My daughter (12 yr old) LOVED the Creative Writer. It turned writing into her favorite subject. After the first level, we are now doing OYAN and saving things like WWS for another year? or maybe not at all. WWS made us crazy here too. I wish I could just get the WWS dummies guide, so I would understand the basic goal and final destination so I could teach it myself. I agree it can be maddening at times in it's complexity, though some people really work well with that style.

I'm glad we started it this year! My daughter is in grade 7 and she really likes it. It's nice that it's so independent and doesn't take much time during the week. We've been using it with LTOW (loosely) and with WWS2 (though I've been doing WWS2 at half time because it's just a bit too much writing for the week. I don't know if we'll continue on into the poetry half of the book or not. We've been doing one lesson a week (on fridays). I'll see how our year is going. I'm glad to see they have a level 2 as well. We might do the story part of level 2 first and then go back and pick up the poetry unit in CW1 afterwards.

This is what we are doing this week too... trying to use WWS 'framework' to apply it to our own material. I feel like WWS is taking too much time out of our day and then she's too tired to do any other writing. I wish that either WWS was only a 2 or 3 day a week program, OR that SWB would publish another Complete Writer focusing on the middle grades like she did with WWE.

shhh! don't tell anyone, but we skipped a big chunk of the middle of the book to skip ahead to the literary analysis and the poetry sections because we wanted to mix it up a bit and enjoy a different style of writing. My DD enjoyed these parts much better than the beginning of the book.

yay! It worked! Thanks Justin! Now I have something to listen to while folding laundry :D

Thanks! Except, I'm having a problem purchasing it. It says 'the request quantity is not available' and won't let me put it in my shopping cart. I only tried to purchase 1. Looking forward to listening to it!

Thanks Michele!! That is great to hear :) I love downloads, because the shipping to canada is usually so expensive and there are never 'free shipping to canada' sales :confused:

Thanks!! I couldn't find that page for some reason. Do you think the audio download is just as good as the DVD? I would love to save the shipping costs, if it's worth it.

Can you post a link? I can't find it :)

We used classical comp for fable and narrative (after having done level 2 of writing tales and a bit of CW homer).. so we've done quite a bit of work in the early pro gym stages. I've just started looking into next year (7th grade) for writing. It's the last thing I need to plan out, and I would love to get some help from others who have used this curriculum. It looks really crazy to me! It's such a jump from the first two levels, and I'm having a hard time figuring out how we are going to tackle it. Maybe it's because the version that I own is the earlier Selby one that was in a binder (not the brown covers)... have they updated it significantly to warrant another purchase? It just seems to me that it's going to be difficult for my daughter to use the program. The language of the samples seems so flowery and hard to understand. Is she supposed to be writing with that same style? It's so different than the fables and narratives from last year. help!! We also have LTOW (3rd edition) and I am loving what I see, looking through it. Maybe we should just skip CComp and use LTOW for our program? It's so hard to see what the bigger picture is as she's my oldest and I'm not sure where we are going with all of this. thanks for any help

Also, another Kolbe mom and myself moderate a yahoo group called "Kolbe parents learn the classics". We aren't too active, but the idea is that hs parents can read the high school books ahead of the kids (or alongside) so that we are better prepared to teach them when we get there. Anyone is welcome to join us :)

Here are a few reviews for kolbe academy that I found helpful when i was looking into it originally. There is quite a bit about the high school program.

From a newsletter they sent out last year (aug 2011... the newsletters are linked from this page) this is what they said: (although I think their timeline for implementation has been delayed a bit, since Memoria Press took over the publishing for CC this year... meaning right now I know they have course plans available for Fable, narrative and a beta one for chreia/maxim with the others following shortly).

