s/o Non-Christians Going to Church?

[Spy Car]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

[lionfamily1999]

:shrug: As long as you:

a. expect to get preached at

b. maintain an attitude of respect

c. maintian an attitude of respect

Why not?

 

Doubled the respect, simply because it's very difficult to attend to the sermon/praise and worship with disrepectful/irreverent people giggling or whispering the whole time. That's about the only thing that comes to mind that could be an issue.

 

Not to say I think you'd sit there pointing and laughing.

[Spy Car]

:shrug: As long as you:

a. expect to get preached at

b. maintain an attitude of respect

c. maintian an attitude of respect

Why not?

 

Doubled the respect, simply because it's very difficult to attend to the sermon/praise and worship with disrepectful/irreverent people giggling or whispering the whole time. That's about the only thing that comes to mind that could be an issue.

 

Not to say I think you'd sit there pointing and laughing.

 

No. No. I'm super-respectful, and only attend churches I expect to enjoy.

 

Ones with cultures and traditions with elements of majesty and spirituality.

 

And have never had anything other than a very rewarding experience.

 

Bill

[rosesinsummer]

I agree with the above poster about being respectful with the added caveat that in many Christian traditions (Catholic, Orthodox, and some branches of Lutheran etc.) you should not present yourself for Holy Communion.

[Pink Fairy]

Personally, I think it's great, and I doubt anyone in "authority" would object to your attendance at their church. My only caveat is that it would be inappropriate for you to participate in parts of the service that are reserved for church members in good standing. I'm thinking in particular of my own church, Roman Catholic, and the reception of Holy Communion as a sign of one's unity and belief.

 

But always you would be welcome to attend Mass any time, at any Catholic Church, regardless of your individual beliefs. :001_smile:

[Crimson Wife]

I'd say go find yourself a Unitarian Universalist congregation. A good friend of mine is an agnostic married to an atheist. They wanted to raise their kids within some sort of ethical tradition and like-minded community so they joined the local UU congregation. The way she describes it, members can believe whatever they want so long as they agree on the UU's 7 ethical principles (tolerance, compassion, truth, peace, etc).

 

Not my particular cup of tea but the great thing about America is having the freedom to choose whatever spiritual tradition suits each of us best :D

[Aubrey]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

Well, I think it's great. Yes, there will be a sense of false hope, but a) you'll never convince them that it's false, & b) w/in this framework, I don't think false hope will necessarily hurt anyone. I think it may be really hard to find churches in which people will understand what you've written here, & it *may* be a good idea (for your sake, esp) to be up front about it (maybe--it might not matter).

 

And if you find a place that can respect your position & welcome you (although I understand you're not looking for one particular place necessarily), there could be some wonderful results, although "results" is a bad word choice there. I'm thinking friendships, life experiences, etc.

 

I hope that's clear & helpful...I'm always nervous to try to talk about things that can be so delicate. :001_smile:

[lionfamily1999]

Oops, I should have mentioned that taking part in certain acts/services would not be taken well.

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

I recommend Unitarian Universalism:D It is bound to fit your needs if you desire.;)

 

I see no problem with church tourism. It is a nice way to check things out:)

[asta]

I say go on wit yo bad self.

 

Who bought the patent on religion, anyway? There are some seriously beautiful ceremonies out there.

 

Personally, I have always wished that I could be a fly on the wall at a *real* Hopi ceremony, but, alas, that will never be. (as it should be, I might add)

 

Yep, full of contradictions on that one...

 

 

a

[Satori]

I was going to mention joining a Unitarian Universalist church as well. I think about it sometimes. For me it would be the community aspects, as well as any humanitarian ethics.

 

I do go to church about 4 times a year when I'm with my parents, and I respectfully go.

[Sue G in PA]

By all means...please go! All are welcome at church and you don't have to be a "prospective convert" to go. Go and enjoy yourself! Let us know how it goes, Bill!

[kmacnchs]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

You would be MORE than welcome at our church (can't speak for other churches) but don't expect to blend in! :D We have about 60 members and when there is a guest, we know :)

[Melinda in VT]

I'd say go find yourself a Unitarian Universalist congregation. A good friend of mine is an agnostic married to an atheist. They wanted to raise their kids within some sort of ethical tradition and like-minded community so they joined the local UU congregation. The way she describes it, members can believe whatever they want so long as they agree on the UU's 7 ethical principles (tolerance, compassion, truth, peace, etc).

