizon does, and I think Organic Valley does as well.

 

As to Trader Joe's milk - they tend to buy from local suppliers who are willing to use their packaging. For example, by tracing the plant numbers printed on the packaging here, I know that the local TJ's buys Clover for their regular milk and Strauss for their organic. If you want to find out where your TJ's milk comes from, just compare the plant numbers on the packaging from TJ's and your regular grocer store.

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[JeneralMom]

I am very lucky - in the San Antonio area we have at least 4 options for local, organic, raw milk, and the price is the same as or less than a gallon of organic store milk. My preference is 1) local, raw; 2) organic from our local grocery chain (not Horizon or Organic Valley because they are ultra pasteurized)or WF; 3) hormone free conventional milk from local grocery or WF; 4) conventional (which we haven't bought in years).

 

After going raw, my kids refuse to drink the hormone-free, non-organic stuff (they say it tastes awful) and only grudginly drink organic milk.

[MSNative]

I wanted to address this part in specific. Although it's true that cows on organic dairy farms do not get antibiotics it is not true that milk from a non-organic farm has antibiotics in the milk. By law, farmers are required to dump the milk of a cow while she is being treated with antibiotics. So the real difference here is that if a cow gets a bacterial infection on a non-organic farm, the farmer can treat that cow. If a cow on an organic dairy farm gets any bacterial infection, the farmer does not have antibiotics as an option for treating the cow if he wants to keep it in his herd.

 

As for the longer shelf life, the only reason organic milk has a longer shelf life is because it is pasteurized at a higher temperature than non-organic milk. Some people can taste the difference and don't like ultra-pasteurized milk. And the reason they ultra-pasteurize organic milk is because demand is so much lower that it tends to sit in the grocery store for longer before it sells (and thus, organic milk is not as fresh). Once the milk is opened and exposed to the air, both types of milk have the same shelf life.

 

And for what it's worth, cows on organic dairy farms produce more methane gas than cows on non-organic farms. It also takes more cows to produce the same volume of milk. So if the environment is a factor in your decision making, you need to weigh pesticide use against more green house gasses.

 

If hormones are a concern, you could get non-organic milk from cows not treated with the hormone. It's more expensive, but only by about $1/gallon vs $3+ more for organic milk. I don't worry about it, because there is no way to tell the difference in the milk of a cow treated growth hormones vs a cow not treated with hormones. Because of that, some states don't even allow dairy produces to label milk as from cows not treated with rBGH.

 

In case you can't tell, I buy the cheap milk and have no guilt over giving it to my children.

 

Very interesting post. I've never thought much about the milk I buy. This thread is illuminating.

[nukeswife]

Not sure about the difference.

 

I have Oberweis delivery, and a milk man leaves about 8 half gallon glass bottles on my porch each Tuesday. It's not organic, but it is hormone and antibiotic free. My son says it tastes better than the regular store bought milk, but will drink Horizons Organic if we're away from home.

[weaver_67579]

I buy organic because we drink so little (i.e. my kids drink one gallon every 1-2 weeks). If I were in your shoes with the high milk consumption, I would check the label for hormone free or ask your grocer which milks if any are hormone free. One of our local chains requires farmers that provide their milk pledge to not use hormones on their cows.

 

I got the following passage about organic milk vs. regular milk from here:

 

 

we buy a lot of milk 6-8 gallons a week for our family of 5. It is just regular milk from the store-no organic or raw.... Both DH and I were raised on dairy farms.

 

No milk is hormone free. It all contains hormones-cow, mine....the milk produced by cattle injected with bst is undistinguishable-even hormone levels from cattle that are not. Can't remember where the study is that I saw that in-it's been years. Anyway-someone that tries to sell hormone-free milk is not being truthful, since all milk contains hormones.

 

"Organic milk is obtained from cows that feed on grass that is not sprayed with fertilizers or other harmful chemicals. Organic milk is also gained from cows who are not injected with hormones to increase their production of milk. On the other hand, the cows producing organic milk are left in the pastures to feed themselves in the natural environment.

 

 

Organic cattle don't have to be just fed grass. They can be fed the same type of diet as regular dairy cattle-but it has to have organic commodities (corn, cottonseed...) Basically-the crops they are fed have to be organic-at least that is my understanding. There are whole feed mills devoted to just supplying organic feed. My FIL has sold organic hay to dairies for years and DH runs a conventional feed mill.

