Any farm families sending kids away to college? (Open for input from others too!)

[Julie in CA]

My ds(18) has just graduated from our homeschool. He's already earned about 40 credits from the local community college though dual enrollment. Our plan was for him to continue toward either an AA from the local community college and then choose a career path, or for him to get an AA and then transfer to another school, probably a state college where he could also stay at home through school.

 

This kid does his schoolwork half-heartedly, and his gpa for college is about 2.8 without much effort. He works on the farm appx. 20 hrs. per week, though he's not really paid much--about the equivalent of $100 per month.

 

I've suddenly realized that I think he should go away for college. Not far away, just enough that he'd live in dorms during the week but still come home for the weekends (about a 1 1/2 hr drive). He would still be able to see his friends, go to church and worship together as a family as we've always done. I think that being away from family, girlfriend, farm work, and other distractions during the week will help him to apply himself to his schoolwork more effectively. As long as he's home, he's doing farm work. Going to stay at school frees him from that obligation. Short of actually being gone, he *will be required* to work on the farm. My dh is one of seven brothers, all farm families, and all of the boys work for their dads. My ds is the very first one who will depart from that path. It's a long story, but we just aren't able to support him and (hopefully) his future family on our farm.

 

I've written this long, rambling post, and I'm not sure what I'm asking.

Maybe I'm wondering if it really will be easier for him to apply himself to school if he's not here working at the same time. Will he be bored enough without all of his usual pursuits and distractions, that he'll work harder on schoolwork by default?

Things have been mildly strained between us for about a month, though his behavior is normal for a kid that age and we're still relatively close. He's trying to find some independence that I just don't think he'll find here. I also don't want him to have the impression that I'm wanting him to go away simply because he's a bit harder to enjoy lately...:001_unsure:

We've always assumed that our dc would stay with us until they formed a family of their own, or until they had to go in order to follow their career. That's how it was in my family, and that's how it was in dh's family.

I dunno, maybe it's just that he's my oldest out of the five kids, but I just feel really unequipped to deal with figuring out the best option for him now.

 

If you've read my rambling thoughts on this, I thank you.

If you have advice or thoughts I should consider, I'd appreciate that too.

If you have a traditional farm family and know what I'm going through, I'd especially love to hear your input, since I think that lifestyle is pretty integral in this situation.

Thanks.

[Starr]

Julie, I'm sorry, this sounds tough for you. It sounds like he could do very well in school with a little more application. It might be easier if he goes away but there are many distractions at school as well. We know many farm families and dc have done many different things. It's hard to convince an 18 year old that what he does now will make a difference in his future. I'm sending you prayer and moral support.

[Nan in Mass]

We're not a farm family, but I definately think you should send your son away for at least part of college. We recently watched a relative try college from home and fail, partly due to the distractions of living at home. Fortunately, he has a second chance and this time, everyone is working hard to get him into the dorms. There is nothing to guarantee that he will do better living at the school, but his failure the first time round got us all talking about college and the advantages and disadvantages of living at home, and the extended family concensus was that almost all of us wouldn't have been able to do it. We were young and not 100% motivated when we were going to college and it was easier to do it in a bunch with others doing the same thing. Yes, there are distractions and temptations living at college, and yes, we worry about them a lot, but you are surrounded and supported by other students who are also juggling the same set of distractions. You are all supposed to be doing the same thing - putting your studies first. When you live there, it is easier for that to stay seeming the most important thing. If you live at home, other matters intrude, very important ones, ones that are hard to over-ride, like the well-fare of your family. You may be socializing with friends who don't have the same priorities and obligations. Also, college is about more than just the classes and the studying. Lots of other learning goes on - learning to live with a room mate, getting to know a few prof's who are passionate about what they are doing, joining clubs and getting to try some things that you normally wouldn't be able to try (I tried spelunking LOL - never again - but I learned a lot about myself). You get to know people from other places and learn something about what it is like to live in those places. You have someone to discuss your new knowledge and ideas with, eating together in commons.

 

I love our community college and I think it serves a very, very important function, but if you can afford to have a child go away to college for at least part of the time, I think it is worthwhile.

 

Just my opinion...

-Nan

[Julie in CA]

I love our community college and I think it serves a very, very important function, but if you can afford to have a child go away to college for at least part of the time, I think it is worthwhile.

 

-Nan

Nan, thank you so much for the input. Do you think that it's worthwhile even if it's a community college dorm and not a high-powered college or university? We cannot afford anything other than community college, and don't want any of our dc saddled with student loans. There is a cc about 1 1/2 hrs away that has dorms. It also offers more academic options than our close cc.

