This is about DD's new friend & there is a problem

[RoughCollie]

We moved here 2 months ago. The culture here is very different from what we are used to: from a middle class suburb of Boston to rural western PA.

 

DD has made a friend who lives down the road and is in one of her classes. The girl is outgoing and friendly. Her family is on welfare, her mother's live-in boyfriend has a full-time, minimum wage job and is a drunk. The girl is not refined in any sense of the word. The girl also told me that she is on Prozac and has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, as has her mother.

 

DH and I do not think this girl is a suitable person for DD to have as a friend, but DD likes her. So we started out by saying that DD cannot spend the night at her house or go there to visit because the man is a drunken lout. DD's friend knows this and said she doesn't want DD to go there because she would much rather be at our house because her "father" is verbally abusive when he is drunk.

 

A couple of days ago, the girl told Olivia and me that she is bisexual. It came up when she said that her mother would marry her "father" when he grows up. Then she said that she would not get married until gay marriage was legal in PA. Then she said that she is bisexual.

 

Well. I told Olivia that the girl may not spend the night here again. The reason is obvious -- DH and I will not be awake in the middle of the night to supervise the girl's behavior.

 

Meanwhile, the girl keeps telling us (not asking) that when her "father" gets drunk, she will come over here to spend the night.

 

The girl has no manners, no concept of boundaries. She is loud, rude, presumptuous. She says she is poor, in a very matter of fact way, and now DD wants to give the girl half of her wardrobe and other possessions.

 

I have never met a family like hers, or a child like her. I don't wish to offend either the child or the family, but I must draw a firm line.

 

What is the best way to handle this? Should I tell the girl straight out that she cannot spend the night here because she is bisexual? Should I call her mother to explain? My mind is made up that the girl will not spend the night here.

 

Thank you for your help!

 

RC

[Remudamom]

I'd be frank with her and tell her that she can't spend the night any more than a boy her age could spend the night there.

 

Actually, I'd cut all ties. It's a bit heartless, but I wouldn't have her anywhere around my girls for many reasons.

[mommaduck]

#1 no pity gifts from your daughter. Children that have less or are poor ARE matter of fact about it, because it is a fact of life. They don't try to hide it and pretend otherwise like would happen in middle class areas. It's a fact of her life and she's being honest. She is not hinting for things.

 

#2 agreed on the no spending the night. I would just say that it's not a good night whenever it's brought up. If it comes down to it, I would explain that just as you don't have a heterosexual boy spend the night, you can't have her spend the night. Also, if she declares she will again, your daughter could tell her that she is supposed to ask, not invite herself.

[RoughCollie]

I'd be frank with her and tell her that she can't spend the night any more than a boy her age could spend the night there.

 

That is exactly, word for word, what I said to DD.

[amy g.]

I just want to say that I think your daughter has a very dear and tender heart to want to share with her friend.

[hillfarm]

Sounds like the friend is a troubled child in the midst of a mixed up world. It is up to you to protect your family and to decide where you draw your lines.

 

However, being poor and uncouth are not crimes. Perhaps you and your family are the best chance this poor kid has to rise above these things. Regarding the bisexual part, no--I wouldn't allow overnights in my child's room. However, have you considered that this child might need refuge when her so-called father is on a drunken rampage? I might consider allowing her to crash on my couch in a situation like that. IMO, it is entirely possible that the claims of bisexuality may just be more talk than action.

 

You mention that the girl is loud, rude, and presumptuous. I would calmly and kindly sit her down and explain to her what your boundaries are and how they will be enforced. Go slowly and be very clear. This may be an entirely foreign concept to the child.

 

She may be on Prozac. She may be pursuing an alternate sexual lifestyle. She may be a rude jerk. Or she may be creating a lot of smoke when there is really only a little fire, just as a method of self-protection in a very precarious situation. While I would proceed with great caution, I would also try to extend the hand of kindness to her as much as possible. Otherwise you may be the person who could have helped her but didn't.

[RoughCollie]

Actually, I'd cut all ties. It's a bit heartless, but I wouldn't have her anywhere around my girls for many reasons.

 

How? The girl comes over here every day, uninvited. I don't want to damage her emotionally -- she lives in a fragile enough situation as it is. I set firm boundaries and send her home a lot of the time because DD has to study (the girl has a D average in school). I put aside Sundays as being totally off-limits because that is our family day. I forbade sleepovers.

 

Plus, DD likes her, and the girl does have a good personality. DD will be 14 years old in a few weeks. She is going to like this girl even more if I forbid her to be friends with the girl.

 

Plus, DD has a kind, generous heart and will think I am cruel and unfeeling, which will damage our relationship. She is so innocent.

 

Also: I have 4 teenagers, 2 are in PS, 2 are homeschooled and have special needs, my DH works 6 or 7 days a week, and we are all have a very difficult time adjusting to living here. It is like living in a nightmare; I had no idea places like this existed, but that is not the current problem. Certainly if I had been here before I actually moved here -- DH picked it due to having our original plans falling through at the very last minute -- I would have said we are moving here over my dead body.

