What to do for highschool

[Jorsay]

My 10 year old is a competitive wrestler and well ahead of his grade level in academics (BTW: after failing kindergarten in public school). Because he is a wrestler, I want him to compete in high school. One problem is that he will be done with high school curriculum before he gets to high school. I certainly don't want to send him to college at 14 years old. Are there high schools that accommodate accelerated learners? Are there any with a highly competitive wrestling team? We are willing to move.

 

Does anyone know if I can put him on a private high school wrestling team but continue to home school him in CA?

[Laura Corin]

Can you take his curriculum broader and deeper so that he doesn't get so ahead and can still go to high school at the standard time? For example, rather than the standard lab science subjects, you could go into astronomy, geology..... Calvin is doing 18 months of intensive high school level classical civilisation (myth, literature, art and culture) before returning to standard history - there are many other such possibilities.

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

[KAR120C]

Can you take his curriculum broader and deeper so that he doesn't get so ahead and can still go to high school at the standard time?

 

This is what we're doing too. If we take advantage of the "extra" time to cover some of the things that generally don't get much attention in a regular school curriculum, then the PS won't be just a re-run of what's already done.

 

We're not planning on PS high school ourselves, but in case it happens anyway I'm leaving some "regular" topics for later. Math, for instance, I'm alternating "regular" and "extra" years (for instance: algebra then statistics, geometry then combinatorics, algebra 2 then number theory, precalculus then financial math, and calculus).

 

Literature I'm doing much more specific areas -- rather than "British Lit" we're doing just the Victorian Era. That means if he went to PS later, he could still take British Lit and not have read everything already... but he'll have plenty of challenge right now, too.

[Jorsay]

I don't think I could broaden his studies and still improve them.

 

I probably am guilty of over doing it with homeschooling, but my son is just so excited about excelling. It is not that he is genetically gifted, but he just has such a determination to achieve. He devours everything that I put in front of him.

 

Anyway, I think that his education thus far has been quite broad. I don't know how I would broaden it and still improve it.

 

----------------The following is me bragging about my son and can be skipped without loss of message content---------------------

 

We have watched the Teaching Company lectures on Prehistory, Western Civ I and II, Egypt, Mesopotamia, Old testament, New Testament, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Story of Language, Classical Physics, building Sentences, and Understanding Music. He read the entire bible. We did 1st through 6th grade singapore math. He is half way through Chemistry. He is half way through my old college ancient Greek text. He has read nearly the entire illustrated classics series. He does typing once a week and is at 30 wpm. He takes an art class once per week, which he loves. We have dabbled in South American and Asian History (Dabbled because I cannot find a good source). When we study a subject or read a novel, we watch movies and documentaries such as "The Ten Commandments", History channel videos, "Last of the Mohicans", "Apocalypto", and other Hollywood productions. All this, and he is a state and national champion wrestler. We work the entire week, but he plays on the weekends, no homework other than reading in the car if we are driving to a tournament.

 

--------------------------------------

 

Would you agree that this is broad enough?

 

My intention now is to move through history again at a slower pace. I want to have him learn Latin, Spanish, and perhaps Aramaic or Hebrew. It seems certain that he will be finished with Calculus by the end of 6th grade. We will be doing philosophy and formal logic this summer. My background is in science and he seems to have the knack and interest; he should be at a college level by the end of 6th grade.

 

His writing skills are comparatively weak, but we practice every week and they are probably above grade level.

 

His social skills (ability to communicate with his peers) are behind, but I don't know what to do about it. He plays well with his wrestling friends, but he seems to me to behave more mature but to be less adept at joking and goofing around.

 

Again, I do not think he is a child prodigy. He seems to me to be quite average in his ability to grasp new ideas (Except in science and math where he seems moderately above average.). However, he is abnormal in his inquisitive nature and his determination to improve himself.

 

Please tell me what you think. At 10 years old, should I send him to school dances to improve his social skills? I am not certain. More to the point, what do I do about high school?

[Laura Corin]

 

His writing skills are comparatively weak, but we practice every week and they are probably above grade level.

