Ugh, I hate dealing with the school district.

[NanceXToo]

So my younger two are homeschooled, of course.

 

But I also have a daughter- who is going to turn 19 in January- who is NOT of compulsory school age (that would be age 8 to 17 where I live).

 

She attends a special needs/life skills school at a facility that is still part of our local school district, but is a separate facility, just for kids with special needs. She can go there until she's 21.

 

So, my family is planning a vacation to Florida in February/March. We're going to drive there and back, and we're going to spend a little over a week with my husband's aunt and uncle and cousins, and then a week or so with his mom (they live in two different parts of Florida) and then we'll drive back.

 

We expect to be gone somewhere between 3 and 4 weeks total. (including travel time, and in case we spontaneously decide to stay at one or another house for an extra few days or whatever).

 

So I wrote my daughter's teacher a note the other day explaining our plans and asking how this works insofar as the school is concerned. And as it turned out, she talked to the school principal, who had "never heard of" someone taking a trip that long over the school year, and who got in touch with the district to ask them about it, and they just called me back, and here's what they said:

 

The district will NOT approve a student being absent for more than ten days. And even if it was ten days, even a special ed student would be required to do schoolwork while they were away. And it doesn't matter that she's not compulsory school age, they won't approve a trip that long.

 

And my options are:

 

1) Don't take her out that long.

 

2) Allow her to be dropped from the school roll and when I get back from my trip, I will have to re-register/re-enroll her.

 

Now, I'm fine with doing number 2 if that's what I have to do, if it's just a matter of bringing in paperwork again and so on.

 

But I'm a little worried about whether they will give me a problem about LETTING her back in for some reason.

 

This is very frustrating!

 

What would you do? Am I right to be concerned about her being able to get back in, or do you think that shouldn't be a problem? I did call and leave a message for the person at the district who is in charge of Special Ed and I'm waiting for her to call back to try to see what she says. But in the meanwhile I figured I'd vent a little and get your thoughts!

 

ETA: I just added a post on Page 2 of this thread which contains a letter I am thinking of sending to the superintendent of my school district, and I would appreciate any thoughts/feedback on that letter! Thanks!

Edited December 17, 2010 by NanceXToo

[angela in ohio]

What would you do? Am I right to be concerned about her being able to get back in, or do you think that shouldn't be a problem? I did call and leave a message for the person at the district who is in charge of Special Ed and I'm waiting for her to call back to try to see what she says. But in the meanwhile I figured I'd vent a little and get your thoughts!

 

Dh is a special education administrator, so I understand their problem. If she is enrolled, they are responsible for her education. They can't explain her missing for a month, because there are rules about how much school a student can miss. And if you choose to participate in their program, you are choosing to follow the rules for it. If they say it doesn't matter because she is special needs, that wouldn't say much for what they provide, nor would it be the sort of thing a school should say about a special needs student.

 

If PA law is that she can go until 21, they should have no choice but to let her back in if she qualifies. I would probably not take the trip during the school year, but if you don't have a choice, I'd say let her be dropped from the rolls and then re-enroll her.

[Jean in Newcastle]

Is your dd able to stay with a trusted friend while you are gone? My nephew (who has Down's Syndrome) has been able to do that while his parents go on trips. They make sure he is able to continue with his normal routines.

[NanceXToo]

Thanks, Angela- I do see your (their?) point, I guess... I'm just aggravated. But hopefully like you said they will have to re-enroll her and it won't be a problem.

 

Jean- I don't, I would need to bring her with me, but thanks for the suggestion!

[angela in ohio]

Thanks, Angela- I do see your (their?) point, I guess... I'm just aggravated. But hopefully like you said they will have to re-enroll her and it won't be a problem.

 

I understand. The same rules designed to protect many students also entangle parents with good intentions, unfortunately.

 

The special ed person should be able to tell you what will happen if you re-enroll, I would think.

[NanceXToo]

talk to the secretaries, they really run the place! Check the statute for your state and I bet you will have your answer. A friend of mine took her son out of school for 6 weeks to visit relatives and had to do the whole withdrawal / reenroll thing, but he was only seven so there was no question of them taking him back.

 

Yeah, at that age they kind of have to lol. At my daughter's age, they might pull some weird "sorry, we don't have room" thing in retaliation for my poor choice of not following the rules or some such! I don't know! Maybe I'm just being paranoid. I will look into it more, thanks!

[JoyfulMama]

You need to make sure you validate the work ($$$) that is being offered by the program, for your dd. If you as a parent of a student in the program does not show value for the program, then why should others? (Not trying to be mean here AT ALL - but the program has to justify its expenditures.)

 

For each person that leaves the program, I'm sure there is some evaluation. And again, if the person re-enters the program, then there must have been some "failure" somewhere else, since needs were not met, hence the return to the program.

