I agree. I liked pairing Elemental Science with RSO, but apparently that isn't acceptably secular, either. RSO honestly wasn't enough for my very inquisitive kid, and pairing the two worked out really well for him in elementary. I think Oak Meadow is secular (possibly not by the secular group standards), but I'm not sure how rigorous it is. I have 7th grade OM science, and it's a bit simplistic for my 6th grader, but I have an older version before the recent updates. We are secular homeschoolers, but I don't mind 'neutral' science because I know that we use *a lot* of different resources and that my kids will end up with exposure to more concepts just by virtue of the variety of resources we use. Just the same way we use a lot of resources in all of our subjects. I really like Ellen J. McHenry's books - they make science concepts really interesting for kids. I loved her Botany in 8 Lessons book, and we just started her Elements book. If we need more information, I pull out another resource like our Kingfisher or Usborne Science Encyclopedias.

Which plans have you used so far? The Math Mammoth plans are set up really well. We've used Math Mammoth for years, and I'd always wished they had lesson plans. I don't know when they started offering them, but I'm glad I found them! The plans include a couple of pages of work per day, along with a video of Maria explaining the concept, and a link to a math game or further online exercises. It isn't anything that isn't already available, it's just organized according to topic. I rarely incorporated the online math games or activities because I just never worked them in. The links are directly in the plans now, so that is going to make them quite easy to utilize.

Does anyone use this? How do you like it? I'm trying out the free trial, to use the Math Mammoth lesson plans. I've never used an online planner, but I need to start getting a bit more organized as I have one going into 8th grade. I'm wondering if it might be helpful to go ahead and subscribe. So far, I like the Math Mammoth lesson plans, but there don't seem to be a lot of curriculum options, particularly for other curriculum that we use, and I'm not sure I would want to subscribe for only one subject. Those of you who use it, do you do your own planning and input everything into the online planner? How did that work for you? Thanks for any advice!

Thanks everyone! I think we will try out Analytical Grammar. I took a look at the samples and it seems like it will be a good option.

I'm looking for a grammar program for my two middle schoolers (rising 6th and 8th). I've looked at the WTM recommendations, but they seem largely religious and our charter school won't cover that expense. What are secular grammar options for these grades? Thanks!

We are using Oak Meadow 5th grade and most of Oak Meadow 7th grade this year. We are using older versions (from 2013 and 2007) and I think they have recently revamped the curriculum, so our experience may be a bit different. Each week's work is laid out in a separate lesson. 36 weeks in a school = 36 lessons. The older versions do not tell you how to break this out into daily work (I think the new version *may* do that, I'm not sure). I give my 7th grader her work and she works on it throughout the week, with the understanding that she needs to complete the lesson by the end of the week. I do review her lessons ahead of time to make sure that she gives appropriate time to larger projects. I work through the lessons with my 5th grader, spacing the work out somewhat evenly throughout the week. I have heard that the early grades are very gentle, but the work does ramp up as it progresses through the grades. 5th grade history and literature has a lot of writing and reading.

I have found MBTP SS to be hit and miss. Some units are really good, some need a lot of supplements. I'm using 7-9 with my son right now, although we haven't done any of the social studies units yet. I pick and choose and he's ended up doing three back to back literature and science units. I'm using SOTW for history currently, but I'm pretty eclectic with our history studies. However, the 8-10 social studies units I have used are pretty good. There is a good unit on government and voting, I think it is called Power to the People or something like that, and we also did Early Explorers. MBTP does pack a lot of activities into each lesson. I extend the lessons over several days if necessary, and also skip activities that are a bit pointless. There is enough in it that I still feel like I'm getting my money's worth. I also buy each unit individually. I usually buy the online option because it's cheaper. I do generally end up adding in lots of extra library books, but that's the way we roll. We did the 7-9 Rain Forest science unit a few months ago and I added in at least 5 extra books.

I saw ILL listed for 4th-6th grade, so that sounds totally appropriate. I just found a hard copy version at Half Price books - I'd been using a PDF Version. Hard copy makes it so much easier to use! I've used it off and on for the last two years and we will still be using it next year, in 6th grade.

