Conversation. Talking about life. Discussions about stars, Obama/Clinton, friendship, the Wars of the Roses..... We focused VERY heavily on the academics. I am glad we did -- dd is benefiting enormously from her high school education. BUT for my youngest two kids, I am trying to remember that no one asks about your SAT scores when your 40! (or 30...or even 20!) Relationships, curiosity, learning how to ask meaningful questions.....that's the BIG stuff in life. (Don't get me wrong -- I have a list of AP classes that I want my dd2 to take -- and she is only in 6th grade! I am NOT talking necessarily about lightening up on academics -- but on seizing the moments to talk.)

Yes, yes, yes. Dd is attending a top-20 LAC on full-tuition scholarship. If she went to a VA state school like William and Mary or UVA, we would be paying considerably more! Ds just received his second full-tuition scholarship offer the other day......I never dreamed of the amount of money that is floating around for scholarships. (Ds did apply to UVA, but he almost definitely won't go there -- because we can't afford it!) The scholarship money may not be for your top-choice school, but it is there.

I wish I'd spent MORE time talking about what she is actually learning and LESS time focusing on subject-specific studies. I think talking and discussing and talking and sharing insights, about the "stuff" of life whether about the weather or the War of the Roses or Obama/Clinton, is what homeschooling is REALLY all about.

Ditto here. My kids have LOVED read-alouds and endless discussions....but somewhere around age 14 they all seem to just want to do their own thing. I am doing read-alouds with my third child this year for the last time -- he will graduate to a read-aloud-less existence in June. :-( He wants it that way -- he can read through the book faster on his own, and gets to self-pace his day more. My older teens and I touch base and discuss, but for the most part casting them off on their own is what has worked around here. (Lunch will go on for an hour occasionally if we hit a "hot topic" -- but that is more spur-of-the-moment.)

Our story with spelling -- Ds1 is a brilliant speller -- and he NEVER did a day of spelling in his life. In fifth grade I gave him a spelling test to see what level to start him at -- and he made it through all the words until he hit the word catastrophe. He didn't spell it correctly, but he also had to ask what a catastrophe was! So he has never done any spelling. Dd1 was a horrible speller. She misspelled and misspelled, and spelling programs made no difference. Eventually when she was in the middle of sixth grade we chucked spelling. She uses spellcheck EXTENSIVELY. She has improved considerably over time. Her poor spelling has never held her back, but it is something she is aware of -- when she went to write the thank you note for her scholarship she didn't think to bring a dictionary and was too embarassed to ask how to spell certain words, so her thank you note is full of very simple words! Next year she intends to remember the dictionary! So my advice is -- ENJOY LIFE AND DON'T SWEAT THE SPELLING!

We use the Dolciani Algebra 1 textbook that is just called Algebra 1, published in 1986, 1989, and 1992, by Dolciani, Swanson, and Graham. It may be dumbed down - - but we like it! (I hadn't heard of the Structure and Methods book when I bought this, and, obeying the "If it ain't bruk don't fix it" principle, we just continue to use it!) I actually do second the last post -- you know your own kids best, so stick with what feels right / works well to/for you and your kids.

I have NO experience with Math-U-See byond seeing it at a homeschool conference about 12 years ago, so I cannot compare it with anything. I am writing in just to encourage you to look at Dolciani. I love the way her books teach the material. I love the problems. I love the review and self-test exercises. I love the rigor. I love the cumulative review sections. I love the way the TM provides different tracks for different kids -- average, enriched, accelerated. etc. I love the way that for the most part the books are logically enough presented so as to be self-teaching. And I love the way Dociani has prepared my kids to do well on all the standardized tests they have ever encountered. If you can, do look at Dolciani. It isn't for everyone, but if your kids are at all mathematically inclined you should consider it! (No, I do not own stock in Houghton Mifflin nor am I related to Dolciani in any way! :D)

My dd has a TI-84, and she is VERY jealous of the kids in her lab class who have a TI-89. She will probably get a TI-89 with her summer earnings. That said, be aware that sometimes a TI-89 is not allowed -- and not just in the standardized tests. My ds is taking a calculus class at a 4-year college, and TI-83's and TI-84's are allowed, but no TI-89's -- the TI-89's are TOO capable! Both my older kids are going into math-intensive areas (chemistry and economics) and I figure that they will need both -- the TI-83 or 84 because it's allowed and the TI-89 because it can do so much more. If your child is probably not going into a math-intensive field I would just get the TI-83/84 and call it good. Many people will never really need the more advanced features found on the 89. (My dd is interested in getting the 89 because it is much better about fitting data to lines, which is essential for chem labs!)

my oldest left for college last fall. I missed her like crazy last fall, but I figured I'd get used to it. Well, I'm still missing her like crazy! :( (And I still have three at home -- it's not like I've been left with an empty house!) Any comments from folks who have been there and done that?

