Have you ever thought you found the perfect math and then...

[mystika1]

got online and read math threads that make you feel like you chose a bad program?( I think that is why I have a shelf full of math material which my daughter hates. )

 

This is friendly conversation:)

What do you do when your child(7) hates(and I really mean hates)the "highly recommended" curriculum that is supposed to make them tackle math from all angles but responds well to the program that gets described as boring and not rigorous enough?

 

My daughter asked me if we could go back to MUS. She had hit a wall in Alpha that was very difficult so we ended up switching to CLE then MM. She said that she likes it better than MM. When she sees the MM materials her whole body seems to droop. She would end up in tears and tell me she's stupid.(She reacted the same way in K with RS lvl A)The last week we have used MUS and sprinkled MEP and she is so much better.(which makes me happy) Lately, I have heard lots of negative comments about mus which has me doubting everything. It is my own fault for reading all of the threads but I guess I like getting advice from seasoned homeschoolers.

 

I will officially skip all math threads from now on.:D

 

Sincerely,

Penny

[PollyOR]

We go with what works for each individual child.

 

I will officially skip all math threads from now on.:D

 

Good idea!

[Guest Cheryl in SoCal]

I love MUS!!! I found it after torturing (their word) my 5th and 6th graders for years with Horizons (5 years) and Saxon (3/4 of a year). We've used Alpha through Algebra 1. My kids like it, understand math and score very well on their SAT's. This year I added Life of Fred for more real life math and fun (yes, they think it's fun). I don't think you HAVE to but do think they complement each other very well.

[usetoschool]

Yeah, whatever. I use what works for the kid. I got some grief for giving up on a child and switching to CLE from Singapore but, hey, they aren't with the kid and doing the teaching. Use what works and makes your kid love math. Personally, I think they are all pretty good and any one of them is better than most of what they would get in public school, especially with a parent sitting next to them walking them through it and explaining it one on one in a way that they understand. Ah, the beauties of homeschool. I have personal favorites that teach how I see math and what I want my kids to learn and how, but that's me and my kids. You know yours better than anyone.

 

Don't skip the threads though - contribute what you have learned about how it works for your child because there might be someone else out there wavering and needing help.

[Jlynn]

What do you do when your child(7) hates(and I really mean hates)the "highly recommended" curriculum that is supposed to make them tackle math from all angles but responds well to the program that gets described as boring and not rigorous enough?

 

 

That was my son...Have used Rod & Staff from the beginning. Sister gave me a year's worth of Singapore so I tried that, but he HATED it. Stuck with R&S and have been happy campers ever since. FWIW, I loved Singapore and even tried supplementing with it....but it just didn't work for him at all.

[Satori]

I'm going to try my hardest from now on not to label any program as boring, as that is quite thoughtless.

 

But I say, use whatever works! We're all individuals with different abilities and interests, so different programs will work better than others. That's to be expected. There was a time I loved MUS myself, and when I tried a popular math program that people talked about a lot here, I just didn't get it. We finally found one that works for us. Once you find something that works, go ahead and keep using it.

[blessedmom3]

MUS is a great program . My son likes it too , but he does much better with CLE . He still watches the videos from MUS now and then but we use CLE as our main math program.

[Food4Thought]

I think if I've learned anything from these forums, it's that there are a million different possible ways to combine curriculum, and no single person in the world seems to use the same curriculum as anyone else for anything. :lol:

 

But I totally understand what you mean about constantly wondering if it's right or not. If you've found something that works with your DD, then you're doing a great job! :)

[MerryAtHope]

This is friendly conversation:)

What do you do when your child(7) hates(and I really mean hates)the "highly recommended" curriculum that is supposed to make them tackle math from all angles but responds well to the program that gets described as boring and not rigorous enough?

 

Back when I started out, I read all about how great it was to do Miquon and Singapore together. So I tried it. Hey, I love math, two programs sounds like fun to me! My oldest was not at ALL interested in doing 2 programs! So, I had him do Miquon for a year. We suffered through all year & then I finally thought maybe he'd like Singapore better. He looked at Singapore and then told me (as a just turned 7 yo) that the writers of Miquon didn't want children to understand math!

