DS9 begged to not go to his dad's today

[aggieamy]

That is *so* sad ~ the fact that his father would make his son miss something that was obviously VERY important to him (son)...it's selfish, IMO. Sounds like it became about the dad getting his "rights".

 

I don't know. Something very similar happened to us this year. DH and his ex-wife share custody of their daughter. We planned a family vacation way in advance to get tickets and reservations. Well, then her dance class that her mother signed her up for and took her to scheduled a dance recital at the same time. It happened on a week that was our time. It was important to her but the vacation was much more important to the whole family. Should one person's fun be more important than family fun? In my opinion a non-refundable family vacation ALWAYS trumps extracurricular activities of one.

[Scarlett]

I don't know. Something very similar happened to us this year. DH and his ex-wife share custody of their daughter. We planned a family vacation way in advance to get tickets and reservations. Well, then her dance class that her mother signed her up for and took her to scheduled a dance recital at the same time. It happened on a week that was our time. It was important to her but the vacation was much more important to the whole family. Should one person's fun be more important than family fun? In my opinion a non-refundable family vacation ALWAYS trumps extracurricular activities of one.

 

In a situation like this one I would say who ever had the plans first and communicated such plans first would have priority. I am assuming you didn't plan such an expensive trip even if it was on your time without first discussing it with her mother?

[sheryl]

Scarlett,

 

There are alot of us who h'school on my side of the family. My cousin is getting a divorce and the rest of her family, my family too, homeschool. Her kids are too young right now, but the stbxh in negotiations said that the kids will never be allowed to be h'schooled. That was one of his "wants".

 

Be careful in your situation. I would not send up a "red flag" to the opposing side though. My cousin talked about the future of homeschooling and that's when he said NO!

 

You're already h's'ing but still hopefully this will pass by him w/o thinking about it.

 

And, forgive me if this alarms you.....DON'T want to do that. Just trying to be helpful.

 

Sheryl <><

[Joanne]

Some feedback from all the related perspectives I have on this issue.

 

1) A strong reaction/resistence in the case of new separation and divorce does NOT mean automatically mean a "red flag" regarding the parent being "resisted". It could easiliy and absoluteliy be an expression of the fear, worry, concern and complicated dynamics of the divorce. The child can be completely fine and safe with the non custodial parent and still hide in a closet and not want to go. It might mean more "divorcing well" work is needed but I caution people who are jumping to "dad is not safe" conclusions and especially any advice to violate law/court orders.

 

2) I resisted rigid visitation for a long time. I wanted to have a cordial, cooperative, collaborative and fluid for the kids arrangement. Let me just say that with any level of hostility, the rigid schedule is best. An unfortunate best, perhaps, but best.

 

3) Go to a divorce class for you and your child. Tell him EVERY DAY, SEVERAL TIMES A DAY that the divorce is not his fault. That he can't behave enough to change things and that he didn't cause it at all with any of his behavior.

 

4) Related to the rigid schedule, do not allow an early return. This reinforces your son's behavior and will hurt you in court should things amp up (and trust me,they can easily).

 

5) Be cheery, positive and firm about your son visiting his Dad. "Your Dad loves you. So do I. See you Sunday. Bye."

[Scarlett]

Some feedback from all the related perspectives I have on this issue.

 

1) A strong reaction/resistence in the case of new separation and divorce does NOT mean automatically mean a "red flag" regarding the parent being "resisted". It could easiliy and absoluteliy be an expression of the fear, worry, concern and complicated dynamics of the divorce. The child can be completely fine and safe with the non custodial parent and still hide in a closet and not want to go. It might mean more "divorcing well" work is needed but I caution people who are jumping to "dad is not safe" conclusions and especially any advice to violate law/court orders.

 

2) I resisted rigid visitation for a long time. I wanted to have a cordial, cooperative, collaborative and fluid for the kids arrangement. Let me just say that with any level of hostility, the rigid schedule is best. An unfortunate best, perhaps, but best.

 

3) Go to a divorce class for you and your child. Tell him EVERY DAY, SEVERAL TIMES A DAY that the divorce is not his fault. That he can't behave enough to change things and that he didn't cause it at all with any of his behavior.

 

4) Related to the rigid schedule, do not allow an early return. This reinforces your son's behavior and will hurt you in court should things amp up (and trust me,they can easily).

 

5) Be cheery, positive and firm about your son visiting his Dad. "Your Dad loves you. So do I. See you Sunday. Bye."

 

That reminds me I have to go to a class in order to be granted my divorce. I had forgotten all about it. Thank you for reminding me.

 

I see your point about number 4 reinforcing my son's behavior....but I don't see any way in the world I could have said, 'no you can not bring him home tonight.'

 

Ds tells me he does not like spending the night there. And as you say Joanne, I do not think it is because he isn't 'safe' in any way, but more that he just wants to be where his own bed is with his own stuff and his comfort level is high.

 

Thanks for your thoughts Joanne. I know you've been through the ringer. I am trying to adjust my attitude to be more in line with your number 5.

[Scarlett]

Scarlett,

 

There are alot of us who h'school on my side of the family. My cousin is getting a divorce and the rest of her family, my family too, homeschool. Her kids are too young right now, but the stbxh in negotiations said that the kids will never be allowed to be h'schooled. That was one of his "wants".

 

Be careful in your situation. I would not send up a "red flag" to the opposing side though. My cousin talked about the future of homeschooling and that's when he said NO!

 

You're already h's'ing but still hopefully this will pass by him w/o thinking about it.

 

And, forgive me if this alarms you.....DON'T want to do that. Just trying to be helpful.

 

Sheryl <><

 

It has been discussed and he tried to bully me about it. I have full custody for that very reason. He can't stop me at this point. I know never say never...but the custody issue is a done deal for now.

