Wondering what the thoughts are on this one? We love Fred, and I really need a chem program for the son. Any thoughts of using this text to getting a good score on SAT II?

you'll probably be interested in the author's response to that question. This is my first time posting:blush5: I'm including my own question, so that you can understand the context the question was posed in. What he says makes perfect sense to me! Here it goes... Hi Midori, Thank you for your interest in Conceptual Chemistry. I should tell you a bit about some of the problems we college professors face when teaching general chemistry: 1) Our students have such widely varied experiences in previous chemistry courses. So much so, that we can't assume much. Therefore, we take the attitude that we're starting from scratch. Any insight that students bring with them from previous courses is an added plus. Often, though, we spend time "unteaching". Working with conversion factors is often a hurdle in that regard. 2) Many of our students are whizzes at math. They can plug through the questions at the end of the chapter and come through with the correct answers. But they don't understand what those answers mean. We find that these students have done quite well in their high school (even AP) courses. They're accustomed to doing well, which is why they get irate to discover that their old algorithmic methods are no longer working. In college we demand conceptual understanding along with mathematical prowess. 3) Then there's the flip side of #2. Many students are strong with the concepts, but they are weak with the math. They too suffer. Conceptual Chemistry is foremost a college chemistry text for the nonscience major. My students are typically seniors who have delayed taking their science requirement to their last semester of college. These are student who are not destined to become future scientists. But they are destined to become the general public, which has an incredible need to understand the workings and discoveries of science. The nature of this curriculum has made it also popular with high schools. The chemistry is NOT watered down. This is a serious college level course amenable to motivated younger students. That said, as per its title, the focus is on the concepts of chemistry. Quantitative problem solving, such as stoichiometry, is certainly included but it's not the main entree. Does Conceptual Chemistry work well for a student who is confident that he or she will be taking college level general chemistry? Yes. But only if the student is doing well with his or her math courses. The mathematics of general chemistry really aren't that complicated. What's really important are the analytical thinking skills that math helps to nurture. The students who are most adequately prepared for college general chemistry are the ones with a strong handle on the concepts of chemistry alongside strong analytical thinking skills. Keep in mind #1 from above. I disagree with the idea that Conceptual Chemistry needs to be followed up with a more rigorous math-intensive high school chemistry course. I agree, however, that it must be supplemented with math-intensive math courses. Keep in mind #3 from above. Ultimately, it depends on the student. Some will do well in college Gen Chem with very little background in either the concepts or the math. What is most important is that the student be excited about the chemistry. This is particularly true for the high school student who is just beginning to decide career paths. Too much too soon could turn some students off. For others, though, they may be chomping at the bit. I recommend your child take a look at a "math intensive" chemistry book along side Conceptual Chemistry, 4e. If they happen to pick CC4e, make sure that they've also read this email. Will I end up with a Problem Solving book like that of Conceptual Physics? Not in the immediate future. But thank you for suggesting it. I should mention that CC4e is now being fitted with my publisher's Mastering Chemistry tutorial/assessment program, which I know will be very attractive to homeschoolers. It will be ready by this summer. You should check out the following link: MasteringChemistry.com I hope you find this information helpful. You are welcome to post this reply to the homeschool forums. I would very much appreciate that. Please let me know if I can be of any further assistance. Good chemistry to you, John On Mar 7, 2011, at 11:33 AM, TM Stock wrote: > Dear Dr. Suchocki, > > We are homeschoolers and I’d like to use “Conceptual Chemistry†for our children’s high school years, but I have a few questions. >> > 1. It seems that among homeschooling community “Conceptual Chemistry†is considered as a pre-chem course, which needs to be followed up by a more rigorous math-intensive chemistry sometime during the high school. In other words, they think “Conceptual Chemistry†cannot constitute a full high-school chemistry course. Is this true? Our children want to pursue science majors in universities. Would “Conceptual Chemistry†prepare them on its own? We are not interested in AP course – my question pertains to “Conceptual Chemistry†as the only chemistry course the future science majors take during their high-school years. > > > 2. If “Conceptual Chemistry†indeed needs to be supplemented with problem-solving exercises for future science majors, is there any plan to publish its math component in the same vein as “Conceptual Physicsâ€â€™s new Problem Solving book? I think this is a fabulous idea – people using Conceptual series can just add problem solving component as needed, rather than going through a whole new book later to cover the math part. > > > I’d really appreciate it if you could answer these questions. And if need be, may I quote your answer on the homeschool forums? >> > Regards, >> > Midori

I thought those of you who helped me decide which way to go with our chem labs for this year might be interested to see the kit I assembled. I spent $67 on equipment from Home Science Tools, scrounged a few left-overs from the last pass through chemistry and saved assorted small containers from household stuff. Otherwise, it's all from the dollar and grocery store. I actually spent $116, but the round number sounds better as a title.