 

 

Contrary to organic milk, regular milk is obtained from cows that are fed on grass sprayedi with fertilizers or chemicals. These cows are also treated with hormones to increase production of milk. Regular milk is obtained from cows that are kept in sheds and are fed on grain. Regular milk contains antibiotics and synthetic hormones and it has a lower shelf life as compared to organic milk

 

 

Not all regular dairies inject use bst-the hormone used to boost production. Many regular dairies have their cows out on pasture-as well as having a grain ration. Any cow treated with antibiotics has to have the milk dumped and not put into the milk supply Each different drug has a specific witholding time during which the milk has to be dumped. Every load of milk is tested and if some is found-the offending farmer must purchase the whole truck or storage tank full. As you can imagine-farmers are very careful about this.

 

I'm all for everyone making informed decisions about what they eat or drink-but the false information about agriculture out there is really irritating to me personally-having been raised on a farm and having an ag degree. Currently, we live on a portion of dh's family farm-much of the land still belonging to his parents has been certified organic-so I am not opposed to organic.

[Dawn in OH]

We buy RBGH/RBST free milk. We cannot afford organic.

[Colleen]

 

Just a sidenote - not ALL organic milk is ultra-pasteurized. Clover does not do this to their organic products, although Horizon does, and I think Organic Valley does as well.

Some Organic Valley milk is ultra-pasteurized, while some is not.

 

[Colleen]

 

Just popping in to say that I have read in multiple places that there is not much difference between organic milk and regular milk that has no hormones.

Mmm, no, there are differences.:)

 

[Colleen]

 

I have not idea since I don't have to option to buy organic milk. I mean, there is some at the store, but it is cost prohibitive. It isn't even from our local dairy.

Which organic milk is available in your area?

 

[Colleen]

 

FWIW, our generic grocery store-brand milk is from cows not treated with hormones, so I guess fertilizer would be the difference.

Yes, that's one difference.

 

[Colleen]

 

I'd like to give my kids organic milk but can't afford to pay twice as much. So I go with hormone-free regular milk. The cows are not fed organic grain/grass so there may be some residual pesticide exposure. It's still much healthier than standard conventional milk.

Just to clarify, many conventional dairy herds don't receive artifical growth hormones.

 

[Colleen]

 

We buy local, hormone free, non homogenized milk. It's not organic, though. I don't like that our only organic choices are really costly and shipping in. I think it's generally better to have local milk. I think.

That's great that you have a good, local product available to you! Just wanted to note that there are many Organic Valley milk producers in Minnesota, so the OV milk sold there is regional.:)

 

[Colleen]

 

I want to know what the ACTUAL difference is between regular milk from there and Organic milk.

I realize you said in a subsequent post that you don't have time to research online, but I'd encourage you to give it a bit of attention. Some of the posts here are accurate, but some convey misinformation and generalizations with regard to both organic and conventional milk production. Here's a link to a page at Organic Valley (our nationwide, farmer-owned cooperative) that enumerates a few benefits of organics.

 

[justamouse]

I can't afford organic so I buy hormone free at Costco for 2.70 something.

 

Also, another reason why I don't go for organic is that it still comes in plastic containers. Until I can buy glass, or a milk man delivers glass, I'll buy the hormone free.

[MindyD]

I can't help with the science, but I've recently started buying organic milk because the kids say it tastes so much better. I have to agree with them on it.

[Colleen]

 

So the real difference here is that if a cow gets a bacterial infection on a non-organic farm, the farmer can treat that cow. If a cow on an organic dairy farm gets any bacterial infection, the farmer does not have antibiotics as an option for treating the cow if he wants to keep it in his herd.

Right. We rely on other methods, such as homeopathic treatment.

As for the longer shelf life, the only reason organic milk has a longer shelf life is because it is pasteurized at a higher temperature than non-organic milk. Some people can taste the difference and don't like ultra-pasteurized milk. And the reason they ultra-pasteurize organic milk is because demand is so much lower that it tends to sit in the grocery store for longer before it sells (and thus, organic milk is not as fresh).

This is inaccurate. Some milk, both organic and conventional, is ultra-pasteurized; some is not. The reason Organic Valley began ultra-pasteurizing some (not all, by any means) of our millk was a demand to do so on the part of the consumer and the retailer.

And for what it's worth, cows on organic dairy farms produce more methane gas than cows on non-organic farms. It also takes more cows to produce the same volume of milk. So if the environment is a factor in your decision making, you need to weigh pesticide use against more green house gasses.

Whether or not it takes more cows to produce the same amount of the milk is dependent upon input and management factors. As far as environmental impact is concerned, organic farms don't contribute synthetic nitrogen, herbicides, and pesticides to the soil. Methane is an issue, no question. Manure digesters (both on organic and conventional farms) are one means of addressing this. And of course, methane emissions from other sources (landfills, for example) far outpace that of the emissions from dairy farms.

 

[Colleen]

 

I buy local milk that is hormone & antibiotic free. Organic here doesn't mean much as there is no real consistency or oversight.

Where is "here"?

