Grammar help needed with this sentence

[MIch elle]

Sometimes, Charlie had trouble motivating himself to do his work.

 

What part of speech is "motivating"?

[8filltheheart]

Sometimes, Charlie had trouble motivating himself to do his work.

 

What part of speech is "motivating"?

 

Participle modifying trouble.

[MIch elle]

Participle modifying trouble.

 

 

I couldn't figure it out. I subbed today and the teacher told the 6th grade students it was the verb. His answer didn't make sense to me. Thank you!

[angela in ohio]

I couldn't figure it out. I subbed today and the teacher told the 6th grade students it was the verb. His answer didn't make sense to me. Thank you!

 

I can't help wondering what she said 'had' was? :001_smile:

[MIch elle]

I can't help wondering what she said 'had' was? :001_smile:

 

I mentioned "has" to him when the class was doing quiet seatwork but he didn't explain, and I didn't want to correct the teacher. ACK! What do you do when you know the teacher is wrong (when you're only the "sub")?

 

I knew "motivating" was a verbal but couldn't come up with the diagram in my head at the time of the class. He only did this ONE word in the sentence as part of vocabulary/grammar lesson. No other discussion of sentence parts, parts of speech, etc. were discussed in this sentence or in general. I wrote the sentence down to think about later because I knew he was wrong. The rest of the class time was spent discussing the rising action in the book Hatchet.

 

BTW, he's been a teacher for 9 years.

Edited October 15, 2010 by MIch elle

[angela in ohio]

I mentioned "has" to him when the class was doing quiet seatwork but he didn't explain, and I didn't want to correct the teacher. ACK! What do you do when you know the teacher is wrong (when you're only the "sub")?

 

I knew "motivating" was a verbal but couldn't come up with the diagram in my head at the time of the class. He only did this ONE word in the sentence as part of vocabulary/grammar lesson. No other discussion of sentence parts, parts of speech, etc. were discussed in this sentence or in general. I wrote the sentence down to think about later because I knew he was wrong. The rest of the class time was spent discussing the rising action in the book Hatchet.

 

BTW, he's been a teacher for 9 years.

 

There is very little grammar content in most teacher college programs for English. I looked at many when I thought I wanted to be an English teacher. Most of the time is spend on reading and literature. I used to be very suprised by how little English teachers know about grammar, but I'm not anymore.

[christine in al]

I don't have my glasses , I'm I'm supposed to be downstairs with the family not talking to my " imaginary friends"

but, I'd love to know what a participle is and what a verbal is.

~c.

Edited October 16, 2010 by christine in al
participle,,, not ...particiPAL ... sigh can't see, can't spell

[Mallory]

If no one questioned him and he didn't explain the rest of the sentance, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt and say he picked a sentance wrote it down and then carelessly picked the wrong word.

 

I mean it looks like a verb and I have been known to say the wrong answer, even if I really do know what I am talking about.

[Matryoshka]

I don't have my glasses , I'm I'm supposed to be downstairs with the family not talking to my " imaginary friends"

but, I'd love to know what a participle is and what a verbal is.

~c.

 

There are two types of participle: past and present. The past participle is usually formed by adding -ed to the verb; it is often but not always identical to the simple past tense of a verb (though there are many irregulars). The present participle is formed by adding -ing. So, for the verb "to motivate"

 

Past participle: motivated

Present participle: motivating

 

Verbals are when either participle or the infinitive are used as a part of speech other than a verb in a sentence: a noun, adjective or adverb.

 

A participle cannot be the verb in a sentence when used alone. Participles are only part of the verb in a sentence when they are used with conjugated helping verbs. If they are verbs, they will show up in one of these forms:

 

The present partciple is used with the verb "to be" to form the progressive tenses:

 

He is motivating the students.

 

The past participle is used with the verb "to have" to form the perfect tenses:

 

He had motivated the students.

 

It is also used with the verb "to be" to form the passive voice:

 

The students were motivated by him.