I would like to echo an earlier post -- do NOT assume that there will be no merit or financial aid. Merit aid story from the trenches -- our oldest is going to a school that costs approximately $50,000 per year. Thanks to extensive merit aid, last year we paid only a few thousand. (No loans involved). Financial aid -- Some schools are VERY different from others. One school may say that you have to pay X; another school will say that you have to pay 2X or even 3X. Private schools can be VERY good with financial aid. Before dd applies, you need to be clear that if the fin aid package is not acceptable, she won't go -- but then encourage her to apply. (Investigate average student indebtedness on college confidential and US News & World Report to get an idea of how much schools vary with their fin aid programs!) One last thought -- student loans may not be the worst thing. We wouldn't let dd take loans -- she wants to go into art conservation, which obviously pays next to nothing. But ds1 wants to go into economics, which has a rosier future in terms of earnings, so we won't mind if he graduates with some debt. (We are NOT talking down payment - sized loans here -- but some debt is not the end of the world.)

I have really enjoyed this anti-thread. Some things in homeschooling go well, and some things go -- not-so-well! Here are my (many) reasons why we don't belong on this forum -- 1) My husband and I are engineers. Neither of us enjoyed studying literature in high school, and I have a minor in literature in college solely because I needed a minor and it was the path of least resistance. 2) My kids don't like studying literature either! (Seriously!) My older two read LOTS of books, but third will do almost anything (including chores) to avoid reading. :( (He's gonna be an engineer like daddy!) 3) All upper-level English classes are taught by someone else -- I know my limits! 4) All of my kids do Latin -- under duress. Ds2 is on his THIRD attempt at Latin 1! Well, actually, Ds1 does Greek instead -- he's a Latin dropout! 5) All Latin classes are taught by someone else -- I know my limits! 6) My dd (in college) is rejoicing because she only has to take one English class during her college years -- and she is 7/12 of the way done with it! 7) We are going the AP route for many upper-level classes -- which means many primary source documents, but fewer classics. 8) All high school science classes are taught by someone else -- I know my limits! (We are deeply indebted to those teachers at Scholars Online, PAH, and Regina Coeli -- thank you!) We are giving our kids a rigorous education -- in many respects -- but it has MANY MANY holes. (Spelling? What's spelling? If you're not a natural speller in our house, you use spell-check!) But I am in absolute awe of many of you moms who really explore logic, who spout literature, and who bury yourselves and your children in history. You are inspirational! Thank you ALL who contribute so much to this forum -- including the 99% of you who "don't belong"! :)

I would second what others have said about writing and math. My two (limited) (skill-based) requirements for entering high school are -- 1) Be rock-solid on math and have finished algebra 1 2) Be able to write a SOLID SOLID paragraph -- almost any type of paragraph -- with originality and pizzazz. Be able to connect a few paragraphs for a mini-essay or report. Be starting to work on the 5-paragraph essay. Obviously, there are many other things that it would be nice to have covered, and many intellectual traits that it would be nice to have developed before high school, but WRITING and MATH are absolutely central to high school. For example, take a 10th grader who wants to take AP US Govt. If he knows NOTHING about US history or US government, this is a drawback, but not an insurmountable one -- he will just have to work harder to learn the material. If he can't write, he will have problems with ALL of the essays and with the AP exam itself. Essentially he will have to learn two subjects in the course -- writing and US govt. Talk about a handicap! And I guess I should add strong reading skills -- being comfortable not just reading junior-high-level fiction but also news magazines, history books, science books, works written centuries ago that are more challenging to read.....

Sorry -- my previous post wandered. The textbook sequences I have seen for high school math have ALL jumped textbook series at some point. I would not be concerned about hopping from one to another -- but I would follow the sequence of someone, whether a friend or a school.

I figured out what books to investigate by checking out what the honors-level math classes used at various public and private high schools that I respect. Many / most high schools have information about texts and scope & sequence online now. I discovered that my local high school (in Massachusetts, and one of the two top-scoring schools in the state) used the same book that we did (Dociani) for algebra 1. I figured that if the teachers had enough sense to use Dolciani for algebra 1 that I would follow their textbook sequence, and we have been very pleased with it. Also, if you happen to have a friend who is a mth teacher, beg to have access to her textbook collection. I spent a delightful day in a friend's office poking through math texts and was amazed -- some prealgebra texts covered almost identical material to some algebra 1 texts. Which textbook you choose can make a HUGE difference in not only how the material is covered but also what material is covered.

I have a funny story to relate concerning "classical education." We are a family that holds VERY loosely to TWTM -- I love many of the ideas in it, but I would be hard-pressed to find specific examples of where we have directly followed TWTM. I wouldn't even consider the education that my kids have had particularly "classical." One of the hallmarks of a classical education is knowing the epics of Western Civ, right? Well, oldest dd goes off to college and takes art history. In art history, of course, it helps to know the stories behind some of the art. This is a small liberal arts college, so the prof usually asks around so a student can tell the story. Well, dd now WAITS and WAITS before raising her hand -- she is almost the only person who knows any of the classical mythology and medieval tales. I was dumbfounded! She has even thanked me for her education which is "heavy on the classics"! So I now have NO idea what a classical education is, since my dd feels she received one but I didn't give her one! (I know -- she REALLY didn't receive a classical education, but I was amused by this!)

