TheAutumnOak Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Hello Everyone...My name is Tahara and I am homeschooling 3 boys ages 10, 6, and 4...We have been Waldorf homeschoolers all of this time... My oldest son is struggling with reading and many concepts in general, so I decided to take a look at another method of teaching to see how to best help him since I have had a difficult time emplementing the Waldorf method...I borrowed "The Well Trained Mind" from the library and really like the ideas...It seemed to explain alot of the problems we have been having... This is where I need help...My oldest son is in the fourth grade and is very far behind...He struggles with reading and writing and many of the math concepts...I just bought the books "An Ordinary Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading" and "Writing With Ease"...I am feeling discouraged because I know that I will have to start at the beginning of these books to lay a solid foundation for him...He doesn't mind going from the beginning, but wants to be caught up to 5th grade level next year and I wonder if this is possible... Has anyone else started in the middle with a child who was behind academically?...Does anyone have any advice to give? Thanks so much in advance... Tahara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mesa Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I dont have any advice... I just wanted to say welcome to TWTM! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caitilin Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I too have no advice, but I am sure you will get some good stuff here--and Welcome!:grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I have a child with some learning disabilities so he is "behind" in some areas. My very best advice is not to be overly concerned about what level your child is working at. Just start where he is and work from there. Now is the perfect time to lay that good foundation for the future. The wonderful thing about homeschooling is that he is not really "behind". He is where he is...and that is okay.:001_smile: That said, I have been able to start where my son is and work at a somewhat accelerated pace as he is able to tolerate it. He has made a lot of gains. We school during the summer on a light schedule, which is a nice time to gain some ground for some folks. WWE has a placement test, as I recall. My fourth grader began the year working in the level 2 of this program. He has just moved into level 3. Have your son take the placement test and start at the level which fits his needs. Good luck!:001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saille Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I like what texasmama said, but I wanted to pop in and say "Welcome!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 :grouphug: I have tutored remedial students with phonics for 16 years. Most of my students get to grade level within a few months! So, it can be done!! Also, I most recently worked with a group of children whose Moms were formerly homeless and who had been in and out of inner-city Los Angeles schools. After working with them for about 2 months, two of the 3rd grade students were able to read passages at a 12th grade level. The easiest thing for you to do would be to have them watch my online phonics lessons. Most students who watch them gain a grade level or two, but I had a 19 year old who went improved at least 5 grade levels (he scored the highest grade level on the test that was given him!) I also had a 5th grade student who watched them 3 times, gaining a grade level each time. (He went from 2nd to 5th grade level.) The same basic program with slightly different format and words is in written format for you to teach yourself is on my how to tutor page. This is easier to customize because you can just spell and read a few words for units that the student knows well but do all of words for units where the student needs more practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAutumnOak Posted November 23, 2010 Author Share Posted November 23, 2010 Thanks so much for the advice and thank you so much Elizabeth for the links to your site...I just took a look at lesson one...That is a great resource you have made! Tahara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NineChoirs Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 My youngest son (12) is highly intelligent and very gifted in the arts, music drawing, acting etc... however he gets bored very easily with "book/busy work". He loves to read and write but only on his own terms (for fun, not for work). This has made him a real challenge to teach. My suggestion is to find what your son enjoys doing then build his curriculum around it. Also be willing to switch methods and approaches often. If the eyes start to glaze it is time to move on to something else. This doesn't mean they will never have to do things they don't like to do. But sometimes it is obvious that they just aren't getting anything at all from the material. There is a difference between having to do something they don't enjoy, and doing something that makes them feel like they just don't "get it". Also for certain subjects that simply reteach concepts each grade level but at higher