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Another parenting wwyd - hey, I haven't asked in a while!!


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I have a 13yob who is being very disrespectful.

 

I already have heard about all the physical activity to have in his life...

 

Sometimes, though, the disrespect doesn't happen at a time when I can have him give me push ups, or dig a ditch or pull weeds...

 

I'll give two examples and then, please, fire away!!!

 

1 - At bedtime... I ask him to put away some of his clothes. He gets an attitude, but I decide to not pick this battle, and don't react. But, as I walk away and am down the hallway, I hear his brother in protest, telling him to stop. Instead of putting away clothes, he is kicking at his brother. Then he walks on his brothers bedding, which is temporarily on the floor while the bed is getting made and he is smirking and very pleased with himself for uspetting his brother. I begin to correct him, and he starts whistling and bobbing his head around! He is on purpose showing me that he is not going to listen or pay attention to what I am saying to him!!!!!!!

 

2 - Morning time, just about time to go to school. Each time he needs redirected he gets an attitude and bumps into walls or another person because he doesn't like being redirected... But, he needs his shoes on... he is required to put away the lunch items on the counter instead of walking away... he is asked to wipe up the mess he made... I am at the same time directing the other boys and everyone is handling it all except him... so I ask him to work on his attitude (it had gotten really stinky) and he begins the whistling routine... He is quite pleased with himself for figuring out a way to annoy me and refuse to listen.

 

I feel at my wits end...

 

While I understand that 13 is an age of challenges, but this seems ridiculous.

 

Thanks for some ideas....

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Bee - I think this child is telling you that you need to be 100% consistent with him every single time.

 

If you ask him to put away his clothes, he must obey every single time. Otherwise, are you expecting him to have some sort of wisdom over when he has to obey and when it's ok to not?

 

You need to put a stop to the whistling - it is disrespectful to you. I know it is tough but keep redirecting over and over and over. . . :grouphug:

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Please? Anyone? I was really hoping to get some ideas...

 

Who out there has had to respond to disrespect in a child older than 10? What do YOU do? If you use physical work or activity to correct, what about when you don't have time for that?

 

Hey, grandma says to smack him a good one when he whistles... but, grandma is from another time... another culture... and I cannot do that! Anyone else??

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I was getting a bit of attitude from one of the 16 yr olds. I called him in, sat him down and told him that I didn't appreciate disrespect from him and that he needed to straighten up immediately. And that if he didn't, he could pack his bags and stay at his grandma's down the road.

 

He loves his grandma but he straightened up. Apparently I'm a better cook. Sorry, that's the best I've got.

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My 12 year old has been behaving this way lately. I have found that unplugging him for a week improves his attitude greatly. I also sit him down when I am not feeling angry with him for his attitude and discuss his disrespectful behavior and what is required of him for us to continue homeschooling.

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I just think every child and every Mom is different, so what works here may not work there, and we may not even agree on what "works" means, since I think sometimes even the best response will take a while to change behavior.

 

But I have a few things. First, my primary rule with teens is to never let them see you sweat. Some of them are nut cases at that age. You have to be very very calm and hide how much it's upsetting you. For one thing, boys like the power it gives them to see their mothers freak out. So don't freak out. You want them to feel powerful, but only in manly, honorable, positive ways. Don't give him the satisfaction for even one second. If you haven't mastered your own emotions yet, this is a great opportunity.

 

Secondly, have a plan. I know that's what you are asking US for, but you will get a lots of conflicting options here. Choose one. Have a plan. I was listening to a psychologist on NPR the other day, and she said that's the thing parents of teens most need. She called it a "protocol." She said that emergency room physicians have to react to crisis without panicking, as do commanders of troops, police officers, etc., and she said that the first line of defense is a protocol.

 

For me, I used John Rosemond's "Teenproofing" to develop a plan - mostly because it's the book that resonated with DH, and we needed a joint plan. Rosemond can be a sanctimonious old hen, but he's also right a lot of the time, and if you can ignore the tone, his advice is pretty sound, I think.

 

So for me, a protocol meant having something to say when I don't know what else to say to a difficult child but I knew better than to say much of anything that would just make the emotional tenor rise. When my oldest made lame arguments about how stupid my rules were, I memorized the line, "I guess that's one way to look at it" and that was my response. It kept me from getting embroiled in arguments with someone who was being unreasonable (because he was a teen and his brain was doing crazy things).