 

 

You mention that his writing skills are not quite at a level with his ability to comprehend. I do think that this is important: I didn't start to consider Calvin to be working at high school level until his output started to reach that level (in his case proved by excelling in a high school level exam last year).

 

So, if I were you, I would carry on giving him the wonderful broad education that he is receiving, allow him to burrow deep into subjects that fascinate him, and work on those writing skills so that he can display his impressive grasp of knowledge. If you have an eye on a high school, then see what the school doesn't offer and provide it in spades.

 

You might like, at this stage, to look into some kind of mentoring relationship for him, in an area that he passionately enjoys. He can use some of the time freed up by his being advanced to develop relationships that will be a real asset to him when the time comes for university applications.

 

Believe me, I do understand that there are some children who are ready for university early, but that doesn't seem to be the road you want to travel, so I'm just trying to suggest other paths.

 

ETA: for Asian history: I have an Amazon list for Chinese history here.

 

Best wishes

 

Laura

Edited May 31, 2009 by Laura Corin

[Brindee]

What Chemistry is he doing? DD has a large interest in Chemistry as well. She reads Chemistry stuff in her spare time for fun! She has trouble with grammar, though does fairly well with writing. We've done many of those same Teaching Company videos, she's doing Algebra 1 next year (after doing 2 years of pre-algebra stuff to broaden her knowledge base), she's done ASL, dabbled in Spanish, and has just started an "Organization" with a friend of hers, to help other kids who need help. They went and talked with a lady and ended up being accepted to be the fundraisers for a Playground for Autistic and special needs kids that will be a safe haven for them. It's a $30,000. project! They are meeting with this lady once a week or every other week, and learning so much about how to run a business like this, raise funds, and write grants! They're getting their highschool AND college economics courses in, that's for sure! :) She also volunteers at the local Humane Society. Maybe something like those would be of interest to him, and would certainly expand and broaden his knowledge! I totally agree that you've done a LOT, but I also think there is still SOOOOOOO much available, that you could do all sorts of things and still be broadening his knowledge and ability levels!

[Jorsay]

Both my kids (16 yo and 10 yo) are doing the Suchocki chemistry portion of Conceptual Integrated Science. It is a very good book thus far. Junior High to High School level I'd say. I sit and read the book to them sentence by sentence and we discuss it and do occasional experiments. My background is science. My plan is to follow up with Brown and Lemay (College Level - [the best in my opinion]) after he gets through bio and earth science at the same level (the rest of the book).

 

Volunteering certainly sounds useful; however, I feel that the time required would slow down his academics substantially. It seems to me that he would get a greater return for his time investment if he first learned some basic principles of economics.

 

I guess I look at it like the academics will lay the ground work for the more advanced stuff (advanced stuff being applied learning) like the business venture that your child is in. For instance, when I was a freshman in college I studied philosophy. I wrote a paper on the mind-body problem. In it I suggested that since light had no mass and still caused a reaction with the human body then an incorporeal spirit should be able to interact with a corporeal body as well. I spent a large amount of time and energy on that project. Without any real knowledge of science, I thought I had solved the mind body problem. Years later, after learning some science, I realized that my comparison demonstrated a complete ignorance of the science. Looking back, I feel like I really wasted my time.

 

I also feel that the more time spent (in terms of years) contemplating the more theoretical science and math, the greater the understanding achieved. After getting straight A's in college science, I began teaching college science and learned from my students' questions that I really didn't have a good grasp on the topics. I soon learned that many college professors understood them no better than I. It took years before I felt like I really understood the basics. Thus I want to expose my son to such concepts as entropy, limits, etc... as early as possible and allow him to struggle with them under my guidance over a period of years. If he leaves for college having just been exposed to them, it is quite likely that his professors (Even at the top schools) will not require much more than a cursory understanding.

 

So my dilemma remains. My son will need a good wrestling coach and team at the high school level, and I think he will be well beyond the academics of the high school.

[Nissi]

How about a Great Books Study as outlined in WTM? Has he done testing through a talent search program like Duke Tip, JHU, etc.? When he is done with highschool courses he could try some AP courses. There is also a huge number of electives he could take based on his interests like music, art, drama,creative writing, pottery, etc. Your child can explore everything from the comfort of your home and determine what he really wants to pursue for the future.

