Sequence of Algebra, Geometry, Algebra

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Can someone explain to me the reasoning behind Algebra 1, Geometry, Algebra 2 sequence?

Math is my daughters strongest subject (unlike her mother :001_smile:).

She is doing amazing at Algebra 1 and I was thinking it just makes sense to go straight into Algebra 2.

Or doesn't it?

We are using Saxon math and I was going to do the separate Geometry and Algebra 2 textbooks.

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Or doesn't it?

not if she is going to continue beyond Algebra 2.

Geometry texts typically have plenty of opportunities for students to continue with their Algebra skills, so they aren't rusty when they get to Algebra 2. OTOH, if a student does Algebra 2, then Geometry, and tries to take Trig or Pre-Calc, it will have been a long time since Algebra 2, and it will be a difficult transition.

HTH

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I've heard that the main reason is so that the student will have completed Geometry by the time they take the PSAT in 11th grade. I've had 2 people I highly respect (the author/owner of Art of Problem Solving and the author of Life of Fred) tell me that they think it's best for students to do Algebra 2 before Geometry so the child will be more mature when he/she takes Geometry. I believe they said this was because the proofs and reasoning in Geometry require a more mature mind.

Since my kids will be done with Geometry before they take the PSAT even if we take the Algebra 1/Algebra 2/Geometry route that is the one we are taking. If they weren't than I would have them take Algebra 2 and Geometry at the same time. We use Life of Fred (and probably Art of Problem Solving with a different ds) the year after we finish a math course with my main math curricula so the year we are doing Geometry with my main curricula they will also be working on Algebra 2 in either LoF or AoPS so there is nothing to forget, and what they learned the previous year will have been expanded. If you choose a curricula that prefers this sequence it will likely have Algebra 2 review in Geometry, just like how publishers that take the Geometry/Algebra 2 sequence have Algebra 1 review in their Geometry book. However, it's easy to supplement with another curricula so nothing is forgotten before Pre-Calculus.

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Can someone explain to me the reasoning behind Algebra 1, Geometry, Algebra 2 sequence?

Math is my daughters strongest subject (unlike her mother :001_smile:).

She is doing amazing at Algebra 1 and I was thinking it just makes sense to go straight into Algebra 2.

Or doesn't it?

We are using Saxon math and I was going to do the separate Geometry and Algebra 2 textbooks.

I really don't know the reason for the sequence but it seems to go either way...

I am inclined to think that students who excell in math go the route of Algebra 1, Algebra 2, then Geometry. Maybe so they can take chemistry right after taking algebra 2?

For our ps school district, if students are in accelerated math program and take algebra 1 in 8th grade.. they take honors algebra 2 in 9th grade and then honors geometry in 10th. But students who take algebra 1 in 9th grade take geometry in 10th and algebra 2 in 11th grade.

Since we pulled out twins out of ps summer between 8th and 9th grades... we went with what we thought was best for our twins.

For Ds: he took algebra 1 in ps 8th grade. Algebra 2 and geometry in 9th grade, and now is taking precalculus in 10th grade. He is also "reviewing" algebra and geometry for the SAT in spring for Math Level II. Even though his test scores say he is solid in algebra and geometry, we are just making sure he stays that way, so he is doing some SAT math practice CD's. Just a 5-10 minutes a day of review.

For Dd: she felt she had some gaps in her algebra 1 and she felt that getting a B in algebra I in 8th grade wasn't good enough. So last year in 9th grade she reviewed algebra I and then started algebra II mid year. She is finishing up algebra II this year in 10th grade and then will do geometry rest of the year and into the summer so she can take precalc next year in 11th grade.

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I really don't know the reason for the sequence but it seems to go either way...

I am inclined to think that students who excell in math go the route of Algebra 1, Algebra 2, then Geometry. Maybe so they can take chemistry right after taking algebra 2?

For our ps school district, if students are in accelerated math program and take algebra 1 in 8th grade.. they take honors algebra 2 in 9th grade and then honors geometry in 10th. But students who take algebra 1 in 9th grade take geometry in 10th and algebra 2 in 11th grade.

Since we pulled out twins out of ps summer between 8th and 9th grades... we went with what we thought was best for our twins.

For Ds: he took algebra 1 in ps 8th grade. Algebra 2 and geometry in 9th grade, and now is taking precalculus in 10th grade. He is also "reviewing" algebra and geometry for the SAT in spring for Math Level II. Even though his test scores say he is solid in algebra and geometry, we are just making sure he stays that way, so he is doing some SAT math practice CD's. Just a 5-10 minutes a day of review.

For Dd: she felt she had some gaps in her algebra 1 and she felt that getting a B in algebra I in 8th grade wasn't good enough. So last year in 9th grade she reviewed algebra I and then started algebra II mid year. She is finishing up algebra II this year in 10th grade and then will do geometry rest of the year and into the summer so she can take precalc next year in 11th grade.

