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Lyn

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Everything posted by Lyn

  1. Nicole: I too was surprised about the nonchalance about food, but the number of posts in this vein is rather small so perhaps it is not really representative. So many colleges have improved food quality and have realized that it directly impacts their students health, behavior and performance. Margaret: It is that college selection time of year and this is a very widely read thread with lots of good info. It even provides food for thought ( no pun intended) for parents who are not even looking at Hillsdale. Often parents and students are overwhelmed during the college selection process and forget that the quality of the administration will impact the student. It is important to look at the school's financials, their food service, placement department, special needs depts., etc..
  2. When looking at a college it is always a good idea to look at their financials. A good place to look is charity navigator. Here is a link to charity charity navigators info on Hillsdale College: http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=3823 Your can see that an unusually large percentage of their budget goes to their president's salary of 1.9 million. This is way out of skew with similar colleges. Just look up Grove City College. Also, lots and lots of money is spent on marketing at Hillsdale. You can use charity navigator to look up other colleges and compare...then draw your own conclusions.
  3. Great article. I see it as a way of constructing one's own college education...something meaningful and relevant. I somethimes fantasize about what kind of education I could construct for my college age son for the thousands of dollars we are spending on each year's college tuition. If there had been an internet back when homeschooling began, I bet we would have seen very similar pros and cons presented in the discussion of homeschooling. The fact is that the student loan bubble will eventually pop. People will start looking for options other than the standard four year university and the self constructed education will eventually become widely accepted by employers. I do think it is possible for a young person to build a very interesting and dynamic resume through the right kind of travel, work and volunteer experiences.
  4. Other posters have given lots of good advice, but here are a few other things to consider: Ask about their alumni network. A strong alumni network can mean a great deal when looking for a job after graduation. Ask if they include nonpaid internships in their employment numbers. One school that does this is Hillsdale College. Obviously it pumps up their after graduation employment numbers. Find out about their placement department. Get detailed info about services it offers current students, what services they offer before and after graduation (for ex. will they work with your freshman on their resume and give practice interviews to help with seeking summer jobs or internships), How has their placement dept. been rank by Princeton review. What jobs are available on and off campus for students. Are on campus jobs only offered to students with financial need. Inquire about organized activities on campus. If your student is not real outgoing, being involved in organized activities on campus will help them meet others and give them a sense of belonging. Look up the names of faculty, preferably in the area your student is interested in majoring in. See how the profs. rank on some online professor ranking services and read student comments. Visit the cafeteria and meet with the chef or dining manager. To know what questions to ask, visit the website for Bon Appetit http://bamco.com/about-us/clients (if the school you are looking at is on their client list you can be assured that the food served there is very healthy). If not familiarize yourself with what Bon Appetit offers in its cafeterias and see how the school you are looking at measures up. Don't underestimate the importance of healthy food. Students' immune systems are put to the test on campus...close living, stress and late nights. Being served healthy food on a daily basis can make a difference. Visit the Charity Navigator website and see how the school ranks. Ask about anything they have been marked down on.
  5. In the school systems today it is quite common for parents to hold children back a year. Especially if your child has a b-day after Sept. 1. So having a child start college as a 19 yo would not look the least bit unusual to a college admittance officer. You could begin high school classes whenever you felt they were up to the academic challenge and just note on your transcript for those classes as "taken in 7th grade" or "taken in 8th grade" as long as it is a high school level class it is correct to place it on the transcript. We did not do a growth year for my ds who is now a college freshman, but he actually did begin high school classes in 7th grade and it was not an issue with the colleges.
  6. What I supplied them with was a letter describing how our classes were conducted and the fact that we he had unlimited time on tests. It wasn't good enough and they basically don't give you any guidance. I have brought this issue to the attention of the HSLDA because I think it is an issue that will impact many home school families. The HSLDA has basically said that there is no legal recourse because they are a private organization, but they are contacting them to see if they can get more specific guidance for home school families. My quote above came from their recent contact with ACT, but hopefully they will glean more specifics in their follow up contact. The one thing that I wish I would have done (but had no idea I needed to) was to go to the public school and get an IEP. Depending on the state you live in this may or may not be a good option depending on the laws of your state and whether your school district is hs friendly.