HTH!

[plansrme]

----------------The following is me bragging about my son and can be skipped without loss of message content---------------------

 

 

So nicely put.

 

We have a similar issue looming with my 11yo. My current plan isn't to send her to college early but, rather, to allow her to take her time through high school and concentrate either on high-level dance or gymnastics, whichever route she decides to go, or spend a semester going to school or volunteering in China to improve her fluency in Mandarin.

 

Terri

[Storm Bay]

In order to still be in high school for wrestling, there really is more to learn; there is never an end to learning. A wise man said, "It's what you learn after you think you know it all that really counts." ;)

 

How about Math. There is so much math and so little time. Aside from the race to get to Calculus, there are many other fields of math most dc never see in hs. There's a really cool list of books for advanced hs math students at the American Mathematical Society. Also, there is a huge difference between doing Algebraic equations and understanding the theory. How about going through Gelfand's Algebra? Even though the beginning is easy, there are problems in there that are challenging for those with degrees in math. If you go to the high school forum, you could ask people there; some of the parents there have had dc do all kinds of interesting math that most people don't see unless they major in math (I'm not talking about what some have called "engineering" math here.)

 

Also, comprehension is paramount; IMO it's the most important part of learning. You are doing a lot, but others have suggested some great things about great books, etc. Sudocki's Conceptual Chemistry is high school level and beyond, and can be followed by AP Chemistry when there's enough math. If you get the college edition of Hewitt's Conceptual Physics your dc will garner a fabulous understanding of Physics, and that could be followed with an AP Physics course when there's enough math.

[Donna]

My 13yo is a competitive wrestler and he is going to start school in the fall for 8th grade. I could have easily put him into 9th in the fall as he has completed over half of the highschool courses anyway but he is small for his age and needs the extra year of growing to even be heavy enough for high school wrestling so we are going by his birthday (late November) rather than his ability for school placement.

 

I have spoken to the school and the highest level they will offer him in the fall would be Algebra 1 which he completed 2 years ago. I have 2 unexplored options at the moment for math...afterschooling or see if once they do their placement testing they will allow him to pull out math and do it through CTY or Thinkwell which I will pay for if I have to.

 

I am not worried about his level in other subjects. There is always more to learn, deeper to go, etc... The school does have a gifted language arts program. I wouldn't send him to college full time at 14 or 15 anyway so we will just take each year as it comes. The high school will allow him to take college classes but that program might not start until 11th grade.

[Corraleno]

My 10 year old is a competitive wrestler and well ahead of his grade level in academics (BTW: after failing kindergarten in public school). Because he is a wrestler, I want him to compete in high school. One problem is that he will be done with high school curriculum before he gets to high school. I certainly don't want to send him to college at 14 years old. Are there high schools that accommodate accelerated learners? Are there any with a highly competitive wrestling team? We are willing to move.

 

Does anyone know if I can put him on a private high school wrestling team but continue to home school him in CA?

Have you asked the local high schools if they allow part-time enrollment? I don't know about CA, but in my district (in NM) you only need to take 3 classes (considered half-time) to count as a student and be eligible for all student services -- and those can be ANY three classes (e.g art, music, PE). They also allow homeschooled students to participate in one extra-curricular activity or sport (band, football, etc). I believe many states/districts have similar provisions; have you checked if that is possible at a school near you?

 

Jackie

[Storm Bay]

Have you asked the local high schools if they allow part-time enrollment?

Jackie

 

 

In our state, the MIAA rules allow homeschoolers to compete without attending ps as long as they compete with a team in the school district where they are registered as homeschoolers. Of course you have to clear it with the coach, etc, but it's been successfully done here. But you do have to be registered as a high school student even if you're dual enrolled with a CC, etc.

[Nan in Mass]

I think we can do this, too. It would definately be worth checking out. Also, if you are thinking to slow your son down, I'd look at extra languages and musical instruments. I, too, go by output for high school, so if it isn't high school level output, I don't count it as high school. Just in case it helps GRIN. You might look for posts by Jenny in Florida. She has children who were doing high school level output well before high school.