[aggieamy]

In a situation like this one I would say who ever had the plans first and communicated such plans first would have priority. I am assuming you didn't plan such an expensive trip even if it was on your time without first discussing it with her mother?

 

It was resolved amicably (luckily) but we hadn't discussed it with her. It was a long weekend trip and we had never in the passed discussed those. They do what they want on their weeks and we do as we please on our weeks. There isn't any hostility on either side but we aren't really "friends" discussing our plans. It is extremely rare that we ever switch times. The last time that there was really a major switch was when the ex went on her honeymoon and we kept my step-daughter during that time.

 

Sorry to hijack your thread.

 

Good luck. :grouphug: I know it seems pretty tough now but I know it will get easier once things settle down and you get adjusted to a new life and routine.

[Scarlett]

It was resolved amicably (luckily) but we hadn't discussed it with her. It was a long weekend trip and we had never in the passed discussed those. They do what they want on their weeks and we do as we please on our weeks. There isn't any hostility on either side but we aren't really "friends" discussing our plans. It is extremely rare that we ever switch times. The last time that there was really a major switch was when the ex went on her honeymoon and we kept my step-daughter during that time.

 

Sorry to hijack your thread.

 

Good luck. :grouphug: I know it seems pretty tough now but I know it will get easier once things settle down and you get adjusted to a new life and routine.

 

Oh it isn't a t/j. It is experience..:) It helps me. I know I don't have the perfect attitude and I'm not handling things perfectly....like today ds told me that he has been called a little Sh**. I expressed mild shock....and asked him who called him that. Guess? Yeah, the chickie neighbor. How does one handle that?

[Cammie]

So I ask you.....why would stbx do that? Why not just bring him home BEFORE he goes over to this girls apartment for 3 hours. That way I could have got the boy in bed at a decent hour instead of midnight.

 

 

Scarlett - I hope you don't feel like I'm picking on you...but since you asked:001_smile:

 

You need to adjust your thinking. Parenting is not about all the things you do with your kids. It can also be about the time you spend with your kids. If you have full custody then your son is home with you most of the time. I would venture to say that during the time he is with you there might be times you talk on the phone with a girlfriend, watch a show on TV, do laundry or any of a million other activities. But during all that time your son is with you, in the house with you, able to see you and be with you. When a parent loses custody they lose so much. They lose all those nights tucking in the child, or reading a story or being there when they have a bad day.

 

You cannot expect that is EX doesn't have something "planned" that means he should give up his TIME with his son. The TIME is the important thing - not the activity. Many custodial and non-custodial parents get caught up in this trap.

 

It seems (IMHO) that you have a prblem with the girl. You are allowed to have that feeling. If it ever gets to the point of being dangerous to your son or really interfering with his time with dad you can consider a court order that his parenting time not be spent at her house or with her. But I would save that for something serious (inappropriate drinking/drug use at the house...).

 

His parenting time means ....his parenting time. Clearly you and he have very different morals (ok, I am even willing to say he has none!) And you probably have very different parenting styles. That is why you are going to be divorced. However, when he is the dad he gets to make some decisions. They cannot be dangerous or health threatening but if he thinks it is ok for son to have a soda, eat pizza, hang out at another house, he can make that decision. You have more time with son so you can influence his personal preferences more. You can teach him about healthy eating, dangers of sugar, etc. Help him make the right decisions when he is not with you.

 

No one says this is easy. The problem with divorced parents trying to parent together is that there is usually a lot of baggage in that relationship. I have see a few families that were able to put aside all the problems (the girlfriends, the money issues) and simply focus on the kids. It is HARD but worth it!

[Scarlett]

Scarlett - I hope you don't feel like I'm picking on you...but since you asked:001_smile:

 

You need to adjust your thinking. Parenting is not about all the things you do with your kids. It can also be about the time you spend with your kids. If you have full custody then your son is home with you most of the time. I would venture to say that during the time he is with you there might be times you talk on the phone with a girlfriend, watch a show on TV, do laundry or any of a million other activities. But during all that time your son is with you, in the house with you, able to see you and be with you. When a parent loses custody they lose so much. They lose all those nights tucking in the child, or reading a story or being there when they have a bad day.

 

You cannot expect that is EX doesn't have something "planned" that means he should give up his TIME with his son. The TIME is the important thing - not the activity. Many custodial and non-custodial parents get caught up in this trap.

 

It seems (IMHO) that you have a prblem with the girl. You are allowed to have that feeling. If it ever gets to the point of being dangerous to your son or really interfering with his time with dad you can consider a court order that his parenting time not be spent at her house or with her. But I would save that for something serious (inappropriate drinking/drug use at the house...).

 

His parenting time means ....his parenting time. Clearly you and he have very different morals (ok, I am even willing to say he has none!) And you probably have very different parenting styles. That is why you are going to be divorced. However, when he is the dad he gets to make some decisions. They cannot be dangerous or health threatening but if he thinks it is ok for son to have a soda, eat pizza, hang out at another house, he can make that decision. You have more time with son so you can influence his personal preferences more. You can teach him about healthy eating, dangers of sugar, etc. Help him make the right decisions when he is not with you.

 

No one says this is easy. The problem with divorced parents trying to parent together is that there is usually a lot of baggage in that relationship. I have see a few families that were able to put aside all the problems (the girlfriends, the money issues) and simply focus on the kids. It is HARD but worth it!

 

Well, this is all true. I just think that if *I* only had ds for a few short hours a week, I wouldn't spend it with a 23 year old girl. I do get your point though....that stbx has the right to be ds's father.....regardless of how I feel about his parenting style or structure. I do get that.

 

How would you deal with this girl calling my son a 'little 'sh**'?