[Nan in Mass]

Yes. He'll just have to pick his friends a little more carefully. The fact that it is affordable and easy to get into wil mean that some students will be just because they are immature and need a waiting place, not because they really want to study. But there will also be lots of people who do indeed want to be there. He just might have to look a little harder to find them. I still think he will gain from living away for a bit, and find it easier to study.

[ChrisN in NY]

We are not a "farm family," but 2nd ds has loved cows his whole life and worked on a dairy farm for almost five years.

 

He just finished his freshman year at a SUNY agricultural school about 3 1/2 hours from home. He is in a two-year Dairy Production and Management program.

 

He did come home some weekends to work on the farm, but is hoping to find a job at or close to school as soon as he goes back in September.

The school isn't as cheap as CC, but CC doesn't offer ag courses.

 

Ds2 wasn't and isn't a terribly academic kid. He's smart and capable, but much prefers to be outside, than inside, and doing something than sitting.

 

He took CC courses his senior year at home for any required courses; he got tired of dealing with me. He did well enough for himself, but didn't really apply himself.

 

He is doing well enough for himself at the SUNY school. He could get straight A's with reasonable effort, but he's not interested in all A's.

 

He is paying for school himself. He has to maintain a mininum GPA for us to continue paying for his cell phone (part of our family plan) and help him with his car insurance.

 

Oh, and he HATES all the drama at school. Instead of living on campus in the fall, he and a couple friends are renting a house. It's also cheaper.

 

Does this help?

[Nan in Mass]

My oldest did plumbing for 3 years before going to college. He's just finishing his freshman year. He was used to working and found it hard not to have a job. Fortunately, his college gathered up all the freshman who weren't in a sport and set them to work helping out one weekend and that turned into a job offer at the restaurant in the bottom of his dorm. It isn't much, but it sucks up some of his free time and makes him happier. You might think about an on-campus job if your son is finding it hard to transition from working and studying, to just studying. Also, encourage him to sign up for clubs and sports. Our CC doesn't have sports teams, but there are intramural sports. For an outdoorsy student, outing club is a good bet, or sometimes there is a search-and-rescue team. Clubs are a way to meet other students who are alive and enthusiastic about something, not just waiting to be grown up.

 

-Nan

[Jackie in NE]

My dc aren't old enough yet to be looking at college, but I have been thinking about this quite a bit.

 

I was raised on a ranch, and I couldn't wait to get away. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely loved the ranch (still do), but I just wanted something different for a while. I went away (6 hr. drive) to Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo, and was glad I did. Incidentally, I really missed the ranch while I was at college. But when I completed college and came home, it was obvious that there wasn't "room" for me there, financially.

 

My older brother has since taken over the ranch. He chose to forego college. He is very bright, and he would have loved college. But he is also happy farming and ranching.

 

My dc all LOVE the ranch that dh and I are building. But truly, it can't even support one family...... there will not be room financially for all of them to stay. Dh and I will require all of them to gain an education (hopefully college, but maybe vocational training) past high school. My oldest dd, though she wants to be a hermit, also has dreams of attending a private liberal arts college because of her love of literature and language.... (Can you spell "she'll have to get a full ride"?)

 

My point, in all this rambling, is that the farm life, though so rich and rewarding, does not, imho, reflect the real world. How will my dc be able to support their own families? It literally takes generations to get a ranch to the point where the dc can stay and make a living. Perhaps your family is already at that point.

 

All of this to say.... I would strongly encourage my dc to get away from the ranch, at least for a while. No work. Just thinking about other options. Even if they're dead certain that the ranch is where they want to be forever. The time away might turn out to be a waste, but at least you'll know for sure. For myself, I believe it is my responsibility to give my dc many options. Who knows what will happen???

 

HTH in some way.....:confused:

[Julie in CA]

My dc all LOVE the ranch that dh and I are building. But truly, it can't even support one family...... there will not be room financially for all of them to stay. Dh and I will require all of them to gain an education (hopefully college, but maybe vocational training) past high school.

 

My point, in all this rambling, is that the farm life, though so rich and rewarding, does not, imho, reflect the real world. How will my dc be able to support their own families? It literally takes generations to get a ranch to the point where the dc can stay and make a living. Perhaps your family is already at that point.

