:seeya: Reading you loud and clear. I'll refrain from further discussion here other than to defend the incorrect inferences from my post. I didn't suggest "you" have anything. I was replying to Scarlett's question about the phrase when your post must have gone through. I hadn't seen your post, didn't mention you by name, didn't quote you, and I certainly didn't correct you. I don't know you from Adam to care what baggage you do, or don't, carry with regards to that phrase or any other. I'll accept that I'm evolved, but I'm no mind reader; you flatter us both. I contributed my thoughts to an on-going conversation, and will continue to do so. It'd be great if you could, and would, too. A difference of opinions and reactions is what makes these discussions interesting and valuable; it's what challenges us in our own beliefs and invites us to better understand others'. Frankly, it's why I'm here - to read, to learn, to grow, to fritter away time while my car gets fixed ... What could have been an informative dialogue on how each of us (and others) interpret the phrase has been lost to, what, exactly? What was the point of your post to me, the one quoted above? the words you use, the tone you wrote with? Rhetorical question. I know we'd disagree on what it was and what was driving it. I bet we can agree that neither of us cares about the other's opinion on it, so here's to that! :cheers2: Nobody corrected you and nobody needs to give you permission to have, and to share, your own reactions. To assert otherwise is petty and absurd, but you know this. To infer that my having a different reaction than you has somehow prevented you from having your own reaction? Well, that is more indicative of your "self" more than it is mine - evolved as mine was said to be. To bring this full circle, note your use of the word EVOLVED. Like the words "baggage" and "broken home," use of EVOLVED in this context can be taken any number of ways. I accept it at face value, regardless of what your intent was - maybe you intended it at face value, maybe it was an emotionally charged attempt to get a rise. I maintain that it's our choice how to accept those words, however they are tossed our way. I already explained my reaction to "broken home" and can easily sum up my reaction to "baggage" at it's face-value: we all carry things through life that slow us down. I'll re-acknowledge that we're all at different places in our healing, and that this affects our ability to recognize the choices we have. But it's true that we have the choice in how we accept the words used by others. We assign their emotional charge (positive, neutral, negative) for ourselves. This has even been demonstrated on a large scale - the appropriation of negatively charged words such as those found in ethnic and sexual minority groups, e.g. It's true that some people are at a point where they are able to see this. It's also true that others are still weighed down by their experiences and pain, and not yet able to see that the choice exists. But I wasn't the one to claim this made one person better than another. I don't believe it to be true. You used evolved, but I think self-actualized is more appropriate. It describes where someone is on their journey, not who or what they are, which is more in line with what I originally posted. See you around campus, Joanne.

When I'm Queen of the World it will be punishable by fine to leave the TP roll next to the TP roll holder. There will also be a lesser fine for putting the roll on upside down. This isn't rocket science, people! I will use the money to fund the arts and public service announcements teaching people how to properly address the TP issue.

I'm divorced. The term "broken home" doesn't bother me, and - thus far, anyway - nor does it bother my children. I think we give rise to emotionally charged words when we can just as easily take them at face value. I think it's a choice, though perhaps a more difficult one for some depending on the baggage they carry over from negative relationships and painful experiences. I could replace the word BROKEN with a synonym, such as FRACTURED. And that's exactly what a divorce does - it fractures a home. A divorce legally fractures, or breaks, a family of origin. Also true: sometimes this break, or fracture, is the same or better than the INTACT family. One need only to look at mosaic art to see that something beautiful and good can come from the broken pieces. That a piece is a lovely work of art doesn't negate that it was created from broken bits. That someone is better off (emotionally) through divorce doesn't negate that this, too, was created from a broken relationship. The term "broken family" doesn't have to be anything more than descriptive - if insensitively so, to some people's perception - unless we choose for it to be. FWIW only one of my children has any genuine relationship with my ex-husband; the others are civil and courteous but could go the rest of their lives not interacting with their father ever again. They'd be the first to say that their home was much more 'broken' during our marriage than following our divorce. None of their friends come from divorced families, so the phrase 'broken home' could feel particularly loaded when coming from those families' mouths. And yet, it's just not a big deal to us because it's true - they are children from a broken, fractured home. Fortunately for them, we're all better off for it - financially, emotionally, spiritually, and physically. So we can shrug off any judgment, implied or inferred, and just accept the phrase at face value. Maybe it'd be different if we were struggling on any of those fronts, I don't know. We're not, which puts us in a great position to shed any baggage associated with the phrase and to move beyond it.