[Jorsay]

In my district we must be enrolled in the "Plublic Homeschooling" program in order to compete on a team. At the high school level, the Red tape involved is so time consuming as to be disruptive to the kids' learning. Instead, like most CA home schoolers, I have just registered my own private school.

 

Also, the wrestling team in our district is simply not competitive enough for my son. Sadly, in wrestling, you need a practice partner of comparable ability or you cannot stay competitive. The better you get, the more difficult it is to find a partner and a program.

 

I was hoping to find a private school with a good wrestling team and perhaps enroll in a class or two so that my son could wrestle. I just don't know if this is possible in CA.

 

I have even thought about moving to Eastern PA or Blairstown NJ. Even such a move won't solve my problem with academics.

 

BTW, I really appreciate your suggestions, however, I hope the answer is not for me is to slow his education so that he can sit in relatively slow paced high school classes. What I mean is that I believe that a high school calculus class, for instance, will take a year to teach him what he can probably learn in a few months at home with me. Also, if he learns calculus in 6th grade, it will allow him a far greater understanding of so many things he can then study in the next 6 years from 7th to 12th grade, just as science allows for a greater understanding of philosophy, history of politics, a foreign language of linguistics, and so on. If I wait until he is a senior in high school before he studies calculus, I will only be able to teach him science at a superficial level; without a superficial understanding of science, our exploration of philosophy will be little more than mental gymnastics practice. The chance for us to explore these topics together in a meaningful way will be lost. Instead, he will be introduced to these topics in college, where I can say from experience as a college student and as one who has taught College students that they can not and will not be addressed in the depth they require.

 

In short, it is my opinion that broadening my son's curriculum would come at the price of depth of study. That is why I say that I believe it is sufficiently broad as it is and I do not think I could broaden it and still improve it. Instead, I think I need a wrestling team for my son where I can still home school him.

 

Your comments have helped me come to this decision. I appreciate them.

Edited June 3, 2009 by Jorsay

[iwka]

I have no clue if that would suit your needs, but this is an option:

http://www.classicalliberalarts.com/

classical (really classical) studies online including college prep

[kiana]

Respectfully, although I concur with your decision -- I suggest that you should consider this article as well:

 

http://www.artofproblemsolving.com/Resources/AoPS_R_A_Calculus.php

 

You may also want to consider choosing courses designed for gifted children, with problems designed to make them think harder, faster, deeper, and understand the material better, rather than simply accelerating him faster through coursework designed for average children.

Many modern math courses focus more on computation and pattern-matching than on actually understanding the material. The modern calculus course is a pale shadow of what it could actually be, given a capable student.

[Laura Corin]

Respectfully, although I concur with your decision -- I suggest that you should consider this article as well:

 

http://www.artofproblemsolving.com/Resources/AoPS_R_A_Calculus.php

 

 

Laura

[Jorsay]

I don't think this article applies to most home schoolers.

 

The article takes issue with "rushing through the standard curriculum is not the best answer"

 

This statement confuses finishing the standard curriculum at an early age with "rushing" through the standard curriculum. I, for one (and my assumption is like most with this problem), have not, in any sense, 'rushed' my son through any math. We have not skipped anything. On the contrary, we have done nearly every single problem in any book that we have chosen as our main source. We spend time applying concepts and relating them to things outside the book. We have studied and done problems from outside sources such as Euclids Elements and other historical sources. My son is not ahead because the math is too easy and we are trying to skip through until he is challenged; instead, my son is ahead because he is interested, and a hard worker and because we have moved carefully through the basics to ensure a deep understanding.

 

Also notice this statement:

 

"...the standard curriculum is not designed for the top students. This is even, if not especially, true for the core calculus curriculum found at most high schools, community colleges, and universities."

 

I agree with this statement, but my son, and most likely yours, is home schooled in order to avoid a 'standard' curriculum. Our curriculum is customized for our own top student.

 

"Rather than learning more and more tools, avid students are better off learning how to take tools they have and apply them to complex problems."

 

I think that if you are home schooling, and not already teaching how to apply the learning, then you are missing the point. Given this, it is important to continue to learn more and more tools.