 

Not my particular cup of tea but the great thing about America is having the freedom to choose whatever spiritual tradition suits each of us best :D

 

I think UU churches are great, and our family attended one for a couple of years. (Then we moved.)

 

But, if SpyCar is loooking for a highly liturgical service (and I don't know that he is), he might be out of luck. There are very few UU churches that have "high church" services. I only know of one, and it's on the opposite coast from SpyCar.

[justamouse]

I love going to high masses and soaking in the reverence and architecture. It's beautiful, you know? Have a blast.

[NoPlaceLikeHome]

I think UU churches are great, and our family attended one for a couple of years. (Then we moved.)

 

But, if SpyCar is loooking for a highly liturgical service (and I don't know that he is), he might be out of luck. There are very few UU churches that have "high church" services. I only know of one, and it's on the opposite coast from SpyCar.

 

If he is looking for that then I recommend the Episcopal Church IMHO which has been accused of being Unitarian by some;)

[Melinda in VT]

If he is looking for that then I recommend the Episcopal Church IMHO which has been accused of being Unitarian by some;)

 

I love attending Episcopalian services when I can. And I think they have the most beautiful churches.

[Hedgehogs4]

I say go. People will make assumptions about why you might be there, but if you are prepared for that and are not defensive, then you should go.

 

I agree with the PP who said do not receive the sacraments or participate in baptismal liturgies. At our church, you would even be welcome to participate in communion, in that you would be invited to the altar rail with those receiving the elements, but you would just fold your hands and place them over your heart, and the priest would offer a prayer of blessing you instead.

 

The thought of this happening in my own church would be both intimidating on a human level and exciting on a spiritual level. Let me explain why.

 

Worship is a very personal, intimate thing a person experiences, both with their God and the people with whom they worship. There are true spiritual bonds that tie us together. Having someone come to observe this ritual is a bit like having someone come into our home to just watch how we live our lives. On this level, it makes me feel a little weird. Being a case study is never a comfortable thing, unless you know that the person watching hopes to gain something more than just data from you. You can go and be a neutral observer which might be comfortable for you, but it may not be for the people being observed.

 

On the other hand, I can't help but think that your desire to engage in such an activity suggests that you are seeking--something. It would be my prayer that a person in your situation who is attending my church would be drawn by the Holy Spirit and touched in a way that is life-changing. I think you have to consider that there may be people praying that very prayer in whatever church you attend, and you may in fact be changed by the experience.

[Spy Car]

I agree with the above poster about being respectful with the added caveat that in many Christian traditions (Catholic, Orthodox, and some branches of Lutheran etc.) you should not present yourself for Holy Communion.

 

I have to confess that we were in Florence years ago on Christmas Eve, and the not-yet-then Mrs Spy Car and I when to the beautiful Duomo in the center of town for midnight mass. We arrived early and took in the beauty (and awe inspiring architecture) and got into a discussion about Jesus and the great moral teachings that can be found in the Synoptic Gospels, and the potential (and actual) capacity for good his message has had on the world.

 

I'm not a spiritual person, but I was having a very unusual evening, and--in my own way--imagined I was feeling some of the same type of feelings a person of faith feels when moved by the sacred impulse with-in. A feeling of some degree of "ecstasy."

 

And it was strange when services started The Archbishop began to tell the story of Saul on the road to Damascus in Latin (a language I have since studied to a slight degree) and I felt like he might as well have been speaking English.

 

And he talked about rich and poor, and that earthy-treasures were no value towards our salvation, comments clearly directed towards the section we were sitting in (as being unaware [and early]) we were in the good seats, and by unspoken convention everybody (but us) seemed to know where they belonged.

 

Anyway, I'm sitting there feeling about as emotion-filled as a person of non-faith can feel, when a church attendant came to me and asked if I would help with the mass. Was I going to say no? Perhaps I should have, but I did not.

 

I was ushered into a back-chamber, outfitted in fine robes and I lead the processional carrying the host on a golden platter, and served as altar boy (man) for Communion.

 

I hope this isn't too shocking. And I took Communion from the Archbishop of Firenza. It didn't seem "wrong" at the time (quite to the contrary) but I now understand it probably wasn't 100% kosher.