:lol: :grouphug: Oh dear, my mom had that same kid. Sorry! I'm not sure how she still manages to love me, but I promise you I'm not as big a PITA to be around as I was when I was younger. I think I finally outgrew it in my 20s. :leaving: Well, depending on who you ask. Here's hoping time flies LOL. I like the suggestion to trim out last week's suit's netting for today, at least. And here's another suggestion, I'm not sure if it'd work for your son but it always worked for me: "Oh, you need a new suit? Let's spend ALL DAY LONG running errands together, including a few stops to find you a [swim suit] along with every other boring store I can drag you to." Suddenly I was willing to ignore shirt tags and seams in my socks for at least the duration of school. I traded one source of irritation for another. I know not every kid is capable of this though.

My boys liked working with leather - 'they' sell kits (key fobs, moccasins, wallets, belts) or you can do your own thing with scraps. My boys would often punch leather and color it, then make something with it. For awhile we had a ridiculous amount of pouches and leather bracelets LOL. The tools can get pricey but for $20 and a 40-50% off coupon to most major craft stores you can get enough tools to work with. I also bought old leather bags and belts at thrift stores for them to use and rip apart. All of my kids have liked whittling - a great knife, a few supervised lessons (or YouTube?) and tons of bar soap! My daughter preferred to whittle wood, so she was always collecting branches in the yard and making shivs, which ... well, she has a lot of older brothers who expose her to things I wish they didn't and I'll leave it at that! She still always has her pocket knife on her and when bored at the park or something she'll pick something up; it appears therapeutic for her. Does your 9 year old have a close friend or sibling he can 'fight' with? Mine used to make cardboard and duct tape weaponry. There are probably similar project ideas in SOTW activity books but we bought some CDs at a homeschool conference about ten years ago that still get heavy use. Looks like they're still around, but now only in book or ebook format: https://www.warfarebyducttape.com/ Since your son likes to paint and draw, what about peg dolls? They parts aren't terribly pricey (~ $1 or less per doll when bought in bulk; also on Amazon) and paint is easy to find for under $1 at WM and hobby stores. Brushes needn't be pricey and he probably already has some. He can do the family, sports teams, super heroes, ... we've done saints, mostly, but also People In Our Community (firefighters, mailmen, etc.) as a gift for younger cousins. We like to put on a movie or music while we sit and paint. Lots of ideas on Pinterest and in blogs. It's not an overtly masculine craft, but I have mostly teen boys and they all get excited when I break out the dolls to paint LOL.

I spent years traveling for work, and as a military family we took every advantage to travel internationally wherever we were stationed overseas. My ex-husband and I are also immigrants from different continents, which has opened up many opportunities for travel. I feel like I've seen and done everything I personally have wanted to see and do. The only exception is that I wish to take each of my children to see the relics of or the historic area of interest relating to their patron saint. We are Catholic, so each child is named for a saint and each has (or will) choose(n) a patron saint upon Confirmation. So far only two of my kids have been to visit "their" saints, which puts me woefully behind. I thought I'd catch up once I retired a few years ago, but I seem busier at home now than I did while I was working. Strange phenomenon. I need to make this a priority, though. I always hear "bucket list" but never know what exactly it means LOL.

I'm a visual person so the idea of a vacation jar is along the lines of what I'd need to do. I think I'd actually use Monopoly money to illustrate a point to myself. I'd put a 24 hour moratorium on spending more than $20 and put $20 monopoly money into the Vacation Jar. If in 24 hours I wanted it back to purchase (x) instead, I'd have to physically remove it from the Vacation Jar and put it into the Other Crap Jar. I think after a few weeks I'd have a visual of how much "other crap" I spent my money on that could have gone towards my vacation, and that would motivate me to be more discerning about where I really wanted to spend my money. (And in the end, it may be that I decide my other crap means more than a vacation - who knows!) But these are the games I must play with myself. :lol: Remember that Marie Kondo book everyone was reading awhile back, the "touch it and thank it" decluttering book? It re-framed my mindset on THINGS in general, which has indirectly influenced my spending habits. The money I'm no longer spending on THINGS I DON'T NEED (which, if I'm being honest, is really: THINGS I DON'T WANT TO THANK AND TOSS IN SIX MONTHS) is sitting pretty for a rainy day, such as a vacation.

