Cambridge and Oxford

[OLG]

Have been reading on College Confidential about these two schools. Was drawn to the three year undergraduate programs and the apparent emphasis on stellar undergraduate education. The schools appear to want students who know what they want to major in, is that right? Does anyone have any experience with the application process and with students who have attended either university? Thanks!

 

Mary

[Laura Corin]

Have been reading on College Confidential about these two schools. Was drawn to the three year undergraduate programs and the apparent emphasis on stellar undergraduate education. The schools appear to want students who know what they want to major in, is that right? Does anyone have any experience with the application process and with students who have attended either university? Thanks!

 

Mary

 

I didn't go to either, but my sister did her undergraduate at Oxford and her postgraduate at Cambridge.

 

Yes, both colleges need you to sign on to a particular course and stick with it - swapping courses is difficult, I think. In order to get in, you need a very specialised high school education, including several targeted APs. UK students would need at least three, usually four of the top possible grades in appropriate A levels (AP equivalents). So to do Physics, you would need top grades in, say Physics, Chemistry, Maths and Economics at A level. Entry is extremely competitive, so you would also need have done internships in relevant companies, or summer schools, etc. Then you need to pass an interview. They really want to see your dedication.

 

All that being said, it is an amazing education, largely taught by full professors, often one-on-one.

 

More information about the application process for overseas students can be found on the websites.

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

[OLG]

Thanks Laura!

 

Wondering how to find out how college courses are treated ( not cc's) given the AP requirements. Have also been reading about how the global economic concerns are loosening up things a bit for those that can pay. Obviously, there isn't the financial assistance via scholarships etc. available like for schools in the States.

 

Sounds like it is on a par with the HYP admit requirements!

 

Your help is appreciated.

 

Mary

[Laura Corin]

Thanks Laura!

 

Wondering how to find out how college courses are treated ( not cc's) given the AP requirements. Have also been reading about how the global economic concerns are loosening up things a bit for those that can pay. Obviously, there isn't the financial assistance via scholarships etc. available like for schools in the States.

 

Sounds like it is on a par with the HYP admit requirements!

 

Your help is appreciated.

 

Mary

 

I suspect that previous college experience that does not lead to exams will not help that much. The UK university entrance system is all based around exams - we don't have transcripts - and it will be hard for a UK university to assess overseas experience. I would definitely head for exam courses if you are interested in any UK university.

 

If you want a more general degree, with a bit more flexibility, then Scottish universities spread study over four years. Entry requirements are still pretty high for the best universities (St Andrews, Edinburgh) but Scotland is better for students who want a little more time to decide what to specialise in. You won't get as much one-on-one study time with the professor as you will at Oxbridge, but the slightly larger classes are still usually taught by full professors, not graduate students.

 

Laura

[kiana]

Oxford lists:

SAT 1 scores of at least 1,400 in Critical Reading and Mathematics and preferably also 700 or more in the new Writing Paper, giving a combined score of at least 2,100. OR ACT with a score of at least 32 out of 36.

 

AND

 

Grade 5 in three or more Advanced Placement tests in appropriate subjects OR SAT II in three appropriate subjects at 700 or better.

 

http://www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate_courses/international_students/international_qualifications/index.html

 

Cambridge lists:

Prospective applicants from the USA studying SATs and Advanced Placement Tests should note that offers are usually made on an individual basis. In addition to a high pass in the High School Diploma and the SAT, successful applicants are normally asked to obtain three Advanced Placement Tests, in specific subjects where appropriate, at grades 5,5,5 or 5,5,4.

 

http://www.cam.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/apply/requirements.html

 

If you had some other plan(such as completing first-year courses here), I would contact the admissions office before sending an application and ask what their advice is.

[KnitWit]

This really is not answering your question...but I just wanted to share that my cousin is a senior lecturer and member of the education faculty at University of Cambridge, UK and she LOVES IT!

[Joan in GE]

I know three students who attended..

