I just want to check back in and say this- I got my hands on a fifth edition. The things they left out between the fifth and sixth are what makes the sixth pretty un-useable, if you want my opinion. In the fifth edition, pages 49-56, there are step by step guides on how to teach each phonogram and how to review and which rules to remind and associate. Actual descriptions of Oral and Written Phonogram Review- in the sixth they refer you to the teacher's manual. So frustrating. I understand more what you were saying, Ellie, when you said to just read the book. I would have felt better if I had just read the 5th edition. Those important guidelines are what they, apparently, take out and put in those teaching manuals? They removed passages that introduce concepts and abbreviations, and then refer back to those concepts and abbreviations later without re-introducing or defining them, and I kept wondering what in the world I had missed. Reading the fifth through makes SO MUCH MORE SENSE. I feel obligated to go leave a non-flattering review of the sixth edition now. And thanks, blondeviolin, I have heard good things about that how to start a notebook. It's hanging out in my Amazon cart, waiting for me to buy it. =)

Thank you Hunter for saying that. I consider myself a relatively intelligent person, but I sure started wondering if 10 years of sleep deprivation and too much caffeine had officially damaged my brain beyond repair! :mellow: In the last two days I have read the sixth edition cover to cover, twice, and have taken pages of notes, and still feel I've gotten more explanation and insight from these message boards than I did from the book. Thank you, Ellie. I didn't mean to imply that we will be rushing through the handwriting. The only examples of dictating the phonograms given in my copy of WRTR are for obviously beginning writers. My two have been writing in exclusively cursive, using the zane-bloser method, for 1 and 2 years respectively. Perhaps this is unfair, but I consider this method "good enough" and don't intend to teach the phonograms with such careful scripting to how the letters are formed. They will be monitored for proper form and care, but this was a portion of the process where I would be seeing myself more in the scaffolding to fading part of instruction. So I am anticipating the phonograms go faster than the 4 a day. I am absolutely not going to push for that, but my daughter has a history of covering in one lesson what I had intended for 3 or 4. So I am really just trying to make sure I plan ahead enough and understand the next step and potential deviations if I can. Proper handwriting / forming of the letters will have to be stressed here as I don't intend a separate handwriting curriculum or other practice. So if we end up at 4 a day because I make them write the phonograms over and over as they speak them, so be it. I think my frustration and confusion with the Writing and Reading Objectives is that I don't feel enough guidance in terms of what to teach when. When it tells you to prepare your lesson plans, it tells you to be sure to have a grade-level objective and a daily/weekly objective. Any time I look for ideas on pacing or sequencing or even spiraling ideas for these objectives, it refers me to the Teacher Guides. I am curious as to if the older versions, especially version 4 which everyone raves about, have the language and direction I am looking for here. I think where I am stuck on the reading/writing stuff may just be a problem with my expectations from the manual. The way I am interpreting WRTR is this: 1) Spelling is first, with phonogram teaching and review, including sound correlations, discussion of syllables, referencing rules, and practicing of the formation of the phonograms. In this section is where the spelling folder is created. I feel comfortable that I understand this process. 2) Writing is next, and this is when I help the students learn how to use the words. Here I introduce simple sentences and break down parts of speech, basically start teaching them grammar. This is where I feel like I don't have enough direction from WRTR. Chapter 2 gives dialogues for many of the concepts, and for some of them it does suggest when to teach them- with section H words, etc. But so many places in the book it says "Grade-appropriate noun objectives such as forming plurals, using noun as subjects or objects, forming possessives, and categorizing nouns as concrete or abstract" are found in the teaching guides. On the same page "The definitions of action, linking, and helping verbs are provided in the ... Teacher Guides." A couple pages later, after including dialogue for all types of verbs, it then informs me "Teachers use the procedure in the ...Teacher Guide... to teach the names for all parts of speech." I feel like every time it needs to address the sequencing, pacing and contextual continuity between spelling, writing and reading, I am referred to the teaching guide. It makes me feel like I am guessing as to what I should be teaching in terms of nouns for this age, and the Scope and Sequence charts in the back aren't the spoon-fed flow-chart I want. And after I typed all of that out (and I refuse to delete it because it was a lot of work and perhaps someone else will find it helpful) I am wondering if this is the crux of my confusion. I am trying to find a correlation between "teach these phonograms/spelling word with this writing/grammar focus which segues nicely into this reading focus." But Spalding is not going to provide that, right? WRTR provides the basic progression of which writing objectives to use in which order, but they are not going to provide specific pacing. I am guessing this is because I, as the teacher, should be assessing when to review or when to move on and spiral back based on proficiency of my students. And I guess this is a taking-off-of-the-training wheels I am not sure I was expecting. I guess my action step now is this- go through the Scope and Sequence charts for Writing and Reading, making a list of all objectives expected to be mastered by second grade. Since we will start as, arbitrarily, third graders, this gives me a target and an idea of what to work on. Order the objectives how they are discussed in Chapter 2, and then progress through those as my daily/weekly objectives. The only correlation they will have to the spellings words are the context that I provide in directing the dialogue and dictation. Yes? And I make notes of areas they greatly struggle, and plan to spiral back in another upcoming lesson. Anything they seem to master, I plan to spiral back on with a more faded focus. I do the same for reading objectives. Okay, I see now why you are saying that reading and writing won't be that difficult to teach. It's just the planning and confidence in knowing what to teach when that feels difficult to me. Which you would think I would enjoy, as an obvious over-thinker. And I cannot help but laugh at my beleaguered mind categorizing her spelling notebook as sanctified. I still stand by it, though- the way WRTR speaks so carefully, adamantly and repeatedly about the specifics of that notebook really comes across as almost reverent. Maybe I just need to giggle right now, because I do understand the reason they stress this being so precise, but it still comes off as a little humorous to me. And I am a bit minimalist when we homeschool- because we travel so much while doing it. So if I can have loose-leaf paper that can be used for most work, and binders to file them in when done, and forego someone deciding to leave their oh-so-special spelling notebook under the hotel bed two states away... less is more for me. :laugh: I thank you from the bottom of my heart. I feel almost ready for this.