  7. We have had experience with this very issue and I would be very interested in the experience of others. My oldest (who is now in college) had a formal workup done by an educational psychologist and was diagnosed with dyslexia based on this huge (and expensive) battery of tests that they administer. Once we had this I thought that we would have no problem receiving accommodations because we had paid privately for occupational therapy, vision therapy, and speech therapy over the years and was able to provide documentation regarding these therapies. The college board did grant some accommodations, but they were rather stingy and the ACT granted none. The roadblock that we ran into was that they place a great importance on showing that you have an IEP and that you have been receiving accommodations all along in your school career. Here is a copy of a portion of an email received from the ACT: Students who have been homeschooled must meet the same documentation guidelines as students who have attended public or private schools. ACT requires confirmation of past and current test accommodations from all applicants. If the student receives test accommodations, the person providing them (homeschool teacher, parent, co-op, or consortium) must document them. Please submit a statement that indicates a) what accommodations are provided; b) how often and under what conditions they are used; and c) the length of time for which the accommodations have been provided. If the student does not routinely use the requested accommodations, or if timed standardized tests are not part of the student’s curriculum, please provide documentation that shows the need for the requested accommodations on the ACT. The problem was that my word did not seem to be sufficient as far as accommodations received. As a home schooled parent, you always accommodate your teaching and testing to your students. That is part of the reason most people homeschool. So this really leaves home schooled students at a disadvantage.
  8. Ame: My situation is different, but I thought I would still jump in here and offer some advice. I still have one at home (the other at college) so this year has been a bit of an adjustment. I know it will be tougher when they are both out of the house. What has helped me thus far is intense exercise. Cardio. 3 to 4 days a week and an equal amount of yoga. Keeping busy in general helps. I too work, but am self employed. If you find that you have too much time on your hands, perhaps looking for some volunteer opportunities in your area. It would give you a chance to meet some new people and do something that you find interesting. Last, but not least, a good therapist may also take the edge off of some of this for you especially since you know how your history is playing into this. :grouphug:
  9. We toured Hope and I didn't run across anything that stuck me as overly liberal. Their chapel services are definitely contemporary. They have held the line on their views of homosexuality which is consistent with the Dutch Reformed Church. I am not intimately familiar with the teachings of the Dutch Reformed Church so perhaps there is something in there that some could construe as liberal. Didn't see any classes that struck me as bizarre. Maybe some consider them liberal. Don't really know. Maybe someone who has a student there could offer something more definitive.
  10. Just wanted to post the following form Patrick Henry's FAQ page under its camps. What is the food service like? Food is served in the PHC dining commons and is provided by BON APPÉTIT Management Company. BON APPÉTIT was named #1 College Food Service in the country by the Princeton Review (2001) and was recipient of SAMCEDA’s Award of Excellence for service to the community (2006). What about special dietary needs or allergies? Special dietary needs are accommodated. Campers with special needs must advise camp staff both through the Health Form and upon registration. So for parents who are looking for a conservative and possible Christian College who values the health and well being of students enough to offer some great dietary choices and accommodation for allergies etc. Here is a list worth considering: Patrick Henry Wheaton Hope College Grove City
  11. I was surprised by the fact that no matter how expensive the school, after merit scholarships they all ended up costing about the same. We really didn't qualify for financial aid. It is similar to shopping for a new car....here is the sticker, but this is what everyone pays. My advice would be to not rule out schools based on cost. Apply and then see what the real bottom line is.
  12. I really had to chuckle about this...Grove City, a college very much like Hillsdale in curriculum and the fact that they don't accept public funds, uses Bon Appetit for its food service. This means that they too have no trans fats, no hormones in their milk or beef etc. http://www.cafebonappetit.com/menu/your-cafe/grovecity'>http://www.cafebonappetit.com/menu/your-cafe/grovecity You can search a college's name right here on the Bon Appetit site to see if they are a client. http://www.cafebonappetit.com/
  13. Chris: The point I was trying to make earlier is that it is not unreasonable to expect healthy food from a school. There are more and more schools offering rbgh free milk, transfat free oils and even grass fed beef. For us this is important and would be even if my son did not have allergies. Ten years or maybe even five years ago this would have been very difficult if not impossible to find on a college campus, but it is much more mainstream now. The rub with Hillsdale is the fact that they seemed so intent on hiding the fact that they did not offer what I was looking for. Frankly, if I loved everything else about a school and was convinced that they were sincerely looking to make their food offerings more healthy, I would not cross them off my list. Ultimately, it is the hiding of facts that is most disturbing. Like I said, if they believe that their food service program is great the way it is, and don't want to be bothered with parents who have such concerns, why not post what they actually use on their website for all to see.
