I'm rearranging the basement today to try and do better with this. Our basement is both school room and play room. I'm moving the play area to the back so we aren't hopping over toys to get to the desks. Compartmentalizing the 3yo toy messes helps me focus, and I hope the "new" play area will keep her busier for a few weeks. I keep binders for independent work. I expect the older 2 to do quite a bit while I do lessons with the 9yo. On days when 9yo is done by 10am, and olders have their stuff done by 10am, we accomplish a lot. He## hath no fury like Momma when you didn't get your binder work done. They do have permission to skip something if they are stuck. That helps me pinpoint my time where it really counts. It's a big rule to not interrupt a sibling's lesson unless there is blood, fire, or the 3yo pooped. When the weather is nice we have a set recess time. We get outside to the park for an hour or more around lunch time. That fresh air works wonders!

Learning ASL and learning to read are two very different processes. I think the analogy breaks down too quickly for that to be a guiding reason for teaching sounds only first. If you read my post, you'll see that I said that I do emphasize sounds. The ABC song is typically learned between 18mo and 3 years, long before kids learn letter sounds. It makes sense to relate the ABC song and the ABC books and the ABC games that we play to the letters as they learn their sounds. That said, when I begin teaching letter formation and recognition, I usually ask them for the sound of the letter and not the name. They say /a/ as they fingertrace a sandpaper a, for example. I've taught 2 dyslexic children to read. Believe you me, I have studied and analyzed the things that hinder and help children learn to read. I'm not finished learning about early literacy, but I do know some things. Pushing blindly toward a goal like "Do whatever it takes to get them reading asap!" is damaging. Taking the time a child needs to master each letter is not damaging. Teaching the letter names along with their sounds does not hinder the process. There are 26 letters. Take the years from 3-6 at the child's pace. There is plenty of time.

Not a bad idea. Do what works. I'm writing a program that works through the Treadwell Readers...so I think this is FABULOUS plan! :laugh: Meanwhile... http://joyfulshepherdess.blogspot.com/2013/03/all-my-charlotte-mason-reading-posts-in.html

I hear you. :iagree: This was my turning point for Van Cleave Science books on the CHEAP vs Science in a Nutshell Kits. I totally get it, agree, LIVE it. Right now, I don't plan anything for my 3yo. It's all "do whatever keeps her happy & safe while we work." She paints and plays playdoh a TON! I'd love to have some more structure for *her* built into our days. The kits are appealing in that aspect, but tbh if I made my own boxes they would look very different. I want to see more hands-on fm work (I don't care if she has something that looks great, I want to see fm skills addressed.). I want ideas for activities to build gross motor skills. I want 3yo level, engaging problem solving (puzzles, riddles...). Where are the storybooks? Maybe I'm not seeing everything in the tote, but these are my criticisms. And, I think I seriously will make something like this for my dd. I'll make seasonal totes, starting with what we already have. It will take a couple of hours to gather what I have around the house. Several hours(4-5) to plan for what I want to add. Several more hours to create anything needed (??? depends upon how creative I get). I'll have to keep purchases down to less than $100. It will take an hour or so to print off any printables and file them in the totes. Organizing the actual totes...another hour or two. And, I wouldn't try to plan as I go, not with 3 school age kids in my house. This is something I'll work on over weekends and breaks from school. It is doable if I spread the work out (and the purchases!) over several weekends. It's work I enjoy, so there is that. I have a workbox rolling cart and easily half of all the supplies needed, so my cost will be minimal.

I emphasize sounds, but it's a both/and for me. I'd rather go slower and have each letter learned fully. If they can learn that a cow says "moo," they can learn that B says /b/. Dogs sometimes bark, sometimes growl. Vowels sometimes say one thing and sometimes another. Kids are smarter than we think. They simply need things put into terms they understand.

That is like Science in a Nutshell but for preschool. Neat idea. Great idea. However. It is way over-priced for what you get! I am better off buying a bunch of activity books, toys, fingerpaints, playdoh, crafting supplies & glue. How much would it cost to spend a weekend making your own monthly boxes? Would you put different stuff in the boxes? I'm going to be thinking this through now. My plans for my 3yo include actually writing down a list of books to read aloud to her. It is to keep ME on track, not forgetting her in the busy days of our home. :thumbup1: She has a rolling cart with 12 drawers. I keep that stocked with educational toys & craft supplies. I want to teach her to use the cart like workboxes in the future. Getting it out, putting it away, and working independently are skills that I want to teach. So, even if the items in the drawers are toys, it is fulfilling my goals for her. kwim. (For 75$ per month, I could stock her rolling cart VERY well.) Things to stock the cart: (I am looking for new ideas. :lurk5: ) I made a set of Sandpaper letters. We've started on those. She enjoys matching upper & lowercase letters. She will start Happy Phonics soon. There are a few games that she can begin. Cuisenaire rod play. paper/scissors/glue (and buttons/poms/random junk to craft with) paper/watercolor paints playdoh puzzles I think my 3yo is maybe ready to have a small chore in her workboxes. I like the idea of making a weather chart out of a calendar. OK - I'm going to make up a little planner for the Three Year Old. (That sounds more fun than cleaning today. :lol: )