Is this actually a high school level Chemistry course? Some websites say definitely while others say "for the non-science" person meaning.... Thanks, Myra

I have a 7th edition which contains 25 chapters. Is there a general rule of how much of the text to complete for a standard high school credit? Thanks. Here's a link to the TOC.

I've read tons of threads on high school science order, and the types of science within each area. Now my questions (my head is spinning from all that reading). - Why is there a split between studying physics or chemistry conceptually vs. mathematically? - Why does it seem that studying them mathematically is "better" for high school? - Is there anything wrong with just studying them conceptually and calling that a high school course? - Would doing a mostly conceptual course in physics or chemistry be detrimental to even a science/math oriented child? As in, for later university entrance? (yes, I'll have a look at some admissions requirements, but just wondering about recent experiences out there) - Why, exactly, do some recommend going physics->chemistry->biology? - Could a mostly conceptual/optional mathematical physics course (the STG, to be specific, along with the WTM rec'd. lab manual and WTM rec'd. source reading, library reading, and writing/sketching/timelining, if you are familiar) be studied alongside Dolciani Algebra II/Trig without problems? - Are there different levels of high school mathematical physics courses? As in, some only require algebra, some require algebra and trig, some absolutely could not be done without pre-cal, etc.? - How are these mathematical physics course levels important in the consideration of future science/math study in university? I tried to find in-depth threads on the bio/chem/phys vs. phys/chem/bio debate, but couldn't find them - I know I read some good ones here within the last few years - if you could point me to some, I'd appreciate it. The reason I'm asking all this is because here in NS, high school is only grades 10-12, so I will probably do earth/space science in grade 9, and the other three after that, but am trying to work out the best order. We do WTM recs for grades 5-8 science, so I'm not sure we'll need to do this "physical science" that I see talked about here a lot (why do people do this, anyway? Is it because they haven't done chem or phys in middle grades?). My goal is to do another four-year round of those four areas, not to do a bit of something in 9th, and then repeat it more deeply in 12th. A possible plan would be: grade 8: 60s Dolciani algebra I, middle grade physics or chemistry grade 9: 60s Dolciani geometry, high school level earth/science (WTM rec'd.) high school: grade 10: 60s Dolciani algebra II/trigonometry, WTM rec'd high school physics plan (STG, lab manual, extra reading, writing) grade 11: 60s Dolciani Modern Intro. Analysis (which I'm told is pre-cal), WTM rec'd high school chemistry plan (STG, lab manual, extra reading, writing) grade 12: Calculus?, WTM rec'd. high school biology plan (STG, lab manual, extra reading, writing) What sparked all this searching and thinking is that I am trying to figure out what to do for chemistry for ds for grade 7 next year. The lab set rec'd. in my 2004 WTM is not sold anymore, and I believe the new WTM recs several labs-in-boxes, but I can't afford to buy a bunch of those. So.....I've been researching what to do - I've seen that some people use Conceptual Chemistry and Conceptual Physics in 7th and 8th grades, but I'm not crazy about doing what seems to be an in-depth textbook for middle grades - I really, really like the WTM idea of using a basic overview spine (and I'm starting to get an idea of what an overview would include - any input there would be appreciated), and supplementing with experiments, more reading, and writing. Also, I think CC and CP are too expensive for us. So, anyway, I'm researching about that (if you have any middle grade area-encompassing "spine" and lab book ideas for me - not RS4Kids - expensive, again, and I don't think chemistry is done? I would really appreciate help there, too!), and then started thinking, "If I can't come up with a chemistry plan for this year, why not do the WTM middle grade physics plan, which I already have (Reader's Digest books, create experiments from that)?" which led me down the road of researching the high school science order. Thanks for any input you can give!

I'm trying to design a high school course using a college level textbook. This text (chemistry) is used for 2 semesters in college. How would I go about deciding *where* to divide the book for a one year high school course? From past experience I find that high school chemistry texts vary quite a bit in content esp. when one factors in the texts written specifically for homeschoolers. The text is: Chemistry: the Central Science. It was recommended by the author of the Illustrated Guide to Home Chemistry Experiments (Robert Thompson). I'm not necessarily wanting to do AP level work, either. So...should I just line up a lot of high school texts and see which units are common? Is there a standard (other than AP) that I can use?