THANK YOU ALL! I won't hold it against you that you gave me some different answers, haha... All kidding aside, I appreciate the different perspectives. And thank you for validating my instincts in the journal writing, I am glad to not have to be the mean mom who tells him no or corrects his art. I should clarify- we did AAS in kindergarten at home. So my kids are not unfamiliar with the phonograms completely. I have continued to purchase the student packs while the kids were in brick and mortar school, as we used the spelling tiles to study for spelling tests. So I planned to use those phonogram cards. I anticipate them re-learning them pretty quickly, but there will be some un-learning happening as well, I am sure. Because I do already own AAS and WWE, I am just not all that excited to buy another curriculum like SWR right now. I feel like I have all the tools I need in front of me, I just need to figure out how to get my brain in step with this manual... Part of my desire to start on the A-G words sooner than later is that I worry about them picking up the markings- they did a completely different way of marking at their school. I anticipate this will be an area of confusion and frustration for them, but maybe that's all the more reason to slow down and just deal with one thing at a time. So, Ellie, I have a few questions as the Spalding "purist" in the group (and that is not a criticism, please be assured,) If the writing and reading component isn't necessary yet, what do you recommend? I really wanted the contextual aspect of the Spalding method, not just the spelling proficiency, as my son will learn grammar and language concepts better when he sees them in practice. It's what drew me to WWE, but it doesn't have spelling, so that was why I was hoping to blend the two. I don't need the scripting of WWE, but the guidance of the sequence of the objectives is helpful to me. Are you familiar enough with WWE to tell me if it doesn't work with the Spalding method? And, since I am so drawn to everything WTM- how much will I be violating all that is Ms Spalding's legacy if we do our notebooks in the WTM model? In other words- I am thinking of having our spelling notebooks be looseleaf papers in a section of their language binder. Since WRTR doesn't really indicate where to practice all this markings and sentence creation, I was planning on creating binders as laid out in WTM for all the other language work they will be creating. I understand part of the spelling notebook is sort of a sanctity thing, where the students come to see it as a sort of personally made resource, and I support that, but I also wouldn't mind all of those papers being in one place. I know that sounds like such a silly thing to ask permission for, but when a program writes something out in such detail, like the exact size and shape and material of the spelling notebook, it makes me nervous to deviate. I just want someone to tell me it will be okay. Or, if it won't, why not. Thanks again for all of your thoughts and recommendations.