You could try Apples & Pears Spelling. It is a program written for dyslexic students in the UK. It is an excellent option for those kids who don't seem to do as well with the O-G programs. A&P spends a lot of time focusing on building visual memory, and some kids really need that. My dd used this program and it worked very well for her. My dyslexic kiddo couldn't keep the pace with A&P, and so I reformatted an old, public domain program for him. I'm using this series with both of my boys now.

I prefer this too.

How old is he?

Keep in mind that 1st Grade math will start at 1+1 = 2. There is NO reason to stress about any lists of objectives for kindy. If you can manage to "lighten up" (good idea), and let them to continue to enjoy play-based and discovery math (Miquon and games!) they will likely surpass any objectives you set for them. Don't start Singapore until 1st grade, and then you'll need to evaluate where to start in Singapore. If they are consistent with Miquon in Kindy, they will likely skip over some of the Singapore 1st grade...or all of it...don't worry about that now, just mark on your calendar for next summer to evaluate where they are in math before ordering 1st grade materials. I like the RS Math Games. There are many other math games available. (muggins) Rather than any other math curriculum, invest in math games.

To the bolded: Listen to your son. He hates spelling & writing? It's normal for a child to wish to play rather than work, but if he hates spelling...say over every other subject with the strong feelings that hate portray, stop and think. Dragging a reluctant student along for the ride is miserable for you both and a bad attitude is contagious. Preserve a pleasant atmosphere. That is more important than even spelling. Don't do copywork only, Study the words. Use what you've learned through teaching LOE and apply that info to words that have meaning to him. The lists in SWR and WRTR, and I'm sure LOE too are rather random feeling...organized by frequency rather than any pattern. Is there really any difference organizing the words by the order in which they appear in passages of literature that are meaningful to your child? Merge spelling with your poetry memorization. Study the words, copy the lines, visualize the imagery, visualize the words. If you memorized one poem a week, studying all the words contained in the poem, do you know how many of the phonics patterns you'd cover in a year? ALL of them...and they would be much more likely to be retained. I understand the desire for a program, for a workbook. There is nothing wrong with using those things IF they make your homeschool run smoother. If they are stressing anyone out, not getting done, or hated...ditch the program...that goes for spelling, math, whatever. Having 4 happy, healthy, and educated kids is possible, but your home is not going to look like someone who has only one or two kids in their homeschool. Think that through as you navigate curriculum. I have banged my head against that wall. (I only do real spelling lessons with 2 of my kids, only the dyslexics. My natural reader/speller gets a go-over of the spelling phonograms & rules at the beginning of each year and she does copywork/dictation. As soon as the less severe dyslexic can, he will switch to copywork/dictation. NOT b/c of the workload, but that is a help...but b/c copywork/dictation is a meatier lesson...a 2-for-1... spelling/grammar/vocab/handwriting/working memory/visual memory/literature/and more...)

Happy Phonics covers phonics & spelling. Madlibs review parts of speech.

SWR was written as a spin-off of Spalding to make it easier to use. I used SWR for 2.5 years, studying WRTR Manual several times over to make sure I was REALLY doing everything right. I was. Spalding is great for teaching 12 year olds and up. I learned a lot as I grappled with SWR and WRTR. That said, for my (at the time) 5-7yo it was too much, too fast, and not in the best format for a young child. My (at the time) 3-5yo learned to read very well by eaves dropping in on these lessons, however. If I had to choose between either SWR or WRTR, I would pick WRTR and I would pick up an old copy. I got mine for $2, I think. Do not spend hundreds of dollars on a spelling curric for a 2nd grader. I think WRTR makes a great teacher's resource. What *I* would do with a kid who already knows the markings for LOE??? I would do daily copywork, pulled from literature. Ask him to spell each word in the sentence aloud. Every word that he doesn't easily spell goes on the list for the day. Study the words ala LOE. Put them in a notebook. Copy the sentence. As he gets older, morph that copying of the sentence into a dictation. You have 4 kids, young kids, and all close in age. Honestly, this is a game-changer! Think about what your day looks like. (I know!! I've got 4 kids also! :lol: ) You cannot spend an hour per day per kid just on spelling. :huh: You have to think about what will actually get done, and what will work within the family dynamic. Some of the Spalding (and O-G) zealots claim that you are going to mess your kids up for life if you veer away from the official rules & phonograms. This makes mom afraid to try other things that fit better into their own lives. (We are not in a school!) With your little crew, you are going to need things that they can do independently, things that can be used to combine some things, and things that are laid out and scripted for you. Perfect programs that are impossible to implement in YOUR real life are a stumbling block, not helpful. Read, Write, Type by www.talkingfingers.com I have the Jingle Spells and Word Querty too. These are AWESOME! They mesh well with Spalding too! You can set a child up at the computer with this and work with the others for 20 minutes. Happy Phonics: This set of games also meshes well with Spalding. Some things are a smidge different, but I like the HP way BETTER! It makes sense for the kids. The way the games are organized is very clever. You can set 2-3 kids up playing a HP game and have 20-30 minutes to work with another child. The older ones will teach the younger ones through these games. Work smarter, not harder, momma! If you do those two things above, then you can feel confident using copywork (as described above) to hit spelling on an individual basis. This only takes 10-20 minutes, depending upon the age of the child and how much they are playing the above games (and getting the phonics).

