Would you keep going with spelling under these circumstances?

[Verena]

Ds9 has been doing SWR for 2 years now and it has worked very well. He is a natural speller with good "photographic" memory. Spelling is pretty easy for him- this year we've focused more on dictation than rules and phonograms.

 

I'm thinking of dropping spelling as a "subject" for next year because I'd like to make a bit more room for writing and grammar (time-wise).

 

Option 1:

I could just pull words from his history/reading/writing to work on- incorporating spelling that way- dictation could be from either his reading or me making something up. The downside I see is that spelling won't "spiral" as nicely as SWR does.

 

Option2:

I could stick with SWR, doing dictation straight out of the book.

 

Option3:

Not worry at all about it and just point out any misspelled words in his writing. Takes courage on my part, though. :D

 

Any thoughts? WWYD?

[Wendy in ME]

We have also stopped doing spelling as a subject with my natural speller. I just point out any misspelled words and he never seems to forget them again. It just doesn't seem like a good use of time to work on a subject that doesn't need any help. We have lots of other things to spend our time on.

[Alenee]

We're in R-2 right now. The lists tend to have a lull in the middle where the student doesn't seem to have to work as hard. However, around R, it starts getting much harder. If you are at a lull, do a diagnostic and if he places later than the list you're working on, start there.

 

Just a suggestion...that seemed to come out like a command...:)

[Verena]

Didn't come out as a command at all!!

I hadn't even considered that option!

 

We're on the last P list right now- it's really been easy for ds so far.

[Verena]

Where can I look at the vocab program, Eliana? I've seen the name tossed around here sometimes, but have never looked into it.

Thanks!

[Verena]

That's what I'm leaning towards, but I also don't want to "wake up" in 2 years and realize that it would have been better to keep going with a spelling program.

Decisions...decisions...

[KIN]

I also use SWR and my 2nd grader, 8 yo, always knows how to spell the words before I even dictate them. We are in list N-7. He gets 100% on his spelling tests each week, actually he would get very close to 100% if I just read him the next week's words and asked him to write them down. I also want to concentrate more on writing and grammar next year so I'm toying with an idea - let me know what you think!

 

I'm thinking about giving my ds the new list as a quiz/test, with me sitting beside watching if he is spelling the words correctly. If he can spell the word correctly, that word is done, if he misses a word, I would dictate it right then and that word would go on his quiz for the week. So, I may only be quizzing a few words or none at all in a week's time. This would keep us moving through this lists, but not take as long as dictating and quizzing each and every word.

 

I'm also thinking I will continue to do some of the enrichment exercises each week, b/c that often practices word endings, e's dropping, etc. What do you think? Would it work? I just can't quite drop the lists b/c if he finishes he will be spelling on a high school/college level and that would be invaluable to him. I'm afraid if I stop he will only be able to spell as well as he can write, KWIM? I don't know if this is what I will do for sure or not, but it is one thought I had! I think I'll ask the question on the SWR loop as well. I'll be watching this thread for ideas as well!

[Dayle in Guatemala]

we just pulled out words I noticed they were misspelling and used them. I also have them working through lists of commonly misspelled words right now. But, we did take a break from formal spelling with my 2 dds and it didn't hurt them at all. I think that's because we continued with copywork and dictation. It really helped them to keep up with the spelling.

 

I have 2 natural spellers and one that can't seem to get it together!

[nmoira]

Option3:

Not worry at all about it and just point out any misspelled words in his writing. Takes courage on my part, though.

Given what you said about him, I'd say this is your best option. Use the extra time for something more productive.

[Verena]

I glanced at the 4th and 5th gr. level very briefly, but already have some questions:

 

1. How much time do you spend with this per day?

2. When did you start using them?

3. Are you using them in lieu of Latin or Greek?

(I'm planning on starting Latin in a few years (probably when ds is in 6th or 7th grade- just wondering if this might be a good "bridge" until then).

 

Thanks!

[Colleen in NS]

I use WRTR, which SWR is based on. I don't know all the ins and outs of how SWR works, though, such as, how many words are on the whole list.

 

WRTR has about 2300 (maybe 2700? I can't remember) words total. When my ds was about 8, he finished all the words, and tested at the end of high school level on the Morrison McCall spelling scale. He knew the phonograms in and out, plus all the spelling rules. So I decided to stop spelling (I had kept going for awhile, using words pulled from history and science, since he was done the WRTR list) as a formal subject each day.