 

My sincere apologies to anyone who is offended that I partook in a holy sacrament without being a confirmed member of the faith. I understand I crossed a line I ought not have. I hope my confession does not cause ill feelings. Mea Culpa.

 

Bill

Edited March 5, 2010 by Spy Car

[Impish]

*snip*

 

The thought of this happening in my own church would be both intimidating on a human level and exciting on a spiritual level. Let me explain why.

 

Worship is a very personal, intimate thing a person experiences, both with their God and the people with whom they worship. There are true spiritual bonds that tie us together. Having someone come to observe this ritual is a bit like having someone come into our home to just watch how we live our lives. On this level, it makes me feel a little weird. Being a case study is never a comfortable thing, unless you know that the person watching hopes to gain something more than just data from you. You can go and be a neutral observer which might be comfortable for you, but it may not be for the people being observed.

 

On the other hand, I can't help but think that your desire to engage in such an activity suggests that you are seeking--something. It would be my prayer that a person in your situation who is attending my church would be drawn by the Holy Spirit and touched in a way that is life-changing. I think you have to consider that there may be people praying that very prayer in whatever church you attend, and you may in fact be changed by the experience.

:iagree:

[asta]

I have to confess that we were in Florence years ago on Christmas Eve, and the not-yet-then Mrs Spy Car and I when to the beautiful Duomo in the center of town for midnight mass. We arrived early and too in the beauty (and awe inspiring architecture) and got into a discussion about Jesus and the great moral teachings that can be found in the Synoptic Gospels, and the potential (and actual) potential for good his message has had on the world.

 

I'm not a spiritual person, but I was having a very unusual evening, and--in my own way--imagined I was feeling some of the same type of feelings a person of faith feels when moved by the sacred impulse with-in. A feeling of some degree of "ecstasy."

 

And it was strange when services started The Archbishop began to tell the story of Saul on the road to Damascus in Latin (a language I have since studied to a slight degree) and I felt like he might as well have been speaking English.

 

And he talked about rich and poor, and that earthy-treasures were no value towards our salvation, comments clearly directed towards the section we were sitting in (as being unaware [and early]) we were in the good seats, and by unspoken convention everybody (but us) seemed to know where they belonged.

 

Anyway, I'm sitting there feeling about as emotion-filled as a person of non-faith can feel, when a church attendant came to me and asked if I would help with the mass. Was I going to say no? Perhaps I should have, but I did not.

 

I was ushered into a back-chamber, outfitted in fine robes and I lead the processional carrying the host on a golden platter, and served as altar boy (man) for Communion.

 

I hope this isn't too shocking. And I took Communion from the Archbishop of Firenza. It didn't seem "wrong" at the time (quite to the contrary) but I now understand it probably wasn't 100% kosher.

 

My sincere apologies to anyone who is offended that I partook in a holy sacrament without being a confirmed member of the faith. I understand I crossed a line I ought not have. I hope my confession does not cause ill feelings. Mea Culpa.

 

Bill

 

No Catholic would be angry with you, Bill.

 

 

a

 

 

ETA: They might mention to you, though, that you had been chosen by the Holy Spirit for communion

Edited March 5, 2010 by asta

[lionfamily1999]

I have to confess that we were in Florence years ago on Christmas Eve, and the not-yet-then Mrs Spy Car and I when to the beautiful Duomo in the center of town for midnight mass. We arrived early and too in the beauty (and awe inspiring architecture) and got into a discussion about Jesus and the great moral teachings that can be found in the Synoptic Gospels, and the potential (and actual) potential for good his message has had on the world.

 

I'm not a spiritual person, but I was having a very unusual evening, and--in my own way--imagined I was feeling some of the same type of feelings a person of faith feels when moved by the sacred impulse with-in. A feeling of some degree of "ecstasy."

 

And it was strange when services started The Archbishop began to tell the story of Saul on the road to Damascus in Latin (a language I have since studied to a slight degree) and I felt like he might as well have been speaking English.

 

And he talked about rich and poor, and that earthy-treasures were no value towards our salvation, comments clearly directed towards the section we were sitting in (as being unaware [and early]) we were in the good seats, and by unspoken convention everybody (but us) seemed to know where they belonged.