comprehension levels such as history, geography, science (until 8th grade), grammar etc... feel free to use lower level texts. If the reading comprehension comes easy the information will be better retained. They will also find the subject less tedious and be more likely to enjoy it. Also use hands on and oral drills whenever possible. I would often find my son would fail a worksheet but answer the same questions correctly when asked verbally. Practice handwriting and composition separately from other subjects. This is probably the biggest difference in a delayed learner and a regular or advanced student. Usually it is nice to be able to combine those skills with other subjects to save time. But because delayed learners usually have focus and boredom issues, too much writing in other subjects will just make them dread said subjects. As far as literature and reading goes, have him read whatever books he might enjoy. Stick to the classics but let him go a few levels under what he would normally read if he wants to. Avoid comics and Saturday morning cartoon storyline books, these can cause children to become "lazy" readers. My kids can only read these types of books while we are at the library, they pick out their books then spend 30 minutes or so reading comics or cartoony books. This way they can read them but only in limited quantities. Have him write a brief summary or draw a picture about whatever book he reads. If you want you can discuss the books with him. As long as it demonstrates he read the book, don't demand perfection from his book summaries. Later on you can require a nicer summary presentation but imo book reports should be no longer than 1 or 2 short paragraphs until high school. Nothing sucks the fun out of reading more effectively then thinking you are going to have to write some giant essay when you are done. My youngest son's talents in the fine arts didn't truly start to emerge until I changed the way I taught him. Taking the pressure off of him payed huge dividends in the end. His understanding of all subjects has increased beyond what I could have expected. He is above grade level in all areas and he got there by often using lower level materials. It was hard for me to change my way of thinking, my older children are natural book learners and academic by nature. They learned everything quickly and painlessly and were a breeze to teach. My youngest was a definite change of pace for me and I appreciate him teaching me a new way to learn. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NineChoirs Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Just to add: As far as his grade level goes, let it be whatever it would be normally. Since you are homeschooling there is no reason to add to his anxiety by telling him he is "behind". This will only make him feel less confident. He is at the level he is at. Grade levels before high school are for the most part, arbitrary. Simply a way to count the years before high school. Sometimes a student moves faster, sometimes they need a bit more time. Simply tell him he is in the grade level he would normally be in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelBee Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Just to add: As far as his grade level goes, let it be whatever it would be normally. Since you are homeschooling there is no reason to add to his anxiety by telling him he is "behind". This will only make him feel less confident. He is at the level he is at. Grade levels before high school are for the most part, arbitrary. Simply a way to count the years before high school. Sometimes a student moves faster, sometimes they need a bit more time. Simply tell him he is in the grade level he would normally be in. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melissel Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I don't have any advice for you but wanted to say :seeya: from over here on your local HSing loop :D I'm glad you found your way over. You will find SO MUCH help and knowledge here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone43 Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 :bigear: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Hello Everyone...My name is Tahara and I am homeschooling 3 boys ages 10, 6, and 4...We have been Waldorf homeschoolers all of this time... My oldest son is struggling with reading and many concepts in general, so I decided to take a look at another method of teaching to see how to best help him since I have had a difficult time emplementing the Waldorf method...I borrowed "The Well Trained Mind" from the library and really like the ideas...It seemed to explain alot of the problems we have been having... This is where I need help...My oldest son is in the fourth grade and is very far behind...He struggles with reading and writing and many of the math concepts...I just bought the books "An Ordinary Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading" and "Writing With Ease"...I am feeling discouraged because I know that I will have to start at the beginning of these books to lay a solid foundation for him...He doesn't mind going from the beginning, but wants to be caught up to 5th grade level next year and I wonder if this is possible... Has anyone else started in the