My teenagers work. Most of my boys do referee or umpire work (seasonally), and one is a junior training coach (assisting HIS coach at younger teams' practices). The boys also run private training lessons (in season) and speed & agility camps (off season) for their respective sports. My other son is more of a "get rich quick" guy who will come up with short-term money making ideas such as painting addresses on curbs for donation, power-washing trash cans for neighbors, etc. He buys bulk candy at Costco and re-sells it at profit to other kids at the park, practices, co-op, etc. His big earner is an annual garage sale for which he solicits donations all year long and makes most of his money in one shot. Every one of my kids babysit. My boys are surprisingly in demand - parents at their games, practices and church often ask them to watch their sons, especially. They'll get the occasional traditional babysitting gig, but usually it's more of a "mom's helper" thing where my boys take some high-energy younger kids to the park, or the pool, or just in the backyard to play while Mom runs errands or just gets things done inside. They've turned that idea into a few weeklong summer camps the past few years. This year two of my boys and a neighbor kid started a pet-sitting business. They charge $5 per visit, with most jobs requesting two visits per day while owners are away. They'll also do $10 for an hour at the dog park or to drop off/pick up from groomers (the boys drive) or to take the dog for a walk while the owner is at work. We have one neighbor who pays them $10/day M-F to let the dogs out at noon to potty, then bring them right back in. It's a 5 minute job. They usually outsource this one to my 11 year old during the school year because she will sit and play with the dogs for 15-20 minutes. All told, this man paid out $200/month to my kids, from Sept - May, with the expectation they'd spend less than 30 minutes per week with his dogs. Crazy money. Wish we had more neighbors like him, for my own income! :lol:

StephanieZ, I nodded through almost all of your post. This one sentence is something I wanted to touch on, WRT shawthorne44's POV. I was a paid sociologist and see where shawthrone44 is coming from. I don't share her takeaway on which habits fall into which levels, but her insight that those habits exist is spot on. You are absolutely correct in saying that spending habits do not EQUAL income or class. And shawthorne44 is correct in recognizing that there are identifiable spending habits FOUND within each income and class level. They won't represent everyone within a given class or income level (as evidenced through experiences shared within this very thread), but these habits often shed insight into the overall norms of a stated demographic. It's stereotypical, but also fairly predictable. Even people who aren't name-brand conscious for the commonly thrown around luxury goods (designer leather or shoe brands, e.g.) will have status symbols reflective of their social community. I made a great income analyzing people's spending habits :lol: I worked from home and on location as a consultant. This gave me the flexibility to move from a HCOL area (where I was middle-class income) to a LCOL area (where the same income was now upper-middle). The change in COL is what enabled me to retire early with a solid middle-class passive income on par with what my neighbors make by getting up early and going to work 5-6 days a week. The median income for my suburb of is $155K, which is $100K+ higher than the state median. According to this link, my state's COL rank is in the bottom (lowest) 15 nationwide: https://www.missourieconomy.org/indicators/cost_of_living/ There are many people living in this town who, like me, came from HCOL areas and are benefitting from the COLA. Longtime locals consider us transplants to be upper-middle, but really our spending habits still typically reflect the middle class we were in HCOL areas. We just came with enough positive cash flow to invest in bigger homes and newer cars. And that excess allows us to pay for landscaping, housekeeping, tutors, competitive pay-to-play sports for our kids, overseas vacations, and other things mentioned here as upper-middle class. Being able to afford those things reflects our COL more than it does our class level. I'm nodding in agreement with those who say income alone doesn't define class; I consider the majority of us transplants to be middle-classers in upper-middle-class clothing. I agree with your assessment, StephanieZ, that most people will self-identify at, or under, their accurate level. At least for me, "upper class" has the connation of having been born into it. And I like what someone said up thread about it being about power more than money.

I'd probably tip $1-2/day if they mostly did light re-stocking, and $4-5/day if they did a full clean. But when we stay at hotels more than 3-4 days consecutively I request that housekeeping NOT come daily. If we're staying under 7 days we just live with our mess; if we're staying longer than 7 days, I request weekly servicing. If we need fresh towels, we call down to exchange our dirties for cleans (or we put the dirties in the pool hamper, depending on the hotel). And then, yes, I'd tip $10-20 for the weekly clean. When I worked, I spent as many nights in hotels as I did my own bed. Years of talking with (and overhearing!) housekeepers has me trained to be as thoughtful a guest as possible LOL. Some of my colleagues were absolute pigs, and worse - proud of it. I always hoped my tip balanced out anything I overlooked in my own room, or the disgusting mess that was left by my colleagues. But I also spent years in a job where tips MADE me so when in doubt, I tip. Generously. It's never backfired!