That is 3 full programs. Try sticking MEP out through the end of Year 1 and see how things go. MEP covers place value very well. Drop Horizons. If you are doing MEP as written you do not need more review. If you do need more review, do it through games and not more worksheets. If you want to hit place value *right now,* use Miquon and just pull those sheets that deal with 10+1, 10+2....and so on... Miquon is one of the best resources I know of to teach place value. (And I have tried a LOT!) Still, if you stick closely to MEP lesson plans, you'll likely find that you don't need Miquon. Do NOT just go through the math motions at this age. Build the problems with the rods. Base Ten blocks are nice to have when you are working numbers bigger than 100. Craft sticks grouped by 10's with a rubberband work just as well.

Use the OPG lessons for handwriting lessons. Write out some words from previous lessons on the board and have her copy on the board. Play matching games where you match the uppercase letters to lowercase letters.

I remember my math lessons as a student. The teacher would demonstrate several problems, gradually giving the student more and more of the work. Especially for the VSL, this process is a need. Watch me work one. (Use colored pencils, C rods, etc...) Let's work a few together. Gradually...I explain while you write....you explain while I write...I set up the diagram and you solve...you set up the diagram for me to solve... Finally, the student knows how to do this and finds the buddy work a drag. Let's move on already! For something that is really giving a student trouble. I might have them watch me work a problem, one problem, daily and for a week. Then for the next week or two, we work one problem a day gradually shifting the responsibility. I keep the buddy work going until the child tells me, "I can do it faster if I do it myself." This is how I survived teaching long division. Most math books are not set up to work this way. I like Singapore for a VSL in part b/c it doesn't feel wrong to just put a sticky note in several sections and work through - wherever we are - in each section. That way you aren't stagnating in long division limbo forever.

Some parents need a curric to lead into lessons exactly as you described. Ex. Miquon Math is hands-on exploration with numbers. For a mom who has been an academic student herself without any experience teaching 4-8yo children, it can be difficult (or just anxiety producing) to pull math off of a worksheet and *do* it. Having a curric, like Miquon, say "This is a great way to teach." gives mom confidence that the goal is the child's learning and not completion of worksheets. Five in a Row is another curric that takes what some mothers do as second nature and scripts out the moves. If a mom feels uneasy "just reading aloud," try FIAR. Then do these sorts of activities as they come up with other books. Most children will begin to come up with their own questions and ideas after rowing a few books. Reading? Many moms don't remember how they learned to read and there is so much angst about doing it according to the experts (at the time???). I love the basic CM method for most kids, but most modern moms feel uncomfortable about it, feeling they will miss something crucial. Ironically, they often do miss something crucial as the price of using a curric that is completely divorced from actual books. So...I agree and disagree with you at the same time. Make sure that the currics you choose are designed to facilitate lessons for young children. A program designed to remediate an older dyslexic (9-12yo) will not produce the same results on a 5yo. Don't burn a 5yo out on math worksheets with 30 problems on each page! But, do begin teaching them how to notate real life math on paper. (Have you seen the Miquon pages? They model this.) Memorize a corpus of poetry and songs and fairy tales, leave the lists of facts for much much later.

