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As to some males being "very unhappy" being circumcised I've never met any man, ever, who is unhappy that he was circumcised. Where the few friends I've had who were not circumcised were the "very unhappy" ones, and the only males I've ever known to have UTIs.

I don't doubt that no one you have met is unhappy (i.e I have no reason to believe you would lie) however, other people have met men who are not happy they are circumcised. I have had a long discussion on the issue with one man who is very bitter indeed about it, and it had nothing to do with complications or infections but simply that a piece of him was removed without his permission. Sure many men may be very happy with their circed status, but don't dismiss the real distress of those men who are not happy. The simple fact is that if you circumcise your son, he could end up either happy or unhappy about the fact it was done to him.

 

eta: My boys were born in NZ, it's considered fairly barbaric to circumcise a boy there. It never occured to me to even do it, in fact the first time I realised it was still done was when I was pregnant with DD and joined a US based online Mom to be group. Males in our family, for at least 3 generations, have been intact.

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http://www.examiner.com/family-health-in-washington-dc/new-study-estimates-neonatal-circumcision-death-rate-higher-than-suffocation-and-auto-accidents

 

My son is 11, so it didn't effect my decision. The study may be flawe, I haven't looked at it. I have looked at the studies saying circuncision lowers rates of HIV and I find those flawed. I decided condoms made more sense than genital surgery.

 

And saying intact men are less clean is just not true. The penis is no more dirty than a vagina, neither needs special cleaning.

Funny, because the two anti-circ drs I met both tried to convince me that studies showed that men that were intact were less likely to get HIV or other STDS.

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As to some males being "very unhappy" being circumcised I've never met any man, ever, who is unhappy that he was circumcised. Where the few friends I've had who were not circumcised were the "very unhappy" ones, and the only males I've ever known to have UTIs.

 

Bill

There are websites, Bill ;)

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I've never known of any friends or acquaintances who have had problems themselves or with children--while the few who haven't circumcised their children have had the infection and adhesion and retraction issues.

 

Bill, we've had trouble with years of infections in one of our circ'd sons. No problems with our intact son (you aren't supposed to retract...it will eventually retract on it's own with age and maturing. Those that retract are the the ones introducing infections to their child and thus the infections. Like the vagina, until it retracts on it's own, it is a self cleansing organ).

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In some ways I would rather not have had them circed, but something that impacted my decision was the fact that when my sister started having tea with her intact dh, she had quite a few infections for awhile. Her previous experiences had been with circed men and she had not had that problem. Her sons are not circed though as she thinks it's barbaric.

 

 

I had quite a few urinary tract infections soon after I got married. My dh is circumcised.

 

Urinary and vaginal infection, here. Dh is circ'ed.

I was *freaking* out, but my ob/gyn insisted it was just my body adjusting to a new partner and, um... large quantities of teA. :blushing:

Definitely not foreskin related!

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Two intact sons. I would never do something so barbaric and unnecessary to my children.

 

While my very smart and sensible (circ'd) husband was completely on board with leaving our children intact, it wouldn't have mattered to me if he had wanted them circumcised. I would never have consented to it and did not consent when my first husband insisted he wanted my oldest son circumcised. Dad can do whatever he wants with HIS penis, but he isn't cutting anyone else's. Not in this family.

 

This. I'm glad my husband was on the same page as me, because I am NOT a mama who's going to 'leave it up to dad' whether a piece of my baby gets cut off. I would never consent to it no matter what my husband thought.

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As a mom of 3 boys, all circumcised. I have differing views on this for us.

I was VERY young when I had my oldest, only 20 and we had him circ'd. No thought of it, no research, just did it. He had no problems.

 

When son # 2 came along 6 years later, still no research, we just did it. A few minor problems but nothing big.

 

When son # 3 came along, 9 years after son 1, we did it again. Same thing, just did it no real thoughts about not doing it.

Well, it didn't turn out so great. He has had bladder and other problems since infancy. When, he was 6, we took him to see a pediatric urologist. This nice Doc, examined him and asked him if it hurt went he went potty. My sweet little boy answered " Yes, but isn't it supposed too?"

I cried. My son thought it was supposed to hurt every time he went potty and didn't know the difference.

So, the Dr.s did surgery to fix the mistakes of the circumcision.

He was like a different little boy after that.

If I knew then what I know now, I think I would have made a different choice or at least a more informed choice.

 

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1.03.01

Edited by Jilly6
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As to some males being "very unhappy" being circumcised I've never met any man, ever, who is unhappy that he was circumcised. Where the few friends I've had who were not circumcised were the "very unhappy" ones, and the only males I've ever known to have UTIs.

 

Bill

 

 

I'm just pondering exactly how these conversations come up :lol:.

 

"Gee, Stan, you're looking pretty glum today. Any chance you're not circumcised?"

