Ahhhh, I think you are right. I'm even wondering about going to more time, less days. We currently have screen free days on Sundays. They think they hate it, but as I type this, they are playing Uno. With each other. And they aren't obsessing over when their next Geometry Dash fix will be. Maybe I should go to screen free days two or three days a week, with more time allowed on the "on" days. Or I could tell them they get six hours total in a week---use it all up the first day if they want, or bank it for later in the week. This would cut down on start/stop frequency, which I think is annoying for all of us.

I'm not sure whether I know what you mean or not. Do you mean that perhaps what seems to me to be intentional lying on his part is maybe not really quite that? If so, yeah---you may be right. Not sure where to start, but it sounds like a good idea. This is not the first conversation about this kid that has drifted toward topics related to ADHD. When he was in school, none of his teachers ever brought it up...but now that I have him at home, I do wonder. But either way---yeah, reading up on this would probably be beneficial. Let me know if you have any recommended websites or books. I'm fine with rewards. I think that intrinsic motivation must be awesome for those whose kids have it...but I've mostly given up on it with my kids. I think rewards can be especially helpful when they are on their way to discovering something that takes some practice and skill and WORK to discover---like reading. Once they reach a certain level of proficiency (at least in theory, I guess), they will enjoy it and it will be the reward. Or at least I can hope. It's just with this particular kid, I don't want to set him up in a situation where he's likely to lie to achieve his desired outcome.

Just one more question for now: What's the best source for Asterix comics? Our library doesn't have them, grrrr. Should I just order a few from Amazon for starters?

Oooooh I've seen that website recommended before and did look at it some. I'll have to go check it out again. Also will look into Asterix Comics. Thanks for all the suggestions (and keep them coming); I have my work cut out for me!

Sorry for the posting marathon, just following up on what was said after I went to bed. :) I suppose the elephant in the room here is that I do let them play video games. I limit it (30 minutes twice a day, after chores are done, except Sundays which are screen free), but it is there. And, beyond their video game time, they are currently obsessed with finding and listening to songs they have downloaded from their favorite game du jour, and also playing around with Garageband and making their own songs. I have been of the "all things in moderation" perspective. However, what I don't like about video games, even on a limited basis, is that they seem to kill my kids' enjoyment of other things---such as reading, playing with toys etc. So there is the route of just going screen free for the summer (at least). They would HATE me if I did that. And it may or may not push them to books---I just don't know. It could totally backfire if they knew I did it to try to get them to read. Thoughts?

The whole intrinsic/extrinsic motivation thing. I get what you're saying...but nobody would ever tell a voracious reader that he/she "had" to read. So are you suggesting that I just let them off the hook? Keep reading to them, and be ok with it if they never choose to pick up a book on their own?

Can you share some specifics? What are the easy novels of which you speak?

Me too. I just want them to LIKE it (reading, that is), gosh darn it! LOL

Well, of course I expect honesty. That is to say, I teach them that lying is wrong. We listen to and read stories about the pitfalls of lying. I don't lie to them. If I catch them lying, there are consequences. My kids know that if they lie, they won't be trusted---and trust is a good thing. Yet...I have a child who lies. This is the one who will say he brushed his teeth, but you go check and his toothbrush is dry. He will say he did the chore, but you go look and the chore is not done. Oh by the way, they both do other sins too, even ones I have worked hard at teaching them not to---ones that I "expect" them not to do. My parenting dynamic is lacking in other areas as well. And gosh, I myself even sin. Guess my parents missed the mark somewhere along the way. So I can SAY "you better be honest," but with this guy, I can't guarantee that he won't check off the box without reading the book. So I was just wondering if there's a good way, short of giving a comprehension quiz after each reading period or making him read out loud (a surefire way to get this kid to cry), to ensure that he's not just checking the box to get the incentive.

Lots to think through here...I'm overwhelmed. Of all of the above, what would you say is the one thing to do first? And a question about incentivizing time spent reading, or finishing a book: What about the kid who will say he was reading when really he wasn't, or will say he read a book when he really didn't? Do we just count time spent with a book in front of his face, and hope that he will one day decide that actually reading the book is more fun than sitting with it?

Ok, off to the library we go. (but am I asking too much to ask them to also read SOMETHING else?)

I've had a little bit of difficulty finding material at the right level for the 8yo. By this age, my other guy was reading Percy Jackson and I find there's a lot more at that level. Seems like DS8 needs stuff more on the level of Magic Treehouse or so (but he got tired of those). One book that he did actually read from cover to cover recently was an old favorite of my childhood: Key to the Treasure by Peggy Parish. So I went ahead and got my hands on five or six other books in the same series (didn't even know it was a series till I looked up the original on Amazon and saw the related titles). Two of those are the ones I started aloud today; thought they would be big hits. The jury's out; maybe they will catch on. I was just disappointed with today's reaction. They didn't really like the Boxcar Children, much to my disappointment. It's been a couple years, though...maybe I should try some of those again. Any other suggestions?

Ack! Don't scare me!

Haha. I'm actually fine with them reading Garfield and C&H, but it's ALL my 8yo really wants to read. Maybe I should just say hey, it's summertime, knock yourself out? Read all of them? They each have their own personal basic kindle. I've loaded some stuff on there, but somehow it seems to lack the pizazz they are looking for. We also have a Kindle Fire. What would you suggest I could load onto any of the above that might entice them?