 

Maybe for you, you need to say, "I don't like the way you are behaving, but we will talk about that later. For now, do what I asked." If he doesn't do it, then do it for him. And do NOT escalate by making a big deal out of doing it for him. That's the best thing I got from Rosemond - an appreciate of the dangers of wanting immediate gratification of my desire to impose justice. So I say do the job for him. Don't point it out, make threats, give him six chances, etc. Just do it. You clean the dishes or wipe the counter or whatever.

 

And then later, you get your say. That might mean that later he asks to watch tv and you tell him "no" and explain why. It might mean he says, "Don't we need to leave for soccer today" and you tell him you aren't going and why. You revoke privileges but don't tell him ahead of time, because that will escalate things. I learned not to argue about that consequence either. He would pitch a fit ('that's not fair, you didn't tell me, that's not what happened') and I would say (according to protocol), "I hated it when my parents took privileges away too." And then I got busy with something else.

 

But it wasn't a magic wand.

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You know, I'm trying to think of what I do & I just can't put my finger on one thing.

 

I do not tolerate whistling at all because it drives me batty. Roger Whittaker makes me violent. So no whistling has been a rule around here for ever. But that's not really the issue, is it - it's the deliberate doing of something that drives you crazy.

 

I don't think my kids do that (or maybe that's still to come with ds :001_huh: & :lol:) but I'm not entirely certain why. I think it's a combination of :

 

a) Humor & actually letting things slide. I do kind of expect there to be some adolescent idiocy & I try to not get sucked into it. I try to pick my battles. I expect to have to remind them endlessly b/e apparently their brains are on the floor somewhere (under their laundry).

 

If I get 'tude, I usually just say "KNOCK OFF THE "TUDE, DUDE!" It works for me.

 

If I get 'tude for the reminders, I say "KNOCK IT OFF & you can thank me for reminding you."

 

I do ignore lots of things. Sibling issues I expect them to resolve but I also nix petty arguments fast (they both are apparently in training to be lawyers & will ARGUE & split hairs till the cows come home) by just saying NO MORE TALKING. IT'S OVER.

 

Then I start talking & nobody can get a word in edgewise.

 

b) reconnecting with the child by doing something every day that they enjoy - even if it's for just 20-30 min, one on one. My ds likes to talk to us about all the things he's inventing, or thinking of buying, or should be invented. I have no idea what he's talking about a good half of the time but he enjoys telling me about it anyway.

 

c) whigging out every once in a while. Whig out enough & all you have to say is "Keep it up & I"m going to whig out!" and that's usually enough of a deterrent. The natural consequence of being a jerk is that you tick someone off & when you tick them off enough, they're no longer very nice to be around for a while.

 

But mostly I try for humour. With a big enough repertoire of good books & British comedies, we usually have some 'sketch' or quote to fall back on to ease the tension.

 

"It's all your fault, Mother! We couldn't have got this selfish without some guidance!" is cropping up a fair bit here. It's from My Family & Other Animals. :D

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Since anger begets anger, I try really hard to keep my cool. One of my favorite techniques for bad attitudes is do-overs. If a child responds in a less-than-appropriate way, they get the raised eyebrow, and a loud "ahem". If that doesn't do it, I model what I expect. "Yes, mother-dearest, I am doing it as we speak" (in an overly dramatic voice.) If the tone is inappropriate I will model how I want them to respond. It doesn't guarantee success, but it does remove the contentiousness of the moment. This is also how I deal with sibling squabbling - model a less argumentative tone of voice that still communicates what they need to say.