For geometry we use Jurgensen, Brown, and Jurgensen's Geometry. It is VERY proof-heavy and rigorous. We don't have the solution's manual so when we correct the proofs we do not have the right answers -- and there are a few proofs that neither my dh nor I can do! But we love it -- and it challenges not only the student but the teacher as well! :rolleyes: Yes, we do have the TM so at least we have ALL of the simple numerical answers readily at hand. :D

One caution about advance planning -- stay flexible! Over the years, other options may come up -- a tutorial available locally or a college class that is too good to miss -- or your child may start expressing STRONG opinions on what is really important to him/her. He/she may want computer programming at the expense of history, or music theory at the expense of a fourth year of science. Advance planning is wonderful, but don't make the plan in stone! (For the record, for American history we love Clarence Carson's A Basic History of the United States)

I'm not sure that I "discuss" math much, but I do discuss it in one way -- when my kids don't come up with the right answer, I ask them if they should have known that the answer is wrong. This gets them to think about the answer -- what should the answer look like? For example, my 6th grader is doing compound interest, and she was asked to figure out how much needed to be repaid given a principle of X. Her answer was smaller than X! She just took a quick look and gasped -- and realized that she was hopelessly wrong. She looked at her equations and realized what she had done wrong -- and all I did was ask her why her answer was wrong! my older kids internalize the process at some point. Asking the kids to think about the answer does not eliminate all errors, but it at least means that it will be in the right units, the right order of magnitude, etc. An ability to do back-of-the-envelope calculations should be encoouraged, and asking our kids to estimate helps develope this ability.

I love Jane's answer! So I will only add what we have used -- Algebra 1 -- Dolciani Algebra 2 -- Dolciani Geometry -- Jurgensen, Brown, & Jurgensen Pre-calculus -- Advanced Mathematics by Brown My kids have basically taught themselves, but dh and I have had to step in and solve some of the REALLY weird problems. This set of books has provided an excellent foundation for my kids -- strong test scores and both have done well in calculus.

I have a couple of questions for you to consider -- 1)l How much time do you plan on being able to help the student? 2) Do you want a basically self-teaching curriculum? 3) Do you have a strong math background and/or are you willing to work through the materials with the student, learning the material as you go? The answers to these questions will help narrow down suggestions for good math programs!

Yes, most kids who do AP bio get two credits of bio on their transcript -- sort of like 'biology" and then "advanced biology". I don't know about cc classes. My younger son will probably be doing some cc science classes, but he will only do those that he will not have done earlier because I am not sure (based on my older son's calculus experience) that the classes are actually "college-level" at our cc.

I have NO idea how the two of them compare -- BUT -- When my kids were trying to narrow down the field of colleges, I urged them to sit down for two or three HOURS (per interesting college) and poke around the college websites. There is an ABUNDANCE of information on them -- everything from what the dorms are like to descriptions of religious groups. The colleges work hard to have their websites reflect who they "really" are, and my kids have found them to be an absolutel treasure-trove of information. If you absolutely cannot visit them beforehand, I guess your son should apply to both (I know -- they both have painful applications) and then visit whichever one(s) he gets accepted to. I cannot urge you enough to let him visit the schools before he accepts, even if he puts of the visits until April so he only visits schools he has been accepted to. My dd, a college freshman, says that the only people she knows who are unhappy at her school accepted it either 1) on the basis of financial aid packages only; or 2) sight unseen. My son has applied (and been accepted) to a college that he has not seen. We are waiting until early April, when he will have heard from all the others, to schedule visits, but we will not allow him to go to a college he has not seen.

You can think of an AP test as a rigorous final exam for a course -- you wouldn't take a final exam for a course that you took a year or two earlier -- you take the final exam right after you take the course. The "normal" way to do the AP biology is to take biology in 9th and then AP bio in 11th or 12th. I know personally several students who have taken AP bio in 9th or 10th without having taken a bio course beforehand, but that is a "challenging" way to go. If your student is really really into bio and is a very strong, motivated student I would consider it, but otherwise I would just do bio in 9th and AP bio in 11th or 12th. AP exams are supposed to indicate a college-level mastery of the material in the course, so "normally" just 11th and 12th graders take them. I would only have a student do an AP exam in freshman or sophomore year if he/she is truly motivated and a very accelerated learner.

Like others, we didn't list any courses done before 9th grade. My children did algebra 1 in 8th, but since they did algebra 2 in 9th we felt that it was rather obvious that they did algebra 1 before high school. My younger son, entering 9th next year, will have completed both algebra 1 and geometry before 9th grade, so we will put a notation on his transcript indicating that he took geometry in 8th grade; we will still not mention algebra 1. He will do Latin 2 in 9th grade, so we feel that it is pretty obvious that he took Latin 1 in 8th and won't list it anywhere.

If he doesn't "need" the credit on his transcript, I would keep his drumming as an extracurricular activity. You can't have too many of them or show too much involvement! :-) On its list of 'desired high school curriculum" my state lists 1/2 credit of "fine arts." We have tried to do 1/2 credit of fine arts somewhere in high school for each child -- music theory or something similar. Given his background, having him work through a bit of music theory (and notereading since drumming doesn't involve it) would help his musicianship and would make a great 1/2 credit course.