 

But we are here and I have to make the best of the situation somehow, for my kids' sakes.

 

How far does this "we are our brother's keeper" stuff go? Am I charged with that responsibility just because some girl who lives down a mile down the road decided to descend upon us and insert herself into our lives? She was never invited. She found out where we live when she asked DD -- and here, it's a choice between farms and few isolated houses like ours, so we weren't tough to locate.

 

I feel targeted.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[LMA]

As an alternative, if it doesn't damage your family, teach her manners and boundaries while she is at your house. If she is loud and obnoxious, just tell her gently, please talk at a low voice, please don't use such words, etc. You will have to repeat yourself and I don't know how much you want to take on, but it is worth a try if she is at your house anyway.

 

Could she study at your house while DD is studying? You could put her at the kitchen table and say that it is study time now and, if she wanted to stay, she would need to work.

 

The girl may be just craving the structure and rules at your house. I just read your reply about all the stuff that goes on at your house and how you just moved. Could you just fold her in to the routine? When you homeschool, she works on her school stuff. When you clean, she does some chores also. I know I am not at your house and situation, so I may not be making the greatest solutions.

 

(I got this idea from my friend who has 7 and has lots of teenagers at her house. She just brings them in. They practice modesty and if some girls show up with immodest shirts, she asks them to put on the sweatshirts/t-shirts on top if they want to stay. They put on the clothes. If they are cleaning and kids show up, she says that her kids will be free after chores and, if they wish, they can join her kids. Otherwise, they can come back. The kids help clean. She has posted rules in her mud room.)

Edited September 25, 2009 by LMA

[Erica in PA]

How? The girl comes over here every day, uninvited. I don't want to damage her emotionally -- she lives in a fragile enough situation as it is. I set firm boundaries and send her home a lot of the time because DD has to study (the girl has a D average in school). I put aside Sundays as being totally off-limits because that is our family day. I forbade sleepovers.

 

Plus, DD likes her, and the girl does have a good personality. DD will be 14 years old in a few weeks. She is going to like this girl even more if I forbid her to be friends with the girl.

 

Plus, DD has a kind, generous heart and will think I am cruel and unfeeling, which will damage our relationship. She is so innocent.

 

Also: I have 4 teenagers, 2 are in PS, 2 are homeschooled and have special needs, my DH works 6 or 7 days a week, and we are all have a very difficult time adjusting to living here. It is like living in a nightmare; I had no idea places like this existed, but that is not the current problem.

 

We have dealt with these kinds of hard situations before. You can't have her unannounced visits hanging over your head like that-- it's way too stressful. If your dd enjoys spending time and wants to do so with this girl, then I would set very specific times and days when she can come over. (If she doesn't, then I would cut the ties.) I would say to her, "DD wants you to be able to come over and hang out, but from now on we're going to set specific times and days when it suits both you and our family." And then I would have coming over be by invitation only from then on. If she comes uninvited, I would tell her it wasn't a good time, but that your dd will call her and invite her when it is.

 

There is a good chance that this girl will get tired of all these rules and restrictions and you'll gradually just see less and less of her. (which might not be such a bad thing.) Or, if she really does enjoy coming to your home and spending time with your dd, in a normal, healthy home environment that she's lacking at home, she will comply with your rules.

[RoughCollie]

Regarding the bisexual part, no--I wouldn't allow overnights in my child's room. However, have you considered that this child might need refuge when her so-called father is on a drunken rampage? I might consider allowing her to crash on my couch in a situation like that.

 

I do not know this girl. Can she be trusted? I have 3 teenage boys. Will she accuse them of molestation or rape some day, when she gets mad at one of us? Will she go after one of them or DD? She can get up from the couch and go anywhere she likes when DH and I are asleep.

[Moxie]

This is an issue my MIL and I have. When her kids were young, there were a few of their friends that were in trouble (with the parents and the law) and she allowed her boys to befriend them and let them stay at her home when they were frequently kicked out. MIL thinks I'm over-protective. Well, her boys don't tell her the stories my DH has told me. It really is a wonder DH's brothers didn't get arrested more often!!

 

I have no advice except to tell you that my DH and his brothers all turned out okay after some bumps in the road (not all small bumps either). The boys that were befriended never did much with their lives and are probably sleeping in a van somewhere. I just don't think there is that much you can do to undo a lifetime of influence.

 

:grouphug:

[coralloyd]

Sounds like the friend is a troubled child in the midst of a mixed up world. It is up to you to protect your family and to decide where you draw your lines.

 

However, being poor and uncouth are not crimes. Perhaps you and your family are the best chance this poor kid has to rise above these things. Regarding the bisexual part, no--I wouldn't allow overnights in my child's room. However, have you considered that this child might need refuge when her so-called father is on a drunken rampage? I might consider allowing her to crash on my couch in a situation like that. IMO, it is entirely possible that the claims of bisexuality may just be more talk than action.