 

"Hey, Mike, <insert male bonding high five here> aren't you glad you're cut?"

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A male can be circumcised as an adult, but at that point it is no longer the simple procedure it is at birth, and the benefits of growing up through adolescence without a foreskin are lost. It is a very bad move to wait if one is to be circumcised eventually.

 

As to some males being "very unhappy" being circumcised I've never met any man, ever, who is unhappy that he was circumcised. Where the few friends I've had who were not circumcised were the "very unhappy" ones, and the only males I've ever known to have UTIs.

 

I'm very curious about the benefits of growing up through adolescence without a foreskin.

 

My husband is circumcised and regrets that he is. He's had no issues or problems, he just feels like it shouldn't have been done.

 

You can research "foreskin restoration" to read about some men that are so unhappy to have been circumcised that they have surgery, use devices, stretch and tape to try to restore their foreskin.

 

I'm of the opinion that there are enough pros and cons on each side of the debate that there is no one right answer and I support each family in making the decision that is best for them. It's just not a choice that I would make.

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It always amazes me how "knowledgeable" a circ'ed man thinks he is about the foreskin he never experienced!!:glare: Which is why the logic "his dad has a penis, so I let him decide" is just silly. In fact, by still owning a labia minor, we women are more experienced than circ'ed men on the topic! (It's formed from the same parts in the womb and functions similarly.)

 

Please, mothers of intact-but-might-need-to-be-circ'ed sons, read this article first. Forced Foreskin Retraction. It includes about post-natal circ and basic anatomy.

That is a pretty big benefit since in the case of spreading HPV or HIV it can be a life vs death difference to that partner. No small thing.
:001_huh: You seriously believe HPV and HIV are passed by foreskins? If one is having unprotected sex to be exposed to the foreskin at all...the "end" would introduce far more disease than any part of the skin. In fact, the mucosa of the inner foreskin produces plasma cells, which secrete immunoglobulin antibodies, and antibacterial and antiviral proteins.
As to some males being "very unhappy" being circumcised I've never met any man, ever, who is unhappy that he was circumcised. Where the few friends I've had who were not circumcised were the "very unhappy" ones, and the only males I've ever known to have UTIs.

 

Ingorence is bliss. Most circ'ed men don't know they lost 50% of the nerve endings in their penis. No small thing.
You can't wash it if it doesn't retract. And if you force the retraction you can cause all sort of trouble. Uncircumcised men are generally just not as clean. And you can't simply wash away viruses like HPV and HIV which find the mucous membranes of the foreskin the perfect entry for the infection and spread of disease.
(Refer to first sentence of my post.)
Urinary and vaginal infection, here. Dh is circ'ed.

I was *freaking* out, but my ob/gyn insisted it was just my body adjusting to a new partner and, um... large quantities of teA. :blushing:

Definitely not foreskin related!

:iagree:
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Most circ'ed men don't know they lost 50% of the nerve endings in their penis.

 

Does that mean circumcised men last longer? If so, lucky me! :D Seriously though, am I the only one who selfishly thinks that I could get short changed in the "teA" department if dh had 50% more nerve endings down there!!!!

 

I asked dh about this several years ago and he said that he can't imagine "teA" being more pleasurable and erotic than it already is. He's quite content with the current situation.

Edited by mommyjen
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An uncircumcised penis (before the foreskin retracts on its own) is no more dirty than a vagina, nor does it require special care. Once the foreskin retracts the male must practice good hygiene, of course, but an intact penis is not difficult to clean (unless you live in a country with sub-par sanitation, but that is not the case for most of us).

 

Forcibly retracting the foreskin is a problem and a risk factor for infection. Circumcision itself is a risk factor for infection, and (without looking it up) I think it's safe to say that circumcised infants run a greater immediate risk of infection that uncircumcised infants.

 

Having unprotected sex with anyone, intact or not, is risky. It's not like most of us would consider a partner and think, "Oh, he's circ'ed. No condom necessary."

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And the medical establishment, including the WHO, is coming back around to good science after years of caving to ideological pressures.
From the WHO website:

 

"Countries with high rates of heterosexual HIV infection and low rates of male circumcision now have an additional intervention which can reduce the risk of HIV infection in heterosexual men. Scaling up male circumcision in such countries will result in immediate benefit to individuals...There is now strong evidence from three randomized controlled trials undertaken in Kisumu, Kenya; Rakai District, Uganda (funded by the US National Institutes of Health); and Orange Farm, South Africa (funded by the French National Agency for Research on AIDS) that male circumcision reduces the risk of heterosexually acquired HIV infection in men by approximately 60%."

 

It seems clear (to me) that the WHO is making a recommendation to specific countries where AIDS infection is rampant and increasing exponentially among heterosexual males (as it is throughout Africa). Several factors contribute to the spread of AIDS in these regions, including hygiene, sanitation, cultural practices, rape, etc.