 

Fine, we'll do Singapore I thought--that one is highly acclaimed too! We barely got through a year of that. It was a slightly better fit than Miquon, but not really very workable.

 

We ended up with Horizons which was a good fit. I always thought maybe I'd fit in those wonderful Singapore word problems and rod diagrams...didn't happen.

 

Next year we're going to do MUS prealgebra. (Horizons doesn't have upper levels). I'm excited, and my son is too, he really liked the demo video. Hopefully it's a keeper through highschool, but if not, we'll look around again. I think it will be fine . If there was one perfect math program for all kids out there, then we wouldn't need so many choices. Your thought to not read the math threads is a good idea! Go with what works for your daughter. The best program isn't very good for you and your daughter if it leaves her in tears and she hates it--she won't learn much from that. So don't feel badly about that--move on, guilt-free!

 

Merry :-)

[Lovedtodeath]

got online and read math threads that make you feel like you chose a bad program?

Yes! Luckily a friend has given me her Teaching Textbooks so we can give it a no-risk test drive. :D

 

MUS is a good program. Relax. You have my permission.:lol:

[Pongo]

got online and read math threads that make you feel like you chose a bad program?( I think that is why I have a shelf full of math material which my daughter hates. )

 

 

 

Although I do read the math threads among others, I know that I know my kids best.

Do what is going to make them succeed in math, writing, grammar , vocabulary..whatever. Does it really make sense for force feed a curriculum to a child, only to find out they retained nothing:001_huh:? It's much better to see progress, however that needs to come. I have 1 student that is an academic dream, my other two are bright. The Singapore I loved using for my older two will not cut the mustard with my third. That's okay, I use different material for her and her scores were amazing. On the IOWA ITBS her total composite was in the 99 percentile and I use whats considered the less- rigorous material for her, in just about everything. My dh and I were shocked!

Even for vocabulary, we dropped Latin and her scores still soared(go figure).

My older two had great scores but, they work harder, and to think my youngest had the most fun last year. Still she scored the highest and that really put it into perspective for me. I did some last minute changes last night before I hit the purchase button. I really tried to look through their eyes, and for the first time I picked some unknowns for a few subjects. I want them to have fun, they are more likely to retain information that way. I just went with my gut feeling, I can't wait to get the stuff...lol

 

I say, go with your gut, school IS work but it doesn't have to be a tearful mess. Good luck!

Edited June 30, 2010 by Pongo

[Robin's Song]

I have noticed that when a certain poster participates in math threads, there are suddenly fifty spinoff threads because moms start agonizing over their choices. That's a huge complement to his persuasive skills :D. I have examined a ton of math programs in person before making my choices and I liked a lot of them for different reasons. Honestly, I think I could make any of them work.

 

To the poster who mentioned R&S, I personally think it is excellent at teaching arithmetic. It fits very well with my understanding of classical education in the grammar stage. I'm always surprised that it gets such a bad rep. We value repetition, memorization, and mastery in other subjects, but not math. :confused: What about those pegs?

[Mom0012]

Oh, yes, I know how you feel. I use R&S Math for my son, which is a perfect fit for him. A couple of years ago, it was proclaimed that R&S Math is not rigorous enough and every couple of months (if not more often) the subject is raised again. I have looked at the program, looked at my son and decided I don't care what other people think about it. It works for us and we are experiencing success in the same way others are experiencing it with their much more "rigorous" math programs.

 

Find what works for your child and stick with it. One thing the rigorous math people don't seem to consider is that not all children are designed to learn in the same way. Just because their program is working for them, doesn't mean yours can't work for you.

 

Lisa

Edited June 30, 2010 by LisaTheresa

[fairytalemama]

Use what makes you and your child happiest! Who cares what we all think anyway :001_smile:

 

Seriously, you know your child and family best. MUS is a solid program that gets the job done. If that's what gets your child excited about math, go for it and don't look back!