You can look at samples of any of their course plans here. They include a summary of the objectives for the course, and then a daily breakdown (into quarters) of the work to be done each day with a space for checking off work done, and recording grades. For most courses, there are also 4 quarter tests and answer keys. The language arts programs are using books that are fairy open and go, so you probably wouldn't need a course plan.. though I enjoy having everything planned out across the year into 4 quarters. Kolbe plans 7 weeks of work, 1 week of review and 1 week for exams (mostly a week off, if you do the exams at the beginning of the week). They follow the Ignatian style of education which I don't know LOTS about (8filltheheart has talked about it a bit on here somewhere)... it is very classical... and one of their main tenants is that you need periods of review to really solidify the knowledge. This is something as homeschoolers we often ignore, I think. The quarter system keeps the year in manageable chunks for me. In feb, I don't feel crazy that we are only on week 25... I think, yay! We are on week 7 of quarter 3!! Horray! almost done another quarter. :-) anyways, the LA programs are: grammar: the Old Voyages in English edition (very similar to R&S I believe, but don't quote me on that ) vocab: Sadlier/oxford vocabulary workshop. We used this last year and it was a good book. I don't have anything to compare it to because we haven't used anything else. there's samples of it here. writing: Classical Composition or Sadlier/oxford. Classical comp has been discussed on these boards before.. try searching it. It's also been discussed quite a bit on the Koble forum. The sciences often draw people to Kolbe as well, because they use the often more rigorous school textbooks like Holt (Life science and Earth Science are the two middle school books). I just received the plans for the life science course and I like how they have picked through the book, choosing which chapters to skim through and which to go into more depth so that it fits into the quarter system they follow. I could do it myself, but I love having the option of following their plan so I don't have to ... but still tweaking when I like. Some people are drawn to plans like this, because they like the 'idea' of it, but then they end up tweaking it so much that they might as well have not bothered to pay for it in the first place, because they ended up doing most of the work of planing anyways LOL. hth :)

I think they first came out with the TTC DVD and seminar workbook, which is what most people mean when they are talking about TTC. This is the theory of how to do lit analysis. You can then apply it to any book you choose. Then, they produced these Teacher Guides leading you through the process in specific books, holding your hand through the whole thing. They are pdf downloads (helpful to save on shipping!) You can try the entire guide for 'The Bronze Bow' for free. They also have a compilation of teacher guides grouped by age. These are called Ready Readers and are also available as a pdf download. Then, if you really want to have everything done for you, you can just buy a DVD of Adam Andrews teaching a lit course on a particular book. This includes a syllabus. These are called the Classics Club. There are a few other resources they sell that I haven't looked into, except which is a table that briefly lists plot, conflicts, themes and literary devices for over 200 books (K-12). I'm sure you can just find a lot of this out by either a) reading the books yourself and thinking about them, or b) using the internet or sparknotes/coles notes... but it does look handy to have anyways. It also is available as a download.

I haven't used the Sadlier-Oxford writing program either, as we have followed the more classical route (Writing Tales, CW Homer, and now Classcial composition)... but in some ways I wish I had also done a bit of the more 'normal' writing program to get in some practice in regular non-progym writing (i.e. letters, short reports, essays etc...). I know in the end we'll end up in the same or better place, but along the way sometimes I wish we had the same skill set as the kids in public school. (but that is a whole other topic).

We skipped through most of WWS1 very quickly, but did the whole section on lit analysis, and I agreee.. it was very helpful. DD used what she learned to apply to her Kolbe lit study and it really enhanced the Kolbe program for us. In some ways, Kolbe is assuming you are doing a writing program (they use either Classical Comp, or Sadlier writing workshop) so there isn't a lot of teaching on how to do the writing assignments.