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Oh baby, a similar boy lives in my house LOL. OK, here goes. You need to get creative here. Principle 1: Every kid has his currency - make sure you know your son's, and use it to advantage. 2: make consequences fit crimes. OK, so *all* of the above is happening.....son starts whistling....first you very calmly ignore the whistling and say in a regular voice "I want you downstairs with no whistling, and I'm timing you....the number of seconds it takes you to stop whistling and get down to the couch will be the number of days you go without X" (make a list for yourself....refer to it often...if you can't remember, say 'something you value very much', and think of it later. Then calmly walk away, and keep track of the time. Ball's in his court. If he loses "X" for a year....well thats his problem, he should have listened. Once he is on the couch, you can let him stew in silence while you come up with appropriate logical consequences (yes, on top of whatever he loses for being slow)....doing chores for the siblings he picked on, making his brother's bed himself, whatever. A nice little twist that I have used for about the last year or so with my son is to throw in the requirement of a certain number of "yes mom"'s before he gets "X" back as well. My reasoning to him? If you don't give me "yes mom" willingly, then I guess you need some enforced practice. Consequences with practice of the desired behavior built right in :o). As to what privileges to remove, or consequences to give....you know your kid. The key is, there is no reason why you should have to think of the consequences on the spur of the moment. Give yourself time to beeeee creeeeeaaaaativvvvve....yaahaahaa (evil laugh....). Really.....my son knows that he does NOT want mom to be creative. Make sure he knows....the longer he takes to be in a cool off spot, the greater his loss. Oh, and also make sure there is apologies to offended parties as part of the bargain.....NOT "sorry" in a sullen voice, but "I was wrong to do "X", will you forgive me?" For the record, revokable privileges in my house include but are not limited to: fun food, a bed to sleep on (sleeping on the kitchen/patio/tile for a certain number of days is no fun), any screens, any favorite toys or gadgets, friends....you get the idea. You know......"If you can't treat your brother with respect, then you don't get to be with friends"....that sort of thing. OK, scenario #2. Stuff like this becomes a certain amount of "yes mom"'s (for my son, "yes mom"'s mean AUTOMATIC loss of ALL SCREENS till he has given me a certain number of them happily), plus maybe extra of whatever it was that made him grumpy. They also need to know what your priorities are. If it is more important to you to ignore him, "take it", or react verbally but not really hit him where it hurts, then he will know it. Deep down, they need to know that they are more important than any other agenda.....even if tough consequences are how they learn you care. If my son says "I don't care", I tell him..."I know you don't, that's why God gave you a mom to care *for* you". I regularly tell my son, "you know, it's really important to me that you grow up to be a real MAN, someone who is ....... I will take as long as necessary dealing with you because that is more important than my dishes or laundry, or whatever"

Now, I'll say that I'm in this for the long haul because my son has sensory issues, is EXTREMELY strong willed, incredibly intense, and struggles greatly with self control. There is NO magic bullet. Some days he gets it, other days are ....um....very difficult. Some kids are just hard. Hang in there. BE CREATIVE :o).

Kayleen

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Is someting amiss in the relationship? Are you able to have any good conversations at all? Can you have a nice chat in the car or at the dinner table? It's so important that not all conversations with older kids be orders/rules/clean your room type conversations. There has to be a closeness, some inside jokes, some times where it's just about being together and sharing ideas, thoughts etc. I find that when we have a relationship, things are much smoother, in general.

 

I think some hsers are always 'on'. Always being teacher, always being general, and not being mom, which I see as the nurturing part. Do you have any nurturing opportunies at all? Will he let you kiss him goodnight? Touch his hair as you end a day, start a day?

 

If kids are in school, they at least have the opportunity to say "Hey, you will never believe what my mean English teacher said to me today!'. If the the 'mean' English teacher is mom niether side gets a break. The lecture about how you didn't finsih your work carries right over, relentlessly, to dinner, to the laundry room, to bedtime....everywhere. There is no place to hide. For anyone.

 

Working on the relationship (not 'best buddies', obviosuly) is paramount ime. Cutting each other some slack, having fun, laughing, trusting, respecting etc is so important.

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After reading the book "Say Goodbye to Whining..." written by Turansky and Miller and having good success with their parenting approach, I gladly attended one of their parenting seminars when it was offered at a local church a few years later. I bought the "Parenting is Heart Work" book and CD series at the seminar, which I highly recommend. They teach a biblical approach to parenting that focuses on changing the heart, which in turn changes the behavior. The link to their site is below. They have free email tips for dealing with behavior/attitude problems that are very useful, and you might find the first book I mentioned at the library, both of which would give you a better understanding of their parenting approach. http://www.biblicalparenting.org/tips.asp Dr. Kevin Leman is someone else who offers some very common sense methods for behavior problems, and he has a great sense of humor. He has been interviewed on FamilyLifeToday so you could look through their archive for past interviews. Good luck!

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Thanks, Danestress. That was really helpful and I can see the wisdom in it. The library has teenproofing and I like Rosemond for the most part, so I am going to read it.

 

I also like the idea of cutting off the arguing. It isn't that my ds doesn't do what I am asking - it is that he doesn't do what I ask without major drama on his part. A simple request to wipe down the counter can lead to a 15 minute argument. So, I won't engage.