  14. Very informative discussion about deposits. I had no idea that the college board had these guidelines. In our instance we had some acceptances that that led us to believe that the spot may not be available by May 1 if a deposit was not made prior to that date. It also clearly indicated that these deposits were refundable up until May 1. I kinda read this as you need to make a deposit if you are still seriously considering our school. So I am not sure if those particular schools have different policies than the norm. Very confusing.
  15. In regards to the question on the whistle blower policy, I see that someone provided the answer, but here is a little background: http://www.nonprofitrisk.org/library/articles/employment091005.shtml As you can see it is just good business practice to have such a policy in place. I'm in agreement with the comment that stated that there is no good reason not to have one, and some potentially bad reasons to avoid having one. The comment about not having deposits with more than one college was not really accurate. There are in fact some colleges that offer more acceptances than spaces. They will state in their acceptance letter that to guarantee a place at May 1 you need to make a deposit and if you change your mind prior to that date your deposit is refundable. So different schools, different MO's. It seems to me that some of the comments are being made by individuals who have not carefully read this thread. One example is the gal who would have her child with food sensitivities eat out of a fridge in his dorm room. Really! First, you missed the part about Hillsdale avoiding my dining related inquiries, and then falsely answering the questions I posed about dining services. Had they answered my questions honestly from the beginning, we would have crossed them off our list, but it looked to me like a bait and switch tactic. Second, what I require in regards to dining services has nothing to do with "organic produce". Where did that come from? Hillsdale is cooking with vegetable oils that contain trans-fats and serving milk that contains rgbh. This is not the standard in college food these days. See for yourself: http://www.housing.umich.edu/dining/nutrition#livechat http://www.cafebonappetit.com/our-ap...hen-principles http://hope.edu/dining/ http://www.calvin.edu/admin/food/nutrition.html Cafe Bon Appetit (see link above) manages the food service for a number of colleges. Now I realize that not everyone is health conscious when it comes to their eating habits, but there must be enough people demanding this level of healthiness in college food or there wouldn't be such a large number of institutions providing it. One poster concluded that this is how they keep their tuition lower. Perhaps, but they should be up front with this info. when asked. Or why not put it on their website for all to read. When you think about it, would it cost that much more per student to use better milk and cooking oils. I really doubt it. However, at the end of the day I really wonder what else they are hiding. Catherine, Stripe and Lenore, thanks for your wise words. On this board, especially, you wouldn't think these ladies employ argumentum ad hominem. I suspect that some of the more nasty posts come from individuals with ties to Hillsdale because I can't imagine anyone getting in such a fluff over this topic. At this point, this thread has received more than 4,000 views so in retrospect the percentage of those posting vicious comments is pretty small.
  16. Certainly, every family is different and will select a college based on their own priorities. It would be a problem if we all liked the same college.:001_smile: It is obvious that we have some pretty staunch Hillsdale defenders on this board. Before visiting, I probably would have thought that there couldn't possibly be anything wrong with this institution. In fact, we have been donors. Received their lovely mailing with the $2 bill a couple days ago soliciting funds for their new on-line constitution program. Anyway, I am no longer impressed. Some pointed out that the town/gown issue is not all that uncommon. However, you need to realize it does make a difference to some families. Some college ranking services even break out schools by whether there is tension between the college and the town. From my perspective this was just another sign that arrogance, rather than humility, was promoted at this institution. We saw arrogance in the attitudes of almost everyone we dealt with at Hilldale. The comments from the towns people supported what we were seeing ourselves. The people did not seem genuine and honest. We prefer to have our child in an environment that will promote humility not arrogance. Don't forget that this institution does not have a whistle blower policy. This is certainly unusual and not very reassuring. The issue we had with the food service was multifaceted. Our initial inquires were ignored. Then our questions were not answered honestly. Basically, they did not want to admit that they were cutting corners. Regardless, of the fact that my ds has a food allergy, I would not have been comfortable sending him away to a school that uses oils with trans-fats to prepare their foods and serves milk with rbgh. As you can see from links in my earlier post, it is not common practice in the college dining industry to use these types of things...they are unhealthy. They are also cutting corners on the salad bar as I mentioned above. This is the info. I was able to obtain in a couple of visits so there are probably other ways that they are cutting corners that I did not see. While this will be of concern to some of the 3,000+ viewers of this thread, to others it will not. We happen to be health conscious. Someone brought up ADA issues in response to my mention of them requiring Drs. notes for food allergies. Well, I am not sure that a food allergy is a disability. Disability is defined differently under different statues. However, no other school we visited required any kind of rx in order for a student to avail themselves of a special diet. Special diets seem to be no problem whatsoever at the majority of schools. This again is a reflection of the attitude at Hillsdale. Again my overall impression is that there is a undercurrent falseness at this institution. Why mention the Sarah Palin double? Perhaps she is just a visual that underscores the overall feeling of a facade.