 

I know that homeschooling and self-employment offers you a lot of flexibility, however you do have to play by the rules of dd's school.

Sorry. :001_unsure:

[NanceXToo]

That is totally ridiculous. I have no advice. I'd probably just take her and deal with the school later. How can a trip be less educational than sitting in a room all day?

 

Yep, that's what I was thinking. And my daughter's teacher totally agrees, she made a point of telling me that. Too bad it's not just up to her!

[NanceXToo]

You need to make sure you validate the work ($$$) that is being offered by the program, for your dd. If you as a parent of a student in the program does not show value for the program, then why should others? (Not trying to be mean here AT ALL - but the program has to justify its expenditures.)

 

For each person that leaves the program, I'm sure there is some evaluation. And again, if the person re-enters the program, then there must have been some "failure" somewhere else, since needs were not met, hence the return to the program.

 

I know that homeschooling and self-employment offers you a lot of flexibility, however you do have to play by the rules of dd's school.

Sorry. :001_unsure:

 

I understand. And I do value the program. But I also value those once in a blue moon experiences that come up that revolve around family and travel and seeing and doing things you normally can't, and I sort of expected that the school would see it that way too, particularly for a kid who isn't of compulsory school age anyway- but I was wrong about that, unfortunately! Anyway, I do know I have to follow the rules, so I'm willing to go through the process of dropping her and re-enrolling her if that's what I need to do... I just don't want it to be a problem for me to GET her back in!

[JoyfulMama]

I understand. And I do value the program. But I also value those once in a blue moon experiences that come up that revolve around family and travel and seeing and doing things you normally can't, and I sort of expected that the school would see it that way too, particularly for a kid who isn't of compulsory school age anyway- but I was wrong about that, unfortunately! Anyway, I do know I have to follow the rules, so I'm willing to go through the process of dropping her and re-enrolling her if that's what I need to do... I just don't want it to be a problem for me to GET her back in!

 

But, see, the program is modeled around the school-education model, where the extra stuff- travel and family - usually takes place during the summer. Now, if she were going away to attend another "program"... maybe you just need to think about a better way to present the information to the school... and if the teacher is on the same page as you are, she might be helpful. ;)

[Tullia]

If your daughter has an IEP, is there a way for you to use some of the activities on your vacation to reinforce one or more of the goals listed? You'd probably need to work with her teacher to design something that would satisfy the paperwork requirements. If you can enlist the sympathy and help of the staff you might be able to find a workaround which might entail you keeping a diary so that you could justify saying something like: Student practiced a certain skill listed in the IEP by doing_____________ at some specified location on a certain date. My cousin always does this for her special needs child when they take extended family vacations. They also plan several educational stops on their trips such as attending lectures at national parks, going to a petting zoo etc. Her son is severely handicapped and can do very little; they have to be creative in finding things that work. Depending on what kind of life skills are appropriate for your dd, she might do things such as buy tickets for an event you attend as a family or buy snacks, count chagne at a rest stop, etc. If you do work educational activities into your schedule, maybe you or your dd could take pictures and have her describe what she learned using whatever means is appropriate for her educational plan.

 

The key to getting the cooperation of teachers is showing that you're willing to help them meet the documentation requirements placed on the staff and funding which the school receives. My cousin has found that doing something creative for practicing life skills is well received by most teachers. She doesn't do anything elaborate; they take pictures and keep a diary in a notebook small enough to tuck into a purse or backpack.

 

HTH,

Martha

Edited December 17, 2010 by Martha in NM
clarity

[NanceXToo]

Thanks for those suggestions! The teacher already agrees that it would be good for my daughter but it's the "district" (I don't know who there exactly) who vetoed it.

 

When I count up actual school days that she'd miss, it's going to be between 16 and 18 days. And I would have done school stuff with her or things that would count toward the life skills as suggested here, but I guess that won't matter if my only option is to remove her from school and then re-enroll her when we get back.

 

I'll see what else the special ed supervisor can tell me when she gets back to me.

[NanceXToo]

Could someone give me an opinion as to sending this letter to the superintendent of my district...?

 

---

 

December 17, 2010

 

To so and so, re: (my daughter's name)

 

Dear Superintendent,

 

My daughter, Melissa (lastname), is a student at (school). She is in a life skills class there.

 

Melissa is an 18 year old girl (who will turn 19 in January), so she is not of compulsory school age, but will likely remain at the (school) until she reaches the age of 21.

 

Recently, I sent in a letter to my daughter's teacher explaining that our family is planning a vacation to Florida in February/March. Melissa would be flying down with her father's sister, who lives in NY, and who wants to take Melissa and her cousins down to Florida to vacation and visit some theme parks during President's Week.