[swellmomma]

In regards to this girl calling your ds a little sh*t, in what context was it said? For many the context doesn't matter, but I ask because I rough hosue with my kids a lot and there has been times when my ds gotten the better of me and got a good shot in and I will jokingly say something like "you little sh*t, I'll get you back for that". It is not a mean or nasty way, it is just part of the trash talk that goes with us rough housing. If she meant it in this sort of way I would feel much differently about it than if she was calling him it to be mean/nasty, in another context etc.

 

I can see how even if it was said in a joking matter, if your son is not accustomed to people talking like that it would hurt his feelings and regardless of context it should be brought up with the stbx. Don't approach it in a way that will make him defensive, instead mention that your ds had his feelings hurt due to this comment, and as you were not there to witness it, you wanted to bring up the incident so that he is aware that ds's feelings were hurt by this girl's comments. As long as he doesn't feel that you are attacking him or this girl we can hope he will listen to what you are saying about how your ds felt about what was said.

[Scarlett]

In regards to this girl calling your ds a little sh*t, in what context was it said? For many the context doesn't matter, but I ask because I rough hosue with my kids a lot and there has been times when my ds gotten the better of me and got a good shot in and I will jokingly say something like "you little sh*t, I'll get you back for that". It is not a mean or nasty way, it is just part of the trash talk that goes with us rough housing. If she meant it in this sort of way I would feel much differently about it than if she was calling him it to be mean/nasty, in another context etc.

 

I can see how even if it was said in a joking matter, if your son is not accustomed to people talking like that it would hurt his feelings and regardless of context it should be brought up with the stbx. Don't approach it in a way that will make him defensive, instead mention that your ds had his feelings hurt due to this comment, and as you were not there to witness it, you wanted to bring up the incident so that he is aware that ds's feelings were hurt by this girl's comments. As long as he doesn't feel that you are attacking him or this girl we can hope he will listen to what you are saying about how your ds felt about what was said.

 

Well.....Hmmmm.....I'm sure it was joking. Ds thought it was hilarious....He has never heard anything even remotely close to that....We are talking...about a different class of people. So do I just let it go?

[kiana]

Let it go, but make sure he knows that's an inappropriate way to talk. At his age, he probably considers it hilarious and will start using it. :glare:

 

With regards to the pop issue, it may help if you suggest that he asks for sprite, 7up, root beer, or some similar caffeine-free pop (that he likes) when offered a soda. If he's out anywhere and ordering off a menu, they'll definitely have one of the above. If it's at his dad's house, they might not, but if he has a liking for it they might start keeping it around.

 

Or they might not. But it's worth a shot.

[Cammie]

Well.....Hmmmm.....I'm sure it was joking. Ds thought it was hilarious....He has never heard anything even remotely close to that....We are talking...about a different class of people. So do I just let it go?

 

 

Yeah, I think I would. You can also try to use it as a teaching opportunity. You can amake sure he understands that there may be different rules in different houses. In your house certain language is not ok. He may hear things out in the world that are not ok. You expect certain behavior of him regardless of where he is. Even when he is at dad's house you expect him to (be polite, not curse, pick up after himself, etc...) It is a good chance for him to learn that even when mom is not around there are right and wrong behaviors.

 

This is a process, there will be bumps in the road! Make a record of the serous stuff and try and let the other stuff roll off your back!

[Scarlett]

Let it go, but make sure he knows that's an inappropriate way to talk. At his age, he probably considers it hilarious and will start using it. :glare:

 

With regards to the pop issue, it may help if you suggest that he asks for sprite, 7up, root beer, or some similar caffeine-free pop (that he likes) when offered a soda. If he's out anywhere and ordering off a menu, they'll definitely have one of the above. If it's at his dad's house, they might not, but if he has a liking for it they might start keeping it around.

 

Or they might not. But it's worth a shot.

 

Thanks.....because you know....I want to call up stbx and scream 'how can you let a 23 year old call your son a little 'shi*'. But I guess in the grand scheme of things.....I have to let it go.

 

And as far as the cafffeine......I have let ds know that he is old enough to make the decision to NOT have caffeine after lunch. I don't even like it before then...but after that we have a real problem.

[Scarlett]

Yeah, I think I would. You can also try to use it as a teaching opportunity. You can amake sure he understands that there may be different rules in different houses. In your house certain language is not ok. He may hear things out in the world that are not ok. You expect certain behavior of him regardless of where he is. Even when he is at dad's house you expect him to (be polite, not curse, pick up after himself, etc...) It is a good chance for him to learn that even when mom is not around there are right and wrong behaviors.

 

This is a process, there will be bumps in the road! Make a record of the serous stuff and try and let the other stuff roll off your back!

 

But how do I determine what is 'serious' and what is just me?

[Rosie_0801]

But how do I determine what is 'serious' and what is just me?

 

Don't know the full answer, but for a start, if it's something you'd call your very favourite friends or relatives on, then it's probably serious. If it isn't something you'd call people you like on, you are probably better off grinding your teeth and not calling your ex on it either because nitpicking isn't a good way to encourage positive motives in him. Also, the more of your house rules you want him to abide by at his dad's house, the harder it is for him. He'll either do as you say, and irritate his dad, or he'll have to start hiding things from you. Obviously some things are important enough that they need to be house rules in both houses, other things, well, you just have to grind your teeth and try not to think about it.

 

:grouphug:

Rosie

[Cammie]

But how do I determine what is 'serious' and what is just me?

 

 

Serious is life threatening/health threatening. Serious is also emotional abuse.

 

For example - if you said the girl was calling him a sh*t, yelling at him, cursing him out. That is serious because it sounds emotionally abusive.

 

If you said that drugs were being used in his presense or that EX was driving drunk with son in the car - that is all serious.