Today, I let them pick from about five options. Usually if I leave it wide open and tell them they can pick anything (except Garfield, Calvin and Hobbes or their 39th rereading of some Wimpy Kid book), my 8yo will tell me there's nothing in the house that he wants to read. Every option I suggest: no, he doesn't want to read that. Often, I have to just pick something for him and make him read it. He will not pick for himself. Then he complains about what I pick. Sometimes doesn't even read it---just sits or lays around for 30 minutes. We do read alouds every day. Everyday. Sometimes twice a day. They don't see me reading, except when I read to them. I know, you don't have to say it...they are following my lead. But darn it, they are the ones saying they are bored! Bored people should read!

I'll keep an eye out (pun intended) for further eye complaints; however I am skeptical as this child is the king of sudden-onset physical maladies whenever he is asked to do something that's not his favorite. Hunger, thirst, fatigue and needing to go to the bathroom are his everyday tricks. Eye pain is a new one...not going to ignore it, but also not making that appointment today. Well, yeah. And that's what I did today. I guess my underlying question, though, is WHY they find reading to be so dreadful, and what can I do to fix it? Can I fix it? Or are there some kids who will just never enjoy reading?

Seriously. I asked my two boys, ages almost-10 and 8, to spend 30 minutes reading today. The 10 year old cried. The 8yo said "reading huuuuuuurrrrrts his eeeeeeyyyyyyyyeeeeesssss" and suddenly desperately needed some resting time on the sofa. They are not horrible readers. I started aloud with an easy, light book for each of them. They were interested in the stories. However, they apparently just want to be spoon fed. WWYD? Do they just need to get used to the idea? I generally required a half hour of independent reading several times per week during the school year, but we've had a long break from that as the school year wound down and we went on a long trip, during which they read MUCH LESS than I would have liked. Am I unreasonable to ask for 30 blessed minutes of reading from them?

No---not after schooling. I get them all day, lucky me! They were in PS for a couple of years but I pulled them out.

LOL Targhee you can obviously feel my pain!

Yeah I didn't mean I thought MM should be completely independent, but what attracted me was that it seemed to be less teacher-intensive than some of the other curricula. I was hoping I could get away with reading through the concepts with them and then letting them do the exercises more or less on their own, asking me for help when needed...but I've found that if I don't hover, they just don't do it. I posted about this in another thread, and got some good advice.

One other thing I should say is...when I refer to the older two "self destructing," it's not always complete anarchy. A lot of times, it would be more accurate to say that they just get off task. They stop doing their work. So if I'm working with one and the other is supposed to be working independently, he often just drifts off into doodle land. A lot of great pictures get drawn this way, but not much academic work. And...honestly, it's kind of hard for me to figure out what "work" to give them that they CAN do independently, that isn't just busywork. I chose Math Mammoth because of it's open-and-go nature and because I'd heard that it can be done relatively independently...but found that my guys can't do it without me at their side and sometimes can't do it even then. I've posted about this elsewhere. Copywork/handwriting...you would think that could be done independently, but in their case we are trying to correct some bad letter formation habits that they acquired in PS, and if I don't watch them write I cannot be sure that they are doing the letters correctly. So that leaves...what? I mean, there's always independent reading. My oldest guy is pretty good with that, but my 8yo would like to stick to a strict diet of Garfield, Peanuts and Calvin and Hobbes. If I try to give him real books, he doesn't want to read them. Worksheets? Documentaries? (yes...need to look more into that. I bought the subscription to Discovery Streaming or whatever it is, and have used all of about 20 minutes of streaming from it. : / ) Typing? (I've had them do DanceMat typing. I think my 8yo cheats.) Or, just let them play?

This all sounds like a great day for the students. However, it leaves me wondering HOW you find the time to get everything prepped, organized and set up for each day. I see that you have a folder system, but I'm guessing those folders don't populate themselves. Me, after they finish school I slide right in to household/paperwork/church business mode (I coordinate the nursery, for example), which goes right into dinner prep which goes right into dinner time which goes right into the nightly bath/meds/teeth/storytime/bedtime circus which goes right into mama exhaustion. I can't imagine coming back down for an hour of prep for the next day after all that, nor can I imagine getting up any earlier than I already do to do it in the morning. What's your secret? Less sleep?

First may I say...WOW you get a lot done before lunch! It sounds amazing! And I really love your idea of releasing everyone to recess but bringing them back in one at a time. In this way, it sounds like yours don't really do that much independently either, right? I think the kids would feel like they were getting away with something if we approached it that way...and that would be a good thing! :) We do have several subjects all together. Our mornings usually start with Bible and/or history and/or memory work all together including the little guy (who interrupts quite a bit but we try to just roll with it), then sometimes some other reading aloud if I still have everybody's attention. Lately this has been picture books focusing more on either science, nature or art...or more history if the mood strikes us. :) I try to get my guys to do some of this reading. After that I had been trying to work individually with each of them for some time before lunch, while the other would theoretically entertain the 3yo. Then, afternoon would be more of the same, and/or "independent" work while 3yo napped. However, he's dropped his nap in the past couple of weeks so now he is in the mix too. Good times. Fortunately, Classical Conversations is over for the year so we now have a lighter load. Prior to that, it was pretty crazy with weekly presentations, and with this year being our first year homeschooling, first year of CC, and first year with my oldest in Essentials which was rather demanding. I'll stop here with this post; maybe reply more to other posts down the line. Maybe not tonight though.

Oh man, this is all so good! Thank you everyone! Keep the advice coming but just wanted to duck in and say that I'm really really grateful to you veterans for sharing your ideas. :) :grouphug:

It's hit or miss. I feel he is able to play by himself; i.e. I don't worry about him getting hurt or destroying anything. It seems to be more of a social thing for him. He usually just doesn't last long by himself; feels he needs a playmate.