 

Anyway, I'm sitting there feeling about as emotion-filled as a person of non-faith can feel, when a church attendant came to me and asked if I would help with the mass. Was I going to say no? Perhaps I should have, but I did not.

 

I was ushered into a back-chamber, outfitted in fine robes and I lead the processional carrying the host on a golden platter, and served as altar boy (man) for Communion.

 

I hope this isn't too shocking. And I took Communion from the Archbishop of Firenza. It didn't seem "wrong" at the time (quite to the contrary) but I now understand it probably wasn't 100% kosher.

 

My sincere apologies to anyone who is offended that I partook in a holy sacrament without being a confirmed member of the faith. I understand I crossed a line I ought not have. I hope my confession does not cause ill feelings. Mea Culpa.

 

Bill

Just don't let it happen again........:glare:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:lol:

Really, it's a matter of respect more than anything else. Sacred rites, etc, are normally off limits, because if you don't believe then it's a bit of a smack in the face. That being said, I'm not Catholic, but in your position I'd be very tempted to do the same thing. ;)

[HRAAB]

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

Bill

 

I'm thinking larger churches. The parish (Catholic) my family attends is big (around 2200 families). Honestly, you wouldn't be noticed. If you were you might be asked if you wanted to attend an information class. Say no, and they will leave you alone. The large Anglican church I've attended occasionally with my aunt would be the same. Beautiful liturgy, but I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be bothered with evangelizing.

 

In smaller churches, or non-denominational ones, it would be hard to blend in. They'll probably never believe you when you say you'll never convert. :001_smile:

[Parrothead]

Anyway, I'm sitting there feeling about as emotion-filled as a person of non-faith can feel, when a church attendant came to me and asked if I would help with the mass. Was I going to say no? Perhaps I should have, but I did not.

 

I was ushered into a back-chamber, outfitted in fine robes and I lead the processional carrying the host on a golden platter, and served as altar boy (man) for Communion.

 

I hope this isn't too shocking. And I took Communion from the Archbishop of Firenza. It didn't seem "wrong" at the time (quite to the contrary) but I now understand it probably wasn't 100% kosher.

 

What a lovely way to receive your First Holy Communion. It is a lot better than how I, a cradle Catholic from the 60's/70's, received mine.

[Crimson Wife]

You were in Italy so the priest was probably heartened by seeing someone who wasn't elderly attending Mass :D

 

I spent a summer as an au pair in a nominally Catholic country when I was 18 and my host family (who considered themselves to be Catholic) found it so odd that I would want to attend Mass on Sundays. It was just me and the village's seniors :tongue_smilie:

[rosesinsummer]

I have to confess that we were in Florence years ago on Christmas Eve, and the not-yet-then Mrs Spy Car and I when to the beautiful Duomo in the center of town for midnight mass. We arrived early and too in the beauty (and awe inspiring architecture) and got into a discussion about Jesus and the great moral teachings that can be found in the Synoptic Gospels, and the potential (and actual) potential for good his message has had on the world.

 

I'm not a spiritual person, but I was having a very unusual evening, and--in my own way--imagined I was feeling some of the same type of feelings a person of faith feels when moved by the sacred impulse with-in. A feeling of some degree of "ecstasy."

 

And it was strange when services started The Archbishop began to tell the story of Saul on the road to Damascus in Latin (a language I have since studied to a slight degree) and I felt like he might as well have been speaking English.

 

And he talked about rich and poor, and that earthy-treasures were no value towards our salvation, comments clearly directed towards the section we were sitting in (as being unaware [and early]) we were in the good seats, and by unspoken convention everybody (but us) seemed to know where they belonged.

 

Anyway, I'm sitting there feeling about as emotion-filled as a person of non-faith can feel, when a church attendant came to me and asked if I would help with the mass. Was I going to say no? Perhaps I should have, but I did not.

 

I was ushered into a back-chamber, outfitted in fine robes and I lead the processional carrying the host on a golden platter, and served as altar boy (man) for Communion.

 

I hope this isn't too shocking. And I took Communion from the Archbishop of Firenza. It didn't seem "wrong" at the time (quite to the contrary) but I now understand it probably wasn't 100% kosher.

 

My sincere apologies to anyone who is offended that I partook in a holy sacrament without being a confirmed member of the faith. I understand I crossed a line I ought not have. I hope my confession does not cause ill feelings. Mea Culpa.