I havent' looked at my WTM for ages. It will be a good summer read for me :) It's nice to see there is quite a bit of overlap. I started out doing WTM very faithfully, but with teaching 5 kids and having two 'helpers' underfoot, I ended up doing mostly kolbe the last two years to keep my sanity. The lit program looks really good for us for next year... but I also broke down and bought Teaching the Classics (just the DVDs and workbook to go with them). I wanted to have a bit more of the 'how to do literary analysis' skills so we could have spontaneous discussions without me feeling lost or inadequate. I also checked Deconstructing Penguins out of the library and read very quickly through it last month. It was very helpful and inspiring. I highly recommend it!! It made me WANT to learn to do literary analysis, instead of dread it. btw, sometimes the Kolbe material seems hard to understand, or as if it's lacking extra explanations that would be helpful. This is often because the course plans are just 'part' of the whole package of being enrolled: families who are enrolled have the advantage of calling the advisors whenever they need to ask questions and seek out the help they need. I love their content and the direction that they are going. I just wish they were as slick in presentation as the Memoria Press materials which are so easy to use.

:001_smile: No problem. I just remember when I was looking into it and I really wanted to know what was inside.. their samples are sort of helpful, but don't give the full picture at all. One thing I would note is that the people in their office and book store are super helpful if you want to call them and ask a question. Their prices in the bookstore are quite reasonable, but many people get the books elsewhere used. Because Kolbe is as accredited school that you can register with for K to gr 12, they don't do a lot of marketing of their materials to people who aren't registered with them. Not because they don't care... probably just because they are a small organization and don't have the man power to think about marketing effectively outside their sphere of influence. Compare this to Memoria Press, who started out marketing individual curriculum to homeschoolers.. and then moved into full year plans. Kolbe is very good at breaking things into daily chunks and spreading them out through 4 quarters, but has many pieces to put together and the presentation isn't as nice. MP is more of a book you could sell in a store, with lovely introductions, nice binding, Table of Contents, index etc... To someone who isn't used to Kolbe's style of course plans and books and ordering...etc.. they can seem a bit confusing, however. This past year, I registered my 6th grade daughter in kolbe (mostly to get the elem. lit plans). While I did tweak a few things, I found that i loved having a lot of the preplanning done for me in the other courses. I love how they have the year split into four quarters (7 weeks on, 1 week review, 1 week exam). We are going to do grade 7 next year with a few tweaks (history and supplementing writing). I also have my eye on the high school plans. They look fascinating (and intimidating at the same time). I haven't seen anything beyond the 7th grade plans. One thing I like about Kolbe is their science is quite rigorous compared to some of the other schools you can get course plans from. We are going to use the Holt life science course next year (new middle school science option for kolbe next year). They are also working on writing up elementary plans for Singapore math as they are moving away from Saxon and MCP. (although it is still an option if people want to use it).

The elementary plans are also nice. They do not have the short story or poetry course, however. They also do not include literary devices or the elements of fiction, and have very limited 'literary analysis'. However, I love the chapter summaries for the parents in the course plans, the weekly assignments (which are quite similar to the jr high course) and parts of the final exams. The student book has the questions, vocabulary and glossary. The Teacher's book has all the 'answers'. The course plans are what have the assignments, final exams and chapter summaries