I know there are tens, if not hundreds, of posts on this topic, and I did try to read as many as I could. Of course, though, I think my situation is unique. ;) I really just need some guidance and a little validation. Background- I have a 2nd grade daughter and 3rd grade son whom I home-schooled for K/1st. They have been in a "traditional" private school for 2.5 years, and I am pulling them out to finish this year at home. Both my children are proficient in cursive, and have had a decent (but poorly designed) spelling, writing and grammar education. I would like to use WRTR for our language; I have edition 6, and I am struggling to put together a plan. I feel like every time WRTR is about to answer my "how" or "when" question, it directs me to a Teacher Guide for further information. I would like to avoid an additional purchase and am hoping someone can give me some basic guidance. I could probably write a book on my questions, but I will try to be concise: 1) We will start with learning the phonograms week 1, and I am planning to work a little handwriting practice into the mostly oral process. Would it be okay to start them on the A-G words in the spelling/vocabulary list and notebook at the same time? My kids test anywhere from a 3.4-6.8 on the Morrison-McCall evaluation, because their spelling lessons have been so sporadic and, well, they haven't really "stuck." So I want them to do the very basics and build on a good foundation, but I also don't want to bore them silly or slow us down too much. If we should wait until the 70 phonograms are mastered before adding any words to the notebook, can you suggest what to do in the dictation and HFW portion of the spelling and writing lessons for that week? 2) I find the Writing Scope and Sequence charts in the back of WRTR a bit... unhelpful. Maybe I am just tired, but they seem full of teacher-speak, short on details, and non-intuitively organized. I have The Complete Writer: Writing With Ease on my shelf- can I use that for my Sequencing for writing and reading objectives? 3) Any thoughts on how creative, free-expression writing is approached in Spalding? My son struggles with language and is a very reluctant writer. He has asked to be allowed to journal every day as part of home-schooling. I hate to quash any hard-to-come-by enthusiasm to put pencil to paper... but also I am leary of developing bad habits with free-form, uncorrected writing. And correcting journal writing is a tricky world, as it tends to make him reluctant to try more colorful language and sentence construction for fear of getting something "marked wrong." Any thoughts? Thanks in advance for any and all advice! 4)

Another vote for the claw. Helped my son, when he was 7, immensely. I will also add, though, that he is still underwhelmed by the mechanics of writing and gets tired of it easily. He is 9. Some things are just in their make-up.

I think I relate. I think it's a by-product of coming into our own, becoming confident as moms and wives. Not that we intentionally look down on our own moms, but maybe we don't hold them on such a high pedestal as we did when we were new moms. As a result, it's easier for them to let us down. For me, I think it's less that my mom is becoming less perfect but more than I'm just a bit more worldly-wise as a mom that I can see more of her flaws. Like you, I'm SO grateful to have a mom close by, and I love and admire her above just about any other woman. But, yeah, I have a shorter patience than I used to, as well. If it helps at all, I look at my daughter and think about I'll want her to treat me when I become my mom's age. This usually buys me enough patience to get through. :D

:iagree: This is an interesting perspective, and, I think, a challenging one for us all. It is sometimes tempting to take the easy path, and I would agree that that is what the mom is doing. For what it's worth, we talked about Santa and the Tooth Fairy, but were always pretty clear that they were pretend, just like all the other characters they might watch on TV. We said, "They're just pretend people we like to tell stories about because it's fun and we like to make you smile and laugh." So just having your kids know about the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus doesn't mean you're lying. It takes a bit more work and creativity to allow your kids to have fun stories and still be honest with them, but it's worth it. We get the best of both worlds- kids who won't question our honesty and kids who still get to play along with the stories of Santa and the Tooth Fairy. So, back to the point, I do think it could be a sign of laziness, or instant gratification, at the least. Thanks for that reminder, I have some areas in my own parenting that could use some inspection. ;)

Oh, I totally agree! I am in the same boat- just two kids, have tried and lost four in the 2nd-3rd trimester since, and we live quite comfortably. We tend to give things to families that have more kids and less money than us all the time. I think this is probably the best way I know of to keep myself content. God has provided for us enough excess in order to help those that are living on less. Sure, I'd like to be able to be tighter with money if it meant I got to hold those four lost babies. But I do get to feel God working through us to bless other families and that is important to me, too. I think when I get discontent, I usually can check my spiritual life. When my spiritual life suffers, and the enemy plants selfish or destructive thoughts in my head, well... I'm likely to also be eating poorly and not exercising. It's just something I think that is used to distract us and fester discontentment when things really are SO good. That's just me, though. I rely heavily on my spiritual walk so things usually boil down to that. ;) But, yes, when my friend carts his six kids over for a playdate, I cannot help but be a bit wistful. But our three closest friends each have only one kid and they stress about the only-child syndrome all the time. So I am one minute the famine and the next the plenty. I guess it's all about where you're standing.