 

Bill

 

I believe in the case you presented, you were not aware of the rules. That is different from someone who knows that they should not partake and does so anyway.

 

I do find your story very interesting, however. Whether or not you personally believe, you did, in fact, receive the true Jesus Christ, Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity, fully present in the Eucharist at that Midnight Mass.

 

Perhaps you are a "seeker" in some way and don't really know it...........no offense intended. The Lord works in mysterious ways. :)

[Spy Car]

I'd say go find yourself a Unitarian Universalist congregation. A good friend of mine is an agnostic married to an atheist. They wanted to raise their kids within some sort of ethical tradition and like-minded community so they joined the local UU congregation. The way she describes it, members can believe whatever they want so long as they agree on the UU's 7 ethical principles (tolerance, compassion, truth, peace, etc).

 

 

No. No. I'm afraid I'm being mis-understood.

 

I'm not looking to join a church. I'm saying I like to visit the Greek Orthodox Church, and the Episcopal Mass, and the Roman Catholic, and the Assyrian Church of the East, and the First AME Church and have been to a great number of other African American churches ranging from the huge to small store-fronts over my life. Plus attending Mosques and Synagogues at time of worship.

 

I think it is an "interesting" experience to partake in (in a spirit of good-will, but not one of "communion). But I'm sensitive to the charge of "voyeurism" (which I don't feel inside) but which I can understand a person who can't know my heart might suspect. Or there may even be a "partial truth."

 

On the Unitarian front, I did attend some Unitarian services back in the 70's as my Mother went though a "Unitarian phase." I was (mildly) surprise to see some of the flock were seemingly adding dope-smoking as a sacrament ;).

 

And I wasn't sure how good an idea it was handing wine to a pre-teen during the reading of the Torah portion, but we were all hippy-dippy then :lol:

 

Bill

Edited March 5, 2010 by Spy Car

[Pink Fairy]

I also received Holy Communion once, in grade school, before I became Catholic. An innocent mistake is just that--innocent. No hard feelings, no mea culpa necessary.

 

Of course, now that we know you did indeed receive your first Holy

Communion, we Catholics have a certain claim that you are on "our" team. :D

[Jennifer in MI]

Bill - You'd be welcome at our church! My dh is the priest. We welcome visitors - and encourage questions. I just know you and my dh would get along well. I'd love to hear some of your conversations (although I think most of it would go over my head!).

 

Anyway, much of the Episcopal church is not what it used to be. There isn't much liturgy there that resembles anything ancient in most churches. You might want to try an Anglican church. Many of these churches used to be Episcopal and have returned to a much higher, liturgical mass.

 

Our church is still Episcopal and we have a very high mass, but churches like ours are few and far between.

[Spy Car]

If he is looking for that then I recommend the Episcopal Church IMHO which has been accused of being Unitarian by some;)

 

We have a beautiful Episcopal Church around the corner. It is "our church". We attend Christmas Eve mass there most years, and try to help them in their missions to feed the hungry and the destitute.

 

We also have family connections to the Anglican Church and I feel very at home there, other than the obvious problem.

 

Bill

[jenL]

I believe in the case you presented, you were not aware of the rules. That is different from someone who knows that they should not partake and does so anyway.

 

I do find your story very interesting, however. Whether or not you personally believe, you did, in fact, receive the true Jesus Christ, Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity, fully present in the Eucharist at that Midnight Mass.

 

Perhaps you are a "seeker" in some way and don't really know it...........no offense intended. The Lord works in mysterious ways. :)

 

:iagree: The first thing I thought of was how the Holy Spirit was fully in you. What a blessing even if you weren't looking for it or believe.

 

FWIW, I don't see any problem attending a variety of church services. My sister actually had a class in college that involved doing this. The services were followed by open round-table discussions with the rabbi, priest, pastor, etc. afterward. She said it was one of the most amazing experiences in her life, and it actually led her closer to God.

[LMA]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

It's perfectly appropriate. Visitors are welcome at most churches. No one asks their "motive" in attending.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Bill,

 

There will be a bit of expectation. I think you just have to be honest.

