BMW Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Well, I have a few questions, but lawyers wont just let you call and ask a few questions... First, if court ordered child support in 2007 if the non-custodial parent had the same or more wages, would it be increased a bit now because of cost of living? (supposing the custodial parent didn't have an increase in income) Second, if the non-custodial parent has been in a committed relationship for 3 years with a partner and they have lived together for that time, would the court consider the partner's income for child support? I remember California law being that if you lived together for 2 years, you were considered married, but that was several years ago... The non-custodial parent is choosing to keep taxes separate and also will not get married because he does not want his partner's income to be considered... (it's a very substantial income) I can prove that they have been in a committed relationship, living together... would a judge consider that? I am not out to grab more money for the sake of increasing my income, but there are other circumstances that have come up and they are using every advantage for themselves to pay me as little as possible at this time and I am not okay with that... my children deserve better than this, too... and I was very stupidly generous to them over the past few years and when I COULD have required them to pay 50% of medical, dental and vision, I didn't... I felt that I was taking the high road and now I am getting bit big time... Thanks for any information that you have... I am not able to do much research right now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemrae Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 I don't know about the state you live in, but in Michigan, there is a slight cost of living increase every year regardless of whether or not income goes up. Having said that, if the change would be less than 5% they probably wouldn't change it. Only the parents' incomes are taken into consideration when figuring child support, even if the non-custodial parent is re-married (again this is in Michigan). The only other thing that might change the formula is if the nc parent has additional biological or adopted children that he is financially responsible for (not step-children). Usually there is a wealth of information available online as far as child support calculations are concerned. Look online for your county friend-of-the-court or child support documents. You shouldn't need an attorney to figure out the basics. You also might have a caseworker that can answer some of those questions for you once child support is ordered. They can let you know when it is time for a review and in what circumstances the amount might change. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Child support is based on last reviewed and documented income of the ncp. You can request a review and possible adjustment. This usually requires an attorney and some $. Cost of living does not matter. The income of significant others does not ever factor in. That works on your "side" as well - if you remarried, your spouses income would not count "against" you and be used to reduce child support. I encourage you to submit all medical bills (and whatever else your decree allows) for reimbursement. They are still his children and he is obligated to pay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandamom Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 :iagree: with the previous poster. Only the parents' income is calculated for determining child support, at least in the states I have heard about. Also, here you would have to file for a request to change the child support amount unless it was already written into the decree/agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW Posted July 29, 2010 Author Share Posted July 29, 2010 What is crazy is... I thought for sure the significant other's income wasn't put in the equation... and then I was REQUIRED to give my new husband's income and I said, "He is not my bio-children's father and he has his own son's to pay for" and it was still put into the equation... but my ex's sig. other wasn't put in because she was not on his taxes... that's what I was told... (this situation was with an agency outside of court) About the medical bills... the general rule is that you are supposed to submit them to the other party within a month. I didn't do that, thinking that I was taking the high road... would a judge be likely to look at me and say, "Gosh, too bad for you, you could have had him pay some of this!"? Or would he look at the entire story and put that back in the equation? Could a judge? I know that I can file a motion, submit my side and get before a judge on my own for a minimal fee... I just wouldn't want to go through that trouble to hear, "too bad for you"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smithie Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 I'm sure they're being absolute jerks if they've gotten you this worked up where you were inclined to be generous before, but other than demanding reimbursement for those previous (and all future) medical costs and/or requesting an adjustment if you think you might get it based on a change in your ex's income, I'm pretty sure there is nothing you can do. His girlfriend's income is not a factor, and shouldn't be. She doesn't owe your kids any support. If she chooses to buy them things, take them on trips, etc. when they are in her home, that's great. But it's not a legal or moral obligation she has, to contribute to the support of her boyfriend's kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW Posted July 29, 2010 Author Share Posted July 29, 2010 Thanks... I'm in a position where it's not easy to walk away and shake it off... Looks like the only thing I can do is put it all in front of a judge. And I agree, neither his nor MY spouse/mate should be part of the equation. The folks at this other agency need a wake up call... they are using my dh's because of how we filed taxes... but it's not right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Thanks... I'm in a position where it's not easy to walk away and shake it off... Looks like the only thing I can do is put it all in front of a judge. And I agree, neither his nor MY spouse/mate should be part of the equation. The folks at this other agency need a