 

BUT......I told him that whenever he came across a word he couldn't spell (or something misspelled in his writing), I would have him analyze it in his spelling notebook, and tell me the markings and why they were there. Everything he could tell me about that word. Just to keep the skills fresh on remembering phonogram sounds and spelling rules. So far, he hasn't needed to put words in that notebook very much yet, but I expect it will pick up over the next few years (though it won't become a formal subject every day again - just using the notebook periodically to analyze a word). Plus, in high school, I'll have him keep a page of vocabulary words from his reading that will help him remember pronunciation, meaning, and spelling.

 

I DO think keeping spelling skills is important, esp. as he gets older and into more complicated vocabulary. Latin is helpful in English spelling, but I still want him to use the rules and sounds he learned for ENGLISH words. In high school, memorizing how a word is spelled will not be enough, IMO (I say this as a "natural speller, spelling bee winner" myself). I plan to have ds study some in-depth content areas in high school, so I want him to have as many skills to confidently tackle them as possible, and I believe the spelling skills he learned in WRTR will be very helpful for these later level studies.

 

hth

[KIN]

Here is Wanda Saneri's answer to my question regarding my natural speller. I told her he is testing mastery beyond our lists and that we started at 40 words/ week and went down to 20. I also told her ds writes the words down before I finger spell them. Her reply:

Dear Kathy,

 

You have the blessing of a child that learns spelling more easily

than others, but I'm glad that you realize that it would be a big

mistake to stop spelling. It would. I want to remind you that are

not even half way there. Some natural spellers run into a brick wall

as the level gets harder without the type of tools you have to give.

The same thing happens with a student who can play piano by ear.

Even a student with natural gift, need systematic training to make

full use of the gift.

 

You say he is in second grade and showing mastery at about fourth.

This is great. While you should be pleased, I want to also put this

into perspective. That level is actually at the average range for

students trained in a Spalding-Orton type approach such as SWR.

 

We believe that the ideal time for a child to master the broad

picture of spelling (Sections A-Z) is in the elementary grades. I'm

puzzled why when he is doing well, you slowed down the recommended

pace from 40 words a week to only 20. You have not yet reached his

tension of learning point. You have not stretched him yet. You

don't need to slow down when the level is so easy for him. You need

to keep the movement up to get him to a place where he will become

more engaged and stimulated. Please keep moving. Ideally by the

end of fourth grade, you will have finished, at least once, teaching

all the words in the program. That means that in the next several

years your goal should be to cover spell levels Grade 4 to Grade13.

You have nine grade levels to cover in just a few years. It is not

time to sleep. The ideal is to expose him to the various spelling

scenerios ahead while he as at the best time in his life for language

learning. This sets the stage for him to self teach new words for

a lifetime.

 

Smile. Be happy that he gets it easily so far, but keep plugging

away giving him a fuller foundation than even a natural speller can

ever do from himself. That will truly help pave the way for strong

grammar, composiition, and comprehension skills.

 

I had a son who could work out algebra problems in his head. He did

not understand why he needed to to write the steps out on paper. I

did not let him fully off the hook because I knew that soon there

would be problems that he could not work out in his mind. He

needed to clearly have the steps in place to be able to move to the

next level. I saw this as an exercise in logic. I had a long term

goal bigger than his ability to do the easier problems. I see

fingergrams in the same way. It is a way for the student to

reinforce the mental process before writing. Do you have him drive

your fingers? I'm finding that many teachers are doing all the

talking and letting the child just passively observe until he

writes. It is best to engage the student in dictation much

sooner. Say, "Pencil down, eyes on me." As he gives you each

sound, you show the matching fingergram. You can do this quickly.

Then he picks up his pencil to write. I would maintain that

practice even with the words that he seems to already know. You may

want to even throw in a few bonus words here and there that might

stretch him, words that are new vocabulary for him. Some children

do not grasp the value of our dictation process until they apply it

to words they have never seen.

 

 

 

Blessings,

 

Wanda Sanseri

[Colleen in NS]

Here is Wanda Saneri's answer to my question regarding my natural speller. I told her he is testing mastery beyond our lists and that we started at 40 words/ week and went down to 20. I also told her ds writes the words down before I finger spell them. Her reply:

 

Wow, this was incredibly helpful to my thinking for my own kids - thanks for sharing that!!!

[Verena]

Thanks for posting this, KIN! More to think about....