 

My dh's family has been in dairy farming for...well, ever. Many, many generations. The way it worked out though, was that my dh is one of 7 brothers. In order to establish dairies for his sons, my fil partnered 2 boys on each dairy, built over years. My dh and his brother are partners on the dairy, and bil has two sons that are already in their 20's. Simply by being older than my boys, the nephews got the only jobs available, and even that is going to be a stretch that might break us. Bil never considered having it any other way. Now his sons are getting married, and dh and I can't figure out how we will possibly support 4 families on the same income that we've been supporting 2 in the past. I'm trying not to be bitter about it, but I'm saddened by the fact that my boys never had a chance to be dairymen, but the cousins will. Financially, there's no way we can go out on our own, either. It literally takes millions$.

Dh and I have emphasized to the boys that even though they're living this lifestyle now, that they need to find their own way in the world, get the education, and find a vocation or career of their own. They have the skills and experience to be dairy farmers, but we can't give them the opportunity.

My boys work on the farm 7 days a week, and I think that ds#1 won't be able to make the break unless he's living away during college. The expectation is that he'll be working on the dairy as long as he's home, but I think that's just making it impossible for him to apply himself to getting the education he needs.

Thanks for your perspective on this. It's difficult to be a farm family in our country right now.

[Jackie in NE]

My dh's family has been in dairy farming for...well, ever. Many, many generations. The way it worked out though, was that my dh is one of 7 brothers. In order to establish dairies for his sons, my fil partnered 2 boys on each dairy, built over years. My dh and his brother are partners on the dairy, and bil has two sons that are already in their 20's. Simply by being older than my boys, the nephews got the only jobs available, and even that is going to be a stretch that might break us. Bil never considered having it any other way. Now his sons are getting married, and dh and I can't figure out how we will possibly support 4 families on the same income that we've been supporting 2 in the past. I'm trying not to be bitter about it, but I'm saddened by the fact that my boys never had a chance to be dairymen, but the cousins will. Financially, there's no way we can go out on our own, either. It literally takes millions$.

Dh and I have emphasized to the boys that even though they're living this lifestyle now, that they need to find their own way in the world, get the education, and find a vocation or career of their own. They have the skills and experience to be dairy farmers, but we can't give them the opportunity.

My boys work on the farm 7 days a week, and I think that ds#1 won't be able to make the break unless he's living away during college. The expectation is that he'll be working on the dairy as long as he's home, but I think that's just making it impossible for him to apply himself to getting the education he needs.

Thanks for your perspective on this. It's difficult to be a farm family in our country right now.

I am sorry for your boys. It sounds like the dairy business is the life they love. And speaking from personal experience, it is HARD to think about doing something else, when you're working 24/7 at something you love. I always used to think... "something will work out. I'll get to stay in ranching somehow..." But the economics, as you know, are brutal. The only way to be able to stay is through off-farm income. And frankly, that is tough on families, especially if you have values like homeschooling.

 

I so understand where you're coming from. I have this real love/hate thing going on right now with respect to ranching. We have literally sunk every. single. penny. into a ranch that will not be able to support a family for probably 30 years. There will be no retirement. Dh says "we've got to start somewhere".

 

Are there absentee owners in the dairy business? I know that we considered that route (working for an absentee owner) in the ranching, just so that we could have the livestyle that we loved. But we couldn't get around the fact that we wouldn't be "building" anything for the next generation. We also realize that we're probably much too opinionated and headstrong to not be making ALL the decisions ourselves, lol. You HAVE to be headstrong to be in this business.

 

I wish I had a good answer for you. I wish you had one for me, lol. I think you mentioned that your ds is studying dairy science? or a related field? At least then he'll get to hang around the industry he loves and has a lifetime of skills in.

 

Blessings, Jackie

[Nan in Mass]

Hugs Julie. I think if I could change one thing and one thing only about this country it would be the farming. It is so fundamental and it is so messed up right now. Your situation sounds like Puss in Boots.

[Julie in CA]

Are there absentee owners in the dairy business? I know that we considered that route (working for an absentee owner) in the ranching, just so that we could have the livestyle that we loved. But we couldn't get around the fact that we wouldn't be "building" anything for the next generation.