At least 2 hours of daily outdoor play. At least 2 hours of daily read aloud time (audiobooks count). Break this time up into 4-6 chunks throughout the day. At least an hour of craftiness...painting, playdoh, cutting & pasting, paper sloyd, etc... I prefer free-style, Give them ideas and then let them craft while I cook dinner. Reading & Writing lessons. See my siggie. I just finished the Pre-Primer, which is a prep for learning to read through the Treadwell Readers. Miquon Math. Games! At least 3 hours per week. Give me a first grader who knows how to entertain themselves, enjoys listening to good books, plays fair at games, is confident with numbers 1-10, knows all letters and their sounds AND how to form them, and can blend CVC, CV, and CVCE words...and we can breeze through learning the 1st grade material and more. I would add in memory work, but I don't like that to be schoolish in Kindy. Sing lots of songs and have fun with all sorts of poetry. 5yo children memorize without effort when they love something.

On second thought, I'd want to see each situation in person before deciding. If you have an opportunity for a teacher like Mr Chris, I wouldn't even think twice. Group B. If the Group A teacher is too new or too closed-minded or simply too strapped down by standards and testing, I'd lean towards Group B. There are so many factors to consider. I think I'd have to see both situations live and in person before I could make a decision.

I think they are marketing to a new generation. I'm not rushing out to buy any. I know, right!?! :lol:

Kids grow. Give him a fighting chance with the challenging group. His ability to face challenge and failure and try, try again will be a defining characteristic. He will get a chance to grow that in Group A. "Jenny taught me how to climb. I taught her how to dangle." ~ Forrest Gump

Do it for one year. That will help ease the urge to do more when your time is needed elsewhere. Just read. I wouldn't buy a curric for this. Nope. Hand-pick a few books. Schedule those at the pace of 1-3 chapters a week. Perhaps have a tea time once a week with both 11yo and 8yo, and use a narration cube to spark discussion about the books. Casual. For the rest, a book basket will do. I agree with others who recommend scheduling the time and not the books. And, I'd purchase both kids a nice hardbound journal, a little tote bag to keep it in, and some lovely new writing utensils. No instructed writing assignments needed, just time and opportunity.

You are smart to sit tight and keep working on fluency before pushing forward. Fluency doesn't have to be perfect before moving on, but it should flow fairly smoothly before adding multi-letter phonograms into the mix. Some ideas... Use a cursor to uncover one sound at a time as you read. Take a 3x5 index card and cut a small notch out of the top/left corner to make the cursor. I prefer a pastel color card. Do this a LOT! Play word games on the board. Review words/patterns by writing one sound at a time, having her say it as she sees it. Make a list of these words at the top of the board. Then play hangman with the words, the traditional hangman. Hide 3-5 letter magnets around the room. She has to find the magnets and unscramble to make a word. (Obviously, you choose the words and pick the magnets accordingly.)

Flashcards are probably OK together. I sound like a broken record, but you will get more mileage out of games. Happy Phonics. They will know those phonograms forwards and backwards, and they can play together (without much help from you). There are all sorts of math games for sale these days. The kids will sit for an hour playing a game happily. They will get so much more out of it too. Sometimes flashcards present more like a quiz, uncovering what they do NOT know. Games, however, present like a challenge to figure it out faster than your opponent. Kids wilt under quiz-pressure, but thrive under game pressure. It may seem like playing hookie from school, but especially with children so closely spaced, teach them games. Even games that are not directly phonics & math are highly beneficial. Strategy games, basic checkers & chess, build mathematical problem solving skills. Those skills pay off big time when you are entering middle and high school. I'll stop hijacking your threads to tell you to play games now... ....but PLAY GAMES!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Another thought: My oldest 2 dc are also 2 years apart. The younger outpaced the older in LA by *years* worth quickly. If they would have been in the same materials, it would have been devastating to the oldest. Always separate those reading/writing/math skills. Things you can combine: History Science Literature & oral narrations (Foster discussion between the 3 of you!) Art Music Grammar (Do FLL at the year level between. So for a 5yo and 7yo, that's FLL 1.) Math Games! Other games! (Teach them to play games together. You can get so much mileage out of games!!!) That leaves reading lessons, writing lessons, and math lessons to be done individually. At 5 and 7yo, writing is mainly oral narration and copywork. You can cover oral narrations together, and they can do copywork while the other sibling is working with you. I would build a routine like... 5yo reading lesson : 7yo copywork 7yo reading lesson: 5yo copywork Break 5yo math lesson: 7yo play with lego 7yo math lesson: 5yo play with lego Do math, reading, and writing daily. All of the together things, I would plan on a loop schedule. If you get to one other thing or 4 other things, that is a good school day. I hope it helps to see how I have done it. It's crazy trying to juggle several kids! As they get older, some things get easier - like they can read their own lessons. Other things get harder- like writing involves more than copywork. Enjoy the stage you are in b/c it flies by quickly. Do lots of games and teach them to play together without you directly involved...that will give you time in the future for the 3rd child. (I seem to remember you have another little one.)