I've never tried a nature documentary like that, what an interesting thought. I gave him the barton screening for kicks and he couldn't pass the first task. He pulled tiles down for each syllable, rather than words. but for syllables, he was 100%. For the third task, isolating sounds, he was 100%. Not even hard. Does make me wonder if he is literally having trouble with word-level language and with pictures and context understands but stripped of those supports with read-alouds (stuff like trumpet of the swan, peter rabbit, etc.) and phonics instruction, he just has trouble with understanding.

I looked up my notes on how we titrated the dosage, we actually started at 3 grams and added a gram a week. We started noticing a calmer/happier kid by the end of the first week. At 5 grams I talked to his dr. about how high I could go because we were still dropping off in behavior prior to dinner. She gave me the green light to go to 8g. I stopped at 7 grams because the improvements in mood/behavior were level all day, with no significant drop off in behavior prior to the evening dose.

My son takes inositol for OCD/Generalized anxiety. He started at 2g and we worked our way up to 7g. (his dr. gave us the ok to go up to 8g) For him it's huge. It's like it took this giant thing hanging over his head and toned it down to something that's more manageable. He doesn't have ADHD though and I would not try it with my daughter who has anxiety issues who also has ADHD because of the stuff I read about it aggravating ADHD symptoms. That combined with L-Theanine means we no longer need melatonin for him to sleep at night. The theanine took the edge off of the anxiety but wore off too fast. The Inositol has a much stronger impact and lasts longer. L-Theanine works great for my daughter with ADHD (we pair it with some coffee in the morning and she's much less impulsive). She tells me that it calms the anxious thoughts in her head within minutes of taking it, and will take an extra dose before certain activities that she knows will spike her anxiety (like a rambunctious social setting). I am looking into other supplements too, zinc is what we're currently working on and then Vit. D might be next. I like to do things one at a time to know what impact they make. I personally take NAC, I need to read more about that in kids. I have an appointment with a nutritionist in a couple weeks that I'm hoping will help with direction to go too.

no I missed that! I'll go check it out... inositol is one of the things we're using that is helping!

Yes. He does. That's true - asd is the top diagnosis and then anxiety, then toileting issues, but we've resolved those during the day with the OT work. The psych said OCD but the diagnosis is generalized anxiety because it was just so pervasive. And we've toned it down CONSIDERABLY with supplements, but it's still a big piece of the puzzle.

ok so in the absence of a behaviorist to help me at the moment... here's what I've got for reading: Narrative difficulties, emotional tension within the plot, (and perhaps the difficulty realizing that just because someone else in the story feels upset, tired, angry, scared doesn't mean I have to feel that way too...) anxiety over not knowing what the words say and they MIGHT prove to be that emotional tension that he doesn't like, difficulty with word parts due to not understanding the language piece and dyslexia Any other ideas that fall into the possible issues I'm seeing? The article on inuit parents was fascinating, I am going to have to ponder it some, lots of thought provoking ideas in it.

The OT identified a couple in January, but we haven't gone looking specifically for any. Those that she saw are now integrated . He's doing play therapy. But the therapist isn't good at sharing opinions on anything - she shares themes that he's working on and says it could be developmental or something he's working through, and her only suggestion for further therapy was for me to learn how to do the play therapy and she'd train me to do it. I'm not sure she's had much training with ASD either, so that could be part of the problem, but my son loves going to her. I think this is why the reading thing has me boggled right now - the other stuff I've been able to provide proper supports and the tasks are within reach and we're in a good place with those things. But I can't figure the reading thing out and it's both auditory (listening to read-alouds) and phonetic - reading instruction. I never considered dyslexia becuase of how quickly he picked up letter sounds and cvc words. My dd8 with dyslexia took 2 years to just match letter sounds to letter shapes and her progress has been slow and painfully obviously dyslexia. We've worked part of this into our routine, but I love how you spell this out and it gives me some great ideas for tweaking the reading issue, building in the supports and self-advocacy and helping support what is obviously still a difficult thing for him. Yes. This is my kid. We figured out from really really early on that we had to have his buy-in for something before we could do it with him. If not- major behaviors. BUT this is where I am struggling right now because it's not just school that has this expectation - it's society. Society expects me to get a behaviorist, to break him and teach him to comply. To do this or that or the other thing and their assumption feels much like dog training. Well that doesn't work for my kid. I love the baby-steps idea, for this. The other day I texted my husband and told him that we were having a rough morning but that my win of the day was the fact that my son sat and listened to a picture book about immigration for history. HUGE win for us even if it looks like this tiny insignificant baby step. But that's my life. I keep a binder of baby-step goals. What I'm looking for in every-day life. Then I come here to post and process things with the big picture to see where I'm going, which direction to head, what path to walk. Thanks for the article and book recs.