We are enjoying Children of the Longhouse right now. You may already have it as it is written by Bruchac. We also enjoyed the Brown Paper School Book of the American Indians. It is a mix of folk tales, activities, and history.

Math Mammoth and Beast Academy cover a lot of the same things, so you don't necessarily need to to MM3 before Beast Academy 3. Beast Academy presents it differently, and adds in a fun way of looking at math and problem solving. I believe they both are complete math programs. We have used both this year - started with Beast Academy, took a break and did MM3 for a while, and now are back at Beast Academy. The things that we covered in BA I skipped in MM. For 2nd grade, he did a mix of MEP, Miquon, and Life of Fred and did fine going straight into Beast Academy. I added in MM because I have a bundle of grades I have used with my older child.

I have found the science to be a bit hit and miss. Some units are good, some a bit light, some heavier, some not very well organized. For us, it also depends on the kid. For my science oriented 8-year-old, MBTP science isn't enough so we supplement. I still like the activities and the way MBTP connects science to literature if you use the entire unit. My 10-year-old isn't as interested in science, so MBTP science, even the light units, works for her.

They make a book. The pocket for each section (folded over 11x18 construction paper) holds the crafts/activities for that section. When you are finished, you can bind the pockets together as a book, with a cover sheet. I have one kid who loves history pockets, one who hates them. We have used a few, and are working through the Native American set right now.

The Black Friday sale is by far the best. But they also usually have a Memorial Day sale and a Labor Day sale, if you can't wait until November. I think those were more than 25%, maybe 30%, but can't remember exactly.

The Internet Linked Encyclopedias. We use those on a regular basis.

Have you read it? I have one kid who liked Matilda and one who hated it so much he didn't want to finish it. The one who didn't like it was really, really bothered by Matilda's parents. It opens up a lot of good discussions, but he just didn't want to consider parents who were so mean to their own daughter. So, in my experience, it's a classic but not a good selection for my sensitive kid.

Beast Academy is in comic book form, with an accompanying workbook. We use it as a supplement to Math Mammoth (which I find pretty dry, but thorough) and my son loves it. It is problem solving oriented, so it presents math in a different way than the standard curriculum. It starts at 3rd grade, so it might be something to think about for next year.

Wow, I had no idea that there was such a range in times! Based on the other comments, our local elementary is on the long side. When my kids were there (we pulled them in 3rd and 1st grade) the day started at 8 and ended at 3:10. The day was extended in the current school year to a dismissal time of 3:25. So the kids are at school for almost 7.5 hours, not counting drop off and pick up times. I think middle school and high school have similar hours, but different start and dismissal times. What made the original time even harder for us was that my 3rd grader had a couple of hours of homework every night between reading logs and math/science homework worksheets and spelling word practice. It made for really long days. Kinder was a full day, too, which was fine for my daughter but really hard on my son.

My son also hates worksheets. He's good at math but hates writing things down but it was getting to the point last year where he wasn't getting anything done. So we did some things orally and worked with manipulatives like C-rods. I also used MEP as our main math. It does still have worksheets, but just one sheet per lesson, and I didn't alway have him write out the complete sheet. What I really liked about MEP is the lesson plans - there are a lot of hands on activities in the lesson plans and lots of ways to get the concept across without writing things down. I also used a dry erase board, he was happy to write on that. He's more willing to use worksheets this year so we are using Math Mammoth.

We use MBTP, but I use it more as a supplement or with a unit study approach because I didn't find it to really be 'all-in-one'. I like it for literature and social studies, but the writing and grammar isn't really consistent enough. Like the previous poster said, it does lack some specifics of actual writing instruction. And while it does include grammar, the grammar worksheets sometimes seem like an afterthought. We have separate science curricula that we use and like, so we wouldn't use their science anyways. I did try one science unit, but since we already have RSO and Elemental Science, I really didn't need to switch science. It also doesn't include math, you have to add in your own math (or follow their recommended math, which I think is Life of Fred).

We used part of the grammar stage biology lapbook - just the part covering the human body. My writing-hater preferred working on the lapbook rather than doing the sheets from the workbook. It was cute and a nice alternative for a kid who can't stand writing. I haven't used the stand alone lapbooks.