middle with a child who was behind academically?...Does anyone have any advice to give? Thanks so much in advance... Tahara Hi there Tahara! I'm kind of in the same place as you.. and I see our DC are relatively similar in age too. :001_smile: I "discovered" TWTM around 18 months ago and as I read it, so many things fell into place for me. We were complete unschoolers so I have literally done a 180 deg. turn! To be honest I still like the Steiner/Waldorf way of educating little ones and believe that a hands on, physical learning process is great until the child is around 5 or 6; my son is 5.5 and he recently began to show an interest in "doing school" with his sisters so I have made the most of that enthusiasm. With my older two girls it was quite different, I don't actually remember if they were interested in reading at 5yo because I was so focussed on them "just being kids". DD11 is very much a Language Arts person and she learned to read partly with my mum and partly with me, becoming fluent around age 6.5; DD9 does not find English easy, so I left her to it and she eventually taught herself, without hardly any intervention from anyone, at around 7.5yo, becoming fluent by the time she was 8. For both of them, their knowledge of phonics, spelling, grammar and punctuation is well behind average grade level and I am left with the guilty feeling that I have done my girls a great disservice. I hope that we will at least be able to catch up to a certain extent. We mostly use the recommended curricula in TWTM, as you can see from my sig. Both DD11 and DD9 are using Saxon 6/5 and working through it together; DD11 is on Rod and Staff Grammar 3, Spelling Workout D, MCP Word Study D, Diana Hanbury King's Cursive Writing for Left Handed Students, Writing with Ease 3; DD9 is on R&S Grammar 2, Spelling Workout B, MCP Phonics B, CLP Handwriting with Grace, WWE 2. As you can see, some of this is quite behind their grade level, but I would rather go through this properly so they know it and become confident at it before we attempt harder work. After New Year I hope to add Apologia Elementary Science, SOTW (with added material as and when), Nallenart French (L'art de Lire), Song School Latin, and Music Theory. I teach them Piano in fits and starts. I've found that it's really hard to start in the middle and I recently wrote a post on this Board about how I felt a failure because we never seemed to manage to get everything done - or if we did, then the housework didn't get done. I got a lot of support and encouragement so I would really recommend you come on here and ask for help whenever you need it. There are some amazingly generous people on here who give freely of their time and expertise! Partly because of this support, advice, and encouragement I've pared down what we were trying to do to just the basics - the 3R's, if you like - and am getting going steadily first, before I attempt to add in anything else. HTH! Blessings, Hedgehog x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlugbill Posted November 24, 2010 Share Posted November 24, 2010 Sorry to hear about your son's situation. First of all, relax. It's not a problem at all, even though it seems that way to you. It will all work out. Don't worry about him being "behind". He is where he is supposed to be for him. Some children learn to read later and quickly go into higher level work. It's not necessarily a sign that he will have trouble down the road. I suggest that you use multiple approaches, but just use each one for small amounts of time (5-10 min.) daily. Long periods of making him read to you or doing worksheets, etc. can make reading seem a very tedious task. Yes, do the phonics, but only for very short periods of time. I know Waldorf doesn't advocate early reading and there is some wisdom to that. Now, he should be able to learn to read because he is developed. I used to be a boy myself, and I know how boys look at reading. The women who teach them often use methods that they like, rather than using what the boy is interested in. Many boys actually view reading as a chore and/or a girl thing math. If he can read with his dad some or at least see his dad reading some, it will help. Boys often prefer non-fiction, but female teachers, librarians, etc. often tell them to read classic children's fiction, which does not hold some boys' interest. Find subjects he is interested in and find non-fiction books, articles, magazines, etc. that involve that interest- cars or computers or whatever he is interested in. It is counter-intuitive, but the same boy who won't sit and listen to Charlotte's Web will be very interested if you give him the owner's manual for your car to read. I read all the time, but rarely read fiction books. I read newspapers, magazines, on-line reading, etc. but only rarely do I read a fiction book. Get him a subscription to a magazine that might interest him. When kids get their own magazine in the mail, they are excited and want to read to him. Here is what I recommend: -Good phonics program -Read to him daily (if you do nothing else, do this one!) -Have a silent reading time at home for 15 minutes/day when everyone reads (including you). -Let him stay up a little extra at night to read after he is in bed, ready for sleep (have a lamp