The OT told me auditory processing, so it's not her wheel house. The SLP told me no auditory processing issue, but refused to do anything other than the CELF test. I see the connection between behaviors and language - I asked him a question yesterday and recognized his grumpy refusal to answer was related to the difficulty with verb choices that I've seen in language therapy stuff and that he simply can't come up with the right word and so he got grumpy and refused to answer. I'm doing the language myself because I can't afford the lady who would do the right stuff with him (working on possibility of a grant). I'm using 100%vocab and am considering other linguisystem products to support and reinforce weak areas I find but haven't purchased yet. Regarding the asd diagnosis - we got there, but she didn't give us a support level. She had other issues too, like, refusing to give us answers on the evals she ran for literally months until we left the practice and demanding a written report, that again took MONTHS to receive, but in the end we got the diagnosis in the mail as part of the report. I have mixed emotions on the behavior support stuff here... The other moms I've spoken to who use them are like, it's great, they push my kiddo until they break and then dial it back and teach them how to manage next time and I'm thinking, no thanks, that's not gonna work for me. I had access to ABA with a different company but it's a long wait list (6+months) and I don't know how they function because I don't know anyone who works with them, so... Anyway, I was just trying to think through what COULD be behind this, because rarely do behaviors show up in isolation for pure behavior reasons, I've found. There's always something driving it - whether anxiety, OCD issues, rigidity in thought, sensory discomfort, language, etc.

asd... no other educational testing completed as of yet.

I am trying to figure out what might be underneath my 6 yo son's dislike of listening to me read aloud anything other than picture books, because I feel like it's bleeding into reading instruction too. The professionals I've discussed with with tell me that the intense dislike (often leading to panic attacks) of watching movies (anything with a "bad guy" or tension - veggie tales, animated hero classics, even peter pan's opening scene with peter trying to get his shadow back...) has to do with what they say is a hyper-awareness of emotions in others, but that his dislike of books would be auditory processing issues. The thing is, his auditory processing is excellent. I know that's not the issue. I wondered if it was again a hyper-awareness of social tension in the plot-line, which is kept much more minimal in picture books, but I keep getting behaviors with reading instruction too, so I wonder if it's something else. He learned how to blend cvc words together really quickly a full year ago now, but progressed really slowly from there. He flipped out when I tried to have him read 2-3 word sentences and when I couldn't get past that I took him to the eye dr. The eye dr. said he had a mild eye tracking issue that he considered developmental and average for his age but that otherwise his sight was perfect. I have spent tons of time on tracking exercises (mazes, dot to dot, tracking across lines to circle all the ..... shapes. etc.). He seemed to improve, but I am still getting these behaviors, and we are regressing to where he's even giving me behaviors for isolated single words again. He has very little frustration tolerance, and is a perfectionist. but I am getting literally NO pushback on math instruction, or handwriting, or language (therapy stuff), or science. History he doesn't like me to read the books aloud, he'll literally leave the room and go somewhere he can't hear us for history or throw a major fit if I try to get him to stay. And I can't get him to do reading. I've tried every trick that's worked in the past - incorporating reading words into obstacle courses, only read the words he writes, as he writes them...etc. I hate to increase the candy motivators again just for reading alone when he's not requiring anything but a picture schedule to follow for everything else. So what am I missing here?

I was reading through some old threads and Lecka said this: "Asking a question and responding to another person's language (reciprocal questions) are both things that would be considered their own language function. And it's a different language function from "telling about something." So iow -- being able to "tell about something" doesn't automatically transfer into being able to ask a question or respond to another person's language, even if all the same words would be used. " I really wish the SLP who first tested my son understood this! Her exact words were "he's got all the language he needs to communicate in any situation - if he's not, it's a behavior issue and not something I can help with." It's an interesting thought process to ponder the difference in language function and the simple collection of words and ability to spit words out in an isolated environment. It's similar to the idea of assuming that since a child shows the ability to feel a variety of emotions, and maybe even can list the types of emotions there are in an isolated environment, they can obviously identify those emotions in ANY given setting. Obviously the identification of emotions will range in difficulty level based on the situation and function (ID in you, ID in me, ID in me when I'm reflecting vs. when I'm experiencing it), just as the ability to communicate will range as well, in the variety of functions that language can play.

when you mention the mindwings charts, are you referring to the chart that shows the narrative levels? That type of sale would be awesome! I'll not hold my breath for that much of a discount but any amount off would be helpful! I've already told my husband that I'll need at least $100 in the education fund for April. He rolled his eyes a little but said ok 😉

Wouldn't this fall under the concept of narration? I'm still working this through in my own head and how it applies to life, but the ability to explain character (yourself), setting (where you were) and actions (what you saw and why it was important). So narration focused products could help.