We use elemental science, although I do combine it with REAL Science odyssey for one of my kids. My 10 year old is currently working on Biology for the Logic Stage and my 8 year old is currently working on physics for the grammar stage. We have gone through most of the grammar stage, although we skipped most of biology. That was our least favorite. Chemistry and Earth/space went really well. It's simple and straightforward. Earth science and chemistry for the grammar stage have excellent book lists. The only reason I combine it with RSO is that my 8 year old cannot get enough science so we ended up doing experiments and demonstrations from both RSO and ES. We did this with chemistry and are also combining for physics. My 10 year is fine just doing elemental science. Some days take longer than others, but honestly, it doesn't really take that long. Maybe 30 minutes tops for the grammar stage unless there is a really involved experiment. I think the logic stage is taking my 10 year old about 45 minutes, maybe. I'm not really timing her, but she does the 2 day a week schedule. We do not do the memory work. The poems seemed a bit cheesy to me. There is a lot of writing involved and we do not do all of the writing. My 8 year old hates to write, so I have to carefully pick and choose what he writes. Usually vocabulary is what we skip - I would rather have him write out his own observation or something that interested him about the reading. And when I do get him to write, it is usually only a sentence or two. I also read everything aloud to him. He can read but I still read to him. My 10 year old likes to write and she sometimes still skips vocabulary. So a strong writer will find the assignments do-able. She works independently. We do PDFs. I like being able to print out as many copies as I need. Also, I originally intended to have my kids do science together so I wanted to be able to print out multiple copies, but it has worked better for them to work separately. The experiments are not complicated and for the most part I've been able to find all of the supplies easily. I didn't buy the supply kit. Although I think the biology for the logic stage supplies are probably more involved, so I will have to search around for those since dissection occurs later in the year. So we like it. There isn't anything fancy about it - no fancy graphics or cute worksheets, but there are lots of ways you can add on to it and adjust it to meet your needs. The writer has included extra activities if your kid wants to do more, and we try to check out as many of the additional readings as we can from the library. Also, the abundance of activities mean that it's very hands on.

We have used Math Mammoth but not Singapore. The Math Mammoth sheets can be overwhelming as a lot is packed into one page. That's my biggest complaint about it - I wish it were more visually appealing. As for explanations, each new concept has an explanation but I do have to introduce the concept and explain it myself. I wouldn't say it is hard to teach, but I do find that I sometimes have to present the material in a different way for it to make sense to my kids. But I have a feeling I would have to do that regardless of which program we used. I have two using Math Mammoth right now, one in 3rd and one using a combination of 4th and 5th.

If your DH isn't immersed in the everyday education of your kids, I wouldn't worry about it. I agree with another poster that he might have been suggesting books that he enjoyed as a kid. And possibly it just slipped his notice what reading level your child is at. My husband isn't really a reader, so I really can't imagine him choosing an appropriate book for even my 10 year old. He wouldn't know where to start. I'm the educator in our home, so I'm very well aware of my kids' levels in reading and everything. I keep my husband well informed about what we do, but because he's not immersed in the day to day education, he doesn't always fully know where we are. When he does make suggestions, some of what he off-handedly suggests usually isn't on their level.

We primarily homeschool because we wanted to give our kids a better education than they were receiving in public school. Also, we didn't like the focus on testing in the school system. As for curriculum, I'm one of those who researches a lot. But I know that every parent has a different method, and I'm inclined to think that most parents research as best they can. Some of us just like researching a bit more than others. And some of us are probably overwhelmed by all of the options available! I know parents who unschool, parents who use online schools, parents who use box curriculum, and those who use a mix. I don't know any parents who blindly use curriculum just because someone else uses it, but all of my homeschool friends and I regularly share what works for us, and what doesn't. We make recommendations. Sometimes what works for us will work for someone else, sometimes it won't.

I know the Usborne science used price can fluctuate, so if you are able to wait to see if it goes down, maybe that could be an option. But, it's also a book you will use for several years, so it maybe be worthwhile to purchase new if you need it immediately. I haven't used any other Usborne science books, but if you are looking for more science books, my kids have also liked the Scholastic Discover More series. The books cover individual topics like weather, rocks and minerals, elements and more. The pictures are fantastic and each book also includes a code for online access to an online ebook.