 

The risk factors for contracting HIV in westernized nations are different. They include drug use (needle sharing) and promiscuity. From the same WHO article:

 

"In countries where the HIV epidemic is concentrated in specific population groups such as sex workers, injecting drug users or men who have sex with men, there would be limited public health impact from promoting male circumcision in the general population. However, there may be an individual benefit for men at high risk of heterosexually acquired HIV infection."

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HECK NO!

 

My son is beautifully intact, just as as perfect as the day he was born, just as perfect as I grew him in my womb. I would not ever cut off his nose or his ears and I would not ever cut off his foreskin either! It is part of his perfectly designed body.

 

If I cut off his foreskin, I would have to cut the labia off any girl babies I might have too - despite what some people think - it is all the same thing and, to me, any form of genital mutilation is wrong!

 

And just for the record - in our house, it doesnt matter one bit that DH and DS are "different" from one another (or that all of my family were circ'd too). If DS ever asks about the difference (which has not happened yet) we will be honest with him and tell him we loved him too much to cut off part of his body just so that "he'd look like his Daddy".

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My oldest is. He was done two weeks after birth (nicu stay and they wouldn't do it there). I'll never forget the screaming and the being forced out into the hall to listen to my two week old screaming for help. Took him 4 weeks to calm down afterward. Three months later after battling yet another uti saw a ped. urologist who said the circ was done incorrectly. Had surgery again at 9 months of age to repair. Couldn't fully repair because my child was having trouble in surgery. Had several more uti's while waiting for 2 years of age to try again. Did surgery again at 2 years and he spent 2 weeks in the hospital recovering. Started having infections and uti's again about 4 months later. Had another surgery done at age 4. Still having infections and uti's and he is now 7. Scheduled to undergo another surgery later this year. Not to mention the fear he has when someone has to look at his penis. I think of all my child has been through and I'm sick that I allowed looks to be the deciding factor as to why I had him circ'd.

 

My twin boys were not touched. Not one problem with them.

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And just for the record - in our house, it doesnt matter one bit that DH and DS are "different" from one another (or that all of my family were circ'd too). If DS ever asks about the difference (which has not happened yet) we will be honest with him and tell him we loved him too much to cut off part of his body just so that "he'd look like his Daddy".
I remember the first time one of ours noticed he looked different from Daddy and asked about it.

 

I, having prepared for this future conversation, started explaining what a foreskin was and circumcision...I received a mortified look as he said, "No, I mean it's huge and hairy! Will mine grow that big and get hairy one day??"

Oops. "Uh...yeah, one day"

...(long pause, him thinking hard)..."Grandma cut part of his off?!?:scared:"

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I remember the first time one of ours noticed he looked different from Daddy and asked about it.

 

I, having prepared for this future conversation, started explaining what a foreskin was and circumcision...I received a mortified look as he said, "No, I mean it's huge and hairy! Will mine grow that big and get hairy one day??"

Oops. "Uh...yeah, one day"

...(long pause, him thinking hard)..."Grandma cut part of his off?!?:scared:"

 

:lol::smilielol5:

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I remember the first time one of ours noticed he looked different from Daddy and asked about it.

 

I, having prepared for this future conversation, started explaining what a foreskin was and circumcision...I received a mortified look as he said, "No, I mean it's huge and hairy! Will mine grow that big and get hairy one day??"

Oops. "Uh...yeah, one day"

...(long pause, him thinking hard)..."Grandma cut part of his off?!?:scared:"

:lol:

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It's $14.00 to read it, so I didn't either, but I found this sentence in the synopsis: "Circumcision-related mortality rates are not known with certainty; this study estimates the scale of this problem." I suppose whether it's flawed would depend on how they estimated the results.

 

Off-topic, but... I'd heard of Women's Studies at universities, but I had no idea there were Men's Studies until I followed the link. That's interesting.

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Neither of my boys is cir'ced. I asked my Dad one time, and he told me that no male in his family has ever been done (ever meaning as far back as anyone can remember - he is Hungarian). My brother was not done either, nor would he have had any of his sons done (he has all girls). So, I never even considered that I would do it, but my decision was solidified by my ex-fiancee. This may be TMI so do not read on if that will bother you.

 

My ex was 13 the first time he had teA with a much older woman. After multiple times, she started teasing him about being uncir'ced. He became really self conscious after she told him that cir'ced guys lasted longer and decided to have the procedure done when he was 14. So, after recovery he decided to hop back on the horse, so to speak, and was intimate with another girl. He said it was horrible; felt so much inferior to his intact experience. He thought it might have been too soon, so he waited until his exposed areas "toughened up", or maybe it was the girls (they were both 14). So, he tried with someone else..same thing. He regretted having the surgery done, told me that the loss of sensation during teA and self-teA (is there a proper acronym for that) was astronomical.