 

At the same time, my husband and I are planning to drive down to Florida ourselves, to visit family. Melissa's aunt would drop her off to us at family's house after their vacation, and Melissa would spend the rest of her vacation with us.

 

We will be visiting with an aunt, uncle and cousins who we only see once every few years. They have a large property, orange groves, and so on. When we leave there, we will be driving to another part of Florida to visit with my mother-in-law, who we only see once or twice a year, and spending some time with her. While we are there, we will be going on various educational outings and field trips. Melissa would have the opportunity to spend time with family, particularly family she does not see often, to attend various outings, to see people, places and things she does not normally get a chance to, and so on.

 

After visiting each relative for 1 - 1 1/2 weeks, we will drive home again.

 

The letter I sent to Melissa's teacher was referred to the principal at the (school) and then turned over to the district as the (school) was not sure how my request should be handled. The issue, apparently, is that Melissa would end up missing 16-18 school days when all is said and done, including visiting with family time and travel time to drive back and forth.

 

As such, I have been informed that the district will NOT approve this request, as students are not allowed to be absent for more than ten days. I was told that I would need to disenroll her from the school/district and could then re-register/re-enroll her when I returned.

 

I wanted to clarify with you that this IS my only option.

 

I did read in The Pennsylvania Code the following:

 

 

§ 11.24. Unaccounted absences.

 

Students whose names are on the active membership roll, who are at anytime in the school term absent from school for 10 consecutive school days, shall thereafter be removed from the active membership roll unless one of the following occurs:

 

(1) The district has been provided with evidence that absence may be legally excused.

 

(2) Compulsory attendance prosecution has been or is being pursued.

 

Authority

 

The provisions of this § 11.24 amended under section 1317(a) of The Administrative Code of 1929 (71 P. S. § 367(a)); and sections 1327, 1330, 1372, 1511 and 2603-B of the Public School Code of 1949 (24 P. S. § § 13-1327, 13-1330, 13-1372, 15-1511 and 26-2603-B).

 

Source

 

The provisions of this § 11.24 amended December 19, 1986, effective December 20, 1986, 16 Pa.B. 4874; amended October 22, 2004, effective October 23, 2004, 34 Pa.B. 5798. Immediately preceding text appears at serial page (252441).

 

 

I am wondering if the fact that Melissa is not of compulsory school age could be considered sufficient evidence that her absence may be legally excused? The absence would be more than 10 days, but would be well under the three months that students could be granted temporary absences for when it comes to illness or "urgent matters" and/or perhaps could be considered some sort of temporary alternative program.

I would be willing to do some schoolwork with her while we were away, and/or to work with her teacher on ways in which "life experience" can be transferred into school credit.

 

If there is no way around this and there is no choice but to disenroll and re-enroll Melissa when we return due to strict policy as opposed to legality, I am willing to do so- bringing in the necessary paperwork, refilling out necessary forms and so on. However, I would like confirmation/reassurance as to the fact that she WILL be able to re-enroll without a problem once we return. I would not want to return and go to fill out the forms etc only to be told that there is no longer a place for her or some other reason why she won't be taken back at her age, etc.

 

Please reply at your earliest convenience.

 

Thank you,

 

 

 

myname

[jplain]

I don't think age of compulsory attendance is at all relevant, because they aren't threatening you with the possibility of a truancy hearing.

 

The relevant point is that she is currently enrolled. In order to stay enrolled she needs to follow school and district guidelines. If she doesn't, she risks losing her slot.

 

As long as there's not a wait list for her school, it seems likely that she'd be granted readmission after your trip. Worst case scenario, maybe she wouldn't be granted readmission until Fall 2011, assuming they allow new students her age.

 

I agree with the above suggestion to talk to the school secretaries. They are the ones who can pull strings and cut red tape for you. Hopefully you already have a good relationship with them!

[NanceXToo]

I don't think age of compulsory attendance is at all relevant, because they aren't threatening you with the possibility of a truancy hearing.

 

Right, I know... I just hoped it would also work in my favor... that they'd be more lenient with absences for a specific reason since she doesn't legally HAVE to be there anyway. And this has never come up before, it's a one time thing. So not like I've been taking advantage, I mean.

 

The relevant point is that she is currently enrolled. In order to stay enrolled she needs to follow school and district guidelines. If she doesn't, she risks losing her slot.

 

Yeah, makes sense.

 

As long as there's not a wait list for her school, it seems likely that she'd be granted readmission after your trip.

 

I hope so! I'm hoping to get confirmation on that.

 

Worst case scenario, maybe she wouldn't be granted readmission until Fall 2011, assuming they allow new students her age.