[Dmmetler]

FWIW, In my local homeschool group, I'm the strange one because I use Singapore instead of MUS or Saxon. I think no matter what you use, you're going to run into people who have contrary opinions. Use what works for your child. Realistically the difference between programs in K-12 math is miniscule, and while no program covers everything perfectly, most eventually get to all the really important stuff. As long as your child comes out in the end knowing and understanding math, you're fine!

 

Remember-you will find kids in college math programs who went to all sorts of schools and used all sorts of curricula. NO ONE, and I mean NO ONE cares what 2nd grade math book you used once you're studying calculus :).

[saja1029]

It's funny - I love this forum and it has been a great source of info. But, I've also read numerous threads about certain math, grammar, etc....decided to buy that product ....and HATED it (sent it back the next day!).

 

Everyone is different - you just can't sweat it. All that matters is that you are using something that works for you and your children. :)

[Annabel Lee]

Heh heh heh, I am one of those math thread readers and even posters. I love looking at stuff I haven't checked out or heard of and hearing more from people who've tried it, are using it, or are considering it and hearing their concerns. I comment on things I own but haven't got around to implementing. Guess what? I use "boring" math; traditional, non-Asian, "non-mental" math. We make it work. We all have our limitations. Were I a math professor, or even just a math whiz, I could probably figure out how to start some of the "mental math" programs in the middle. Once your kid is far enough along with a certain approach, you'd have to back up a grade (or sometimes 2) to switch to some programs because their sequence is so different and has already covered early parts of topics not traditionally covered in the US until later. My son would absolutely hate to find out that he has to go back a level and a half and do that much more math just because mommy read that this new math might be better.

 

I must be the meanest mom ever because I'm sticking with a math program that my older son "hates". Yet when I do little trials of other math programs with him, he "hates" those too. So I choose to use what I know will do the job well, what I understand well enough to teach, and what gets done. I've learned to tweak things so that I'm not a slave to the TM, substituting RS games & interesting activities for some of the "boring stuff". Just put on blinders, like horses wear, until you have a genuine need for new curriculum. :D

[Annabel Lee]

Realistically the difference between programs in K-12 math is miniscule, and while no program covers everything perfectly, most eventually get to all the really important stuff. As long as your child comes out in the end knowing and understanding math, you're fine!

 

:iagree:Exactly. With my hs friends IRL, I'm always saying that it's not about the path you take, it's about where the kid ends up cumulatively at the end of 12th grade.

[Dinsfamily]

I'm going to try my hardest from now on not to label any program as boring, as that is quite thoughtless.

 

 

:iagree:

[Tabrett]

OK!!!!!!!.......................

 

Now you have ME wanting to check out MUS!!!

 

My dd did the same with RS A and CLE. Although with CLE she started actually started understanding math. With RS she just did the activities, but couldn't translate what she had done to paper! She is my "I need to write it" child! CLE had a little too much writing. I am trying SP math this coming year with HOD's lesson plans. I "hope" it will be more pleasant.:001_huh:

 

MUS scares me:eek:. I'm afraid of mastery programs. I am afraid my dc will forget what they learned without constant review especially since my dd has a hard time remembering things like which coin is which. (?????)

[angela in ohio]

I think it is good to have criteria that you give yourself ahead of time for reading curriculum recommendations. For example:

 

Only listen to people who have actually used the curriculum for more than one full year.

 

Only listen to people who have dc with similar needs or personalities. Ask if you aren't sure.

 

Only listen to people who have a bit of homeshcool experience (you can set your own level here, I won't give mine as it might offend some.)

 

When in doubt, listen to the people whose experience you know and respect on the board. IRL advice is always better, because you know the person and their dc. I use a LOT of caution when taking advice on homeschool boards. I could tell you we used XYZ math curriculum and my child is now a rocket scientist at age 14. But I could be delusional and said child could be taking off his socks to count his age. :001_smile:

 

ETA: Also, pay attention to the mood of the thread. For example, in this thread, most people will be pro-MUS and support you. Those who dislike it will bow out kindly. Someone reading it will think everyone loves MUS. If you post that you are having difficulties with MUS, most people who dilike it or switched will post. That thread will make it appear that everyone hates MUS. You have to consider that when you read a thread.