 

But, exposure to people with no class, exposure to people you don't like, eating junk food, playing video games, etc - none of that is serious - even if as a mother you wouldn't allow it.

 

One way to look at it is this - would DHS or Child Services step in and investigate the problem? If it is drugs, abuse, etc then the answer is yes they would because it is a serious problem. If it is a kid eating junk food, the answer is no they would not because it is a parenting issue.

 

One more thing, I don't want to discount your son's feelings. If he continues to REALLY resist going to dad's house I might was to get a therapist involved to talk with him. Just to see if it is a transition problem or if there is something else causing him to want to avoid going there.

[Tree House Academy]

Oh, and listen to how last night played out. Ds and stbx went to that neighbors house to watch a ball game on tv. It was over at nearly 11:00. Stbx calls me and says ds wants to come home and he (stbx) didn't really mind since he will be seeing him today to put the dome up. So he brings him home just after 11:00. I asked ds why he wanted to come home...thought maybe he just got really tired and wanted me. He said no, that he had been asking his dad if he could come home for the night since they were at the river after the float. Now....the thing is....my kid is not a sports fan. I asked him if he watched the game. He said, 'no I just played with Brandi's Iphone.' So I ask you.....why would stbx do that? Why not just bring him home BEFORE he goes over to this girls apartment for 3 hours. That way I could have got the boy in bed at a decent hour instead of midnight.

 

This is a vent.........I will not mention it to stbx at all. I was just glad to have my boy home.

 

Yeah, that sucks. :( My ex is not inconsiderate to that level most of the time. Just after we divorced, he had a girlfriend that he actually "stole" from his own brother. She was a....gosh, there just is no nice word for what she was. I told him that if my son was ever even NEAR her, it would be ON! He doesn't pay the right amount of child support as it is (he makes $150K a year and gives me $600 a month - which was based on a salary of around $48K which is what he was making when we divorced. I have let it go because we don't NEED the money and because, honestly, it is my ace in the hole when it comes to things I want - like homeschooling. Sad but true). So...he respected my wishes (or understood my threats :D) and my son never met her. The girlfriend he has now is young - 25 or so. BUT, for the most part, I really like her. She has a decent head on her sholders and she is good to my son. My dh and my ex get along well too. But I have been divorced 8 years, so it took awhile.

 

:grouphug: I am sorry you feel attacked here - I am pretty sure no one is meaning to come off that way. You are in a very personal and emotional situation right now and it will take time for things to feel *good* again...but they will!

[Tree House Academy]

I am left wondering why ds's life has to be so turned upside down because of what his dad has done to this family. I do not buy the party line that some speak that says 'he didn't do this to his children, he only did it to his wife.' Well, 'doing this thing to me' has destroyed this child's family of origin. So why does he have to give up something as simple as a last minute ballgame with friends because his dad destroyed the family. I know the law. I know there has to be guidelines. I get it . I just. don't. like it.

 

I don't like it either! :( I am so sorry! :grouphug: My son still suffers so much from our divorce and he was 2 when it happened. Just last week, he asked me why his dad was so bad that I couldn't love him like I do my dh. Even 8 years later, it still hurts him.

[Scarlett]

I don't like it either! :( I am so sorry! :grouphug: My son still suffers so much from our divorce and he was 2 when it happened. Just last week, he asked me why his dad was so bad that I couldn't love him like I do my dh. Even 8 years later, it still hurts him.

 

What do you tell him? Was there infidelity? Do you tell him age appropriate truth?

[Scarlett]

Don't know the full answer, but for a start, if it's something you'd call your very favourite friends or relatives on, then it's probably serious. Rosie

 

I would not allow my own mother to call my son a 'little **it'.

[Scarlett]

Yeah, I think I would. You can also try to use it as a teaching opportunity. You can amake sure he understands that there may be different rules in different houses. In your house certain language is not ok. He may hear things out in the world that are not ok. You expect certain behavior of him regardless of where he is. Even when he is at dad's house you expect him to (be polite, not curse, pick up after himself, etc...) It is a good chance for him to learn that even when mom is not around there are right and wrong behaviors.

 

This is a process, there will be bumps in the road! Make a record of the serous stuff and try and let the other stuff roll off your back!

 

That is pretty much how I handled it. I just smiled a smile....sort of 'oh you are being naughty.'....and hugged him and said, 'that is no way for people to talk to each other.'

 

I also have to be careful that I don't make it so that stops telling me stuff.

[aggieamy]

Ugh. She sounds very interesting. (Not really in a good way.) Maybe I missed this but how old is stbxH? My DH is 34 and has a friend his age that dated a early 20's girl. He didn't understand how the guy could stand being around her, she was very immature and I can't imagine what they talked about.

 

I would be so incredibly angry about her calling him a sh**. I can't imagine anyone talking to a child like that. Even if it's joking ... still not acceptable in my book to cuss at a kid. However, I also wouldn't say anything. I imagine this woman will be merely a footnote in your son's life and won't make much of an impression. For the sake of keeping things civil I would bite my tongue. We had a situation recently where I was livid but kept my mouth shut ... mostly. Sophia's step-father told Sophia that he thought Cameran was a bad kid. Sophia of course repeated this to DH and I. I was really beside myself because these kids LIVE together and he's going to say something mean about her. It just seemed like a very tacky mean-spirted thing to do. I talked to Sophia about it and we decided that it was a hurtful thing to say and we didn't agree with his opinion. I never said anything to him though I would have dearly loved to.

 

BTW, Cameran isn't a bad kid at all! She's very outgoing and brave which makes her do things she shouldn't. Like last summer when she decided to jump off the diving board even though she didn't know how to swim and someone had to jump in and get her.