 

You mention that the girl is loud, rude, and presumptuous. I would calmly and kindly sit her down and explain to her what your boundaries are and how they will be enforced. Go slowly and be very clear. This may be an entirely foreign concept to the child.

 

She may be on Prozac. She may be pursuing an alternate sexual lifestyle. She may be a rude jerk. Or she may be creating a lot of smoke when there is really only a little fire, just as a method of self-protection in a very precarious situation. While I would proceed with great caution, I would also try to extend the hand of kindness to her as much as possible. Otherwise you may be the person who could have helped her but didn't.

 

 

:iagree:

[OLCH]

I don't have any advice as our DDs are not there yet. However the thread caught my eye (DH from Pa) & this is just 1 of those things I can't imagine how I'd handle when the time comes.

 

I just wanted to add you & your family are in my prayers. :grouphug:

[patchfire]

I do not know this girl. Can she be trusted? I have 3 teenage boys. Will she accuse them of molestation or rape some day, when she gets mad at one of us? Will she go after one of them or DD? She can get up from the couch and go anywhere she likes when DH and I are asleep.

 

This, to me, is the heart of the issue - not whether or not she is in fact bisexual. Bisexuality is seen by some teenagers and young adults as "edgy" and "cool" to play at, so I wouldn't necessarily take her declaration as fact. Even if she is, it's a big jump from "she's bisexual" to "she's going to go after my daughter." However, the simple fact that you don't trust her and wouldn't know what she might do is enough reason not to have her spend the night. It's sad, because it sounds like she might need an escape hatch, so to speak, but it sounds like it would be a bad idea for your family to be that escape.

[RoughCollie]

We have dealt with these kinds of hard situations before. You can't have her unannounced visits hanging over your head like that-- it's way too stressful. If your dd enjoys spending time and wants to do so with this girl, then I would set very specific times and days when she can come over. (If she doesn't, then I would cut the ties.) I would say to her, "DD wants you to be able to come over and hang out, but from now on we're going to set specific times and days when it suits both you and our family." And then I would have coming over be by invitation only from then on. If she comes uninvited, I would tell her it wasn't a good time, but that your dd will call her and invite her when it is.

 

There is a good chance that this girl will get tired of all these rules and restrictions and you'll gradually just see less and less of her. (which might not be such a bad thing.) Or, if she really does enjoy coming to your home and spending time with your dd, in a normal, healthy home environment that she's lacking at home, she will comply with your rules.

 

That is great advice, thank you.

 

Now, do I tell the girl that there will be no sleepovers, and why?

[RoughCollie]

It's sad, because it sounds like she might need an escape hatch, so to speak, but it sounds like it would be a bad idea for your family to be that escape.

 

I agree, the girl does live in sad circumstances. She wants to move in with us. She has said so. She wants me to adopt her -- she has said so more than once.

 

We've known her for exactly one week. One afternoon, I looked up and there was a fat girl with burgundy and black hair, dressed in all black, wearing garish make-up, trudging up to my house. A few days later, she's one of my most pressing problems.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[mirth]

I'd be curious between the 2 girls, do they have more friends like your daughter or her friend?

[Tree House Academy]

I can see that you are in a terrible situation all the way around here. I understand that and I am so sorry. I remember how much you didn't even want to move in the first place and what a hard time you had in finding a suitable place. I can sense your frustration over that and I would be willing to wager a bet that part of your upset with this situation stems from the bigger picture.

 

That said, I have a friend who is bi-sexual. We met when I was a teenager. She spent the night with me and so forth, but she never had any interest in me. Even bi-sexuals have "types" and she very well may not be "attracted" to your dd in that way. If dd knows she is bisexual and doesn't care, then likely they have discussed it and the girl has not shown interest toward your daughter.

 

Still, it is your house, your rules. If she has never spent the night, then just tell the girl that you don't allow sleepovers. If she has been allowed to spend the night before and has now been suddenly outcasted because of her confession, then there is no way around the hurt in that situation, unfortunately.

 

I would also venture to guess that she is not bi-sexual, but more or less, confused. I could be wrong, but from her living situation and such, she may very well be seeking love and not really care from what gender it comes. She may also be confused between love and s*x or intimacy since it sounds like her parents are real winners and God only knows what she has seen at home. :(

 

I am not sure if you are Christian, but if you are, I would like to throw this out there (if you aren't, then please just ignore this part). Have you considered that God has put you in this situation for some *reason*? Maybe your dd being part of this child's life is purposeful in God's plan. Maybe she is meant to help the girl turn her life around, or at the very least, change the course. If you are a Christian, my first advice is to pray about it - ask God what He would have you do here and to please give you peace and comfort to weather the storm if this is His will for you. I will be praying for your family. *hugs*

Edited September 25, 2009 by Tree House Academy

[Pamela H in Texas]

I'd just do some general discipline (teaching/guiding/coaching). I would let her crash on the couch or be honest about why not. I'd be honest with her regarding some of the restrictions (manners, imposition, expressed bisexuality, etc).