Just finished three hours of school work and shampooing the living room carpets. Have a few loads of laundry to fold and basic maintenance chores- how does the school room carpet need vacuuming already when we're barely in there this summer?! We're going to try to catch Brave at 2 this afternoon with some friends. Then we have marriage counseling, then I have Bible Study, then I go to the gym, then the grocery store... Mondays are my crazy busy days. :glare:

For the K books last year, we used the Standards books. I didn't bother with the teacher's manual (my kids already knew how to add and subtract, so we were really just using the books to get used to the Singapory terminology and method.) For 1st, we're using the Standards textbooks and workbooks, I don't have the teacher's or parent's guides- I think it's pretty self-explanatory for this grade. As for manipulatives- I didn't buy any. I had unifix cubes already, but I frankly used them maybe 4 times in all of the K books. I haven't used them yet and we're halfway through 1stA. Anything I used the cubes for, I could have used beans and bowls, or legos, etc. I did buy the story books. Meh. We've used them, but they certainly weren't necessary. Sometimes I just used them to fill some needed math times (our district tracks by hours) and reading practice. Honestly, I wouldn't buy anything but the kid's books. You can find what you need for the rest of the stuff around your house.

That's awesome! For what it's worth, I wouldn't consider a six year old who can read The Black Stallion Returns as reading-phobic. We celebrated last week when my almost-seven year old finished the Bob books. ;)

Maybe I'm doing the math wrong, but it seems like you should be on antibiotics for 10-14 days each time. If you're just in your third week, you should still be taking or just finishing up your second round? My gut reaction was to wonder if you didn't take them for long enough. But, otherwise, I would make sure you ask your doctor.

I think it's a very sad commentary on our society that this woman, this grandmother and paid employee of the school system, who has earned respect as an elder and authority figure, didn't feel compelled or capable of reporting it. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's her fault. But what does it mean when our elders don't feel safe among some punk kids?! Why did she feel so unable to get the kids straightened out in the moment, and unable to bring any consequences to them afterwards? How does this happen?! I'm so sad for this woman, and for those kids, who are just a product of bad influence and probably some neglect. They should be held accountable, but who is going to hold those that let these kids down responsible? Who is going to make sure the parents, schools and teachers know that their inability to correct these behaviors is destroying our children? No one, because they are self-monitoring. And it's not working. Funny, I cannot watch any reality TV (the Housewives shows, the dating show nonsense...) because it makes me sick how people talk to each other. Could the fact that this is how 90% of conversations on popular TV shows sound, and that so many kids are raised by their TVs these days, be contributing to this? I'd say so. We're one step closer to getting rid of all TV before my kids turn 8, this just pushes my buttons so hard...

We use these basic boxes I picked up from WalMart. They weren't exactly what I wanted- I was looking at the pricey ones at Lakeshore at the time- but I've come to like them. I didn't like the handles at first, but now I do as they make the lids lock down, which keeps everything in place in case of a wayward cat or nerf gun bullet. They're transparent enough that I could print off a small label (just a simple thing in Word) and taped it inside so we can see what each subject is. I can change those if I need to. Like I said, I didn't love it as first, it was supposed to be a cheap solution while we were short on cash. Two years later, we're not replacing them. ;) Each of us has three, for phonics, math and handwriting. Then we each have our own color. I can fit past, future and current workbooks in each one, I just keep the most current on top. I put my teacher's manuals in my bin. These sit on the top shelf of the bookshelf next to the school table. The next shelf down holds their notebooks for LA, history and science, as well as our encyclopedias and other reference books, some teacher's manuals. And the last bookshelf holds other bins and books for me. I've found this one small bookshelf holds just about all we need for our daily school work. It's worked very well for us.

I don't have a planning page yet, but I did add a page to my blog that explains why we chose the Classical Method: http://coloradostrongs.blogspot.com/p/test-page.html I'm working on the planning. But first, I have to actually DO the planning, then learn how to TALK about the planning. ;)