I have front-loaded a bit and had him play with the concepts with his siblings. He can do a lot more in the privacy of our living room with just our family than he can in practice in social settings. It's one of the benefits of having 4 kids. Might make me juggle more, but it gives me a built in social group. The thing I like about MW is the visuals. I find the manual (Braidy anyway) to be more complicated than it should be to implement, and takes a good bit of planning on my part, but I can't see anything showing me what SKILL looks like, so I'm having trouble knowing if it's something worth looking at for the cost. I will talk to the play therapist and see what she thinks. I think one thing I need to do is think about my intermediate goals. I have short term goals, but knowing what I want to achieve, what "there" looks like, will help me know better where I need to focus.

oh I'll also mention that I am always looking at stuff with dual purpose - my dd with dyslexia needs the language work, my DD 11 needs the social skill work. DD11 may be asd if we really pushed for a diagnosis, or maybe just gifted with social skill deficits, but she really needs the explicit stuff that my son needs, too. Things like, making smart guesses, she really struggles with. So that could be part of why you think I'm moving too fast, If something works on foundational skills for him, and hits goals for my other kids, it's more likely to catch my attention.

Is it too spliced to get just the 6-second stories book from the MW set (which addresses one of the specific issues he has with language) and maybe It's All About the Story so I can have more resources to work with basic narration (I am about out of resources with Braidy on the stage 1 and 2 narrations) but not use Making connections? I like Practical Theory of he mind better than what I see of that on the website, and by piecing together what I want it would cost less...

I'm sort of rushing but only in thought, not in practice. I know I need to take things slow in application, but knowing where I'm going, so that I can add things in as they fit, is what I'm trying to figure out. And the OT side-steps EVERY stinking question I ask her about order of skills, even concrete ones that should be in her territory. I have the interoception stuff and we're going through it SLOWLY. He needs it to be slow, to digest it and process it and apply it across situations. He was telling me how his feet felt today at the store as he paced while we waited in line. That's exactly what I'm looking for. And he's willing to do it, which is huge. I'll look at joint-attention to see what all that entails. He works for me pretty well at this point, because I am able to mirror his emotions really well and have done a good job at learning to validate him, and make things engaging. He's also really enjoying play therapy for quite some time now and has a great therapist working with him. He's 6, but I don't think he has the same language deficits as your son, I'll see more maybe as I work through the 100% vocab. We've not fleshed out all the sections of it yet, again I don't want to rush it, and I want to ensure that he's understanding each concept. So far he's doing better with it (not struggling at all - finds the questions amusing) and my almost 8 year old DD who has dyslexia has to stop and think about the questions a little more. Ironically, I had to explain to my 3 year old son that he couldn't answer the questions for my daughter, as he would call out answers across the room while she was thinking. That boy is going to give me a run for my money. I think the MW ASD set might need to be pretty high on my list, and with an unexpected change in our summer plans, some of our vacation money might be able to go towards it. My thought with the social thinking stuff was that I was told the fact that since he didn't seem to gain anything (except vocabulary) from the We Thinkers group, that he might need something more basic first, thus the Thinking about Me Thinking about You idea - that book was actually the recommendation given me as a more foundational piece that we might back up and do. And honestly, I'm finding splinter things to work on from Color my Conversation (like facial expressions), but in general it's too much for him right now since in practice, he's still unable to remember to say hello and goodbye without prompts. Narrative language he's improved on - He recently was able to retell an entire paw patrol episode to me including characters and what they did and what the result was. He has to be in the mood to do it, though, and there's something I can't quite put my finger on yet that is still missing on his ability to simply narrate a story or event back to me, almost like he has trouble remembering, or dislikes the emotions that remembering brings up, or something. (so he can narrate back each thing he did in order at OT if he enjoyed it and left well-regulated. If he left disregulated due to an issue with transitions or something, then he won't be able to tell me anything they did no matter even after he's regulated again. His language in play is rich and he has gotten a lot more vocal lately. I'm seeing a lot more ideation, a lot more ability to direct the play and he's now able to communicate when he's not happy with how play goes. He can't always solve the problems, but he's able to communicate the problems now. AND, he got Stuck in the store today when I told him I couldn't buy him Batman, and he fought and cried and almost threw a big fit in the store over having to walk away, then I saw him stop, put his head down, and blow slow breaths out. I quietly told him he was doing a good job calming down and taking deep breaths and in amazing speed he had collected himself and was able to finish the shopping trip without issue. I was mentally trying to figure out how I was going to exit the store with him fighting me again and was so impressed that he was able to calm down. So that in itself was a huge win for me. I guess the thing is, I just need to know what direction I need to head next, since I don't have the right level of professionals available to me at this point in time to work with him. I may use the OT for postural strength and fine motor skills. Just needed to know the best direction for the rest.