 

I can't imagine, for even a second, not having her around because of her mother, her "father," bipolar, or whatever. Those are things she has no control over.

 

But you can encourage her to remediate her behavior. Simple rules then enforcing them will help; things such as "you must call before coming over" and "ask permission rather than telling us what you're doing" and "go home by 5:30pm" (so you can have family suppers). You may also need to have supervision be more direct since you have teen boys around and have rules such as speaking to her mother before y'all go anywhere, if she's spending the night on the couch, etc.

[RoughCollie]

I'd be curious between the 2 girls, do they have more friends like your daughter or her friend?

 

This is the situation with the teenagers my kids have met at school:

 

Many of the boys chew tobacco. They do not do this in school, however they do spit directly onto the floors or into empty, plastic water bottles.

 

The guidance counselor and many of the teachers have come right out and said that most of the kids are stupid. Yes, stupid.

 

My kids are still looking for other kids who are as intelligent as they are. They have had to dumb down their vocabulary because the other kids do not know the meaning of the words they use in ordinary, every day conversation.

 

My son was stared at, openly, like an animal at a zoo, all during one day. He thought it was because the other kids were interested in what he was reading, which was a book by Stephen Hawking. No, it was because he was reading. The school's goal is to have most sophomores reading at grade level by 2016. This is not a typo.

 

Every kid my kids talk to asks if they drink or use drugs. This is rampant around here. I asked where the kids get the money to buy drugs, and the guidance counselor said that often they get them from their parents!!!

 

My kids are in honors classes. These classes are like basic (level 1) classes at their former school.

 

The Spanish teacher told my son yesterday to stop raising his hand to answer questions because he is making the other kids in the class feel stupid. He tried to get transferred to Spanish 3, but they will not do it because he has to have Spanish 2 on his transcript.

 

The students in his German I class think he already knew how to speak German before he came there and have told him that he is cheating by taking German I and making them look bad. He did not. He simply pays attention, does the homework, and studies.

 

In my both of my kids' honors geometry classes, several students argued with the teacher that circles cannot have degrees because they don't have angles. The teacher used up 15 minutes of class time explaining this, and the kids still didn't understand. One boy told the teacher, after all this, that she was wrong, and spat on the floor to punctuate his statement.

 

At their former school, 99.9% of the students go to college. At this school, the guidance counselor explained to my kids (and to us) that very few kids go to college -- which is why they don't offer more challenging courses (there are not enough students available to take them).

 

My kids don't fit in here at all. The one good thing, my DD says, is that when she makes overtures to other kids, they are friendly. Neither child has met anyone who is a snob, and in their former school there were many snobs.

 

My kids are not snobs, but I'm afraid they may become that way, just by virtue of being so very, very different than the kids they have met here.

 

DH and I figure that the children of educated people go to private schools. What is really weird is that the school my kids came from is more like a private school, and we had no idea we had it so good. Everyone in our town took the schools for granted and wanted them to do more, which is merely a function of not having been exposed to poor or mediocre schools for comparison purposes.

 

I tell my IRL life friends what it is like here, and they cannot imagine it. But I am not making things up or exaggerating. The only person who fully believes me is a guy who lived in rural Alabama for a few years and saw firsthand this same sort of thing.

 

A spark of hope is that DD has made friends with the daughter of the farmers across the street. She came here once. She is quiet, shy, friendly and well-mannered. I like her. I'm just afraid that DD will become a pariah because she has befriended the other girl -- and get tarred with the "birds of a feather flock together" brush. Birds of a feather do flock together. I didn't think so when I was a teenager, but I have learned that over the years.

 

About the PS being terrible academically, we are trying to find a workable solution for next year. For now, both very extroverted kids do not want to do cyber school or regular homeschool. It is too isolating for them. They'd rather be in the PS than be home for school, no matter what. My introverted kids are happily at home, by contrast.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[RoughCollie]

That said, I have a friend who is bi-sexual. We met when I was a teenager.

 

My best friend in high school was a Lesbian, and she is now married to her female partner of 2 decades and happily living in CA. She never made a pass at me, either. This was a good thing since I was so innocent that I didn't know gay people existed.

 

I am a Christian and I have spent a lot of time in prayer about this. I consulted with my two long-time prayer partners about this. One said that she thinks God put this girl in my life for a reason (to help her). The other said she thinks this is Satan's doing.

