7 year old flipping letters and numbers...

[Verity]

My middle son is 7.5 years and doing second grade work. He has always had poor fine motor skills and we struggle with his writing and drawing anyway. I find him to be better than average at math problems, adding multiple numbers in his head, I have trouble getting him to mark notation for carrying over, etc.

My big question is how most of you would approach his flipping numbers in his math problems. He flips his 6's backwards, 7's, sometimes 3's and even 2's. I usually point this out and because the 6 looks like a 2 explain that even though in his head he knows the answer that it would be marked wrong by a teacher.

Should I be having him correct every flipped answer? Sometimes I push it and other times I feel like writing and math are two separate subjects and I know that he understands the math portion, just can't write it out.

 

BTW, in an effort to address the flipping I have been doing the following:

writing in the air to engage large muscle groups, writing on the white board, writing in shaving cream, writing in sand, worksheets where he traces over the letters. Steady correction and encouragement.

 

He is marginally at the age where he might get an official diagnosis of dyslexia. However, we have very limited resources for insurance and time - I have three developmentally delayed kids and care for my disabled mother. I was considered dyslexic when I was in kindergarten and did some therapy to correct my writing. I am a leftie and can still write backwards in cursive if I think about it a bit. lol...I figure this could run in the family.

[merry gardens]

My big question is how most of you would approach his flipping numbers in his math problems. He flips his 6's backwards, 7's, sometimes 3's and even 2's. I usually point this out and because the 6 looks like a 2 explain that even though in his head he knows the answer that it would be marked wrong by a teacher.

Should I be having him correct every flipped answer? Sometimes I push it and other times I feel like writing and math are two separate subjects and I know that he understands the math portion, just can't write it out.

 

BTW, in an effort to address the flipping I have been doing the following:

writing in the air to engage large muscle groups, writing on the white board, writing in shaving cream, writing in sand, worksheets where he traces over the letters. Steady correction and encouragement. ...

When my 8 yo flips numbers, I point it out. It happens less now, but he still does it occassionally. Writing numbers correctly is part of math.

 

One thing I found that helped reduce my son's reversals was making numbers in clay as a project. He made the numbers and laid them out correctly in numerical order (0-9). If I found any reversed, he had to physically flip them to the right way.

[crowscreek]

I was noticing this week that my 5 year old is reversing his number 7s. He's a lefty in a sea of righties. :)

[SkateLeft]

My 8yo son does the same thing, and so did both my girls when they were younger.

 

Years ago, a friend suggested having the child self-correct as much as possible. So I would ask, "Does that look right to you?" each time my daughter flipped her numbers or letters, and she'd take another look and fix it. It worked really well, making her more aware of what she was doing, and getting her to look more closely at the letters and numbers.

 

So now whenever my son does it, I ask him if it looks right. He's still occasionally flipping, but it's been improving.

[Laurie4b]

Handwriting without Tears includes a way to make numbers that lessens the flipping. You might look into that.

[Verity]

Thanks for all the replies! We are using a HWT printing book but I don't have the TM, maybe I need to look into that. I've been thinking about starting him on HWT Cursive because of how cursive makes it impossible to flip the letters.

[siloam]

My 8yo has been the worst at this, though my 10yo did it too, and still does occasionally. I do point out the errors and have them correct them. I try to make it really low key, emphasizing they got the right answer.

 

My 10 seemed to make a huge leap away from doing these type of reversals when I spent a year working with her writing in sand. I am now trying that again with my 8yo...we will see...

 

Heather

[ElizabethB]

The HWT chalkboard with the little smily and practicing starting at the smily was helpful for my daughter--she flipped numbers, mostly, but occasionally letters.

[Rod Everson]

Here's Romalda Spalding's advice, page 80 of the 4th Edition of The Writing Road to Reading:

 

In writing the brain directs the hand. This cannot be done correctly unless there is a thorough knowledge of how each letter and number is made.

 

The child who has no difficulty in learning to write needs to be taught at first, but need not be held for drill. The children who need help should be given the specific directions in this chapter over and over until they can direct their hands in writing and no longer make errors in direction or orientation. This is where drill is an essential part of teaching, if children are to learn. The teacher has done no teaching unless and until the pupil learns. (emphasis added)

I agree with this advice, and Ms. Spalding provides specific instructions for forming numbers on pages 80 and 81 of the 4th edition or on pages 30 and 31 of the latest (5th) edition. Interestingly, the quote above is not in the 5th edition (written after her death) reflecting, I suspect, modern thinking that drill was overdone in the past.

 

I'm convinced that the reason so many older kids have trouble forming letters and numbers nowadays is because we've ignored Spalding's advice on drilling when they were initially taught, the result being that we are not teaching, by her standard, because the pupil has not learned. Children are shown how to make letters, but they are not taught, since by her definition, teaching implies learning.

 

I've used her approach to teaching the formation (and reading) of b and d for nearly 10 years now, and kids rarely have any trouble with these two letters once they've been taught the method. It's at Telling b from d on my website. It's worked so well that it gives me reason to believe that her advice on teaching number formation would also work. Some kids do take more drill than others though, as she states.

 

Rod Everson

[Guest aprils]

As a mother of three dyslexic children and perhaps one more, I recommend that you always correct flipping numbers. Your job is to help their brain see the number in the right direction. Your eyes act as your childs mediator when it comes to helping dyslexic children.

 

It has been my experience that constant, careful, loving correction will lead to more awareness from the child of this deficit so that they can make a more conscious effort to fix it. How can you fix it if you don't even know it's broken.

 

Keep up the good work!

 

Blessings,

April

[JenneinCA]

I would make sure that there is a correctly formed copy of the numbers on the table (or desk) nearby your son when he is writing the numbers down. My sons do much much better at writing the numbers when they don't have to remember how they look and can instead look at the sheet.

 

I remember in my classroom there was a copy of the alphabet and numbers along the top of the chalkboard. I used them as a young child to make sure my b and d were facing the right way. I have found it helps with numbers too.

[elise1mds]

I'm glad to hear other people with kids of a similar age are having similar problems. My son still flips numbers, and we're using HWT as well. If he has examples in front of him, he can copy them, but if you ask him to free-hand his numbers, he will reverse 5 every time. He will reverse 3, 4, 7 and 9 about half the time. If he's reading, he'll sometimes flip vertically and read 6 for 9 and vice versa - very frustrating when he's in the back seat reading his flash cards and announces that 6-9=3! I hope it goes away but fear that he's on the dyslexic spectrum as well. He also flips b/d, q/p, and u/n. He used to flip w and m, but using HWT has helped that since 'm' has curves and 'w' has points.

 

In the meantime, as Dory says, we will "just keep swimming... just keep swimming...."