Which history/science program is easier to combine....HOD or MFW

[cam112198]

I am making plans for next year and trying to plan ahead. Right now I am only homeschooling 1 child, but eventually it will be 4. I am expecting baby #4 in December. :001_smile:

We send our children to preschool (which also includes kindergarten).

 

I was wondering which program would be easier to combine the children down the road.....HOD or MFW? I have ordered HOD just to take a look at and I like the looks of it, but can't imagine doing 3 programs! I took a peek at MFW at the convention in Atlanta and I really liked the looks of it too. The lady at the booth made it sound like the younger kids could just tag along with MFW.

 

Or maybe it's best just to stick with SOTW? Would it be easier to combine? I was just excited about what HOD and MFW would be studying for 2nd grade and I like that the bible is integrated.

 

Here's what my next couple of years would look like:

2nd grader

 

3rd grader

 

1st grader

4th grader

 

1st grader

2nd grader

5th grader

 

2nd

3rd

6th

 

3rd

4th

7th

 

1st

4th

5th

8th

 

 

and so on......

 

Maybe I shouldn't think so far ahead.....I was just trying to choose something and stick with it.

 

Any suggestions would be great! :001_smile:

[Tree House Academy]

I can't speak to MFW, but with HOD, I would not combine all three kids in the same manual at any point. I would start 2nd grader (probably in Beyond) and then keep her on her own schedule. Your two kids that are only 1 grade apart can likely do the same level....so I would start in Little Hearts or even Little Hands with them when the oldest (of your two younger) starts K and the youngest is Pre-K age.

 

That will put you using 2 manuals at a time, but that is what we are doing (along with MANY others) and it is not difficult at all.

[Tabrett]

MFW is designed to combine 2-8th grade. K and 1 are individual programes because they are designed around teaching your dc to read. After you dc finnishes 1, they join older sibblings in the 5 year cycle. After the cycle is complete, you start the cycle again. Year 4 and 5 have a 2-3rd grade supplement. There is a science supplement for 7-8th graders. You choose you own Math and LA. There is a opptional level for 2-3rd graders called Adventures. Adventures is used if you oldest child is in 2nd or 3rd grade.

[Avila]

I agree with Tree House Academy. With HOD, by the time you have to add in the third program, your oldest child should be working independently, and it should be very managable.

 

Just to point out though, with MFW, you would also be running at least two programs until your oldest three children are 2nd grade and above because MFW has separate programs for K and 1st. The only year you use their "2nd grade" program Adventues is after the 1st grade program for your oldest, so you could do that in 3rd with your oldest next year, or skip Adventures completely and just start in the cycle with ECC. It looks like the only year you would get to combine all the kids is when the oldest is in 6th (and 7th if your last one is going to a brick and mortar K), and the oldest is moving into the separate high school program.

 

I think combining with the age range you have is going to be a challenge in any program you pick. The middle two are your best bet. The oldest and youngest are going to require their own programs most of the time to really meet their needs, IMO.

 

Good luck and best wishes!

Edited May 16, 2009 by Asenik

[Julie in MN]

Of course, life will happen and everything may not turn out as you planned, but just for fun... If you used MFW, here's what combining the grades you listed would look like:

 

2nd grader Adventures

 

3rd graderECC

 

1st grader1st grade for language arts & math

4th graderCTG - could include 1st grader in fun stuff

 

1st grader1st grade for language arts & math

2nd grader2 kids in RTR - could include 1st grader in fun stuff

5th grader

 

2nd3 kids in EX1850

3rd

6th

 

3rd3 kids in 1850MOD

4th

7th

 

1st1st grade for language arts & math

4th3 kids cycle back to do ECC - could include 1st grader in fun stuff

5th

8th

 

 

and so on......one kid off to high school, 3 kids in CTG

[Michelle My Bell]

The lady at the booth made it sound like the younger kids could just tag along with MFW

 

"tag along" is the key word here. I used MFW for a couple of years and found that the lessons were just tag alongs not really all that in depth or very absorbing for my younger kids. I am currently using HOD at the correct age levels for my children and they are getting really great, age appropriate lessons. They also don't take all day so it is not like I am schooling all day. HOD incorporates more independent work in their older guides so it isn't all on you.

 

I would encourage you to really consider HOD if your goal is to really have the full benefits of homeschooling your younger children. If you are really relaxed in your schooling for younger kids (which isn't a bad thing) then I don't think it would be a big deal to go ahead with MFW.

 

God Bless,

Michelle

[MamaAkins]

From personal experience, I found it hard to combine kids in MFW. I know it's designed for large families with multiple ages, but I found that it was usually too easy for the older, too hard for the younger, etc. We have since switched to Mystery of History.

[Julie in MN]

"tag along" is the key word here. I used MFW for a couple of years and found that the lessons were just tag alongs not really all that in depth or very absorbing for my younger kids.

 

Ouch. That is taking "tag along" to a whole different realm!

 

I have never taught a half dozen kids, so I'm just commenting as an outside observer. But it seems to me that if you have lots of children, you have to make choices. You can't do everything and do it well.