[Scarlett]

Ugh. She sounds very interesting. (Not really in a good way.) Maybe I missed this but how old is stbxH? My DH is 34 and has a friend his age that dated a early 20's girl. He didn't understand how the guy could stand being around her, she was very immature and I can't imagine what they talked about.

 

I would be so incredibly angry about her calling him a sh**. I can't imagine anyone talking to a child like that. Even if it's joking ... still not acceptable in my book to cuss at a kid. However, I also wouldn't say anything. I imagine this woman will be merely a footnote in your son's life and won't make much of an impression. For the sake of keeping things civil I would bite my tongue. We had a situation recently where I was livid but kept my mouth shut ... mostly. Sophia's step-father told Sophia that he thought Cameran was a bad kid. Sophia of course repeated this to DH and I. I was really beside myself because these kids LIVE together and he's going to say something mean about her. It just seemed like a very tacky mean-spirted thing to do. I talked to Sophia about it and we decided that it was a hurtful thing to say and we didn't agree with his opinion. I never said anything to him though I would have dearly loved to.

 

BTW, Cameran isn't a bad kid at all! She's very outgoing and brave which makes her do things she shouldn't. Like last summer when she decided to jump off the diving board even though she didn't know how to swim and someone had to jump in and get her.

 

Stbx is 45. He still claims he isn't dating her. She had a boyfriend until a week ago and she was crying about it when she came to stbx's apartment when ds was there. Even if he isn't 'dating' (read sleeping with) I dont' know why he subjects ds to her. Ds likes her though. Oh well, gotta just suck it up.

[Scarlett]

Ok, going to divorcing parents class on Thursday. Maybe the instructor will straighten me right up. ;) Stbx going to same class.

[Tree House Academy]

What do you tell him? Was there infidelity? Do you tell him age appropriate truth?

 

When we are alone, I do try to tell him the age appropriate truth. I do not get into any infidelity (my mom spent my whole life telling me how my dad cheated on her with 29 women and told her on her birthday...the same time she was planning to tell him she was pregnant with me) - it doesn't do anything other than place blame one way or the other and he can't understand that at all right now. What I tell him is that daddy and I were not good together. We brought out the worst in each other and we fought all the time. I tell him that I think daddy and I both should be happy and we can do that with other people, but not each other. I also make sure to always tell him that the one good thing his dad and I did together was HIM. :) And that I love his dad, but loving someone in a marriage way and loving them as just a friend (in my case, just as the father of my son!) is much different.

 

It is really hard to teach a child that he shouldn't go into a marriage thinking, "if things don't work, we can get divorced" when his mom and dad did it. :( So hard!

[Scarlett]

When we are alone, I do try to tell him the age appropriate truth. I do not get into any infidelity (my mom spent my whole life telling me how my dad cheated on her with 29 women and told her on her birthday...the same time she was planning to tell him she was pregnant with me) - it doesn't do anything other than place blame one way or the other and he can't understand that at all right now. What I tell him is that daddy and I were not good together. We brought out the worst in each other and we fought all the time. I tell him that I think daddy and I both should be happy and we can do that with other people, but not each other. I also make sure to always tell him that the one good thing his dad and I did together was HIM. :) And that I love his dad, but loving someone in a marriage way and loving them as just a friend (in my case, just as the father of my son!) is much different.

 

It is really hard to teach a child that he shouldn't go into a marriage thinking, "if things don't work, we can get divorced" when his mom and dad did it. :( So hard!

 

He was 2 though when you split up?

 

My son was/is 9...and I told him why. The simplist most non detailed way I could tell him. He only knows about the one girlfriend that I FIRST discovered. He doesn't know about my cousin or any of the other disgusting stuff. I did want him to know I would not divorce his dad over just fighting or anything frivilous. He has been taught about adultery being wrong all his life. What I also tell him is that Daddy did this bad thing (got a girlfriend) and that is why I am divorcing him, BUT Daddy isn't bad and he has the choice at any time to stop wrong things. I also tell him his dad loves him.

[myfunnybunch]

I told ds I want him to stop drinking caffeine and that includes when he is away from me. That he has to take some responsibility for making good choices on his own sometimes. He said he would not do it again. Do I follow this up with a private conversation with stbx? Or is this one of those issues I just have to let go of?

 

Started this post yesterday and got pulled away from the computer....haven't had time to go through additional responses to your post, but wanted to share my opinion based on my experiences.

 

Have a private conversation with the ex one time. Keep it focused on your ds: "I've noticed when he has caffeine, he ______________. It's interfering with his sleep and he has a hard time in school. Would you consider not allowing caffeinated drinks on Sundays/until he's a little older/only on special occasions?" Or " Ds sees that this is interfering with his sleep. I wonder if you could help ds to make a better drink choice." If ex gets defensive, stay calm and bring it back to your ds: "I'm not trying to tell you how to parent. I've just noticed that ds is having a hard time sleeping and hoping to work with you on this, but the decision is yours."

 

Then let go. Let go of the idea of who they should be spending time with and how they should be spending it too. That's just one more way to make yourself crazy, and for your ex to make you crazy too, if he's so inclined.

 

And may I very, very gently say: Think about giving your ds that same freedom. I think it's reasonable to remind him how caffeine affects him and ask him to consider that even at his dad's. Then let his dad be the parent when your ds is in his dad's home. I'm not sure that it's reasonable to expect him uphold your boundaries at his dad's, especially if things are tense between the two of you. Not only is it an additional challenge for your ds at a trying time, it has the potential to become a bone of constant contention between you and your ex, a way for your ex to exert his own control over your life.

 

:grouphug:

 

Reading your post reminded me of the back-and-forth with my dd after my split from her father. Everyone was reeling from all of the changes, and looking back at that part of my life, I think we all felt a little out of control.