wake up call... they are using my dh's because of how we filed taxes... but it's not right. Other agency, meaning what? You dh's income will be figured in terms of welfare or food stamps, those agencies use household income to figure out how much help you *need* in order to make ends meet. Your ex has an obligation to support his kids. However, your current dh is obligated before the taxpayer. He knew you had kids when he married you. There is a big difference in using his income to figure child support v. food stamps or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HelenNotOfTroy Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Different states are different. The state my DH was divorced in bases child support on the NCP's income and other children he/she may be paying support for and nothing else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW Posted July 29, 2010 Author Share Posted July 29, 2010 Mrs. Mungo, the other agency is a child support agency. This is not related to any thing other than child support. I was shocked that they required my dh's income information. As mentioned, looks like I have to go to court if I don't like how they do things... But, now that my wheels are turning... I think I'd like to show the agency the law which says spouses/sig. others are not to be used in determining support... they told me that I was mis-informed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KidsHappen Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Mrs. Mungo, the other agency is a child support agency. This is not related to any thing other than child support. I was shocked that they required my dh's income information. As mentioned, looks like I have to go to court if I don't like how they do things... But, now that my wheels are turning... I think I'd like to show the agency the law which says spouses/sig. others are not to be used in determining support... they told me that I was mis-informed... Yes, you were misinformed. Only the legal parents are responsible for support of the children. Spouses and SOs is never considered. They have no legal or moral obligation to provide for the child. Your child support should have been set by the judge not an agency. The only time I have ever heard of any agency getting involved is when the non-custodial parent is not paying there support and it has to be collect by an agency and then dispursed to the custodial parent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawn in OH Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Mrs. Mungo, the other agency is a child support agency. This is not related to any thing other than child support. I was shocked that they required my dh's income information. As mentioned, looks like I have to go to court if I don't like how they do things... But, now that my wheels are turning... I think I'd like to show the agency the law which says spouses/sig. others are not to be used in determining support... they told me that I was mis-informed... I think this is going to depend on the state in question. My husband pays child support to his ex. Even if I had an income, it would not be considered for the child support. On the other hand, California is different. I don't know the law there, but, when my Step Dad fell behind in his child support to his ex-wife, California came after my Mom and were threatening to garnish HER wages to pay his back child support. I would check the laws for your state if you haven't already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemrae Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Is it possible they requested info on your husband's income just to verify yours? If you filed jointly they may just want his info to determine your portion of the joint tax return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 There are special circumstances in which spouses are sometimes affected, but those are pretty much limited to income tax returns, asset seizing, and lottery winnings, and other potential "joint-income" can be considered. I'm sure that varies by state but, in NJ, that's most often a factor when it comes to arrears, and the spouse is given the opportunity to claim hardship in order to keep their "personal" portion. For straight up support calculations, yes, it's just the legal parents. In NJ, there IS supposed to be a recalculation every 3 years for income changes, as well as a (small) COL adjustment every 2 years IF it's specified in your order. (It is in mine.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingersmom Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 In New york state child support is determined by a formula whereby if you have 1 child you receive X amount, 2 kids Y amount, etc. Of course it is adjusted for your income. My child support checks came from the child support people because my X's wages were garnished. They were not a separate agency though, they were part of the court system. You do not need a lawyer to go to court to discuss this. I did it many many times. You can go to the courthouse and file the papers yourself. You do not need a lawyer to go before the judge. In fact, I preferred going without a lawyer. The law is the law. So depending on your state either they consider your husbands income or they don't. I would not count on a child support agency to have any clue about the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danestress Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 First of all, these questions are mostly matters of state law. Don't let people on a board tell you what the law is - they are often wrong even for their own state. Find out what the law is in YOUR state. Well, I have a few questions, but lawyers wont just let you call and ask a few questions... They typically don't work for free, and also have to screen anyone they advice for conflicts of interest. So you probably won't find an attorney who will answer questions over the phone. But if you used an attorney to do the original divorce, he or she may answer your questions at whatever hourly rate she normally charges. Or if you want someone new, have you called to ask for a consultation with an attorney? For a couple hundred dollars, you should be able to sit down with an attorney and have him or her evaluate your situation and advice you on the likelihood that you could successfully get a modification of the court's order. An original child support order and a modification are two different things, and if you are wanting to modify an existing child support order, that is going to involve a different procedure and different factors than the original one did. Again, you may need advice about the specific jurisdiction where you live. http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cse/extinf.