 

JFWIW, our Sunday (usually it's Sunday though if you live in a huge city, there may be other days) meeting is called the Public Talk. It is coupled with a Bible study (still public). People are friendly, no offering is asked for or plate passed around or whatever. You're welcome to join us whether you're in Los Angeles, Cairo, Beijing, Port Au Prince, Moscow, or wherever else.

 

If you wanted to go on a special day, March 30th this year corresponds with the day Jesus was killed. He asked us to commemorate his death. The meeting that night starts after sundown (7-7:30ish; 9pm if they do a second one). Hint: do not partake here either :)

Edited March 5, 2010 by 2J5M9K

[dangermom]

I'm all for visiting churches. I'd be happy to take a friend to church in a spirit of friendly visitation (and have done), and I have often gone myself or taken my kids to other churches. Our church buildings all say "visitors welcome" on the sign, so I guess that tells you their policy.

 

My dad used to take me to various churches when I was a kid. I thought it was great. Sometimes I would go with my best friend to mass, and once I went with a neighbor friend to something called a Missionette meeting, which I thought was like Girl Scouts. I wanted to be a Missionette too, but then it turned out that they mostly passed out tracts. I had no idea at the time, nor did my parents, that it was an Assembly of God program and the leaders would probably have freaked out if they had known there was a Mormon in their midst.

 

These days, my husband and I both like to visit other churches, but I'm more enthused about going out and finding one to take the kids to, whereas he only does it when an opportunity arises. We've gone to evangelical-style services with friends, I've taken my older girl to Latin mass a couple of times, we visited a Sikh gurdwara a while back (did you know they have free food all the time for anyone in need or just hungry?), and my current plan is to take them to the teeny little mosque here in town. We recently attended a sort of interfaith dinner, and I found out from the Muslim guy next to me that you can visit a mosque, which I thought wasn't OK. So I have his phone number and I need to call him.

[smrtmama]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

Officer Daddyman plans to start taking the kids to various houses of worship in middle school as part of our comparative religions program. Neither of us are religious -- he vaguely ascribes to some eastern philosophies and I think of myself as a nonspecific areligious believer (Daddyman calls me a Deist, as I believe in some sort of godforce, I just don't think it's up in anyone's grill) -- but he's very interested in the ways people worship and why. He thinks it would be good for the children to be exposed to a wide array of beliefs so they can come to their own spiritual conclusions.

[Carol in Cal.]

...about the Holy Communion issue--you're being advised not to partake not because it's a big game of keep away, but rather because it's Biblically considered spiritually dangerous to partake if you're not an informed, repentant believer. It's for your own good not to partake, not accusatory like you're sneaking something if you do, or anything like that.

[dangermom]

Yes, I would concur about communion. In our church, communion is (partly) also a renewal of baptismal vows. No one would scream or anything if you took it, but it's a little tricky to renew covenants you haven't actually made and presumably don't want to.

[Splungeman]

So what do you all think about a person (guess who :tongue_smilie:) attending Church services if they are not "seeking", but are simply there in a spirit of trying to understand and experience how others in our community worship.

 

I find it highly interesting. And often times deeply moving.

 

But I believe what I believe and don't believe what I'm never going to believe. Mrs Spy Car somewhat apprehensive about going to churches other than more public holidays and programs feeling it to some degree seems like "church tourism" (which is somewhat true) and also that it will give people, especially in smaller, more struggling churches, a sense of false hope (which I'm afraid is probably true).

 

So what do you all think, under these circumstance, where one would enjoy attending a religious service (in a spirt of good will) but is not of the faith and is not there as a seeker and is not a potential convert (just isn't), is it appropriate to attend services, or not?

 

Bill

 

 

I don't see anything wrong with it at all. I've done it several times. I don't see that the churches themselves should have any problem with it either, since they are always hoping to get new members.

 

We used to attend an Episcopal church because the priest there was incredible. His sermons were amazing, and he ran a more modern service with electric guitars, keyboards, rock drums, etc. He used sources outside of christian literature to emphasize biblical morality. Awesome man. Well he ended up leaving to work for the bishop, and is now Bishop of Texas himself! Well...after he left, we just didn't like going anymore. The person who replaced him was older and more traditional. He quoted a lot of Old Testament stuff that I can't stand, and really liked to talk about sin.

 

Yeah...okay...so long and thank for all the fish, buddy.