 

I find it is helpful to do a lot of research and think veryhard before making a math choice, and then stick your fingers in your ears and go, "lah, lah, lah" on any further math threads. :D If you are having actual trouble, thn start looking again, otherwise... fingers. ears.

Edited June 30, 2010 by angela in ohio

[mystika1]

Thanks everyone. I guess I just needed a pick-me-up. I was really hesitating to use MUS cause I felt guilty that I couldn't make the others work.(like my daughter would reach 7th grade and be wayyyyy behind or something like that.:001_smile:) I usually follow my gut on these things but somehow got caught up in the threads. I actually learned so much from "Bill" and other math lovers here on the boards. Because of those threads I have found mep which my daughter really loves to use with mus.

 

We all want the "best" for our kids. I guess sometimes the "best " isn't necessarily the most popular.

 

Thank You All,

 

Penny

[mystika1]

MUS scares me:eek:. I'm afraid of mastery programs. I am afraid my dc will forget what they learned without constant review especially since my dd has a hard time remembering things like which coin is which. (?????)

 

That is one thing that I have read about MUS that I didn't understand. There really is review. Each lesson has worksheets A-F The last few worksheets are review. I use all worksheets each lesson so my daughter would get to review previous material. Also, the worksheet generator is awesome to get extra review and the test booklet could also be used for that instead of testing.

 

I am in no way trying to convert you to MUS.:001_smile: I just wanted to let you know my opinion on the review included in MUS.

 

HTH,

 

Penny

[Mandy in TN]

We value repetition' date=' memorization, and mastery in other subjects, but not math. :confused: What about those pegs?[/quote']

:iagree:

 

I am using Saxon and Kumon with an accelerated student which is apparently taboo. Although he understands concepts easily, that isn't the same thing as being able to apply math quickly and accurately. While I understand that calculators can perform operations but humans solve problems, young children- no matter how easily math comes to them- should be able to demonstrate and maintain a level of proficiency. We expect athletes to train in their sport: math is no different.

 

I wish that I had used MUS with my oldest from the get-go. We switched him in high school and it was such a relief. He needed a program where he could see someone explain the topic in a simple way and then let him squat on the topic until he had mastered exercises applying it.

 

Use whatever works best for you and your dd!

Mandy

[Soror]

I think there is a reason there are so many different programs. Different things work for different kids and different teachers. Some people write so well and persausively that it is hard to separate the emotional from the facts. I try to do as pp suggested assess what seems to work w/ ds, his learning style, and my needs and resources and try to look at people that are suggesting various programs and find ones that line up. In the end there is no foolproof way to know what will work without trying some different things and I expect to make mistakes.

[mystika1]

I think it is good to have criteria that you give yourself ahead of time for reading curriculum recommendations. For example:

 

Only listen to people who have actually used the curriculum for more than one full year.

 

Only listen to people who have dc with similar needs or personalities. Ask if you aren't sure.

 

Only listen to people who have a bit of homeshcool experience (you can set your own level here, I won't give mine as it might offend some.)

 

When in doubt, listen to the people whose experience you know and respect on the board. IRL advice is always better, because you know the person and their dc. I use a LOT of caution when taking advice on homeschool boards. I could tell you we used XYZ math curriculum and my child is now a rocket scientist at age 14. But I could be delusional and said child could be taking off his socks to count his age. :001_smile:

 

ETA: Also, pay attention to the mood of the thread. For example, in this thread, most people will be pro-MUS and support you. Those who dislike it will bow out kindly. Someone reading it will think everyone loves MUS. If you post that you are having difficulties with MUS, most people who dilike it or switched will post. That thread will make it appear that everyone hates MUS. You have to consider that when you read a thread.

 

I find it is helpful to do a lot of research and think veryhard before making a math choice, and then stick your fingers in your ears and go, "lah, lah, lah" on any further math threads. :D If you are having actual trouble, thn start looking again, otherwise... fingers. ears.

 

:hurray:This really needs to sink into my brain. Very well said.:001_smile:

 

Thanks,

Penny

[LoveBaby]

I think it is good to have criteria that you give yourself ahead of time for reading curriculum recommendations. For example:

 

Only listen to people who have actually used the curriculum for more than one full year.