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommyof4ks Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 The 'agency' might be right. It may have something to do to with Cali. being a community property state. I don't know how it works there, but in Texas both spouses are responsible for one anothers debts. That might be why your X will not marry, but like you said if they are common law after 2 years of living together then you might be able to go after her also. Personally I would call your lawyer and ask for clarification if the law is not easy to interpret. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiCO Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Well, I have a few questions, but lawyers wont just let you call and ask a few questions... Lawyers will let you schedule an appointment to come in and pick their brain for 30 minutes. I would recommend this, because laws are different from state to state, and they change all the time. Second, if the non-custodial parent has been in a committed relationship for 3 years with a partner and they have lived together for that time, would the court consider the partner's income for child support? I remember California law being that if you lived together for 2 years, you were considered married, but that was several years ago... The non-custodial parent is choosing to keep taxes separate and also will not get married because he does not want his partner's income to be considered... (it's a very substantial income) I can prove that they have been in a committed relationship, living together... would a judge consider that? I have a friend in a different state who's in a similar situation. His wife is remarried to someone who is extremely wealthy. They do their income taxes separately, and her income is zero. Since they have 50-50 shared custody of the children, she gets 50% of his income. He's consulted many lawyers, and they all say there's nothing he can do about it. He's living in a trailer house until his kids are 18. I think child support laws try to make things fair, but people always figure out how to work the system. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiCO Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Thanks... I'm in a position where it's not easy to walk away and shake it off... Looks like the only thing I can do is put it all in front of a judge. And I agree, neither his nor MY spouse/mate should be part of the equation. The folks at this other agency need a wake up call... they are using my dh's because of how we filed taxes... but it's not right. File separately in the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 The 'agency' might be right. It may have something to do to with Cali. being a community property state. I don't know how it works there, but in Texas both spouses are responsible for one anothers debts. That might be why your X will not marry, but like you said if they are common law after 2 years of living together then you might be able to go after her also. Personally I would call your lawyer and ask for clarification if the law is not easy to interpret. This is not applied to child support in Texas. The income of my DH and my xh's wife is not, and will never be, considered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m0mmaBuck Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Well, I have a few questions, but lawyers wont just let you call and ask a few questions... First, if court ordered child support in 2007 if the non-custodial parent had the same or more wages, would it be increased a bit now because of cost of living? (supposing the custodial parent didn't have an increase in income) Second, if the non-custodial parent has been in a committed relationship for 3 years with a partner and they have lived together for that time, would the court consider the partner's income for child support? I remember California law being that if you lived together for 2 years, you were considered married, but that was several years ago... The non-custodial parent is choosing to keep taxes separate and also will not get married because he does not want his partner's income to be considered... (it's a very substantial income) I can prove that they have been in a committed relationship, living together... would a judge consider that? I am not out to grab more money for the sake of increasing my income, but there are other circumstances that have come up and they are using every advantage for themselves to pay me as little as possible at this time and I am not okay with that... my children deserve better than this, too... and I was very stupidly generous to them over the past few years and when I COULD have required them to pay 50% of medical, dental and vision, I didn't... I felt that I was taking the high road and now I am getting bit big time... Thanks for any information that you have... I am not able to do much research right now... DH and I were the NC parents for years and then the custodial parents for years. I think it varies state to state (we've dealt with NC, GA, and WA)and the best thing you could do is consult a lawyer in your state to find out what specifically applies to you. You can usually just do 30-60 minute consulting session with a lawyer for a small fee and get a lot of questions answered. The lawyer we used most recently even had forms ready for us to fill out and file on our own depending on what our needs were. I know in our situation there was never an automatic COL increase. Those always had to be filed with the court. When custody changed hands, the CS was adjusted to reflect her income. My income was never a consideration in the child support. The states we dealt with did not consider the income of a SO or spouse because in their eyes I had no financial obligation toward DSS. RE: medical bills, the initial child support had been figured in such a way that, even though DSS was already covered by DH's TriCare and Delta Dental, DH had to pay extra money to cover DSS's insurance under his mother's plan. As a result, the