 

I say "in my life", rather than just in DD's, since I spend as much time with the girl as DD does. Why? Because DD has always spent a lot of time with me (DD's choice) and so the girl does, too. Plus I have to constantly supervise the girl -- she goes through my things, opens drawers to see what's inside them, is very loud and boisterous, talks about inappropriate subjects with my kids (prostitution, for example), purposely bothers my boys to get them mad, and so forth. Everyone in the family knows she said she is bipolar and bisexual and on Prozac and has a drunk "father", etc. because she tells us all, or talks in such a loud voice everyone can hear her.

 

DH and the boys want the girl to be told she can never come here again. She disrupts the harmony of our home. This house is at least 1000 s.f. smaller than our former home, which makes things difficult in that we are all squished in together.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[Tree House Academy]

My best friend in high school is a Lesbian, who is now married and happily living in CA. She never made a pass at me, either. This was a good thing since I was so innocent that I didn't know gay people existed.

 

I am a Christian and I have spent a lot of time in prayer about this. I consulted with my two long-time prayer partners about this. One said that she thinks God put this girl in my life for a reason (to help her). The other said she thinks this is Satan's doing.

 

I say "in my life", rather than just in DD's, since I spend as much time with the girl as DD does. Why? Because DD has always spent a lot of time with me (DD's choice) and so the girl does, too. Plus I have to constantly supervise the girl -- she goes through my things, opens drawers to see what's inside them, is very loud and boisterous, talks about inappropriate subjects with my kids (prostitution, for example), purposely bothers my boys to get them mad, and so forth. Everyone in the family knows she said she is bipolar and bisexual and on Prozac and has a drunk "father", etc. because she tells us all, or talks in such a loud voice everyone can hear her.

 

DH and the boys want the girl to be told she can never come here again. She disrupts the harmony of our home.

 

Gosh, that is such a hard thing when two prayer warriors feel so differently. I am sorry. If she is a disruption to your home and she is riffling through your things, then definite boundaries need to be set (if nothing else). I will be in prayer for you. I can just feel the frustration in your posts. :grouphug:

[Danestress]

It seems to me that the easiest way to handle the sleep over part it to just say, "Your father and I have decided that we really don't like you sleeping at other people's houses, and we really don't like anyone sleeping over here. Period." I really don't see the point of having sleepovers. I started limiting them when my oldest was a teenager. Just tell them that they can hang out, but that everyone sleeps in his or her own bed.

 

And then I would keep everyone pretty busy. I am not sure I would say, "You can't be friend" but I would feel free to say, "You need to find a volunteer opportunity at the library or hospital or animal shelter or SOMETHING if you have a lot of free time." If your daughter is busy with school, sports, chores, volunteering, family activities etc, she won't have time to hang out as much.

[HollyinNNV]

DH and the boys want the girl to be told she can never come here again. She disrupts the harmony of our home.

 

 

Then I have to agree with Remudamom. And I'd go so far as to say, the longer you allow this to continue, the worse things will get.

[Scarlett]

She may be on Prozac. She may be pursuing an alternate sexual lifestyle. She may be a rude jerk. Or she may be creating a lot of smoke when there is really only a little fire, just as a method of self-protection in a very precarious situation. While I would proceed with great caution, I would also try to extend the hand of kindness to her as much as possible. Otherwise you may be the person who could have helped her but didn't.

 

This is exactly how I feel, but I know it would be hard to handle.

 

:grouphug:

[RoughCollie]

It seems to me that the easiest way to handle the sleep over part it to just say, "Your father and I have decided that we really don't like you sleeping at other people's houses, and we really don't like anyone sleeping over here. Period."

 

I just came back on here to say I'd thought of this solution. No sleepovers. Duh! Sometimes I am just plain dumb.

[kiana]

I would also venture to guess that she is not bi-sexual, but more or less, confused. I could be wrong, but from her living situation and such, she may very well be seeking love and not really care from what gender it comes. She may also be confused between love and s*x or intimacy since it sounds like her parents are real winners and God only knows what she has seen at home. :(

 

 

 

yep, although I wouldn't suggest it to her.

[Mesa]

Honestly, I wouldn't want her over at my house anymore. I dont know if I could actually get up the nerve to forbid it though.... it's a tough situation.

One thing is certain, your family is your number one priority.

Maybe you can sit down with your hubby and daughter and tell your daughter how you feel...

Then, you and your dh can talk to this girl and tell her she isnt welcome into your home because x,y,z. Make sure you are in the room with your hubby, so he cant be accused of anything, if he makes her mad.

 

Good luck

[calandalsmom]

Why would you not consider going to child protective services? This is a child SCREAMING for help and all you guys can talk about is if she might make a pass at your kids????

 

Where is the compassion for this child? Of course she is inappropriate. She has been raised without boundaries and in an unsafe home!

[LittleIzumi]

I do not know this girl. Can she be trusted? I have 3 teenage boys. Will she accuse them of molestation or rape some day, when she gets mad at one of us? Will she go after one of them or DD? She can get up from the couch and go anywhere she likes when DH and I are asleep.