 

I've gone to a synagogue, a buddhist temple, hindu temple (are they called temples? I forget), and a Unitarian Church, and enjoyed all of them. No one seemed perturbed that I was not a Jew, a Buddhist, a Hindu, or a Unitarian.

[smrtmama]

I have also partaken in communion at weddings and baptisms. I've been baptized, so even though I don't ascribe to those specific sets of beliefs, I feel participation in the spiritual symbol on behalf of the married couple or parents isn't wrong or harmful.

[Spy Car]

I believe in the case you presented, you were not aware of the rules. That is different from someone who knows that they should not partake and does so anyway.

 

I'm not sure I can let myself off the hook that easily, because while I'm no authority on canon law, somewhere in my consciousness I must have been aware that I should have been a confirmed member of the Church to have received Communion. At the time it felt right because I felt like I was in a communion of brotherhood with the congregants in that church, and was feeling rather ecstatic. But can I say I'm immune to rationalization and self-deception? Tough question.

 

So as much as that night shines in my memory, I've alway felt a little guilty. See, I am a Catholic! :lol:

 

Bill

[stripe]

I have seen groups, big and small, attending local places of worship of various persuasions, often school groups. Usually it's very clear that these people are not interested in converting but interested in learning. I feel sad for those places of worship who find that offensive. It sure beats the alternative, in my opinion.

 

Just stay away from the "non-denominational Christians" at UCLA. Er, just a suggestion.

[MamaSheep]

You would certainly be welcome at Sunday worship services at our church (by which I mean any of our congregations, worldwide, not just the one I attend). Certainly we enjoy having people join us who are "seeking", but we also welcome any members of the community who just want to see who we are and what we are about for the sake of understanding us better. As in other faiths, we appreciate an attitude of respect, and it would be best for you not to partake of the sacramental elements. In our services that would just mean quietly passing the tray on to the person next to you without taking any. Our Sunday services consist of three blocks of meetings, and you would be welcome at any or all. One of the three blocks is the main worship service, or "sacrament meeting" in which all members of the congregation meet together. For the other two blocks we divide up into various kinds of smaller groups where it's easier to have actual discussions rather than listening to sermons as in the main worship service. You would be more than welcome to ask questions and make comments in these meetings, though it would be polite to keep them related to the topic under discussion rather than go off on many tangents. However, you would very likely be able to find a church member (or several) who would be delighted to go off on any number of tangents with you at a time when it would not interrupt the intended course of instruction.

 

I should probably mention, though, that if you are looking for a "high church" experience, our Sunday services might not be what you are looking for. In our faith temple worship has a much higher level of formality and ritual than does weekly worship in the meetinghouse, and might in some ways correlate to "high church"-type worship, but temple worship is not open to observation by visitors. If you enjoy religious architecture, however, I would invite you to check out one of the temple visitors' centers where you can see pictures of the interior architecture and there will be people to explain some of the symbolism in it. Also, if there is a new temple being built in your area there will be an open house before it is dedicated, in which you would be able to walk through the building and see the architecture.

[Spy Car]

Our church is still Episcopal and we have a very high mass, but churches like ours are few and far between.

 

Our church (if I can call it that) is intimate and quietly reverential in tone. There is a beautiful wood-paneled pipe organ in the rear, and a small choir (maybe 6-8 people) sing from traditional hymnal (with voices like angels).

 

So a relatively small neighborhood church, ours retains enough of the high church to make it fulfilling on a liturgical/experiential level.

 

Bill

[Crimson Wife]

So as much as that night shines in my memory, I've alway felt a little guilty. See, I am a Catholic! :lol:

 

Nah, if you were a true Catholic you'd still be feeling guilty over it *YEARS* after you'd gone to Confession and received absolution for it because you'd be worried that you were not truly sorry enough at the time you confessed. :tongue_smilie:

 

I'd chalk up the feeling to my own neuroticism but I've discussed this topic with other Catholics & found out that it's relatively common :lol:

[Spy Car]

Nah, if you were a true Catholic you'd still be feeling guilty over it *YEARS* after you'd gone to Confession and received absolution for it because you'd be worried that you were not truly sorry enough at the time you confessed. :tongue_smilie:

 

Believe it (or not) I've considered going to a Priest for Confession, but then thought I'd just be compounding the problem :lol:

 

And can you imagine the can of worms?