If this student did Algebra 2 in 10th and Geometry in 11th than they wouldn't have completed Geometry before they take the PSAT in the fall of 11th grade, and I think that is why so many publishers take this sequence. Not because its better but because many students (since many take Algebra 1 in 9th grade) wouldn't have Geometry completed before the PSAT if they took Algebra 2 after Algebra 1.

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We've been using Saxon too, and we did Houghton Mifflin geometry between the two algebras. The proofs were much more challenging than the level incorporated into the Saxon texts, but honestly, I don't think it was at all necessary. My dd is doing advanced math this year, and she's flying through the proofs since it's all just review of what she did the year before last. I added the geometry because I thought it was necessary, and because I wanted to slow her down.

I would recommend just going from Algebra1 to Algebra 2. She'll be getting lots of geometry especially in algebra 2 and advanced math.

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Geometry only reinforces Algebra 1 skills.

If a student completes Geometry after Algebra 2 they will have a more difficult time in Pre-Calc. Most Pre-Calc texts/classes have VERY LITTLE review--and taking a whole year off from higher Algebra concepts makes this transition harder (and frustrating) for the student.

Geometry is great for logic--but students need a solid foundation in Algebra if they will be moving on to college Maths... Geometry is not a pre-requisite for college Maths... some texts have an intro to basic Trig--but it is still not 'necessary'.

I rather see a student take Geometry and Algebra 2 concurrently than see Geometry worked AFTER Algebra 2.

*** On a more personal note--I took Algebra 1, Algebra 2 and Geometry-- (my school only offered Geometry every other year). I was at a SERIOUS disadvantage from day 1 of my Pre-Calc class in 11th grade... I ended up dropping the course (but I did meet DH in that class so it wasn't a total loss!)... I studied on my own to review Algebra 2 then took College Algebra and Trig (same as pre-Calc) dual enrollment my Sr year at the local university.

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According to the author of VTI, it's because schools used to only offer Algebra and Geometry. Then, when everyone wanted to improve math and science performance in the U.S., the new standard became three years of math. So schools realized they never finished the Algebra book anyway, so they could do the last half of that for the third year. That way students who only do two years still get some of each, too.

I have no idea how accurate that is, but it seems like the way many educational standards are developed. :D

We are doing Alg I, Alg II, Geometry. We do Alg I before 9th grade, so they will come out all right for their PSAT. I also don't have to plan fo a school full of children who might take various numbers of years of math. I know my dc will take four years. :001_smile:

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I rather see a student take Geometry and Algebra 2 concurrently than see Geometry worked AFTER Algebra 2.

Any chance you could elaborate on how this would work? Would you recommend stretching the combined course over two years? What would pair well with the Lial Int. Algebra?

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This only works if they are treated as 2 separate subjects.. so there has to be enough time in the school day to allow for aprox. 2 hrs of Math per day..

The student is taking 2 FULL courses... the students I have who do this work on each subject at least 4 days per week.... but I've also seen it done on more of a block schedule--with Algebra 2 days and Geometry 2 days... I don't like this one as much because there ends up being a large gap between lessons in each subject.

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not if she is going to continue beyond Algebra 2.

Geometry texts typically have plenty of opportunities for students to continue with their Algebra skills, so they aren't rusty when they get to Algebra 2. OTOH, if a student does Algebra 2, then Geometry, and tries to take Trig or Pre-Calc, it will have been a long time since Algebra 2, and it will be a difficult transition.

HTH

:iagree: BTW, I do have a math degree if that gives any validity to my opinion.

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:iagree: BTW, I do have a math degree if that gives any validity to my opinion.

So do the people who told me that Algebra 1, Algrebra 2, Geometry was preferred :D It's also not difficult to supplement Geometry with some Algebra 2 to keep it fresh.

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I don't have a math degree - so feel free to ignore everything I say. I think there's a club with a large membership already formed. :lol:

I wouldn't recommend a break between algebra 2 and pre-calculus either. It's much easier to keep algebra 1 fresh, or do a quick review after geometry than it is to do the same with algebra 2 - IMO. My dd agrees. She doesn't have a degree either though. :lol:

(Last year I would have thought this sequence was fine, but with her doing advanced now, it's obvious that it would not have been a good way to go.)

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• 1 month later...

My .02 :001_smile:

My older daughter had a hard time finding a good fit with Algebra. She loves Geometry. So, in order to get her through the required maths before testing she is currently working on Algebra II and Geometry concurrently. She does Geometry everyday and Algebra II 3x's a week.

For my mathy daughter I plan to follow the Alg. I, Alg. II, Geometry, Trig sequence. She will done with time to spare.

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