next to his bed) -Put a bookshelf in his room and give him a bunch of books he might be interested in -Weekly library trips -Do some sort of short writing practice daily- reading and writing go together -Have him read to one of his younger siblings daily -If he really doesn't read at all (as opposed to just being a poor reader), I recommend "Teach Your Child to Read in 100 Easy Lessons" -Use a good language arts program, such as Rod & Staff, CLE, Hake Grammar, Spectrum books, etc. Best wishes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAutumnOak Posted November 25, 2010 Author Share Posted November 25, 2010 Thanks so much everyone for your advice...I really appreciate the thoughtful responses :001_smile: I have one more thing to get advice about...My oldest son is 10 and has a September birthday...In a Waldorf school, he would be in the 4th grade because they start first grade at 7, but in a public school he would be old enough to be in 5th grade...I am wondering if along with his "catch up" work should I include some logic since he is old enough for 5th grade or just leave it until next year?...I am concerned about not meeting him where he is developmentally...I am also seriously considering starting our year now, which would give us a January start next year... Again, thanks in advance for any advice... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LUV2EDU Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 (edited) Welcome to the board, Tahara. :party: Here is a free reading curriculum, just in case. It is for children 4 to 10 years old. http://www.progressivephonics.com/ Edited November 25, 2010 by LUV2EDU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Thanks so much everyone for your advice...I really appreciate the thoughtful responses :001_smile: I have one more thing to get advice about...My oldest son is 10 and has a September birthday...In a Waldorf school, he would be in the 4th grade because they start first grade at 7, but in a public school he would be old enough to be in 5th grade...I am wondering if along with his "catch up" work should I include some logic since he is old enough for 5th grade or just leave it until next year?...I am concerned about not meeting him where he is developmentally...I am also seriously considering starting our year now, which would give us a January start next year... Again, thanks in advance for any advice... We are planning (long-term) to move back to Canada, and a couple of months ago, I was having a chat with a friend of mine and we were discussing how that from state to state and from one Canadian province to another, the intake is set differently. For example, here in the UK, the school year and birthday intake runs from September - August; my eldest, who was 11 in October, is one of the oldest in Year 6. Where my friend lives in Canada however, although the school year still runs September - August, the birthday intake is January - December, so my DD11 would be one of the youngest in Grade 6. (This makes a difference because in Canada the compulsory age to start education is a little later than in the UK.) I posted about this on the board, only to find that there's even more variation than that - some even run March - February! Prior to realising this, I had DD11 down as Grade 5 and had set our standards accordingly. We are behind anyway, but the standard of Grade 5 was reachable in the foreseeable future. Discovering that she would actually be reckoned to be in Grade 6 means that I have even more catching up to do, if I was trying to get her on par with the PSs. However, I have realised that pressurizing my DD to catch up isn't going to help anyone, especially her. It doesn't make any difference to what we can achieve in the here and now, particularly since we have quite a lot of remedial spelling and phonics learning to do. We just have to jog along and do what we can. We might catch up eventually, or we may not. DH and I have decided that if DD11 ends up finishing high school a year later than most other young people, then not to worry. The extra year's maturity might do her good. The point is that she is now receiving a thorough education, which is specifically tailored to her age, ability, and aptitude. I'm happy, she's happy, and for the most part, enjoying learning. :001_smile: HTH! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jyniffrec Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 Sorry to hear about your son's situation. First of all, relax. It's not a problem at all, even though it seems that way to you. It will all work out. Don't worry about him being "behind". He is where he is supposed to be for him. Some children learn to read later and quickly go into higher level work. It's not necessarily a sign that he will have trouble down the road. I suggest that you use multiple approaches, but just use each one for small amounts of time (5-10 min.) daily. Long periods of making him read to you or doing worksheets, etc. can make reading seem a very tedious task. Yes, do the phonics, but only for very short periods of time. I know Waldorf doesn't advocate early reading and there is some wisdom to that. Now, he should be able to learn to read because he is developed. I used to be a boy myself, and I know how boys look