 

So does she have a "nice personality" or is she a raving psychopathic liar? I can't imagine any decent person just randomly claiming rape out of the blue with people she wants to adopt her because her own home is so horrible. :confused: That seems way over the top, personally.

 

I'd just (forewarn dd so she can give a heads-up) set her down and tell her that you're happy to have her over at your house during the day, but she has to follow the rules of your house when she's there. The rules are ___________. Keep them simple so you can remind her later if you have to. Basic stuff like we don't touch stuff without asking, do foul language, etc. Remind her once or twice and if she keeps doing it, politely ask her to head out for the day but she can come back tomorrow if she can remember the rules of the house.

 

And if there was a boy the same age whose father was going on a drunken rampage and wanted a safe place to sleep, you bet I'd let him stay over--in a sleeping bag on my bedroom floor or with a hidden baby monitor out though ;) or I'd send dd to another friend's house for the night.

[calandalsmom]

Also, bipolar people do not take prozac.

 

 

She has isues. You can lock her out and ignore her or you can choose to do the right thing.

[NicksMama-Zack's Mama Too]

I highly recommend you watch it. These "friendships" can become very manipulating regardless of the socio-economic backgrounds of the participants. I grew up poor, from a broken family, and from the wrong side of the tracks. I never was loud, rude or rifled through people's things. My best friend grew up with a alcoholic mother (who brought men home every other night) in a slew of run down apartments and trailer parks. She's an wonderful human being.

 

My own niece has grown up middle class and in a nice neighborhood. She is loud, rude and would steal your wallet from your purse if she had access to it. He career aspirations are to be a Bikini-clad Barista.

 

I think you need to keep all lines of communication open with your daughter and keep an eye on this friendship. Call me cynical.

 

K

[OnTheBrink]

I think this girl is screaming for some help here. Being overweight, garish make-up and funky hair in and of themselves aren't what I'd call warning signals, but combined with her home life and the fact she's on meds and confused sexually indicates to me that she's hurting, lost, and desperate for some stability and true love.

 

Can you help her? I don't know. I do believe that your family comes first. Period. However, maybe, with some very firm boundaries, she can have limited visits until she proves trustworthy and then maybe the boundaries can be widened. I don't agree that she's some sort of tool of satan. I don't believe satan is that blatant! But I do think, as a human being, she's worth some effort to help. Only you can decide how much you can give her. Obviously, you can't be everything to her, and it sounds like at this juncture, she's wanting someone to be everything to her. So, you will have to really rein in how much she's allowed to have from your family (emotionally, I mean).

 

I'd also find out if her home life is as she claims it is, just to be sure you're not being taken for a ride. But, all in all, only God knows what the big picture is in all this. I'd not reject her completely, but give her a little of your time and see what happens. It could be a wonderful thing; or not. But by taking control of it, you determine how far things go.

 

I hope that made sense. :grouphug:

[Erica in PA]

That is great advice, thank you.

 

Now, do I tell the girl that there will be no sleepovers, and why?

 

Hmm......do you think it would work to just avoid bringing up the subject yourself, and when she asks about a particular day, just tell her no? Just always decline the requests for sleepovers, just saying it won't work out?

 

We have a neighbor boy with whom we've had similar problems. We do allow him to come over to our house, with strict rules and times in place, but we absolutely can't allow our kids to go to his house. (Drugs, promiscuity, no supervision, inappropriate media, etc.) It's hard, because he is always asking for my kids to come over, and also asks why... I don't feel like I can tell him the real reason (Your guardians are completely untrustworthy with children??), so I just tell him no, that it suits me better to have him come to our house. It's good to remember that you don't *have* to explain yourself to a child or teen, or anyone really, when it comes to rules for your own home. You can just say no, and leave it at that. You might have to get your dd onboard though, and explain to her why, though that does put her in an awkward position when her friend asks her why she can't sleep over. I just told my kids to say, "My mom said no," and leave it at that, but they are younger than your dd, so you might need to come up with a fuller explanation for her.

[Impish]

Why would you not consider going to child protective services? This is a child SCREAMING for help and all you guys can talk about is if she might make a pass at your kids????

 

Where is the compassion for this child? Of course she is inappropriate. She has been raised without boundaries and in an unsafe home!

:iagree:

While I understand your concern and need to protect your own children, this is still a CHILD. She deserves better than what she's living at home, and she deserves not to be a pariah. Its simply NOT her fault that she is the way she is, that she has the home life she does.

 

I think setting boundries, and allowing her to continue a relationship would be the most helpful thing you can do. I agree with one of your friends that God put her in your life for a reason. She so desperately needs HELP. That she wants you to adopt her after such a short relationship screams how badly she wants and needs a healthy family with structure. You could do that for her.

 

I know what it is to have a child that you can barely tolerate and who is a bad influence on your kids. Diva has a friend like that. I tried to do what I'm advising you to do, but sometimes it just doesn't work.