 

It sounds like HOD is choosing to have parents guide children in early elementary and then have children teach themselves about the Bible and history of the world at the older elementary ages.

 

MFW chooses to keep the parent involved in guiding all children through Bible & interpreting history through the middle years. This logically will mean more time with older kids, who are absorbing more. But parent involvement also provides opportunity for teaching in more ways than a child could do on his own. Sometimes it's nice when older kids get to listen to young books, and vice versa. Doing activities as a family is something my youngest son could only dream of!

 

MFW also encourages 2nd graders to have more free time in their day than it sounds like Michelle wanted. (Of course, at my house, that would be guided by activities I chose or at least allowed during school time.)

 

But children will always be doing language arts and math at their own special level, whatever program you choose. MFW would invite them to join in their family learning time for studying the Bible and the history of the world wherever they are at, and hopefully provide plenty of engaging methods of teaching to draw them in to some of it.

 

Choices, choices, choices... :tongue_smilie:

[In the Rain]

I don't think the author of HOD encourages combining ages.

 

I didn't see it mentioned here, but I have heard from friends that it is better to teach to the younger child and add material for the older. Adding quality books seems easier than watering down ideas for younger kids.

[Donna A.]

I don't think the author of HOD encourages combining ages.

 

I didn't see it mentioned here, but I have heard from friends that it is better to teach to the younger child and add material for the older. Adding quality books seems easier than watering down ideas for younger kids.

 

The term "better" is relative and depends entirely on the uniqueness of each individual family.

 

The term "watering down" is also putting it VERY poorly. Nothing is "watered down". Hardly! We've been using MFW for a few years now, and if anything, I find that I have to make choices about what to skip most weeks! We also have many, many choices from the Book Basket (in the back of the TM) to pick and choose from for each level of reading and comprehension in our family, from youngest to adult. And the weekly lessons include a variety of reading and hands-on assignments that you can choose from for each child to participate in. MFW is actually very flexible, and Marie, who has raised 6 children (I think the youngest is now 14?), intended that flexibility when she wrote the program.

 

I could not combine if I wanted to use HOD with our whole family. Even if I had children close in age together, I'd likely have to have separate TMs because of the individual levels of the 3 R's. I have a friend whose 3 children are 9, 10 and 11, and she'd have to have 3 different TMs even if she combined them in history. And even in history, she could only combine the two oldest because the comprehension level is way above the 9yo's head (she has LD's). So that's something you'll have to consider from year to year if you go with HOD.... it's not just a matter of combining history and science, but their skill levels, too. The placement chart on the HOD website shows that. This sounds nice to be able to "individualize" (one of HOD's big selling points), and I actually considered it because of my children's age differences. But then I realized that I'm already individualizing because each child does their own level of math and LA no matter what, and having just ONE program to use with the whole family in all the other subjects makes things a lot simpler.

 

So with MFW, you use ONE program for the entire family (after 1st grade) for Bible, history, science, music, and *possibly* art. You simply adapt the amount of reading and the notebooking & activities to each child's ability. It's really not that hard, once you get to know the level at which each child is able to work. There's a learning curve at the beginning, certainly. There was a time in the beginning when I felt like I was doing it wrong, but I've been amazed at how much the younger girls have remembered, and even the youngest blew me away when she "caught" the ending of one of our heavier read-alouds (The Bronze Bow).

 

IOW, if I feel the need to individualize one child's education more so than the others, I can do that, and still keep the others together. This primarily happens at the beginning when you have one in the learning-to-read stage, and it happens again later when you have one in high school. That's just part of the natural growth process.

[cam112198]

Thank you so much ladies!! You guys are awesome!! I'm still not sure what I'm doing, but your input has really helped. And thanks Julie in MN for filling in all the programs with MFW for me! I might just need to order MFW to take a look at it and go from there.

[Michelle My Bell]

It sounds like HOD is choosing to have parents guide children in early elementary and then have children teach themselves about the Bible and history of the world at the older elementary ages.

 

Actually, not really. Bible is always woven with history and is taught by the parent, but there are devotional type activities in addition to the regular bible included for older children to do on their own. HOD actually has about 1/3 together 1/3 semi-independent and 1/3 independent in their new guide.

 

MFW chooses to keep the parent involved in guiding all children through Bible & interpreting history through the middle years.

 

HOD does this as well.

 

MFW also encourages 2nd graders to have more free time in their day than it sounds like Michelle wanted. (Of course, at my house, that would be guided by activities I chose or at least allowed during school time.)

 

Not trying to be agumentative, but HOD also has this feature in their program. The younger programs only take about 2 hours a day to complete. The author follows the Charlotte Mason method of short lessons and free afternoons. I would say even more so than MFW does. MFW is more classical than Charlotte Mason.

 

 

Michelle

[Michelle My Bell]

 

I could not combine if I wanted to use HOD with our whole family. Even if I had children close in age together, I'd likely have to have separate TMs because of the individual levels of the 3 R's.