 

My nephew went to Oxford, on an exchange programm for one semester. He was doing philosophy. Because Oxford has this tutoring style education, I think he was hardly ever in a group and therefore found it very hard to meet other students. Because his relationship with at least one professor (and they do not have many per semester) was very difficult, perhaps depressing, it led to a fairly negative experience. His mom regrets that he went.

 

A friend's son (totally homeschooled overseas) did all three years at Oxford successfully. I have not talked with him personally about it. His mom says that there are lots of activities and groups you can join, so maybe if you are there longer, it is better. Now he's getting a PhD at Yale.

 

Another friend's son attended Cambridge. Because it is so competetive, he did a gap year and taught Spanish in South America to enhance his application. Also he applied in archeology and anthropology, two less coveted subjects, to increase his possibilities....Haven't heard how it went.

 

One anecdote from my nephew was about the sorry state of nutrition...he said there were all these deep-fried foods, such as deep-fried Mars Bars and other things equally gross. Maybe that was just for a college town as I haven't seen them on my visits to England.

[Laura Corin]

 

His mom says that there are lots of activities and groups you can join, so maybe if you are there longer, it is better.

 

I think this might well be the case - my sister had a great social life.

 

One anecdote from my nephew was about the sorry state of nutrition...he said there were all these deep-fried foods, such as deep-fried Mars Bars and other things equally gross. Maybe that was just for a college town as I haven't seen them on my visits to England.

 

You can certainly find vile food in most towns in the UK. There's always healthy food to find too. I've yet to eat a fried mars bar, despite our nearest town being a university town.

 

 

Laura

[OLG]

Many thanks to you all! I have learned a lot and have much new to consider here. It is very interesting to hear the tales of those who have experienced these universities and I welcome any and all accounts on schooling over seas from the US!

 

Thanks again!

 

Mary

[danielle]

I, too, looked into this as I've heard that if you have a high achieving student it might be easier for them to get into Oxbridge than Harvard, etc. However, I put the idea on hold because it appears that no financial assistance would be possible. Anyone know anything about the $$ side?

Danielle

[FairProspects]

I studied abroad at Oxford in college and I have to agree, it was a fantastic experience! While there, I did meet an American girl who came right out of highschool as a regularly matriculated student to Balliol college. I can't remember what she read, but I think it was English. She said that she had to pass 5 APs with a 5 to gain admittance at the equivalent of English A-levels.

 

She was also from a wealthy family in Southern Cal., which makes a difference because she said she had to pay out of pocket to attend. This was about 10 years ago, so I don't know how the current economic climate has changed things, but at the time Oxford considered foreign students "deep pockets" and was quite open about the high expense. Of course, the product they are providing is incredible!

 

The tutorial style was hard for me sometimes as a young student, I was 20, and it wasn't until I was back stateside that I realized how much I had actually learned from it. I did love all the freedom to do your own research and the time to write and read, which was my favorite part. Students will need a lot of self-discipline to succeed as there is absolutely no hand-holding and you must structure your work yourself. The tutor only provides a meeting time and an hour of instructional guidance, and then you are on your own to study and write an essay on some aspect of that instruction.

 

Personally, I did not find the social life to be any different than at my large home university. I joined a dance club, went to dances at my college, did many other activities (well, and sight-seeing in my case) but I could see how it might be hard to meet people if you are someone who likes to stay in your room and just do your work. And yes, deep-fried Mars bars are disgusting!:tongue_smilie:

 

I hope it works out for you! Studying at Oxford was one of the most formative experiences of my life, and I continue to see how it has shaped my perceptions even to this day. It would be amazing for your dc, particularly if they want to study liberal arts (I didn't know anyone there in sciences, so I can't speak to those)!

[Laura Corin]

I, too, looked into this as I've heard that if you have a high achieving student it might be easier for them to get into Oxbridge than Harvard, etc. However, I put the idea on hold because it appears that no financial assistance would be possible. Anyone know anything about the $$ side?