 

I finally realized that I had NO control over what happens in my ex's home, unless it is neglectful or abusive, which it wasn't in any way. I (figuratively) bit clean through my tongue over and over. I worked really hard to be positive, to make it clear in every interaction that I wanted us to work together (no matter how angry I was personally), to not let him needle me, and to be fair. It took a lot of giving in and a lot of biting my tongue and a lot of choosing battles very carefully.

 

The outcome is that my daughter, as a teen, is gifted with parents who know how to work together and which boundaries we can negotiate (and the ones we can't). We communicate well, and we work together. At an age when she's testing her wings and our boundaries, it is a HUGE plus in her life that we can do this. Way more important than whether or not she ate too much sugar (one of my PEEVES when she was little).

 

Sorry, I know you were asking about caffeine...lol. Got a little sidetracked.

 

:grouphug: again.

 

Cat

[Scarlett]

Started this post yesterday and got pulled away from the computer....haven't had time to go through additional responses to your post, but wanted to share my opinion based on my experiences.

 

Have a private conversation with the ex one time. Keep it focused on your ds: "I've noticed when he has caffeine, he ______________. It's interfering with his sleep and he has a hard time in school. Would you consider not allowing caffeinated drinks on Sundays/until he's a little older/only on special occasions?" Or " Ds sees that this is interfering with his sleep. I wonder if you could help ds to make a better drink choice." If ex gets defensive, stay calm and bring it back to your ds: "I'm not trying to tell you how to parent. I've just noticed that ds is having a hard time sleeping and hoping to work with you on this, but the decision is yours."

 

Then let go. Let go of the idea of who they should be spending time with and how they should be spending it too. That's just one more way to make yourself crazy, and for your ex to make you crazy too, if he's so inclined.

 

And may I very, very gently say: Think about giving your ds that same freedom. I think it's reasonable to remind him how caffeine affects him and ask him to consider that even at his dad's. Then let his dad be the parent when your ds is in his dad's home. I'm not sure that it's reasonable to expect him uphold your boundaries at his dad's, especially if things are tense between the two of you. Not only is it an additional challenge for your ds at a trying time, it has the potential to become a bone of constant contention between you and your ex, a way for your ex to exert his own control over your life.

 

:grouphug:

 

Reading your post reminded me of the back-and-forth with my dd after my split from her father. Everyone was reeling from all of the changes, and looking back at that part of my life, I think we all felt a little out of control.

 

I finally realized that I had NO control over what happens in my ex's home, unless it is neglectful or abusive, which it wasn't in any way. I (figuratively) bit clean through my tongue over and over. I worked really hard to be positive, to make it clear in every interaction that I wanted us to work together (no matter how angry I was personally), to not let him needle me, and to be fair. It took a lot of giving in and a lot of biting my tongue and a lot of choosing battles very carefully.

 

The outcome is that my daughter, as a teen, is gifted with parents who know how to work together and which boundaries we can negotiate (and the ones we can't). We communicate well, and we work together. At an age when she's testing her wings and our boundaries, it is a HUGE plus in her life that we can do this. Way more important than whether or not she ate too much sugar (one of my PEEVES when she was little).

 

Sorry, I know you were asking about caffeine...lol. Got a little sidetracked.

 

:grouphug: again.

 

Cat

 

Thanks for the post Cat. It does help me see the long range effects of all this. I did tell ds9 that he is getting older and needs to realize how caffeine affects him. He couldn't sleep Saturday night and thus I let him sleep in and we missed services the next am. That won't happen again. If he chooses caffeine, he will choose to have not enough sleep. Natural consequence.

 

I had a very long talk with stbx last night on the phone. I apologized for my handling of the ball game request on Friday night....I explained to him that ds HEARD the invitation, but still and yet I should have just said, 'no ds is unavailable.' I told him that in the future if I need to switch I will discuss it with him (stbx) first and not put ds in the middle.

 

I talked a long time about how we were going to be in each other lives for a long time to come---as long as we live really. Graduations, celebrations, weddings, births, deaths, grandbabies. And that I just want to be cordial. I am happy about my future and I don't want to feel anger. But most importantly I don't want ds to feel our bad energy toward each other.

 

He kept getting angry and saying things like, 'sure, you want to get a long, that is why you (insert any number of things I've said or done over the last 4 months whether it was really inappropriate or just his perception). I would just keep gently pulling him back to 'yes, but let's try to get along now, for our son's sake ok?'

 

We have the parenting class Thursday night and maybe that conversation will make him more willing to LISTEN and see how to best handle being divorced parents. We still have a week to get through before our court date and I'm praying like crazy we can settle out of court.

[NicksMama-Zack's Mama Too]

Thanks for the post Cat. It does help me see the long range effects of all this. I did tell ds9 that he is getting older and needs to realize how caffeine affects him. He couldn't sleep Saturday night and thus I let him sleep in and we missed services the next am. That won't happen again. If he chooses caffeine, he will choose to have not enough sleep. Natural consequence.

 

I had a very long talk with stbx last night on the phone. I apologized for my handling of the ball game request on Friday night....I explained to him that ds HEARD the invitation, but still and yet I should have just said, 'no ds is unavailable.' I told him that in the future if I need to switch I will discuss it with him (stbx) first and not put ds in the middle.

 

I talked a long time about how we were going to be in each other lives for a long time to come---as long as we live really. Graduations, celebrations, weddings, births, deaths, grandbabies. And that I just want to be cordial. I am happy about my future and I don't want to feel anger. But most importantly I don't want ds to feel our bad energy toward each other.

 

He kept getting angry and saying things like, 'sure, you want to get a long, that is why you (insert any number of things I've said or done over the last 4 months whether it was really inappropriate or just his perception). I would just keep gently pulling him back to 'yes, but let's try to get along now, for our son's sake ok?'