 

It drives me nuts how little instruction is given in grammar curriculum on the proper formation of verbs in English! It's just "there are helping verbs; memorize the list" - not why they're there or when they're used. :glare:

[8filltheheart]

I mentioned "has" to him when the class was doing quiet seatwork but he didn't explain, and I didn't want to correct the teacher. ACK! What do you do when you know the teacher is wrong (when you're only the "sub")?

 

I knew "motivating" was a verbal but couldn't come up with the diagram in my head at the time of the class. He only did this ONE word in the sentence as part of vocabulary/grammar lesson. No other discussion of sentence parts, parts of speech, etc. were discussed in this sentence or in general. I wrote the sentence down to think about later because I knew he was wrong. The rest of the class time was spent discussing the rising action in the book Hatchet.

 

BTW, he's been a teacher for 9 years.

 

I wouldn't have known the answer based on my teacher training. I learned grammar homeschooling.

 

FWIW, it is why I appreciate what diagramming forces you to do. You could never have labeled it a verb if you were diagramming the sentence. I honestly see it as a pretty significant error.

 

My 6th grader diagrammed sentences today similar to the example. These are from AG:

 

Feeling suddenly bored by her guests, the hostess stifled a yawn.

The store was packed with customers Christmas shopping and looking for bargains.

 

(If she had been in his classroom, she would have objected to it being called a verb! :lol:)

[Mallory]

I honestly see it as a pretty significant error.

 

I agree that it is a pretty signifigant error, and as a student I would have called him out. But since no one did and he wasn't even given the chance to say "Oh my gosh, I can't believe I did that." I'll still give him a chance.

 

There have been plenty of times both as a teacher before I had kids, or homeschooling, or even talking at other organizations when I would make stupid mistakes. It happens, but if it wasn't brought to my attention, in the midst of teaching class, making sure everyone has their books open, I know where my next book or example is, etc.- there is plenty of room for an honest mistake.

 

Now if someone mentioned it and he argued for it being the verb that is different.

[Penelope]

 

 

 

A participle cannot be the verb in a sentence when used alone. Participles are only part of the verb in a sentence when they are used with conjugated helping verbs. If they are verbs, they will show up in one of these forms:

 

The present partciple is used with the verb "to be" to form the progressive tenses:

 

He is motivating the students.

 

The past participle is used with the verb "to have" to form the perfect tenses:

 

He had motivated the students.

 

It is also used with the verb "to be" to form the passive voice:

 

The students were motivated by him.

 

 

 

What about, He motivated the students ?

[angela in ohio]

What about, He motivated the students ?

 

In your sentence, motivated is the past tense (sometimes called the past simple,) and not the past participle. It can be the same as the past participle or different, depending on the word. Ate/eaten would be an example of different past and past participles.

[Matryoshka]

What about, He motivated the students ?

 

That is the simple past. For regular verbs in English, the simple past and the past participle look identical (but are still used differently). The difference is more obvious with some irregular verbs:

 

To eat

ate - simple past

eaten - past participle

 

To sing

sang - simple past

sung - past participle

 

Although with other irregulars, they still look identical

 

To sit

sat - simple past

sat - past participle

 

Seems like since verbs don't change much with tense and mood in English, there's been some decision to just not bother teaching the details... :glare:

[8filltheheart]

What about, He motivated the students ?

 

On thing I teach my kids is that you cannot determine a part of speech based on the word itself: you must have the word within the context of a sentence.

 

Motivate is a verb in your sentence. However, that does not mean the word motivate is always a verb.

 

Here are the examples I posted yesterday that my dd was diagramming for participles:

 

Feeling (participle) suddenly bored by her guests, the hostess stifled (verb) a yawn.

 

The store was packed (verb) with customers Christmas shopping and looking (participles) for bargains.

 

I could easily change the verbs to participles and the participles to verbs (though the sentences might not be as well written):

 

Stifling (participle) a yawn, the hostess felt (verb) bored by her guests.

 

Packing (participle) the store, customers shopped for Christmas and looked (verbs) for bargains.

 

W/o context, we can't know a part of speech.

[Penelope]

I did know that in my sentence, motivated is simple past tense. I misread matroyshka's post and thought it was saying something it was not. :)

 

Participles, verbals, gerunds, ack! I have so much grammar to relearn. Many thanks for the explanations.