 

That being said, your initial description of the child as 'fat' etc is seething with negativity. I wonder if this is a bit of a self fulfilling prophecy...you expected her to be negative from the outset.

 

Let her study with your daughter. Explain that if she's there at x time, she needs to help with chores.

 

From everything you've written, she's screaming for help the only way she knows how. Help her.

 

I feel for this child. I truly do. When I was 15, I left home one night, after everyone was asleep and went to a church where my best friend was working. I went for the peace and safety I felt, as the bruises my Dad had left were just rising to the surface. My parents found out, locked all the windows and doors. I found out later that my mom had called my best friend's house (different friend) and showed up there.

 

I was immediately labeled a 'bad influence' and my gf was forbidden to even talk to me anymore. Her parents had no idea how abusive my home life was, etc. But I lost her friendship, leaving me even more alone than I had been.

 

I'm not saying to allow her to abuse your home, etc. I'm begging you, as a child that was labeled and abandoned, to please, please, please help her. Call CPS, have her over to study...don't just throw her to the wolves, and leave her with nowhere and nobody to go to other than be trapped in her home with her 'parents'. She's at your home constantly because its SAFE and her home isn't.

[RoughCollie]

So does she have a "nice personality" or is she a raving psychopathic liar? I can't imagine any decent person just randomly claiming rape out of the blue with people she wants to adopt her because her own home is so horrible. :confused: That seems way over the top, personally.

 

We are criminal defense lawyers and it does not seem way over the top to us -- sometimes males are accused and convicted when they are actually innocent. Not often, IMO, but it does happen.

 

When you see a lot of the seamy side of life in your work, the possibilities - no matter how remote - are in your head.

 

Also, we don't know anyone here because we've only lived here for 2.5 months. It's not like having DD's friend since K spend the night -- a situation in which we have known the child and the family for a very long time.

 

I just don't feel comfortable having unrelated teens of both genders spending the night in the same house. I trust my kids, but I cannot feel the same trust for any child I don't know well.

 

Sometimes far-fetched things do happen. I never let DD spend the night at a friend's house unless we knew the family well. The reason was that I was afraid one of the DH's would turn out to be a s*xual predator.

 

The other ladies in my town thought I was paranoid because of the demographics of our town. That sort of thing did not happen there, period.

 

Sure it does. The guy across the street from us was arrested by police in two different states, plus the feds, for distribution of child pornography and arranging with one of his cohorts to have relations with a 5 year old boy.

 

This guy was an upstanding, well-respected member of our community for well over the 14 years we lived there. He was an engineer. His wife was the top dog in leadership positions in our town with groups having to do with children. Their house was huge, beautiful, and their family seemed to be perfect. Well, the DH was a pervert and his actions destroyed and devastated his innocent family.

 

It did happen in our former town, and it can happen anywhere, no matter what the socio-economic class of the people there. Being falsely accused (and sometimes convicted) does happen to decent people, too.

 

One more point: Some of the most decent seeming people are not decent at all. They are sociopaths, con artists -- I've met a few and it is downright difficult to believe they are heinous criminals -- their victims had no clue.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[LittleIzumi]

Also, bipolar people do not take prozac.

 

 

Bipolars often take an anti-depressant and a mood stabilizer, so Prozac wouldn't be out of the running--just be taken with an extra med on top of it.

[RoughCollie]

Why would you not consider going to child protective services? This is a child SCREAMING for help and all you guys can talk about is if she might make a pass at your kids????

 

Where is the compassion for this child? Of course she is inappropriate. She has been raised without boundaries and in an unsafe home!

 

I have compassion for her, otherwise this would not be a problem.

 

I have spoken to the guidance counselor at school about the girl's situation. They are fully aware of it, and more she could not say. She did say there was no need for me to contact child services, and that the child would be given a warm coat for winter.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[PineFarmMom]

There has already been a lot of good advice. If you allow this to continue, I recommend having very firm rules and that you just always be a part of everything that goes on. The girl sounds like she needs attention, from what she says and does. Through prayer and God's guidance you'll be able to decide if He has put you there for that purpose. It is very hard to help others and protect our own children at the same time. I've found no simple way, so I'm moving more towards protecting my own kids, keeping some of these kids at more of a distance, and praying for them. I have waffled back and forth on this many times. I have offered encouraging words to these kids, food, a safe place to play where there is no fighting or ugliness, etc. If they don't follow the rules, they just can't come back. I'd be very wary of a bisexual friend for dd...dh would absolutely prohibit it. That's a different thing, IMO, but you could always try to get to the bottom of it and see how true it all is.

 

Maybe getting help for her in a different way that through a friendship with your dd?? I always hear people say they want to send their dc into the ps system so they can be salt & light...I want to prepare my kids to be salt & light, but I think that's what God will call them to be as adults and not as kids. I have had to realize that this applies with friends also. I am encouraging them to pick friends that will be like-minded and will be iron sharpening iron, etc. They dont' always do it, but I'm trying to encourage it. ;)

Edited September 25, 2009 by Texas T

[Erica in PA]

I never let DD spend the night at a friend's house unless we knew the family well.