 

I have never met an intact man who regrets being intact, or had problems with it. My pedi when the boys were born was very anti-circ, but he would do it just to make sure it was done properly, but he tried to talk everyone out of it. He told me that many boys/teens/men who are circ'ed after birth have it done because it is faster and less of a fuss to just cut the foreskin off than to take the time and use steroid creams, etc. to help with phimoses or adhesions. He also told me that if we ever had to see a urologist to make sure that s/he was experienced in dealing with intact males because many are not.

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I'm in the HECK NO department.

My brother is uncircumcized which was unusual back them and my parents received flack about it but stood by their decision.

Dh is circumcised. I guess ds worked out he wasnt at some stage- we have honestly never had a conversation about it....and we are a family who has no problem with nudity or conversations like that. It's just never come up.

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Okay, see? I'm not "that person" who turns threads into debates. Bill is! Also, he just called my kids dirty :lol:

:laugh:

It's $14.00 to read it, so I didn't either, but I found this sentence in the synopsis: "Circumcision-related mortality rates are not known with certainty; this study estimates the scale of this problem." I suppose whether it's flawed would depend on how they estimated the results.

 

Off-topic, but... I'd heard of Women's Studies at universities, but I had no idea there were Men's Studies until I followed the link. That's interesting.

:iagree:

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The thing I keep in mind when reading stories about boys who needed to be circumcised later is that pretty much every such story I read is about boys in the US. I suspect an American urologist's opinion about when a boys "needs" to be circ'd is much different from a European doctor's.

 

I have only once heard a report of a British male needing to be circumcised for medical reasons - in that case it was a zipper incident. This caused me to look up what to do if that were to happen to one of my sons: surgery is not normally necessary if everyone knows what to do.

 

Laura

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Really? Neither myself, DH, or any of my family who have been to college have ever been required to submit health records of any kind, including vac records - all they want to know is if we're insured or not, and if not, they "lovingly" sign you up for the school's health insurance. The only time I would think that they'd need such info is if you're a member of a sports team or if you're studying abroad.

 

I remember detailed health forms for college. Dorms & college life in general are so close-quartered that many/most colleges require quite a bit of preventive health care, including current vaccinations.

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2nd DS was not circ'd for obvious reasons. We'll see what happens with him. At almost 5 he's not retracting much at all so may have to have some intervention as well.

 

 

It's not uncommon at 5 to not retract. I was concerned, even after reading this, that my son would never be able to retract. He's 7 now, no problems..... They say that it happens at puberty.... DON'T force it..... It happens on it's own.

 

I just said... every few baths..... see if you can pull your f*r*sk*n back... and one day..... presto!

 

:)

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I remember detailed health forms for college. Dorms & college life in general are so close-quartered that many/most colleges require quite a bit of preventive health care, including current vaccinations.

I'm sure there are exemptions. I have a child that CANNOT be vaccinated due to health issues. I doubt she will be turned away from a college because of her medical issues.

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Both of mine are, dh was fine with it, I think they look nicer than ones intact. Sorry, but dh likes oral penetration and I the thought of it not being circ. is gross. But we know quite a few families that have younger boys that are intact.

 

It's just a question of what you are used to. Keeping an uncirced willy clean is no harder than keeping hands clean.

 

Laura

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My son is -- it never occured to me to not. If I had another son -- he would be, too. Honestly, I'm shocked at the number of people on here that are not -- I always assumed that most men were (my family members are, my dh family members are, and any man I've ever *known* was.) Live and learn.

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I remember detailed health forms for college. Dorms & college life in general are so close-quartered that many/most colleges require quite a bit of preventive health care, including current vaccinations.

 

My college boyfriend had not been vaccinated as a child, and he was required to do so to remain at the college. He got a lot of shots our freshman year!

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My son is -- it never occured to me to not. If I had another son -- he would be, too. Honestly, I'm shocked at the number of people on here that are not -- I always assumed that most men were (my family members are, my dh family members are, and any man I've ever *known* was.) Live and learn.

 

A *lot* of it is geographical. More people circumcise in the Midwest, fewer people circumcise on the west coast. Only 30% of males are circumcised worldwide.

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My son is -- it never occured to me to not. If I had another son -- he would be, too. Honestly, I'm shocked at the number of people on here that are not -- I always assumed that most men were (my family members are, my dh family members are, and any man I've ever *known* was.) Live and learn.

 

 

Most men on this world are not.So your family is in the minority.

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Yes, I did and am very happy I did. Why? Because a few years ago, my then 84 yo fil had to have one. It was not a good thing for him at his age. I then found out that it isn't that uncommon for elderly men to be circumsized. I think it is much easier as an infant. ALso, he is much less likely to spread diseases if he is sleeping around (he isn't but you never know what your child grows up to do).

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