 

We have the parenting class Thursday night and maybe that conversation will make him more willing to LISTEN and see how to best handle being divorced parents. We still have a week to get through before our court date and I'm praying like crazy we can settle out of court.

 

Scarlett, you are doing a wonderful job handling this situation. Your last post is very encouraging and I admire you more and more everyday. Your head and your heart are in the right place. Have a great day! You are a great mom.

 

K

Edited September 22, 2009 by NicksMama-Zack's Mama Too

[Scarlett]

Scarlett' date=' you are doing a wonderful job handling this situation. Your last post is very encouraging and I admire you more and more everyday. Your head and your heart are in the right place. Have a great day! You are a great mom.

 

K[/quote']

 

Thanks so much for saying this.

 

GOOD NEWS!!!! NO CANCER!

 

BUMMER NEWS...court postponed.

 

Ds is due to be at his dad's in 30 minutes and is crying because he doesn't want to go. I'm trying my best to be upbeat and cheerful!!!!!!!!

[ondreeuh]

I just deleted a message I had submitted offering advice. You've already received a lot of advice and I don't know you well enough to jump in. I know (from experience) that striking balance is very difficult, but as the drama subsides, it will get much easier to decide which battles to fight and which to let go.

Edited September 23, 2009 by ondreeuh

[Scarlett]

I just deleted a message I had submitted offering advice. You've already received a lot of advice and I don't know you well enough to jump in. I know (from experience) that striking balance is very difficult, but as the drama subsides, it will get much easier to decide which battles to fight and which to let go.

 

Thank you. I take my licks fairly well, even when they make me bristle....:) I know there is so much wisdom here and I do try my best to listen.

 

Hey, everyone, today I had a text exchange with stbx that was hilarious. I asked him if we were going to go by the new agreement starting now or wait until the divorce is final. He answers back, 'I've answered this once, but I"ll say it again. We will keep the current schedule.' I said, 'no need to get snippy. I was confused because in our new agreement it says we will start the new every other weekend rotation (instead of 1st and 3rd) beginning this Friday. So if we are keeping the old schedule you won't have ds this weekend. See you at 6:00' He replies back, 'sorry. Really hectic here. Yes, I would like ds this weekend.'

 

I said back, 'so going to new schedule now? Ok, see you at 5:30 then (new Wednesday schedule is from 5:30-8:30 instead of 6:-10) Thanks.'

 

He answers back, 'No problem sweetie.'

 

:lol: In view of the fact that he NEVER calls me by pet names and in view of our conversation a few days ago about trying to get along...that was just hilarious.

 

I wrote back, 'LOL!! Yer still funny.'

 

Oh and then he called at 5:15 and said he couldn't make it by 5:30. :glare: But I had not left yet. So we ended up at 6:00 anyway.

 

Wow. What a ride. I hope we can live near each other.

[Cammie]

Thank you. I take my licks fairly well, even when they make me bristle....:) I know there is so much wisdom here and I do try my best to listen.

 

Hey, everyone, today I had a text exchange with stbx that was hilarious. I asked him if we were going to go by the new agreement starting now or wait until the divorce is final. He answers back, 'I've answered this once, but I"ll say it again. We will keep the current schedule.' I said, 'no need to get snippy. I was confused because in our new agreement it says we will start the new every other weekend rotation (instead of 1st and 3rd) beginning this Friday. So if we are keeping the old schedule you won't have ds this weekend. See you at 6:00' He replies back, 'sorry. Really hectic here. Yes, I would like ds this weekend.'

 

I said back, 'so going to new schedule now? Ok, see you at 5:30 then (new Wednesday schedule is from 5:30-8:30 instead of 6:-10) Thanks.'

 

He answers back, 'No problem sweetie.'

 

:lol: In view of the fact that he NEVER calls me by pet names and in view of our conversation a few days ago about trying to get along...that was just hilarious.

 

I wrote back, 'LOL!! Yer still funny.'

 

Oh and then he called at 5:15 and said he couldn't make it by 5:30. :glare: But I had not left yet. So we ended up at 6:00 anyway.

 

Wow. What a ride. I hope we can live near each other.

 

 

Good for you! You both sounded reasonable, flexible and that you were trying to do what is best for DS. Hope you guys can keep this up!

[Scarlett]

I had a very long talk with stbx last night on the phone. I apologized for my handling of the ball game request on Friday night....I explained to him that ds HEARD the invitation, but still and yet I should have just said, 'no ds is unavailable.' I told him that in the future if I need to switch I will discuss it with him (stbx) first and not put ds in the middle.

 

I talked a long time about how we were going to be in each other lives for a long time to come---as long as we live really. Graduations, celebrations, weddings, births, deaths, grandbabies. And that I just want to be cordial. I am happy about my future and I don't want to feel anger. But most importantly I don't want ds to feel our bad energy toward each other.

 

We have the parenting class Thursday night and maybe that conversation will make him more willing to LISTEN and see how to best handle being divorced parents. We still have a week to get through before our court date and I'm praying like crazy we can settle out of court.

 

Just a brief update that things are going much better. We had our class last night and wouldn't you know the intructor spent 2 hours sayings things almost word for word what *I* said to stbx earlier in the week. ;)

 

There were 3 other individuals in this court ordered class and 2 of them had such over the top stories that I think stbx was seeing me in a whole new light. The man was fighting for custody of his 4 year old dd and had not been able to see her in months. His body language was so furious it was sad. He told us all about how the laws of our state are set up to benefit mothers and not father. How his x is living with some guy and the guys says things like 'you will never see your dd again.' The instructor stayed after class talking to him and he is going to get him some help, legally, I feel sure.