 

There's your answer!!! Just tell this girl that you only allow sleepovers with friends that you have known for a long time, and whose parents you know well!! That is the truth, and will help spare her feelings from thinking it's all about her.

[Scarlett]

I think this girl is screaming for some help here. Being overweight, garish make-up and funky hair in and of themselves aren't what I'd call warning signals, but combined with her home life and the fact she's on meds and confused sexually indicates to me that she's hurting, lost, and desperate for some stability and true love.

 

Can you help her? I don't know. I do believe that your family comes first. Period. However, maybe, with some very firm boundaries, she can have limited visits until she proves trustworthy and then maybe the boundaries can be widened. I don't agree that she's some sort of tool of satan. I don't believe satan is that blatant! But I do think, as a human being, she's worth some effort to help. Only you can decide how much you can give her. Obviously, you can't be everything to her, and it sounds like at this juncture, she's wanting someone to be everything to her. So, you will have to really rein in how much she's allowed to have from your family (emotionally, I mean).

 

I'd also find out if her home life is as she claims it is, just to be sure you're not being taken for a ride. But, all in all, only God knows what the big picture is in all this. I'd not reject her completely, but give her a little of your time and see what happens. It could be a wonderful thing; or not. But by taking control of it, you determine how far things go.

 

I hope that made sense. :grouphug:

 

Great post.

[Impish]

For the record, I wouldn't take her claim of 'bisexual' as truth. It could be an attention thing, it could be she's been sexually abused and that's what she was told by her abuser...you just don't know for sure.

 

What I *do* know is just because someone is bisexual or gay doesn't make them a predator, anymore than being heterosexual does.

 

Actually, there are far more hetero predators than gay.

[Scarlett]

I have compassion for her, otherwise this would not be a problem.

 

I have spoken to the guidance counselor at school about the girl's situation. They are fully aware of it, and more she could not say. She did say there was no need for me to contact child services.

 

I think this is all you can do legally. I really feel for you. What a sad situation.

 

I know CPS are usually more harmful than help except in the most extreme cases where police get there first.

[RoughCollie]

Bipolars often take an anti-depressant and a mood stabilizer, so Prozac wouldn't be out of the running--just be taken with an extra med on top of it.

 

One of my best friends is bipolar and takes Lithium and an anti-depressant (Wellbutrin).

[RoughCollie]

I know CPS are usually more harmful than help except in the most extreme cases where police get there first.

 

The girl's mother has already warned me that here people never call the state police. They handle all problems amongst themselves. The mother was warned when she moved here, and now it was her turn to warn me.

 

It came up because her daughter played chicken with a car in the middle of our rural road, and the driver called the state police. The driver then stopped to talk to my husband, who was working in the yard with me, to find out whether the culprit was our daughter.

 

Somehow, that warning reminded me of a movie, but I can't remember which one. Obviously, the driver didn't get the memo.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[Carol in Cal.]

I would start with that question.

 

When you're thinking about helping someone like this, I think that you have to be prepared to show them love and respect as well as firmness, even if you don't always feel like it. I think that if you can't do that, you will do more harm than good. You'll seem condescending if you teach her things, and harsh or judgemental if you correct her behavior or ask her to leave when it's time. OTOH, if you can treat her with warmth as well as firmness, you're maybe in a position, as others have suggested, to do a great deal of good here.

[PineFarmMom]

The girl's mother has already warned me that here people never call the state police. They handle all problems amongst themselves.

 

Somehow, that warning reminded me of a movie, but I can't remember which one.

 

Yuck!! That just sounds guilty!

[RoughCollie]

I would start with that question.

 

I do treat her very nicely. That's why she wants me to adopt her. I treat her like I do my own DD.

[RoughCollie]

Yuck!! That just sounds guilty!

 

I added after you posted that the mother had been given the same warning when she moved here, so she was passing it on to me.

 

She is only guilty of being very poor, uneducated and unskilled. She makes more on welfare than she could if she worked full-time, which is why she doesn't work. I would not be surprised to find out that she keeps her boyfriend around both out of loneliness and because he brings in money to help support the family. She has 2 daughters, different fathers, never married, and receives no child support because no one knows where the fathers are.

 

This "lifestyle" is pretty common around here, according to the guidance counselor.

 

The mother is quite friendly. She said I could come by anytime, and we could "sit out on the front porch and bullsh*t for awhile" -- that is a direct quote.

Edited September 25, 2009 by RoughCollie

[calandalsmom]

Bipolars often take an anti-depressant and a mood stabilizer, so Prozac wouldn't be out of the running--just be taken with an extra med on top of it.

 

right. I just meant that prozac alone isnt given for bipolar disorder. Probably the child is self dxing.