  17. Here are links to the dining service sites of some of the schools we considered that did an excellent job of providing for a gluten free diet and consistently offered foods that were free of trans-fats and rBGH free milk. http://www.housing.umich.edu/dining/nutrition#livechat http://www.cafebonappetit.com/our-approach/kitchen-principles http://hope.edu/dining/ http://www.calvin.edu/admin/food/nutrition.html Also on touring these facilities I didn't have the feeling they were cutting corners...the salad bars were full of green leafy lettuce, not iceberg lettuce and the chefs were proud of their offerings and interested in meeting our needs. So for those of you who are concerned about what your child is being fed while away at school, there are a number of options.
  18. Chris: When it comes to wheat/gluten issues there are allergies and sensitivities. Both can have devastating effects. Below is a link to a Wall Street Journal article that discusses this issue. The original article in the paper had a very interesting chart that divided up the effects that wheat/gluten had on those sensitive. Some of these effects include neurological effects in one segment of individuals, intestinal in others, etc. Unfortunately, I think the on-line version isn't quite as informative as it might be had it included all this info. As far as the rx goes we could supply one because we have an integrative dr. who is experienced in these issues. Unfortunately, there are those out there that may not have access to an integrative dr. and are diagnosed by a chiropractor who is knowledgeable. The bottom line is, as you will see in the article, that for some people simply eliminating it will make a big difference in their health. Every school we looked at was equipped to handle many types of allergies, wheat/gluten, nut, etc. All also accommodated vegetarians. I think that Hillsdale is motivated by cost savings. In general gluten free products tend to be more expensive. At no other school did they have such stingy policies or attitudes. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704893604576200393522456636.html
  19. Wow!! A lot has been said since my last post. First of all, for those who suggested others on campus to contact, thank you. However, we already went up the chain of command and did not get what we felt were appropriate responses. Next, to those who think that my concerns are petty, that is your right. These things are important to me and perhaps because of my professional background (I routinely perform due diligence engagements for clients along with management consulting engagements) some of the things that I was seeing, along with the fashion in which my inquires were handled, raised red flags in my mind about the integrity of leadership at the college. Also, the same questions were asked of all schools we looked at and the response at Hillsdale was very different. For those who are suggesting that I am a troll, I have probably been on this board longer then many of you. I was a member of this board before it was changed over to this new format. Perhaps a moderator with access to Susan's site can verify this information. Because I am a busy homeschool mom and a working professional, I rarely take time to post. I will do a search if I am looking for some particular info., but, in fact, do little posting. Actually, I posted much more on the old board because hs was new to me at the time. I really felt compelled to post my experience because I was so disgusted and I was curious to see if anyone had similar experiences. Over the years I have known several families that sent their children to Hillsdale and it was only in the last year that I have heard some griping from families that I know. Last, but not least, for those who must know why I would stay over when I lived only two hrs. from the college: First visit we had an early appt. with admissions. Second visit, my son was staying overnight so it saved me an extra trip and gave me time to look around in town. To conclude, I hope this info. will be useful to others in their college search process whether or not you are considering Hillsdale. It has certainly taught me that just because you think you know an institution you should always do your own due diligence.