 

I am currently combining my 6 year old and my 9 year old in Bigger and it is going great. They do their own language arts and math, but other than slight modifications (expecting less writing for instance) I don't change the program for my younger daughter.

 

I plan on combining my 12 & 15 year old daughters next year in the same program and once again, expecting different levels of language arts and math.

 

Michelle

[Julie in MN]

I hope the original poster will forgive this digression...

 

Michelle,

I was just responding to your original statement

HOD incorporates more independent work in their older guides so it isn't all on you.

But now you are saying

Actually, not really. Bible is always woven with history and is taught by the parent, but there are devotional type activities in addition to the regular bible included for older children to do on their own. HOD actually has about 1/3 together 1/3 semi-independent and 1/3 independent in their new guide.

 

I'm just trying to wrap my mind around the differences, since this comes up so often. I still stand by my statement that each program must make choices. I described what choices I feel MFW makes. Now I'm trying to figure out what HOD has chosen instead, especially in a large family -- since the whole "tag along" issue was the original topic.

 

So I've looked at "prepared" and that seems to be about grades 4-6. My son used CTG in 4th. So can you help me compare these 2, for my own brain as well as others who might want to decide between 2 good, solidly Biblical programs?

 

 

1. The first comparison seems to be time spent with individual children vs. tagging along, & I'm totally confused. In MFW, I was saying that each child has their own language arts and math, but Bible & History are done as a family and they choose to gear it more towards the older kids, who need to start learning more depth and have more conversation with mom. So in CTG, there would be individual language arts/math/foreign language, and the together part of the day would look like this:

 

- Bible 20 minutes (we did this in the evening with dad)

- History time 30 minutes (some of CTG was Bible & done with above, some more independent notebooking, & some projects as a group)

- Book basket 15 minutes (individual time to delve into all topics)

- Greek roots, science, art, & music would be done together on some days for a total of 15-60 minutes

- So, I'd say the MFW family would spend 1.5 to 2 hours together each day. The 2nd graders would probably go play after 30 minutes, and the 3rd graders might last an hour. I'm just guessing.

 

 

As for the HOD day, you said there is more independence with olders, so the parent isn't teaching everything individually to every child, but then you added the 1/3 things & the fact that it's shorter. Now I'm picturing the parent & say 3 kids spending those 2 hours in this way instead:

 

- parent spends the whole time with the 2nd grader - is Bible/history only about 15 minutes for this child?

- parent spends half time with the 3rd grader? is it 10 min. with parent & 10 on own for history/Bible?

- parent spends 1/3 time with the 4th grader - is this 10 min with parent, 10 semi and 10 independent?

- parent checks all the different independent work & works with the semi-independent work somewhere in there, so there is more time spent but not a total of 1.5 to 2 hours, with more time for nature walks in the afternoon ala Charlotte Mason?

- not sure how to write in science, & extras like art & music

 

 

2. The second comparison seems to be whether little ones should read long excerpts from the Bible, or do short devotionals. I guess am very classical in terms of reading the actual Bible, so I choose CTG. Since "prepared" goes through the entire history of the world plus old & new testaments in one year, and since I looked at a sample week that says it's about "creation to noah" but has readings from the New Testament (Ephesians) and Psalms, I am assuming that the Bible study is more of a devotional and that's what you prefer for your 4th graders? Is that a good comparison?

 

 

3. The third comparison on another thread was projects not needing any supplies. I always assume that means the HOD "projects" would be with paper, such as crossword puzzles or coloring? Would that be accurate?

 

 

Can you think of any other really specific comparisons?

Edited May 17, 2009 by Julie in MN

[HollyinNNV]

 

 

3. The third comparison on another thread was projects not needing any supplies. I always assume that means the HOD "projects" would be with paper, such as crossword puzzles or coloring? Would that be accurate?

 

 

 

 

I will only speak to this point. You are not accurate in your assumption. The projects require common household supplies. We haven't done one coloring page or crossword puzzle. I have also never made a trip to the grocery/craft store to obtain supplies for any of our projects (oops-I lied-I did get chow mein noodles one week-sorry). Carrie, the author, has outdone herself in this particular area. The projects are fun and easy to implement. They are directly related to whatever you are studying.

 

Some of the projects are history based, some are math-based, some are geography based and some are science based. We did a project with a flashlight in a dark room. We did a couple geo projects with chalk outdoors. There was a project that took masking tape on the floor. There have been a couple easy recipes. We've played a few card games. We went out to get leaves for a project. We did a couple of active games. Balloons and rocks are the other supplies I can remember using.

 

I'm having to strain my brain to remember the past year......there are more project/activities, obviously. And, I'm describing them generally out of respect to the author and her copyright.

 

I will tell you this. I hate projects. But, I hate myself when I skip them. And I really hate projects that are done without a good purpose. HOD has been the best curriculum I've found to satisfy my need to do hands on projects that I do not wish I could skip. I have actually enjoyed myself this year.:D And that is saying a lot.

 

Here's my curriculum background so you get an idea of what I've done:

SL PK, Alt 2, 3, 4, 5

TOG 1

WP Animals, QFMA