at reading. The women who teach them often use methods that they like, rather than using what the boy is interested in. Many boys actually view reading as a chore and/or a girl thing math. If he can read with his dad some or at least see his dad reading some, it will help. Boys often prefer non-fiction, but female teachers, librarians, etc. often tell them to read classic children's fiction, which does not hold some boys' interest. Find subjects he is interested in and find non-fiction books, articles, magazines, etc. that involve that interest- cars or computers or whatever he is interested in. It is counter-intuitive, but the same boy who won't sit and listen to Charlotte's Web will be very interested if you give him the owner's manual for your car to read. I read all the time, but rarely read fiction books. I read newspapers, magazines, on-line reading, etc. but only rarely do I read a fiction book. Get him a subscription to a magazine that might interest him. When kids get their own magazine in the mail, they are excited and want to read to him. Here is what I recommend: -Good phonics program -Read to him daily (if you do nothing else, do this one!) -Have a silent reading time at home for 15 minutes/day when everyone reads (including you). -Let him stay up a little extra at night to read after he is in bed, ready for sleep (have a lamp next to his bed) -Put a bookshelf in his room and give him a bunch of books he might be interested in -Weekly library trips -Do some sort of short writing practice daily- reading and writing go together -Have him read to one of his younger siblings daily -If he really doesn't read at all (as opposed to just being a poor reader), I recommend "Teach Your Child to Read in 100 Easy Lessons" -Use a good language arts program, such as Rod & Staff, CLE, Hake Grammar, Spectrum books, etc. Best wishes. :iagree: I have taken a very similar approach with my son. My husband is similar in these things as well. We use Sonlight but ds never reads the fiction readers. I have ds in FFL1 because it is all verbal (or you can make it that way). He and his younger sister love it and I know he is getting a solid foundation in grammar. My only other advice is to get him audiobooks, especially ones that would be beneficial but that he probably wouldn't read himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasmama Posted November 25, 2010 Share Posted November 25, 2010 In my opinion, always go with where a child is developmentally and you cannot go wrong. Following a "grade level", which is arbitrary really and changes depending on where you may live, doesn't benefit the child if the work is not developmentally appropriate for that child. If you plan to put him into public or private school at some point, then you might want to pay more attention to what these schools in your area are doing grade by grade, but otherwise, no need exists to do so, in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamonaQ Posted November 29, 2010 Share Posted November 29, 2010 (edited) Hello! Welcome! I just saw this post (catching up over the break!) My ds was also very behind in reading/ writing at age 10. Prior, I had been doing a pretty relaxed approach, and doing all his work orally with me doing a lot of reading. By 10, I was really getting concerned. At that point, I began to explore if he had dyslexia, as it was something that ran in my dh family. My feeling at this stage would be to really work on phonics. I think Elizabeth's lessons are a great place to start. I would say if you are not making noticeable gains that you may want to research more remedial phonics, Barton is one curriculum that comes to mind that many homeschoolers use. Another thought would be to make sure that there are no visual issues going on, so a visit to a developmental optometrist might be something to consider. A writing program that we have had great success is Verticy Composition/Grammar which is based on the Diana Hansbury King Writing Skills books. I can't say enough glowing reports about these, and you could most certainly use the Writing Skills books stand-alone. Finally, my other suggestions is have him read along with audio. I say get engaging books in areas your child is interested in (Percy Jackson, Hatchet, My Side of the Mountain, Eragon were all popular with my ds) and have him follow along. This will do two-fold, continue to expose him to the written word, but also have him learning as he reads, and not causing him to struggle over words he doesn't know. Audio books alone are great too. You just want to have lots of exposure to literature. You really want to meet him intellectually where he is at, not holding him back in any way while you are bringing his reading skills up. Finally, one of the sub-forums here is the Special Needs board and the posters over there have LOTS of experience with remediating reading, among other things. Welcome!!!! Edited November 29, 2010 by RamonaQ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OregonNative Posted November 29, 2010 Share Posted November 29, 2010 I just wanted to say WELCOME!! This forum is incredible and the women are so friendly and helpful. :Angel_anim: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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