  20. Ds is still trying to decide between three remaining schools. Hoping he does this on time because I don't want to lose deposits. Yes, I was quite surprised by our experience too. I do know that they have been advertising on the Rush Limbaugh show and have had quite a response. After all, they only have approx. 300 openings. We were told that they have become so selective that many of their top students from two or three years ago would not be admitted now. So perhaps they are starting to feel quite elite, but there is really no excuse for the attitudes displayed. We toured both University of Chicago and University of Michigan and the contacts we had at both of these seemed very intelligent, but not pretentious. As far as the food, I don't think the students complain of it being bad. Those we know that attend there have said that after awhile they do tire of it because the selection is rather limited. As a parent, I have a problem with them cutting corners. Fast food restaurants have made more of an attempt to make their food healthy than Hillsdale's dining room This may be the result of them trying to keep tuition low in an economy of rising food prices, but if that is the case they should have been candid. The evasiveness was a real turn off. One person I actually spoke with from town had worked at the school for over ten years. This person seemed to be of the same opinion (in regards to student attitudes towards towns people) even though they dealt with the students on a regular basis. I think what really stuck me was the contrast between my interactions with Hillsdale and my interactions with other schools. Honestly, it was night and day. JMHO
  21. For many years we had great admiration for Hillsdale college and what they were all about...that is until we looked more closely. I thought I would share these thoughts since so many homeschool families consider Hillsdale. My ds was accepted early app. he was pretty sure that was where he wanted to go (probably because he knew so many others there), but we placed deposits with other schools that he was accepted to just in case. In the end we are glad we did. Our first visit (prior to acceptance) was for his interview. It was ok, but not impressive. The student that gave him the tour was a quite pompus theology major. The admissions officer we met with was equally unimpressive. He had graduated the June before and had an arrogant attitude. He was also very lazy when it came to following up on email questions over the next few months. Other parents I spoke to in our hs circles had issues with this guy as well. He lost one boy's letters of application twice. Maybe it's me, but I prefer dealing with a mature adult when exploring a college's offerings. I figured that admittance officer had gotten his job because he had graduated and couldn't find anything else so the school, wanting to keep up its employment numbers up, gave him a job in admissions. However, a friend with a child who graduated last year told me that the admissions people are actually 'hand picked' from the graduating class. Apparently, the school feels that it is a duty and an honor for these graduates to serve the school in a low paying admissions job for a year after graduation. Sooo, this is one of their better students. The other thing I have to mention here, which was rather funny, but in a bizarre kind of way. The admissions secretary had made herself up to look exactly like Sarah Palin. She had the glasses and the hair...obviously this was quite intentional. The next time we went there it was for my son's overnight visit. I stayed in town at a bed & breakfast (because on our first visit we stayed on campus at the Dow and came home with bug bites). I spent some time in town talking with some of the business owners and just checking out the local offerings. What I gained from my conversations with some of the business people is that the students from Hillsdale treat the town's people rather rudely. Again, that pompous attitude. Apparently, the towns people are referred to as "Townies"by the students, and the locals find it rather derogatory. They also shared with me that Hillsdale's main goal is to produce a US president. I also made inquires about cafeteria related issues because my son has food sensitivities. The first time I made inquires by email to the dining service manager (per instruction from the admissions officer). These went unanswered. Upon my second visit I spoke directly with him. He seemed evasive and not forthcoming. When we visited the school recently for an event I found that he had actually misrepresented some of the facts. If you are interested in the food area, here are some of the facts I unearthed: The offerings for wheat/gluten sensitive students is limited to mostly stir-fry's. They are stingy as to who will qualify to receive that food. If you have an Rx from a chiropractor they will not accept that (only rx's form medical doctors). Apparently, they get angry because some students on the special diet have been seen eating wheat products. I guess they don't understand there are degrees of sensitivity. They also use vegetable cooking oils with trans-fats in almost everything and milk offered there includes Rbgh. I also noticed that the salad bar was mostly iceberg lettuce with a tiny bit of mixed greens scattered throughout. Oh, and I must say that my persistent inquiries were not well received. Had this been the only college cafeteria I looked at in such great detail, I might have concluded that all college food would be similar, but that is not what I found from visiting other small liberal arts colleges. As far as placement after graduation, the placement department is almost nonexistent. An acquaintance's daughter graduated last summer and she says that the placement department is just a couple of older ladies that don't do much. Her daughter ended up with a good job, but through no effort of the placement department. In reviewing an on-line rating service for donors they seemed to be ranked lower than other similar institutions. One of the the things they lack is a whistle-blower policy. Not surprising. My impression is that they wouldn't want anyone around declaring that the "king has no clothes". The curriculum is the most appealing thing about the school, but after looking at other conservative liberal arts school's curriculum, it dawned on me that you could put the same type of core curriculum together with classes from English and political science departments. So overall, I was left with the impression that Hillsdale is a facade with not a lot of substance behind it. It does not seem to be an institution that promotes humility and independent thinking. Also, it seems that they cut corners wherever they can.
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