I just bought these for my upcoming 7th grader. I can tell you a bit about them. Firstly, the Jr High lit course is much much more robust than the elementary course. The elem. course is fine for those ages (we used the comprehension questions orally to check understanding and then had conversations about the books). The Jr high course has a lot more in it. First There are three parts to purchase: 1) The Student book 2) The Teacher's Guide 3) The Course Plans 1) The Student Book: $20. This is a large spiral bound book with 613 pages. It is basically a workbook with vocabulary to fill in and comprehension questions broken down by chapters. The last 85 pages contain a glossary (mini dictionary) of all of the vocabulary words assigned for each story. Some of the books will have a MEMORY GEM which is a memorable sentence from the book that is suggested for memory work. Sprinkled throughout the comprehension questions, are questions about the Literary Devices that the author uses, Elements of Fiction, and notes about the story. Here are a few of the questions from some of the chapters in Oliver Twist: 2) The Teacher's Guide: $20 This has all the content from the Student book (except the glossary) with the answers added. The suggested answers are all short (one or two sentences long). This book is half the size as the student book because there are no blank lines for filling in the answers and the font is smaller. If you were merely going to use the questions and vocabulary as an oral exercise, you wouldn't need the student book. 3) The Course Plans: $100 Like all Kolbe courses, these are a weekly breakdown of what work to do each day. Samples available on their website here. There is easily over 600 pages of material. It is 3 hole punched and unbound. The course plans contain the following: - a table showing how many weeks each book is scheduled for, the AR Reading level as well as the Kolbe suggested reading level. - a book report format sheet that goes into a lot of detail as to how to do a literary review of each book, and an example of what it would look like for a 7th-8th grader. - three pages describing the Elements of Fiction (plot, setting, character, mood, tone, point of view, symbol, theme. - two pages of discussion of Literary Devices (mostly a list of devices with a short definition). Both of the preceding two sections are sprinkled throughout the comprehension questions in the student guide as I mentioned above. After this comes the bulk of the course plans: a) novel study b) Saint books c) Short Story Course, and d) Poetry course. It starts with a suggestion to discuss the setting, theme and characters with the student: Next it discusses the Elements of Fiction specific to that story. Setting, theme, characters. This is a helpful overview for the parent... especially if you haven't read the book. There is an overview of the week that lists the literary devices and elements of fiction they will encounter and suggest you discuss their definitions. The suggest writing assignment for the week is included here. It is meant to be one or two paragraphs long... the book report at the end of the book is a longer piece of writing. example of writing assignment from Oliver Twist: Following this, the course plans go into a breakdown of MON, TUES, etc,.. Each day lists what pages to read and what study questions to follow. Then there is a little summary of what is happening in each chapter. This is a great help to the parent who might not have time to actually read the book... or who has read the book awhile ago but can't remember what happened in each particular chapter. After the daily breakdown, there is an Assignment Answer Key which gives suggested answers to the weekly assignment questions. Finally, there is the optional Final Exam. This usually has three or four parts: I. short descriptions of various characters from the book II. short answer questions about the book. III. Vocabulary definitions IV. Essay (at least 3 paragraphs with examples or quotes front he text to support the answer). example from Pride and prejudice: example from Treasure Island: ----- The short Story course is one quarter long: 7 weeks of material, one week of review and one week of final exams. The course plans include supplemental material called "how to read and appreciate a short story", and all the same information in the novel study course plans including weekly assignments, summaries and final exams. The Poetry Course is also a quarter long. 7 weeks of material, 1 week of review, 1 week for exams. It includes supplemental material called "The different forms of poetry", and all the same information included in the novel study course. Well, that was longer than I had thought I would actually type out. I hope it helps someone decide on what to do. Let me know if you want any other specific information about the course plans or student books :-)

yes, that is really the ideal, isn't it? It's harder to implement when you have more than just a few kids. I think if I really wanted to have this focus in my homeschool I would have to become a better teacher. (meaning, be present to the kids and not try to do other things while they are doing school... sometimes it's hard when the 'other things' are little toddlers and nursing babies :001_smile:) Thanks for the thoughtful advice.

I'm new to these mastery programs as we've only used spiral in the past. Spiral was easy to plan out for the year. For these 'mastery' type programs, how do you plan out the year if you don't know exactly how fast they will move through the material? I like to plan out a weekly sheet task sheet for each week of the year ahead of time. Do you say something like 'Do 2 pages of math'... or do you set the timer? i know from past experience if I don't 'have some sort of goal in mind, we won't progress at a good speed. I want to be flexible, but at the same time, I want to finish the book. kwim?

Thanks for the reminder!! I think I am over thinking this. I will have a 7th grader, a 4th grader and then these three (1, 1, and 2), and because two of them are already together, I tend to want to lump all three of them into one box to make my life easier... but it didn't work well in the LA department last year, so i'm not sure why it's going to work with math. I need to just bite the bullet and put in the work for each individual child. I'll look through it again to see how I can catch my 2nd grader up to speed, and let the twins work at their own pace. thanks!!