 

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[Brilliant]

...Here's a link to a page at Organic Valley (our nationwide, farmer-owned cooperative) that enumerates a few benefits of organics.

 

Thanks for weighing in on this one, Colleen. Do you have an alert that lets you know when "organic milk" shows up in a post? :)

 

I checked out your link and was surprised - I guess I thought "Organic Valley" was a huge dairy farm; it didn't occur to me that they get their milk from local organic farmers!

[Brilliant]

 

This thread has really been interesting, I'm glad I asked my question :)

 

I'm glad, too!

 

I checked out the code from my Costco 2% rgbh-free milk - it comes from a dairy in our county. It's not organic, but at least it's local. I had been buying organic since about March, and just switched back to regular this month b/c of the cost...but based on the info Colleen & others provided, I'm going to consider organic again.

 

I also bought raw a couple of times, but my ds, who's the major milk drinker in the house, wouldn't drink it. He said milk MUST be pasteurized or it is poisonous. ?? Not sure where the 14yo comes up with this stuff.

[Veritaserum]

We switched to organic a few months ago. My fav. brand (at the natural market) is not ultra-pasteurized, but the kind we buy at the regular grocery store is. We go through 6+ gallons per week.

 

Regular milk is $1.67 a gallon on sale (usually is on sale). Organic is $2.99 per half gallon.

 

I've never seen any non-organic milk advertised as hormone free. Are they usually labeled as such?

[Colleen]

Thanks for weighing in on this one, Colleen. Do you have an alert that lets you know when "organic milk" shows up in a post? :)

:D I rarely stop by here any more, but this thread happened to be on the first page when I dropped in on Tuesday. I do sometimes run a search for the word "organic", though.

I checked out your link and was surprised - I guess I thought "Organic Valley" was a huge dairy farm; it didn't occur to me that they get their milk from local organic farmers!

Yes, it's a farmer-owned cooperative that began in Wisconsin 20+ years ago. While it's nationwide now, the goal is always to provide regional products as much as possible. You can download and print Organic Valley coupons at our website, btw. Thanks for looking into it!:) Edited December 22, 2010 by Colleen

[Colleen]

My Trader Joes milk came from Garelick Farms in Burlington, NJ and my Target milk came from Shenandoah's Pride in Springfield, VA. BOTH owned by big Agri-business company, Dean Foods! LOL!

Doesn't surprise me in the least.:) Dean Foods is also the parent company of Horizon Organic.

 

I guess the whole Giant Corporation vs. Small and Local is more important to me than the Organic vs. non-Organic issue.

Well, I can vouch for the fact that Organic Valley is a both organic and farmer-owned, as opposed to an agri-corp. You can download and print coupons at the Organic Valley web site, if you'd like. I would also encourage you to consider supporting the creamery you mentioned. While it may not be financially feasible for you to purchase all your milk from them, perhaps you could do a half gallon or so each week.

[extendedforecast]

I wanted to address this part in specific. Although it's true that cows on organic dairy farms do not get antibiotics it is not true that milk from a non-organic farm has antibiotics in the milk. By law, farmers are required to dump the milk of a cow while she is being treated with antibiotics. So the real difference here is that if a cow gets a bacterial infection on a non-organic farm, the farmer can treat that cow. If a cow on an organic dairy farm gets any bacterial infection, the farmer does not have antibiotics as an option for treating the cow if he wants to keep it in his herd.

 

As for the longer shelf life, the only reason organic milk has a longer shelf life is because it is pasteurized at a higher temperature than non-organic milk. Some people can taste the difference and don't like ultra-pasteurized milk. And the reason they ultra-pasteurize organic milk is because demand is so much lower that it tends to sit in the grocery store for longer before it sells (and thus, organic milk is not as fresh). Once the milk is opened and exposed to the air, both types of milk have the same shelf life.

 

And for what it's worth, cows on organic dairy farms produce more methane gas than cows on non-organic farms. It also takes more cows to produce the same volume of milk. So if the environment is a factor in your decision making, you need to weigh pesticide use against more green house gasses.

 

If hormones are a concern, you could get non-organic milk from cows not treated with the hormone. It's more expensive, but only by about $1/gallon vs $3+ more for organic milk. I don't worry about it, because there is no way to tell the difference in the milk of a cow treated growth hormones vs a cow not treated with hormones. Because of that, some states don't even allow dairy produces to label milk as from cows not treated with rBGH.

 

In case you can't tell, I buy the cheap milk and have no guilt over giving it to my children.

 

Before I read this thread, I was reading about hormone-free milk options. I came across this site from the Texas Dairy Review that pretty much says the same things you say above in boldface. I am still researching both sides of this and was surprised to see this thread on WTM. I haven't read past your post, but I hope to learn more about this topic.

Edited December 22, 2010 by extendedforecast

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