Danielle

 

Every year, many students with four straight As at A level (equivalent of four top grades at AP) are turned away. They take in about 25% of applicants, which sounds better than the percentage for Harvard. However, the application system is set up so that you can only apply for Oxford or Cambridge, not both, so you get only half of the highest flying applicants applying for each.

 

I don't know of any major system of bursaries for overseas scholars. I believe that President Clinton attended Oxford for one year on a scholarship. You can get the level of fees from the respective websites. The degree is only three years, which reduces costs. Most UK students go on government loans.

 

Laura

[latinteach]

I don't know of any major system of bursaries for overseas scholars. I believe that President Clinton attended Oxford for one year on a scholarship. You can get the level of fees from the respective websites. The degree is only three years, which reduces costs. Most UK students go on government loans.

 

Laura

 

President Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar.

[K-FL]

President Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar.

 

As was Bobby Jindal (Gov. of LA) I'm not sure Clinton actually graduated, but Jindal did.

[OLG]

I, too, looked into this as I've heard that if you have a high achieving student it might be easier for them to get into Oxbridge than Harvard, etc. However, I put the idea on hold because it appears that no financial assistance would be possible. Anyone know anything about the $$ side?

Danielle

 

Ah, yes, this is the sticky situation. As near as I can tell, there is no financial aid from the colleges for international students. Some international students do receive aid from their own country but not the US.....

[cathmom]

So is it hard for Americans to attend Scottish universities?

[Laura Corin]

So is it hard for Americans to attend Scottish universities?

 

Traditionally, Scottish students start university at 17, rather than 18, so the degree takes four years and the entry requirements are lower. However, there is always going to be stiff competition for the best universities. Currently, Scottish residents do not pay any fees if they go to a Scottish university and are EU passport holders, so this has added to their popularity with local residents. All universities in Britain are experiencing very high applications due to the recession.

 

I had a quick look at the entry requirements for two of the best universities - St Andrews and Edinburgh. Here's St Andrews:

 

Our selection committee expect you to have taken a rigorous curriculum at school, with a GPA of around 3.3 and over. They look closely at your letters of reference, so choose your referee carefully. If you are applying to take a French course, you should have studied French to AP level (score of 4 or 5) or equivalent.

 

If applicable, we also expect you to have taken external tests such as SATs, APs and the ACT. If you have taken any APs we require marks of 4 and 5; 1950 + for SATs (across all 3 elements) and a score of 28+ in the ACT. You should submit to us at least one of these external results either directly from the Collegeboard (code: 0861) or the score can be incorporated within your school transcript and verified by your school counselor. In general, the committee look for a good overall application.

 

Here's Edinburgh:

 

All subjects except Medicine & Veterinary Medicine

 

All subjects in the College of Humanities and Social Science and the College of Science and Engineering require completion of the High School Diploma, plus one of the following as a minimum requirement.

 

For further subject-specific requirements check the College websites.

 

* A successful completion of one year of University in the USA

 

OR

 

* SAT score of 1800 (600 minimum in Critical Reading, Mathematics and Writing) plus two APs at Grade 4;

 

OR

 

* SAT score of 1800 (600 minimum in Critical Reading, Mathematics and Writing) plus two SAT Subject tests with 650 minimum

 

OR

 

* ACT Composite score of 27 minimum plus two SAT Subject tests with 650 minimum;

 

OR

 

* ACT Composite score of 27 minimum plus two APs at Grade 4;

 

OR

 

* Three APs at Grade 4 minimum;

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

[cathmom]

Thanks, Laura!

 

Ugh, that's a shame that they rely so heavily on test scores! My 2 dds are very interested in Scotland and I was thinking this might be an option. Of course, we probably couldn't afford it anyway.

[Laura Corin]

Thanks, Laura!

 

Ugh, that's a shame that they rely so heavily on test scores! My 2 dds are very interested in Scotland and I was thinking this might be an option. Of course, we probably couldn't afford it anyway.

 

We just don't have transcripts.

 

Laura