 

Well, there are jobs where ds could be a foreman on someone else's dairy, but there's not really a good future in that either. The salaries are not usually high enough to support a family and/or save anything at all for retirement, and it's a job with no pension plan. The building for the next generation has been long gone, because of the taxation that occurs even after death. In a country that gripes about "factory farming", I find it amazing how difficult it's been made for family farms to get by {but that's another post altogether! :D}

Thanks for the encouragement and thoughtful perspective. :001_smile:

[Julie in CA]

I appreciate your sympathy. I'm just having a pity party right now that I don't usually indulge in. Overall, I really shouldn't be complaining. We have a better lifestyle than most folks I know, and our income has been comfortable in the past, though not quite so much now, and probably very much worse as the nephews marry. My kids will make their way in the world {even if I have to shove them half the way there! ;) }

[outtamyshell]

Julie,

 

Please forgive me if this sounds both bold and ignorant. That really is a dangerous combination that I will try to avoid. Our backgrounds are very different and so my interpreation of your posts may be way off base.

 

From your posts it sounds like your boys have no future in farming, but they are expected to work the farm 7 days a week if they are home. I can't imagine a better environment than a farm to raise young boys into men. But at some point their full time job has to be preparing for their futures. That's going to be a difficult transition for them if the farm family life is all they know and they still have obligations there. I would try to release them from their farming obligations and help them focus on their futures as soon as it makes sense for them.

 

So my vote is to encourage them to go away to college to help them transition into figuring out what's next for them. See my disclaimer in the first paragraph to see how much my vote counts for :001_smile:. A community college can offer a lot of academic and vocational training options. I wouldn't discount the benefit for them simply because it's not a University. I imagine it's going to be an emotional transition as well as an academic/social one - especially if all of their family heritage is in farming and all their role models are in farming.

 

Best of luck. I have faith that you'll figure out what's the best fit for your family. It's nice to talk to friends and family and read posts on boards like this. But the real answer will come from your gut. Trust it.

[Caroline]

My dad grew up on a farm, went away to college and then worked for the Department of Agriculture his entire career. We do still own our family farm. My dad and grandma manage it. It has been in the family since the Revolution. But currently, no one lives on our farm.

 

So, my dad who grew up milking cows, making hay, and other farm stuff (I was raised in the city) ended up in agriculture, but in a different way.

[ChrisN in NY]

Julie,

 

I'm realizing that I didn't read your original post very carefully, and I apologize for that.

 

I'm sorry for the situation your family is in with the farm and wish it could be more equitable for you.

 

I don't know what the financial aspects of farming are there in CA, nor do I know how large the farm is (which makes a difference). All the dairy farmers we've gotten to know here in NY have either smaller "family" farms with the wife having a job off the farm, or the farms are larger, with employees, but the members of all the families also work at the farm.

 

My second son has loved cows his whole life, and like I said, is attending a SUNY ag school to major in Dairy Production and Management. He's been working on a family farm for almost 5 years. The farm is run by a father (nearing 60yo) and son (early 30's, with a young family of his own). As long as we've known them, they've had teen boys working for them as well with varying hours. The guys are beginning to plan for when my ds is graduated, and begin (and expand) his ownership interest and financial responsibility there. They are talking about building another barn and growing their herd to support the son and MY son as the father lessens his work hours, semi-retiring. Nothing is in concrete at this point, but if it is possible for this to work out for my ds, something will work out for yours as well.

 

We've seen a number of farm kids go to college, only to end up with a different major and a different career, and others who said they didn't want to farm come back to it.

 

:grouphug:

[Julie in CA]

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[willowcreek]

I understand the dilemma. Big long whine--sorry--I worked with small farmers in KY prior to my life as a mom, trying to help them diversity and hang on despite the difficulties for famliy farms. Today, I have three sons and am married to a banker--who wanted to be a farmer. We have a farm 20 miles from our home that has been in his family for generations--but it was in Alabama, which meant cows and pine trees where the owners sat back and really poor tenants worked the farm. Now all that is gone (thankfully--as that was always exploitive) except for the 90 yo man who still lives there and we see about him in his old age (doesn't want to leave--only home he has ever known).

 

My husband grew up off the farm--designated to grow up and be a banker, but he really wanted to farm. Today, he spends every off hour working on the farm (we need to make a beef cattle operation profitable-ha!) because we need the income--to maintain the land we are now responsible for, to cover the loss of my income and my healthcare costs (I have MS). Now owning the land is a cost--maintaining it responsibly.

 

We have sunk everything in making that work somehow, and we hope there is an opportunity for one of our sons someday. My middle guy would love to farm, but at this point I am pointing him to large animal vet school or some professional ag field (we live in town with a big land grant university) just so he can have a professional salary and stay close to farming and subsidize and build our farming operation.

 

It is a hard, sad dilemma for farmers. I think trying to find a farm-related technical or professional career path may be a way to think about it. Best hopes..