TT Algebra 2- is it oK?

[SueS]

I read somewhere not to use TT Algebra 2. My ds finished TT Algebra 1 last school year and I was planning to continue to use TT and have him take Algebra 2 as TT recommends it to take after Algebra 1. I'm wondering if I should have him take geometry instead. I wonder if I should avoid TT Algebra 2 also. I've heard "Ask Dr. Callahan" (I think it's called Jacob's math too) is really good.

 

Sue

[Jann in TX]

TT's Geometry program is a solid program... so I suggest you go to that one next.

 

TT's Algebra 2 covers about HALF of what a public school Algebra 2 class would cover...they differ the other half of Algebra 2 until their Pre-Calc text...

 

Jacobs is a text author--I prefer the 2nd edition of his Geometry program over the 3rd edition. Ask Dr Callahan is a separate company that made teaching videos to go with this text.

[Pammy]

Pam here.. I met you Friday at the pool!

 

I will chime in here for you. The reason most people take Geometry in between Alg. 1 and Alg. 2 is b/c of the PSAT in the sophomore year. There will be Geometry questions on it.

 

My oldest dd didn't do that and didn't score very well in math (but that isn't her subject anyway). She did improve her math score on the SAT this summer by 70 points after using Saxon Alg. 2 (which incorporates Geometry). She will be taking a dual credit College Algebra class at the CC down the street from us.

 

My 14 yos, also a freshman, loved math until I made him switch to Saxon PreAlgebra this past year. He hated it and begged to try TT. So he is trying to finish TT PreAlg and Alg. 1 this year, and will only be able to get to PreCal before he graduates. I am not stressing too much. He used to want to be an engineer, but will probably just be a mechanic of sorts, or join the military. Both my dh and I are NOT math people, so my theory is if they are not going to use the higher level math in their jobs, why stress out? Now, my engineering friend would disagree.... and that is why I have her tutor my kids when needed in math! LOL

[SueS]

Hey Pam!! Wow, small world!

 

What if I have him do TT Geometry this year (9th grade) then switch to Jacob's for Algebra 2 in 10th? Jacob's incorporates Trig in the Algebra 2 then goes to calc with no pre-calc.

 

So would it be feasible to do

9th- TT geometry

10th- Dr Callahan/Jacob's Algebra 2 w/ Trig

11th- Calc

12th- What???

 

He's not a super stud in math, but he is thinking of engineering. Or maybe, just use the Dr Callahan/Jacob's for Algebra 2 and then use TT for pre-calc and calc? But is that too redundant with TT having Trig in Pre-calc? I don't have a strong math background so I don't know what he should have.

[EKS]

Hey Pam!! Wow, small world!

 

What if I have him do TT Geometry this year (9th grade) then switch to Jacob's for Algebra 2 in 10th? Jacob's incorporates Trig in the Algebra 2 then goes to calc with no pre-calc.

 

So would it be feasible to do

9th- TT geometry

10th- Dr Callahan/Jacob's Algebra 2 w/ Trig

11th- Calc

12th- What???

 

He's not a super stud in math, but he is thinking of engineering. Or maybe, just use the Dr Callahan/Jacob's for Algebra 2 and then use TT for pre-calc and calc? But is that too redundant with TT having Trig in Pre-calc? I don't have a strong math background so I don't know what he should have.

 

The Jacobs book is algebra I only. For algebra II you would need something like Foerster's Algebra and Trigonometry. But, I'm not sure if a student who has used TT Algbera I would be ready for Foerster's. And then precalculus comes before calculus (which solves the problem of what to do in grade 12). My understanding is that students who take precalculus with trig don't need to do trig in algebra II.

[Pammy]

I am not exactly the math expert here, in fact, far from it. :) So, let the other wise ones chime in for you! :-)

[creekland]

I agree with the others that Geometry is normally the next course one would do. That said, I've done the order both ways (Geo or Alg 2 next) with different boys and had similar (good) results. Since the student you are talking about is just in 9th grade, you can do either option that you prefer and it won't affect the 11th grade PSAT.