If it were me, the suggestion I made would be to have an exit survey - an anonymous survey, if appropriate. And in that survey is where I'd offer feedback on current camp practices. I'd imagine I wasn't the only one with these, or other, concerns. Plus, for someone who isn't naturally charismatic, it offers the opportunity to also state what the camp does well. This will help couch the suggestions LOL. And the format lends itself to concise, matter of fact communication. But really what I'd do in your situation is just put that money towards hiring someone to drive and/or pick-up. It might be a great way for an existing camp worker to pick up a few bucks, or a fellow mom-friend who might like a little spending money. I've done this for a friend. It was easy money for me, and peace of mind for her! O/T: I love that there are camps like this, what a fantastic experience for your girls!

My little girl is 11 and is the only girl. She has a lot of older brothers with a lot of strong opinions and a lot of over-sharing of those opinions re: girls' appearances. I would never want her to change what she likes or who she feels she is because of something anyone said to or about her, especially a male. And yet I think it's important for her to understand how some of her choices are perceived ... whether it's how she dresses, how she does (or doesn't) follow social hygiene norms, how she speaks, etc. And not just from males, but from a range of sub-populations: professionals, women, peers, etc. Conversely I think it's important for my sons to know how females (and others) perceive THEIR choices in dress, hygiene, speech, etc. Our loved ones won't represent the whole of their gender, or age, or profession, or _______, but the insight they do offer is worth hearing. Sometimes it will be dead on, sometimes it will be way off. The point isn't to alter one's choice but to make it with a greater awareness of insights we may not have, be privy to, or have thought about previously. To me this is empowering the child. Empowerment isn't encouraging her to write off an opinion she disagrees with or dragging her through our tunnel vision over an emotionally-loaded word. Choice is empowering. Knowledge is empowering. Awareness is empowering. We don't have to be ignore or be afraid of being open to outside perspectives. We don't need to charge into battle and challenge those perspectives to the death as a primary course of action! Dad made one comment and used an adjective to describe the eyeliner (not to describe his daughter) during a time we know there are outside factors exacerbating his natural tendencies. He's not at his parenting best right now. That could describe any of the rest of us at any given point in our parenting careers. We can agree he's being unreasonable. But to negate his opinion because he used a hot-button word is not doing the child - or their relationship - any favors, either.

Congratulations on a new season in your life! There's a time we need to be fully focused on our marriage and our kids. There's also a time we need to re-gain focus on ourselves as individuals within those relationships - whether it's for our own benefit, or the benefit OF those relationships, or both. I retired almost 3 years ago. I feel like my life is going opposite of yours, so I'm happy to live vicariously through you and I hope you'll keep us updated as your move further towards your goal. :coolgleamA:

Why is she not wearing it - forgetfulness? how it feels? too lazy? doesn't see the point? doesn't want to stand out as the only one re-applying? All of the above? My children are mixed race, White & Asian. Most of them take after me and are darker. I never burn and one month into summer it's rare for me to get any more dark because I hit some kind of saturation point LOL. I'm not the best model for using sunscreen and only one of my sons ever uses it. He's the only one with lighter skin - still pretty tan by White standards, but light enough that he'll get one solid sunburn a year if he doesn't use sunscreen those first month or so of good sun (for him this is usually Spring baseball season). What convinced him was seeing the faces of coaches and ball players who spent years not using sunscreen. Think Marlboro Man type faces that may look rugged ... for a bit ... until they just start to look prematurely OLD and CRAGGLY. And by then they've started to use sunscreen but it gets stuck in the folds of their faces so they walk around with spots of white lotion not able to sink in easily to an overly-weathered surface and getting stuck in valleys of skin. Not cute!! And my son is vain enough that this motivates him to use sunscreen. Well, about 80% of the time LOL, which I'll take. I don't like spray sunscreen (or spray anything). I don't like to use commercial hygiene products either due to common ingredients. But I shove those ideals straight out the window on a few products - sunscreen being one of them. I'd rather he wear it, than not, and he wants that crap OTC sunscreen with yucky stuff in it ... so that's what I buy. :lol: As mentioned in another post, maybe she'd be more inclined to use a different sunscreen than what you sent - like the spray one?