courts waived any further legal responsibility for DSS's medical/dental bills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 There is a website called SupportGuidelines which has valuable information for each state and a calculator to run figures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheBrink Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 First of all, these questions are mostly matters of state law. Don't let people on a board tell you what the law is - they are often wrong even for their own state. Find out what the law is in YOUR state. They typically don't work for free, and also have to screen anyone they advice for conflicts of interest. So you probably won't find an attorney who will answer questions over the phone. But if you used an attorney to do the original divorce, he or she may answer your questions at whatever hourly rate she normally charges. Or if you want someone new, have you called to ask for a consultation with an attorney? For a couple hundred dollars, you should be able to sit down with an attorney and have him or her evaluate your situation and advice you on the likelihood that you could successfully get a modification of the court's order. An original child support order and a modification are two different things, and if you are wanting to modify an existing child support order, that is going to involve a different procedure and different factors than the original one did. Again, you may need advice about the specific jurisdiction where you live. http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cse/extinf.html Wise, wise words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobela Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 You really, really need to find a good attorney thta knows that laws and regulations in your area. Every state is very different. In our state an outside agency is now required to be involved in every child support situation in the state. All monies go to the agency before going to the children - I guess in an effort to keep better track of deadbeat providers. Plus, in our state what is provided is determined by the actual income of the parent. I know some non-costodial parents who deliberately work off the clock or in very low paying jobs just to keep child support low. (I think that iis a terrible thing to do to their children by the way). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW Posted July 30, 2010 Author Share Posted July 30, 2010 Thanks... I am going to try negotiating with them in person today at the state office of child support services. Hopefully we land on the same page. But, this is the state office that required my dh's income and didn't require ex's sig. other's income (which is very, very substantial). In this case it is such a shame. They want as much money to stay in their household as possible and they show the kids how much better off they are and what benefits the child will have if they choose to live with them and not me. I cannot compete with their income. I did read that there is also a standard of living law, which I will look into for CA, which says that if one parent's standard of living if significantly higher, they have to provide more for their children who live with the other spouse... so that it is fair. I am not talking about ME gaining here... I could care less about that. What I do care about is them tossing me nickles and dimes for the children in my custody and then showing them what they can do that is so much more than what I can do... But, the price of lawyers and stress of court... sometimes I think it's better to sleep well and not care what they do... live my own life the best I can... and love on the kids. Even if they choose to leave me and follow the money, they will know who I am and that I love them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charmama4 Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 You really, really need to find a good attorney thta knows that laws and regulations in your area. Every state is very different. In our state an outside agency is now required to be involved in every child support situation in the state. All monies go to the agency before going to the children - I guess in an effort to keep better track of deadbeat providers. Plus, in our state what is provided is determined by the actual income of the parent. I know some non-costodial parents who deliberately work off the clock or in very low paying jobs just to keep child support low. (I think that iis a terrible thing to do to their children by the way). Or they work "under the table" so no income is declared as in the case of the NCP in my case.:glare: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joanne Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 (edited) But, the price of lawyers and stress of court... sometimes I think it's better to sleep well and not care what they do... live my own life the best I can... and love on the kids. Even if they choose to leave me and follow the money, they will know who I am and that I love them... Are they fighting for custody? {edited out a lot of personal info that is not needed in this thread anymore} OP, wishing you lots of loving, great times with your kids! I am glad you worked it out without court. Edited July 31, 2010 by Joanne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMW Posted July 30, 2010 Author Share Posted July 30, 2010 I am happy to report that we were able to talk about the money situation and reach an agreement. For now, we are able to avoid the stress and pressure of court. Joanne, In our case, the last court agreement states that the children can choose who to live with when they begin high school. And my high schoolers have jumped off my ship for the bigger, better, more money and better food ship. But, I love them and they know who I am... and where I am at. After all, high school years are no picnic and they grow up and leave home, anyway. I just have to stand up for myself when I feel that the monetary situation is going the wrong way... and in my case, there were areas I had to speak up about... and it went well... Thanks for the encouragement, everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smithie Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 I'm glad you came to an agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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