 

"Bless me Father for I have sinned. It's been 51 years since I my last, uh actually...."

 

I'd chalk up the feeling to my own neuroticism but I've discussed this topic with other Catholics & found out that it's relatively common :lol:

 

Growing up (and to this day) most of my friends are either Catholics or Jews, so I know all about "Guilt" :tongue_smilie:

 

Bill

[rosesinsummer]

Believe it (or not) I've considered going to a Priest for Confession, but then thought I'd just be compounding the problem :lol:

 

And can you imagine the can of worms?

 

"Bless me Father for I have sinned. It's been 51 years since I my last, uh actually...."

 

Actually, you would not be the first non-Catholic to approach a priest for confession. :) Most priests would be glad to talk with you further if you had any questions about the Catholic faith.

[Spy Car]

The thought of this happening in my own church would be both intimidating on a human level and exciting on a spiritual level. Let me explain why.

 

Worship is a very personal, intimate thing a person experiences, both with their God and the people with whom they worship. There are true spiritual bonds that tie us together. Having someone come to observe this ritual is a bit like having someone come into our home to just watch how we live our lives. On this level, it makes me feel a little weird. Being a case study is never a comfortable thing, unless you know that the person watching hopes to gain something more than just data from you. You can go and be a neutral observer which might be comfortable for you, but it may not be for the people being observed.

 

See, this strikes at the heart of my question. I've been to many (many) services in my time. In some large churches I'm sure my presence is practically unnoticed. In a small charismatic black church, where people are over-come with the Holy Spirit, it's unlikely someone will fail to notice I'm there.

 

But I'm a friendly guy and highly cognizant of not making people feel uncomfortable or "observed". I'm not there gathering data. But I'm there I'm there, and it is not "my community" and it is their time of worship, so I feel the dilemma.

 

Thus far all my experiences have felt very positive on my end, and from my perspective on other people's ends. But who knows? That's why I'm asking.

 

I just don't know if you show others more respect by engaging with their community before, after and during their holy hour, or if you show greater respect staying away? I lean (strongly) in favor of the former, but I do care to know if church-goers might not feel the same way.

 

On the other hand, I can't help but think that your desire to engage in such an activity suggests that you are seeking--something. It would be my prayer that a person in your situation who is attending my church would be drawn by the Holy Spirit and touched in a way that is life-changing. I think you have to consider that there may be people praying that very prayer in whatever church you attend, and you may in fact be changed by the experience.

 

I'm probably (for better or worse) far less likely to visit a church where peoples first reaction is praying the Holy Spirit moves on me, but still I'd assume most places some people would look at me as a "nice young man" (everything is "relative") who they would assume was a Christian, and a potential new congregant. And if you don't come back, maybe they feel disappointed?

 

Bill

[GailV]

We were EXPECTED to visit various churches when I was young -- it was part of our confirmation training, to see how various faiths worship. So why would I be offended if someone else came to see how things work in the church I attend?

 

I gotta admit, though, the title of the thread reminded me of The Almost True Story of Ryan Fisher, which I thought was a funny book. :tongue_smilie:

[MeanestMomInMidwest]

you mean the earth didn't open up and swallow you whole when you partook of the Holy Communion? That's what I thought would happen to me when I stood in line for Communion the year before my First Communion.

 

My dh & I have visited a number of churches (okay, almost every church) in our town. We really were looking for someplace we could fit in, the kids liked, etc. The only problem came when we attended a church for several Sundays in a row. People did have expectations. People asked for our stories. I (regrettably) told them truthfully that I no longer believe in a personal god, but my dh did, and we were looking for someplace the kids felt comfortable. Well....it was downhill from there. Every time we showed up we were targeted for "conversion conversations" as we called them.

 

So, go. Learn. Enjoy. Just don't go to any single church more than three or four times in a row. And that's my advice, for what its worth.

[MeanestMomInMidwest]

 

 

I'm probably (for better or worse) far less likely to visit a church where peoples first reaction is praying the Holy Spirit moves on me, but still I'd assume most places some people would look at me as a "nice young man" (everything is "relative") who they would assume was a Christian, and a potential new congregant. And if you don't come back, maybe they feel disappointed?

 

Bill

I think they might just think you were passing through, if you only went once. It has been my experience that hopes and expectations start after your face becomes familiar (after a few services in a row).