 

With regards to TT... all three of my boys have used or are using it. My oldest two have completed through Pre-Calc. Neither of them missed any Algebra questions on the ACT or SAT (SAT only taken by the oldest so far as middle just finished his sophomore year). My oldest went on to do Calculus at home through Chalkdust and has since tested out of needing a math course in college (though without the Calc credits as I didn't have him take the AP).

 

TT DOES delay or defer when they teach certain concepts, but, IMO, that is not necessarily a bad thing. Actually, I have gotten so I prefer it that way, but to each our own. I think by going slower, it grounds kids very well in the basics/foundations. Once they know the basics well, they can easily move on to higher level concepts. I've seen way too many kids in higher levels of math that don't know their algebra basics well, and then they can struggle with other things - especially tests with mixed up problems like the SAT/ACT - but also with Calc, etc. It's not that they don't understand the Calc, they mess up on the Algebra involved.

 

Anyway, if you switch Algebra books now, you'll need to supplement with the Quadratic Equation and probably more graphing work - esp with inequalities. This is easily do-able. If you opt to continue with TT, feel free to choose either book next, but DEFINITELY follow it up with Pre-Calc as others are correct in saying that many concepts are in there that need to be covered prior to any college math. Then, pending how your student does in math, you could opt to do a "College Algebra" class (essentially another pre-Calc or Algebra 3, but more rigorous than TT), or, if your student does well (as both of my older two boys do), then go straight into Calc (though I supplemented matrices). A local CC math placement test can give you a good idea as to placement. Mine easily tested into Calc. If they hadn't (even borderline), we'd have done College Alg.

 

Some families I know speed up the series since there are only 129 lessons in each book (95 in Pre-Calc) and have this all done (including more to Pre-Calc) in 4 years leaving them room for Stats or Calc senior year. (We all start Alg 1 in either 7th or 8th grades.)

Edited July 26, 2010 by creekland

[SueS]

Wow, thanks for that great reply. It was so helpful. I know so little about this high school math as I never took calc. So, I think I'll have ds take TT geometry and then it sounds like it would be ok to continue with TT through calc even if he may go into engineering.

 

Any other comments about that?

 

Thanks,

[J-rap]

***

Edited March 1, 2023 by J-rap

[distancia]

I can speak for TT Alg 2 from experience, as D has used it. It is very thorough in explaining how to do something (step by step by step), but it doesn't always cover the concept of why. If your children are non-mathy (and intimidated by regular textbooks) it may be a good choice. It WAS a good choice for my non-mathy D until she decided to go into the sciences (!) and that means TT is no longer the right choice because now D is going to need to know more than how to solve an equation, she's going to have to know why she is solving it.

 

I have looked through the Table of Contents and I don't see anything about Matrices being covered. Also, at first glance it appears that Conic Sections aren't included, but digging deeper there is a small section on "cones" which includes the conic section concept.

 

Whenever I buy a math book I always test it out myself before I torture my D with it. I am not a "mathy" person, never got beyond h/s geometry, so I consider myself an excellent guinea pig for learning new concepts. My opinion is this:

 

PROS:

--I like the explanatory CDs and I especially like being shown each and every step of how to solve a problem.

--The graphics are great, very simple, uncluttered, no distractions, on a soothing yellow legal pad

--CDs are well-organized, and frankly, one could probably learn form the CDs alone, because the lectures on the CDs are virtually the same material as covered in the textbook

 

CONS:

--For me, the textbook just doesn't work. The text isn't intimidating or anything, and it's written in a friendly tone, but there seems to be a lot of...I have been trying to put my finger on it and finally came up with: it reminds me of Apologia Chemistry. The text covers too much of the page. I'd like to see the text squished together to make reading it less a physical exercise.

