High School logic help, please

[johnandtinagilbert]

Ladies,

My dc have done very little regarding logic. We have spent the past couple of years completing CD's only using Mind Benders (meant for grades 7-12). We did not follow the suggestions (regrettably) in the WTM. I plan to change that for those up and coming, so my question is this:

 

For a student with little logic instruction, just entering high school, what do you suggest?

 

Thank you for your time and experience :)

 

FWIW, the student will be using

WriteShop1 and 2

TOG (including the lit portion)

Latin Road to Eng. Grammar 1 and 2

 

So we are strong in language arts and humanities...need some logic work though!

[Brindee]

I just put some ideas out for another person. Here's the link. These would be just to go through to get the basics before moving on. I see you've already done some Mind Benders, but the 3-book logic series in here can be used just to get them used to the ideas, and they can go through the books as quickly as they like. Once they have the base, then they can move on. I wouldn't worry about levels. If they put in the amount of hours required, then it certainly counts. Starting them out in highschool logic could be rather confusing. Anyway, here's the link to the other thread:

 

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161985

[FloridaLisa]

Don't beat yourself up! While I've done beginning logic work with my dc in middle school, it's not critical that a student work through Mind Benders or some other logic before working through a formal logic program. And 9th grade is a great time to start formal logic.

 

My dc have used both Intro to Logic and Traditional Logic. I prefer the Traditional Logic series, because it's more language based. Both programs cover many of the same formal logic concepts. My current 9th and 10th graders are working through Traditional Logic I and II this year and will move into Material Logic either this summer or fall. Don't know what, if any, logic we'll do following ML.

 

HTH,

Lisa

[Janice H]

Hi Tina,

 

I concur with Lisa and offer some links and my experience with the Cothran series below.

 

Full disclosure: I am a Nance and Critical Thinking dropout. We finished the two Traditional Logic Cothran books.

 

Cothran makes a strong case on the Memoria Press website for not studying fallacies before formal logic. If you plan on doing a formal logic course, you could therefore skip the introduction-to-logic-through-fallacies type of books.

 

Link wherein Cothran compares his text with the Nance text. http://www.memoriapress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=406

 

Start on this page of a long thread wherein Plaid Dad helps sort out the different types of logic.

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forum...t=logic&page=8

 

Some specific remarks about the Logic I and II books:

 

Cothran's Book One is fairly straightforward. Book Two is more complex. The middle of book II is gets more difficult; the answers are not cut and dry--sort of like geometry proofs. I do not think most students could or should complete Book Two without a parent- or teacher-partner.

 

There are a few typos in the key; many exercises are not fill-in-the-blanks or T/F and could have answers that are correct but phrased differently from the key. Not all questions posted on the Memoria Press board get answered; support is incomplete. There are some old posts on this board from Tina that are very helpful regarding Book II chapter six (?).

 

I own the DVDs for the Logic II book, but they have not added much to the book. It’s nice when your brain is too tired or lazy to read the book, or for review. What I have found invaluable, and will use as a follow-up course for dd is Kreeft's Socratic Logic 3rd Edition. For the time being Kreeft is acting as my "lecturer" and background resource. There are also some exercises in the book with answers to the even numbered ones. I think a homeschooler can get the rest of the answers by emailing the address given in the book. (I haven't done this yet.)

 

Despite the frustrations of the Cothran text, for many users it is the best available book for high school homestudy of classic Aristotelian logic.

[mcconnellboys]

I don't plan to do Cothran with my younger son until he's in high school. I don't think you're "behind" at all! He is going to do Nance's books in junior high, before we turn to Cothran.

[johnandtinagilbert]

Just wanted to jump in and say thank you. I'll be reading those threads! I am finally leaning towards personal, mental wellness, when I think about high school.

[Jane in NC]

Regarding teaching logic in high school: Tina in Ouray had the most informative posts on the old board, but I fear those posts have gone into the abyss unless someone saved them. Thus I am giving this shout out to the organized.

 

Tina does have some posts on these new boards. An advance search may help you find some interesting reading.