 

Only listen to people who have dc with similar needs or personalities. Ask if you aren't sure.

 

Only listen to people who have a bit of homeshcool experience (you can set your own level here, I won't give mine as it might offend some.)

 

When in doubt, listen to the people whose experience you know and respect on the board. IRL advice is always better, because you know the person and their dc. I use a LOT of caution when taking advice on homeschool boards. I could tell you we used XYZ math curriculum and my child is now a rocket scientist at age 14. But I could be delusional and said child could be taking off his socks to count his age. :001_smile:

 

ETA: Also, pay attention to the mood of the thread. For example, in this thread, most people will be pro-MUS and support you. Those who dislike it will bow out kindly. Someone reading it will think everyone loves MUS. If you post that you are having difficulties with MUS, most people who dilike it or switched will post. That thread will make it appear that everyone hates MUS. You have to consider that when you read a thread.

 

I find it is helpful to do a lot of research and think veryhard before making a math choice, and then stick your fingers in your ears and go, "lah, lah, lah" on any further math threads. :D If you are having actual trouble, thn start looking again, otherwise... fingers. ears.

 

 

:iagree:

 

Bolding is mine - I've been homeschooloing 4.5 years now and have 5 children. My perspective on hs'ing is going to be wildly different from somone who has graduated their children or someone who is just starting out with a 3yo. It took me awhile to figure out who to listen to and who to ignore (i.e. not allow them to make me worry about what I was doing with *my* children in *my* homeschool)! I think it's easy on these boards to be swayed by others, only to find out that they are teaching a gifted 5yo or a delayed 10yo or they have 10 children or 1 child which by nature will vary their homeschooling experience, expectations and results from what you will experience, expect or find in your results.

 

"Rigorous Math" is only as good as the paper it's written on if your child disolves into tears everytime it's looked at or scratches their head in confusion every time you try to teach it. That isn't a poor reflection on you the teacher or the student or even the curricula, it's just the reality of the situation. Can it be taught a little differently? Perhaps, but if that makes it more difficult or more frustrating, then maybe it isn't really worth it!! Find something that does work for you and your teaching style and your child and their learning style and ignore the rest, mama!!! :grouphug:

 

For what it's worth, we've tried all the "rigorous" math programs out there only to end in frustration and tears (on both our parts!!) and have happily chosen MUS as our program. It was frustrating when I found something that works and then came here and found people bashing it. It's easy for them to say it's boring or not rigorous or whatever, but it's hard not to take that personally or interpret that as a poor reflection of my choices for my homeschool. My daughter is now confident when doing math, in her work and in real life. That is priceless to me and I won't worry about what others think of MUS anymore, nor should you if it works for your child!

[Guest Cheryl in SoCal]

OK!!!!!!!.......................

 

Now you have ME wanting to check out MUS!!!

 

My dd did the same with RS A and CLE. Although with CLE she started actually started understanding math. With RS she just did the activities, but couldn't translate what she had done to paper! She is my "I need to write it" child! CLE had a little too much writing. I am trying SP math this coming year with HOD's lesson plans. I "hope" it will be more pleasant.:001_huh:

 

MUS scares me:eek:. I'm afraid of mastery programs. I am afraid my dc will forget what they learned without constant review especially since my dd has a hard time remembering things like which coin is which. (?????)

 

MUS does have review. Each lesson has 6 worksheets; 3 on the new lesson and 3 of review. I'm not trying to draw you over to the "MUS side" (cue creepy Star Wars music;):lol:), just letting you know that (at least for MUS) mastery doesn't mean no review.

[Robin's Song]

.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Robin's Song

[twoxcell]

I think MUS and MEP would make a great combo:) You would get the mastery and drill from MUS, and the conceptual/puzzle from MEP. I'm still trying to figure out math myself. These boards introduced me to MEP, and made me sell off Horizons, and buy Singapore Math. I hope we enjoy our choices:tongue_smilie:

[Susan in TX]

What do you do when your child(7) hates(and I really mean hates)the "highly recommended" curriculum that is supposed to make them tackle math from all angles but responds well to the program that gets described as boring and not rigorous enough?