Maybe it's time for you and DD to dig up some 60s or 70s-fabulous photos of Dad in all of his trendy glory. :lol:

I've worn my eyeliner like this, in heavy black, for almost 25 years. I'm not saying I ain't trashy, but if I am ... it's not the eyeliner! :leaving: I feel like as parents we all have >onething< that we over-react and pick the wrong battle about. It's part of growing as a parent to realize so. Hopefully you and she can see and approach it from that angle. It helps me to frame it like this when my ex-husband is reacting unreasonably LOL. It's part of maturing as a child to understand that, too. It sounds like your daughter is there and ... wasn't so much sneaking as asserting her own control as appropriately as she knew how to, while still allowing her father to maintain his. And by "his" control I mean the only thing he CAN control which is his opinion and reaction (including consequences). Knowing how he felt, she removed it in his presence. Knowing how you felt, she wore it in yours. I don't think she did anything wrong here, other than a crappy job of removing it completely LOL. Until her parents are on the same page, she's making a reasonable compromise for all parties. I'd resolve it by starting there. YOU need to advocate for her (privately) to DH and see WHERE (not if) he's willing to compromise with her. Then turn them loose to work it out between them. SHE can then run with her inclination to already remove it in his presence, and extend that to family gatherings or dates or whatever will leave him feeling more comfortable with her wearing it. I don't agree with him on the eyeliner, but I think most people have ideas of what they find immodest or trashy - and that's actually ok! What isn't okay is to push those opinions on certain people (e.g., near-adults) or allow them to cloud our opinion of someone. This is something so many of us work through, long into adulthood. I agree with her that it's reasonable to wear it outside of his presence, but I think she should also not let this be a hill SHE dies on. Encouraging her to respect the wishes of her dad will go a long way in other areas. As women, we may not find the look to promote a certain image but here's a man suggesting that it might. She doesn't have to believe him or agree with him, but she'd be prudent to at least hear him out with an open mind. (And he, her, as well.) There are likely to be times where his perspective as a man will shed light in her life, so it's important to open and prop open that door! Likewise, there are opportunities where our kids challenge us to be better. It's imperative we accept those and model to them how important it is to grow as people.

My personal rules: If I'm driving someone else's kids, no drinks at all out of consideration for their parents' comfort (spoken and unspoken). If I'm driving my kids, 1 straight drink with/before a meal or 1 mixed drink to model responsible social drinking to them. If I'm driving myself I play it by ear, but I usually cap it at 2 drinks in public for no real reason - just seems appropriate? Anytime I start to feel a buzz is the point I won't drive, even if I feel I'm able to (in the moment). At that point I'd consider myself to be driving "under the influence" because the alcohol would be affecting me physically and mentally. The Point of Buzz would depend on what I'd been drinking, what I'd been eating (or not eating), and how much time had passed. It usually takes 4-5 drinks in a short frame (like 1-3 hours) before I'll feel the effects of the alcohol. It's rare I'll drink that much socially, usually just at family weddings (hotel) or funeral wakes (home) where driving isn't an issue. I have been drinking several days a week for almost 25 years and have a high tolerance. We typically drink with at least one meal every day at our house, and it's common to greet and send off guests with a shot. I like to end my day with a night cap and alcohol is the main ingredient in half of our home remedies for illness LOL. I also come from a country of heavy social drinkers but now live in the Bible Belt, which has a very different outlook on drinking and drinkers. I try to respect local culture while still living my own. The courtesy has never been returned, but that's another topic ...

A friend just offered me a temporary job filling in for an employee who will be taking time off for maternity leave. The job doesn't require a degree, but advancement does. It's a competitive market and that's the easiest way to weed through candidates. It's the grown-up equivalent to taking the SAT or ACT - does it really demonstrate what you know and are capable of? No, but it's the standard many schools use to determine eligibility and fit. So it's a hoop worth jumping through, if you can swing it. The employee has been with my friend for 10 years. She started off P/T in high school and was hired F/T upon graduation. All of her training has been on the job - no certifications, no degrees, nothing to really vette her to a prospective employer if she went up for the same job at a different company. She's paid in the mid-range of the industry's standard because my friend values and wants to retain her talent, but anywhere else she'd most likely earn the lower-end and remain entry-level. I'll be earning $35/hour MORE to do the same job as she. Just having a degree (in an unrelated field and almost 20 years old) commands me in the upper-range of pay for the same work even though I have less direct, hands-on experience. I'd say a BA is definitely worth something. I agree with the points made above that a degree doesn't expire, that it's value (if nothing else) is in opening doors, and that just because a job description says it "requires" a Masters ... these are often cream of the crop wish list requirements but there is some flexibility in hiring outside of those requirements and it doesn't hurt to try!