 

And they showed a film where the xw was screaming at the x about cs and how he couldn't see his kids until he paid. And talking to the kids about what a huge mistake she made marrying that big loser and how the less they saw of him the better. I know it was suppose to be drama, BUT apparently some divorced parents act that way. stbx just looked at me with eyes wide, because he KNOWS I am not doing that.

 

After the class we stood in the parking lot talking. He had not been informed by his attorney that our court date next week was cancelled. He said he had a request of me and he didn't want me to give him any trouble on it. He doesn't want his wages garnished. I happily agreed to that. He has never one time failed to pay on time and I'd rather keep the state away from my money. We went for a bite to eat and talked for about an hour. We tried to discuss settlement of the property but it began to get heated so we just stopped and changed topics. THAT was huge for us. So we talked a lot about our son and exchanged stories and together nailed down that the reason ds9 doesn't like going to his dad's on Friday night is that it messes up his Saturday routine of cartoons (stbx doesn't have cable yet). We spoke to the instructor about that and he said it is very common for something so small to get big for kids because it IS big for them. It is their live and they want their life to stay the same.

 

He also told me he is going to stop ignoring me and refusing to speak to me at exchanges because it is just 'stupid' and hurts ds. So all in all I feel we are making progress.

 

He gave me some insight that he was really freaked out earlier this summer, but feeling much better now. He had not let on much how hard it was on him.

 

Now on to court to let a judge divide up our 'stuff'. Sigh.

[TraceyS/FL]

I"m glad it is working out for the better.

 

I wish i could say that mine has reached any level of working together for the kids, but i don't think he has... in fact if anything, the money mind game crap is getting worse. He's moved on to buying them... they know i have no money, so they pester him until he buys them what they want. Meanwhile, i can't even provide food to them while we are out of town for a doctors appointment - yet like yesterday came home and he had bought DD2 a cowboy hat she'd wanted, had taken the other 2 out for dinner, and offered her a breakfast sausage sandwich for dinner.

 

I don't expect it to change because he has been doing this for the last 2 years.... held the power of money over me, and is now turning it more on the kids. It's pretty sad when the 5yo says, "maybe when you get money we can buy the things for my snack for school?". You know, the snack stuff i gave HIM a shopping list for... and he's ignoring. That is the new thing too, ANYTHING for school just gets ignored.

 

I'm hoping his family reads this and sees all it is doing is hurting the KIDS, and i welcome the opportunity to talk about his actions in court.

 

ANYWAY.... i'm really happy that you have reached a point, and hope that it all continues to work out smoothly.

[kiana]

Very happy things are going more smoothly. Best wishes for the future.

[Scarlett]

I"m glad it is working out for the better.

 

I wish i could say that mine has reached any level of working together for the kids, but i don't think he has... in fact if anything, the money mind game crap is getting worse. He's moved on to buying them... they know i have no money, so they pester him until he buys them what they want. Meanwhile, i can't even provide food to them while we are out of town for a doctors appointment - yet like yesterday came home and he had bought DD2 a cowboy hat she'd wanted, had taken the other 2 out for dinner, and offered her a breakfast sausage sandwich for dinner.

 

I don't expect it to change because he has been doing this for the last 2 years.... held the power of money over me, and is now turning it more on the kids. It's pretty sad when the 5yo says, "maybe when you get money we can buy the things for my snack for school?". You know, the snack stuff i gave HIM a shopping list for... and he's ignoring. That is the new thing too, ANYTHING for school just gets ignored.

 

I'm hoping his family reads this and sees all it is doing is hurting the KIDS, and i welcome the opportunity to talk about his actions in court.

 

ANYWAY.... i'm really happy that you have reached a point, and hope that it all continues to work out smoothly.

 

:grouphug: I am so sorry. Of all my worries, money is not one of them right now and I know it must be really stressful.

 

Oh that is one of the things the instructor discussed last night. That both parents must be careful to not start trying to 'buy' the child. stbx and I discussed that further at dinner because he has done a fair amount of that this summer, with a movie every visit, going out to eat at nice places, buying toys....stbx says he knows that can't last (I had not complained about it at all summer) and he is going to work on that.

[jujsky]

Scarlett, I'm sorry you're going through this. I was a child of divorce, and my mom didn't handle it half as well as (it sounds like) you're handling it. She was very (rightfully) angry with my dad, but used the way he neglected and ignored my brother as a reason to hold onto that anger. He died a few years ago, and I thought that would be closure for her, but she's still angry at him and bad-mouths him whenever the opportunity arises. It sounds like you are truly doing the best you can for your son give the circumstances. You are in a difficult situation. I hope you have a strong support network around you because it is one of the most difficult situations a family can go through. :grouphug:

[Scarlett]

Scarlett, I'm sorry you're going through this. I was a child of divorce, and my mom didn't handle it half as well as (it sounds like) you're handling it. She was very (rightfully) angry with my dad, but used the way he neglected and ignored my brother as a reason to hold onto that anger. He died a few years ago, and I thought that would be closure for her, but she's still angry at him and bad-mouths him whenever the opportunity arises. It sounds like you are truly doing the best you can for your son give the circumstances. You are in a difficult situation. I hope you have a strong support network around you because it is one of the most difficult situations a family can go through. :grouphug:

 

Thank you! I have an awesome support network. More friends and family than I have to to keep up to date.

 

I was also a child of divorce and my brother suffered greatly too. He will be 40 this year and it took our dad moving near him for my brother to really realize what a total loser he is. He was only 3 when they split and he couldn't possibly understand what it was all about. Then my mom moved us 2500 miles away a few years later and my brother never got over it. Until now maybe. My mom worries she didn't do enough explaining to my brother as he got older. So no matter how we handle it there are always regrets.