 

I guess so. I hope that doesn't happen! She'd be bored/lonely staying home all day with just me and her younger siblings, she likes to be with peers and she does a work mentor program and so on at school. She wouldn't have as much opportunity from home, in her particular case (says the homeschooler).

 

I agree with the above suggestion to talk to the school secretaries. They are the ones who can pull strings and cut red tape for you. Hopefully you already have a good relationship with them!

 

I really don't have any relationship with them at all. I don't know any of their names and doubt any of them know mine.

[Joanne]

What a mess.

 

I hope, after you get this settled, you have a GREAT vacation!

[angela in ohio]

Honestly, this letter will likely be handed off to the same person at the district wh made the decision in the first place. Superintendents generally deal with school-wide issues, not individual student matters. If you don't get any answers from the pecial ed person, you could always try it, of course.

 

I wouldn't worry about not knowing the secretaries. That must depend on your district, because in dh's district, the secretary would not have any say in this. :confused:

[NanceXToo]

Well, the special ed person called me back! She said that they DO have to take her back and that I will NOT have a problem re-enrolling her when i return! All I have to do is bring in her birth certificate and two proofs of residence and maybe fill out a form when I return, and that she will have no trouble getting right back into the school.

 

And I won't even have to have her do school-assigned work while we're away having fun since she won't be enrolled in school during that time period. :D

 

She asked that I just send in a note saying that I will be exercising that option so they have a heads up, and that was that.

 

So it doesn't seem like it will be a big deal, and hopefully she's right/being forthright about this.

[elfgivas]

just to be on the safe side, i would suggest sending her an email or a certified letter, with copies to you and your dh and the school principal, thanking her for calling you back and then saying something like:

i appreciate the information that there will be no difficulty re-enrolling her upon our return, etc, etc and stating that you would send a letter as she suggested...

 

good luck!

ann

[QueenCat]

 

She asked that I just send in a note saying that I will be exercising that option so they have a heads up, and that was that.

 

So it doesn't seem like it will be a big deal, and hopefully she's right/being forthright about this.

 

I would ask if they will re-instate her current IEP, or if you'll have to start from scratch, like a totally new student. And if she'll be able to jump right back in to all of her current programs.

[Tullia]

Sounds like this will work! The only other suggestion I'd have is to double-check in advance what you'll need to provide for showing residency. It's probably the same thing you provided when she first enrolled, but in case it's changed you won't be scrambling around after vacation.

[JFSinIL]

Haven't read the other replies yet - my 19-yr-old is also at a special needs school, paid for by our local district. My concern would be if the school would not hold her spot at the school past ten days - would she be able to get back into the school? Here the private placement schools have wait lists.

[Starr]

Take her, take the school work, see what gets done...document field tripish activities. Have fun!

[angela in ohio]

I just don't get why these people cannot ever see outside the box.

 

Probably because people who have made it their life's work to assist special needs students transition through life skills don't see themselves as glorified day care workers.

 

I get to see the other side of what goes into this kind of work (my dh was principal of a transitional skills center for three years,) and it isn't day care. It's a program of adults who care about the futures of these students and carefully plan their year to include all the skills they will need. Dh spent hours and hours every evening working on the new skills assessments when the facilitators decided they weren't specific enough. They carefully plan and monitor each student's progress.

 

They care about her missing not because they are ignorant, but because they actually think that special needs students are capable and deserving of the training they are receiving. In this case, yes, she may learn a lot on the trip, but many parents aren't as conscientious about making sure it's a good reason to take their student out.

Edited December 18, 2010 by angela in ohio

[Caroline]

Probably because people who have made it their life's work to assist special needs students transition through life skills don't see themselves as glorified day care workers.

 

They care about her missing not because they are ignorant, but because they actually think that special needs students are capable and deserving of the training they are receiving. In this case, yes, she may learn a lot on the trip, but many parents aren't as conscientious about making sure it's a good reason to take their student out.

 

Thank you! I work in a high school with a Transitional Academy, and those educators are dedicated to improving the lives and life skills of their students. The students are assessed on their skills, and they do earn a diploma, albeit not the same one my AP students earn, but it is a diploma nonetheless.

[Renee in NC]

I would ask if they will re-instate her current IEP, or if you'll have to start from scratch, like a totally new student. And if she'll be able to jump right back in to all of her current programs.

 

I know the answer to that - IEPs are valid for the time period specified, regardless. Even if a ew student has an IEP, the school has to follow it.

[mcconnellboys]

Do they realize that she does not fall within the compulsory school age? Because I'm thinking that's the entire problem.

 

I would contact the principal directly and explain this to him and tell him that I'd be willing to re-enroll her when we get back, but think that will be a waste of time and money for everyone, since they all understand what's happening here....