Edited- lot of rambling for the long story. The short story is that the OT was great on some things and not great on others, and I have to decide whether her focus is where I want to focus, because her attention to some things feels really scattered and causes more work for me as I have to take those things she starts and create usable ways to integrate them into our lives at home without the original resource to begin with. What I want is to know what resources I can utilize for Theory of the Mind so that I can integrate the color my conversation pieces into it. Something designed to give me resources to teach him perspective and thinking through social situations at various levels, starting at foundational levels. I was looking at the Thinking about You Thinking about Me, since he's already been through we thinkers 1 and 2 and it didn't go well - this is a more foundational piece I think. I've got the anxiety piece under control, so now I feel free to work on the language and social pieces in more specific ways. I'm using 100% Vocabulary by Rothstein to look for gaps and issues there, but I just need to know what other resources will provide me the most usability. I was thinking about Think Talk Laugh to help with language organization and ensure word retrieval isn't an issue. Anything else I'm missing?

I've been enjoying the back and forth and just wanted to pop in for a second to say that while I do think that the author of materials mean for them to be used "properly", I think that there's exceptional value modifying materials to suit your student's needs. It's helpful to do so with both eyes open, to be sure you're not missing something important, but at the same time, modification is what makes homeschooling (or afterschooling, whatever) so effective, in my opinion.

Our church is small but we do have a good number of kids...like I think the kids outnumber adults many Sundays (and having 4 kids per family is the average at our church). BUT I think that is not an important feature of the church for attendance, more a better guage for church health (kids are a sign of a healthy church if you listen to those who "know" about these things). Our church is very community focused and I think that's the biggest thing for us (other than solid Bible teaching). Everyone has partnered with us to help our son, so having other kids with autism in the church isn't even necessarily important. Our pastor often going out of his way to stop and talk to my son about anything he can get him to open up about. I've had people go out of their way to let me know things ahead of time, to try to make him feel comfortable, to try to get him involved at whatever level he's comfortable. A quiet smile and hand on my shoulder as friends pass is common when we're in the hall trying to calm down. The support for ME is there, and the support for my son. That's what I would look for in a church, personally. And I would give up all the supports and "thing" in the world to have a supportive church community to lean in on when things get tough.

I do have base-10 blocks but I haven't pulled them out in a while, I should do that and see how that works for her. We've done all of these games, and they are taxing for her. I thought they were brilliant, but the last time I tried playing race to 100 she began crying after the second dice roll because she was convinced she wouldn't win the race and hated playing all games and never wanted to play another game in her life; which was ironic when I found her playing kids monopoly with her sister later...

I haven't done psych evals yet because we've been rather focused on our son over the last year, with the exception of her reading issues. I'll take a look at the ebooks, double down on the ronit bird stuff and see how we progress over the next few weeks and see if we can get over this hump. after looking through the samples available of beast, there's no way I can expect her to go into that without an ability to work with 2-digit numbers, so I may just ditch that idea for next year altogether. But my first priority is to at least move forward where we are now and then I can make a decision about next year.

That's great to know, thanks, I had talked myself out of right start last night again and this helps me know I made the right decision.

printed books

I could be short changing her abilities by focusing too much on her weaknesses... I just gave her the Beast Academy level 2 placement test and I was impressed at her ability to reason out how to solve the word problems, and by using a number line that she drew herself got only 1 question incorrect (and they allow up to 4 incorrect to place into the book). I only read the questions for her. She was quite motivated since I allowed her to do that instead of her afternoon chore, but maybe I stay the course for this year, keep working with Ronit bird and the other suggestions here and allow her to go into Beast 2 next year with her brother...is that too big of an issue to have her working with him?