 

You use the program that works for your child and you don't apologise for it. It doesn't matter how good someone else says a program is, if it doesn't work for your kid, it isn't the right program for you. Find what works and stick with it.

 

Susan in TX

[robsiew]

I think the advice on boards is very helpful when you have a reason for switching. If no reason to switch just ignore everything else! If it's working keep using it! Your dd liking math goes a lot further than some program someone deemed "more rigorous" or "better". The best program won't work if your dd hates it and thusly begins to hate math. :001_smile: It's a blessing and a curse to have so many choices!

[Guest RecumbentHeart]

This thread has been a great read. I'm just starting out and soaking up all kinds of info from all the math threads (and grammar threads .. even though I don't need to concern myself with grammar curric for several years ..:tongue_smilie:) and I've changed my plans several times before even starting. I am learning both to better evaluate the worth (to me) of the opinions/info I read and that it is only with experience that I will know what will really work for both me and my child/ren and that I need to go with that rather than what other's say, regardless of how much the know of what they're talking about .. they're still not in my situation, with my particular children and not necessarily sharing my particular priorities.

 

I agree that IRL friends are probably a better source of info to some extent but I'm thankful for all that I've learned here as well. All my HSing friends have different styles and circumstances and priorities/goals and I've found that my style (though still discovering it)/circumstances/priorities differ to various degrees but at least when discussing HSing with an IRL friend I know the context from which their opinions are coming from far more so than what I could ever gather from the info someone chooses to share in their post or signature.

 

I know nothing about MUS and I'm refusing to Google it .. at least until next year.

 

Fingers. Ears. :lol:

[angela in ohio]

Fingers. Ears. :lol:

 

:D Next time someone posts, "I really love XYZ, but I keep hearing that PQR is better," don't you all be surprised when this is all I post:

 

Finger. Ears. :001_cool:

[nmoira]

:D Next time someone posts, "I really love XYZ, but I keep hearing that PQR is better," don't you all be surprised when this is all I post:

 

Finger. Ears. :001_cool:

Given those choices, I strongly prefer XYZ.

:lol:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I couldn't resist. ;)

Edited June 30, 2010 by nmoira

[angela in ohio]

Given those choices, I strongly prefer XYZ.

:lol:

 

I guess your children will never get into college then...

 

 

 

:lol::lol::lol:

[Guest]

This is friendly conversation:)

 

 

:lol:

 

Oh, yes, I know how you feel. I use R&S Math for my son, which is a perfect fit for him. A couple of years ago, it was proclaimed that R&S Math is not rigorous enough and every couple of months (if not more often) the subject is raised again. I have looked at the program, looked at my son and decided I don't care what other people think about it. It works for us and we are experiencing success in the same way others are experiencing it with their much more "rigorous" math programs.

 

Find what works for your child and stick with it. One thing the rigorous math people don't seem to consider is that not all children are designed to learn in the same way. Just because their program is working for them, doesn't mean yours can't work for you.

 

Lisa

 

Same here.

[Annabel Lee]

Only listen to people who have actually used the curriculum for more than one full year.

 

Only listen to people who have dc with similar needs or personalities. Ask if you aren't sure.

 

Only listen to people who have a bit of homeshcool experience (you can set your own level here, I won't give mine as it might offend some.)

 

 

Such great advice! I learned the 1st point the hard way, and that was with a friend IRL. Some people really like to sound like an authorative commentator on programs they're planning on using, and do so very enthusiastically, convincing others that program is the best. When you follow that person's lead & it ends up poorly for your dc it's irksome to find out your friend switched again after a month. :glare: Take caution IRL, too.

[Lovedtodeath]

What is funny is that I have a child with dyscalculia and I am using Math Mammoth. She is gaining more understanding. Then I find with my research into dyscalculia that these children often do better with "Asian math". MUS was a nightmare for this child. Yes, you (general you) should get what works for your child, but don't assume that one has to be "mathy" in order to use MM or Singapore.