--The grey highlighting of important concepts is a definite turn-off

--The lectures and solutions (on the CD) are very informative and helpful, but I tend to lose interest about 3/4 of the way through because the pace is a bit too slow for my impatient mind (dinner needs to be made! the laundry needs to be done! the phone is ringing!) and I want to speed things along a bit more. But for the student who needs some soft, gentle encouragement who is in no rush to "get on with it" TT might be a good choice.

 

Hope this helps!

[LatinTea]

CONS:

--For me, the textbook just doesn't work. The text isn't intimidating or anything, and it's written in a friendly tone, but there seems to be a lot of...I have been trying to put my finger on it and finally came up with: it reminds me of Apologia Chemistry. The text covers too much of the page. I'd like to see the text squished together to make reading it less a physical exercise.

--The grey highlighting of important concepts is a definite turn-off

 

 

I totally agree with what you said about the text. My brain just didn't like all the words on the page either. Spread out too much and I couldn't take it in easily. My dd used about 3/4 of TT 7 and then she started Saxon Alg. 1/2. The TT CDs definitely were enough to get us through (thus, ignoring the awful text), but I didn't feel it had enough review and many concepts were just dropped. My dd learned about, I think it was quilting blocks, and it never was brought up again. Without review it was forgotten the next day. Why bother in the first place? And that horrid highlighting! That was SO distracting. If I want to highlight something, I would like to choose what it is. And I'll use a bright color. :)

 

Of course, we are all different and many students (and moms!) love TT. It just didn't work for us so we will just stick to Saxon for now and see how Alg. 2 goes. So far, so good.

[lagirl]

We are using TT for Alg 2 this year - my daughter is in 10th gr.

We have opted to do:

Alg 1 - 9th gr

Alg. 2 - 10th gr

Geometry - 11th

 

Math is our daughters least favorite subject and we think this

will be a good fit for her. TT moves slower than some curriculum

but it covers everything in due time. Wish I had had this when

I was in school!

[Brindee]

We've tried other options and are back to TT for dd. She did NOT like Saxon at all, and CLE seemed to jump here and there, and she didn't get it. She likes Life of Fred, but wants something on CD's. So we do TT and she looks at LoF when she wants to. :D

[SueS]

Yes, that helped.

 

I want to prepare my ds for engineering and I'm wondering if TT will do that. I'm thinking that if he went to a PS he would get whatever program that particular school had and that using TT couldn't be any worse than that.

 

What program would be better at explaining the "why" of math. I guess MUS would. How is that as far as preparing a child for engineering, etc?

 

Should I have him take Algebra 2 or Geometry in 9th grade? I would like him to take PSAT in 10th grade (and maybe 9th) as a practice.

[ouzel]

My son has finished TT Algebra II and is in the midst of TT Geometry for 9th grade, which he will follow with TT Pre-Calc. likely done over 2nd semester 9th grade and first semester 10th grade.

 

What I posted recently on another thread . . . My sons love TT. My neighbor had recommended TT and then she flipped when her son went into PS for pre-calc and was struggling with some areas TT hadn't covered in Alg II. She promptly regretted TT and bought Chalkdust for younger son. She put older son into a few tutoring sessions with a math prof., who said he's very well prepared . . .. that the problem was simply switching curriculum mid-stream. The pre-calc teacher held parent-teacher conferences and said her son (over any other student) had the best foundation. This son currently tutors peers in Calculus at his university. He's in pre-med. I'm sticking with TT at this point, but adding in some LOF for the fun of it.

 

Check this recent thread for more info. . . .

Anyone use upper levels of TT and do well on the SAT's

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196780

[SueS]

I was going to send back the Algebra 2 and get geometry, but when I talked to the TT rep she said they really encourage people to take Algebra 2 after Algebra 1 to keep it fresh in their minds. I'm really not sure what he should do this year, Algebra 2 or Geometry. And, I'm still wondering if TT is ok for him if he does pursue engineering. He used Saxon before, but TT seemed to better for him. Each lesson can take him a while to finish each day, but he seems to get it.