 

My dh says I need to crack down because he isn't here all day. He's more than happy to talk about it (and talk to him about it) but it really comes down to me taking care of it when it happens.)

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He's showing you (quite obnoxiously) that he needs more structure. So, tell him that you hear him *loud and clear.* "Son, your behavior is rude and obnoxious, and it shows me that you need a lot more structure. Thanks for letting me know."

 

A couple of minor solutions and one MAJOR one. ;-)

 

Minor:

When he whistles, give yourself a treat and thank him for it. A Hershey's treat works WONDERS in this situation. Grab a "kiss" and say with a loving (not angry) smile and a happy voice, "Thanks for the kiss, son!" He'll see that his attempt at being obnoxious didn't meet its mark, and you might find that you hope he whistles, so you get candy. ;)

 

I tried this when my son started an obnoxious habit, and it made me actually look forward to his habit! ;-) It ended his obnoxiousness in a single day, b/c I was *happy* when he did it, thereby removing the "thrill" for him.

 

When he annoys people, he needs to do their chores. So, if he kicks his brother or walks on his clean sheets, he needs to do brother's daily chore(s) to make up for his obnoxiousness.

 

The MAJOR guns, if you choose to use them:

 

Rude children get the basics, not full privileges. Make his world small and boring until he is pleasant and responsible. Let him know that while he's being disrespectful and rude, he's on "basics." This means, no tv, no video games, no internet, no friends (after all, a boy who is rude to his family clearly isn't ready to be kind to a friend, so he needs to practice his respectful, kind behaviors at HOME before going out).

 

He needs to learn that all "fun" stops until he can do his "six jobs."

 

A child's six jobs are to be *responsible,* *respectful,* *fun to be around*, and to do things *right the first time,* *fast and snappy,* *Mom's and Dad's way.* Any child who can do "his six jobs" is on the right path for having a productive, happy life, b/c (IMO) these six jobs cover almost every situation.

 

When your ds is slow to do what he's been asked, or he's arguing or whistling, he's not doing ANY of his six jobs. So, until he can do his "six jobs," everything but school and chores STOPS for him. Don't take him anywhere unless *you* want to take him with you on *your* errands. Don't buy anything he wants -- only the things he actually *needs.* Don't allow any recreational activities. Right now, he needs to WORK at learning (and doing) his six jobs. STOP everything until he is consistently responsible, respectful, fun to be around, and does things right the first time, fast and snappy, Mom's and Dad's way.

 

Start by having him write his "six jobs" ("My jobs are to be respectful,... etc.) about fifty times, so he knows the mantra word for word. After writing the jobs out, if he's rude, slow, etc., say, "You're not doing your six jobs. Would you like a do-over so that you can do it correctly?" If he won't do it correctly with a "do-over," tell him to write them again X times. When he's done writing (let him take as long as he wants to -- just benignly ignore him until he's done), tell him to do the chore, etc., you asked him to do again, and see if he can do his six jobs.

 

You'll have to be REALLY focused on this, but it does work. The keys to making it work are 1) stopping all privileges until he earns them by doing his "six jobs" consistently and 2) NOT arguing/discussing/debating (or allowing arguing from him). When he is disrespectful, say, "You're not doing your six jobs. Do you need a do-over?" When he's mean to his brothers, say, "You're not doing your six jobs. Do you need a do-over?" When he's slow to do chores, say, "You're not doing your six jobs. Do you need a do-over?" If you don't argue, ever, and he never gets anything out of delaying/being rude, etc., but instead hears the same things ("You're not doing your six jobs. Do you need a do-over?") and loses privileges every time he falls off the "six jobs" wagon, he'll come around.

 

HIH,

 

Lisa

Edited by Lisa in Jax
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Please? Anyone? I was really hoping to get some ideas...

 

Who out there has had to respond to disrespect in a child older than 10? What do YOU do? If you use physical work or activity to correct, what about when you don't have time for that?

 

Hey, grandma says to smack him a good one when he whistles... but, grandma is from another time... another culture... and I cannot do that! Anyone else??

 

I would do the same thing with a 13-year-old that I would with my 9- and 11-year-old. "I'll only give you one warning, then, you lose privileges for the day. We can talk about your attitude as a family when you dad gets home tonight..."

 

Does he still have his privileges? Games, phone, computer...whatever they may be in your household.

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