My parents are not divorced; neither are my former in-laws. They've have been married 43 and 40 years, respectively. My grandmother is divorced, but it was a wartime marriage and her (American) soldier-husband abandoned her when his unit left the country. She re-married a local and was married ~ 40 years before my grandfather passed away. She's been single/widowed for about 35 years. She had three sisters who experienced similar wartime marriage and abandonment; two re-married locals and had long-term marriages, but the third never re-married. These are the only divorces in that generation, both sides of family. Of my grandmother's children, only one is sort of divorced. It was another marriage to an American soldier who was in-country at the time. He took her to the States and they divorced after five years because he developed a drug habit that fueled his abuse towards her and the kids. They never formally divorced, she took the kids and fled home. He was never heard from again. One of those kids has never married. She's a serial monogamist, but refuses formal marriage. I'm divorced. We were the first divorce for my ex-husband's side of the family, going back to his great-grandparents (at least). We're the only one in my generation (siblings, cousins) on my side of the family.

Congratulations to the graduate! Graduations can feel so stressful atop the excitement - I'm sure she's a jumble of emotions and the missing sash is no help. :grouphug: St. Anthony, pray for her!

:driving: I'm on my way! I'm not big on strawberries, and only eat them two ways: 1 - sliced, in a pool of cream with a drop of vanilla extract, with or without sliced almonds 2 - in a parfait (so basically the same as #1 but with yogurt instead of fresh cream LOL)

I'm okay that people think it's unreasonable LOL. Like you, I think that's nuts. I think that thinking is rooted in good intentions, but does no favors for a lot of teens. The concept of "no obligations" doesn't do society many favors, IMO. But I did just watch a Teen Mom 2 marathon so my thinking may be skewed right now.

Well ... we're from a culture where it's deeply rooted that you represent your family. It doesn't matter whether you care or not LOL. So to that end, I don't know how to answer your "what if" ...! I've had friends who broke ties and ran far away from home and filial obligations - some who ended up happily ever after and others who enjoyed their 'freedom' for years, until realizing that family meant more to them than they had previously realized. I suppose each family and each kid will be different. As an immigrant, I straddle the line between the culture I grew up in and the culture my children are growing up in. For a long time I felt "my" way was superior - it was hard not to considering how close I am to my family and how much I - we - have benefited from our relationships. Over time I've learned that "my" way is not superior, it's different. Not everyone has a family like mine that's worth some of the sacrifices we've made to stay close and integral to each other's lives. Not everyone has the desire to forego independence for interdependence. And those families are no less than my own. But they're not the kind of family, or life, that I want. I like the kind I have. It's my hope that my kids feel the same way. We talk about the families of their friends and we often compare the pros and cons of our family versus those of their peers. And there are definite pros and cons to each family and each type of family. I can't make them fall in line with our cultural/familial expectations, nor would I attempt to. Everyone here is a willing participant. We'll love you no matter what and you're always welcome home ... but we're not a buffet where you get to take what you want without paying in. It sounds like this isn't all that different from other families on this thread who don't share our ethnicity or family type!

I answered the other questions in the other thread. I wouldn't REQUIRE church attendance* but I EXPECT it. So does our Church :seeya: we have a Sunday/Holy Day obligation of which they are all aware and in the habit of fulfilling (or to seek dispensation for). One caveat: Attendance is mandatory when family is visiting. It's also mandatory if you're attending college local to me. Because I'll know. LOL What you do when I can't see you is on you. Other obligations? I guess this: You carry the family name and represent us, like it or not, want to or not; live accordingly. Or as my brother just summed it up: "Don't be an a-hole." But that's an obligation/expectation regardless of who's paying for college LOL.

My parents approached college as mandatory, not optional (for us). They narrowed down which majors they wanted us to choose from. We were expected to earn scholarships to put towards our own college costs. It was understood that they'd cover the difference, if any. College was viewed as a FAMILY INVESTMENT in which we all had a role to play. We're Asian and it feels typical of my (Asian) friends' experiences, too. Grades were expected to be high, regardless of who was paying for school. This was carried over from K-12 LOL. It was expected that we'd drink, but not to excess. Our social life was expected to not interfere with our studies. We were to avoid undesirable people independent of who was paying for school. They preferred we didn't have a job; our job was to be a successful student. Obligations included family time, even if we attended school far from family.