(Excuse the length, I have insomnia right now...;) ) I think you are getting an amazing amount accomplished, I hope you aren't beating yourself up? :grouphug: Hang in there, I bet you can get yourselves running smoothly with just a few adjustments. It's clear you know how to work hard and pour yourself out, so none of this is from you not working hard enough. (I read a lot of apology and self-deprecation in your post, I just thought you should start with some encouragement. ;) ) i wish I still had a copy of it, but I read an article once that reported on a study about when is the best time to teach kids. Everyone is different, but most kids learn best, according to the article, from about 9-2 every day. It's not to say they cannot learn during non-peak times, and sleep schedules and hunger will affect things... But when I read your post, the first thing I thought was that you were using your peak teaching/learning times to do other things. Just a thought about maybe switching things around. Let some of your morning chores become afternoon chores. Honestly, it's really not the end of the world if your breakfast dishes hang out in the sink until the lunch dishes join them, then they can all be washed together. My kids (ages 5 and 6) each have five morning chores after breakfast, and we have a set school start time. I try to get things done before then, but if not, I just get things done in the afternoon during play time. Or I don't get them done. Maybe you can lower your standards in home-keeping a tad? (And I definitely support the other posts encouraging you to share the work!) I feel content if my home is relatively put back in shape when I go to bed, but at no time during the day would we be ready for Better Homes and Garden to show up. :D I am NOT a morning person, and I struggle with deep chemical depression, so I completely understand the slow-going morning. It sounds like your illness is even more debilitating. And I resent advice from people who just pop up at 5am, workout for an hour, cook a five-start breakfast and start school by 7, no problems. BUT I know that when I get the hard part and a big chunk of school knocked out before lunch, we're all happier. If you can keep the same morning routine going all five days, I think you'll benefit. I know my kids thrive best when we're a bit more consistent and they know what to expect. Even if it's not the same MWF, say you start at 8:30 instead of 7:30.... There is a big jump between what you're doing in your two schedules- maybe you could start to just lessen that gap. I honestly don't know what it's like to have so many kids with so many ages around, but if you can, try read-alouds over meals. Breakfast, snack, lunch- those are some of our best "family learning" times. Aside from having older kids help with chores, they can also "borrow" the younger kids to read to or teach. Can you play with the toddler while your oldest sits at a table nearby and you teach him? Can your older two kids read to the toddler, or "teach" him their math lesson on some days? I don't understand the need for such long one-on-one sessions for each child. (Again, not judging, it's not something I have experience with, that just jumped out at me...) It seems like you could sit at the table with all three boys doing math at once. Have review problems or tools and a new lesson ready for everyone. Give your two younger boys review problems from the day before, teach your oldest. Once your oldest is ready to work independently, teach your middle. When the middle one gets going, teach your youngest. If anyone gets stuck on a problem, they work on math facts, flash cards or review problems until you can help them. As much as we love being able to offer one on one as homeschool moms, I feel like kids will only learn to work independently when they have to share your time. They need a blend of both- one on one and side by side. Another thought- can you break up school times into lots of smaller chunks? Here we have the kids clear their breakfast dishes, do a narration, then play for while. Then we do a couple things, take snack... We take LOTS of mini-breaks. I found if I could break everything up in 10-30 minute chunks then we are all happiest. We have spelling allotted for 30 minutes every day, but we rarely take more than 15. So when they're done, they go do something for a few minutes until we settle into the next thing. It's easier than you'd think to get them to come back to the school table when they know their next session will also be about 15 minutes. For me, I don't feel quite the over-whelmed feeling of "It's 'School Time' and we have to sit and do this for three hours or until we're done." It's easier to get started when I just think, "Okay, let's do the first subject. Then we'll stretch our legs for a while before we do the next." This also helps my kids- when they're called to the school table, it doesn't signify the end of play for five hours. They know the more efficiently they work, the longer their breaks between subjects will be. These mini-breaks give me time to putter around, or sit and watch the paint peel for a few minutes. ;) Off the top of my head, I would strive for something like: Every day, up and breakfast by 8-8:30. Read a history or science book out loud over breakfast. 8:30-9- play and chore time while your extras arrive 9-10: school work. Maybe you rotate all three boys through phonics, work 15-20 minutes with each of them. Have them do their independent reading then, too. 10-11: recess and snack, read out loud over snack. Or do math fact drills over snack. Or out loud spelling practice. Or they listen to an audio book while you're doing chores. 11-11:30: math- see if you can all three boys done with math at once. Start with just your oldest, then after a week add the second then add the third. 11:30-12- chores, play, make lunch 12-12:30- lunch. Read over lunch or do chores while they're eating 12:30-1- recess 1-1:30- school time with oldest, others do quiet time 1:30-2- school time with second 2- school with youngest, if needed, but if you've done math, phonics and reading already, he's probably done Something like this makes it look like you could get most of your school work done by 2. That should give everyone some play time, rest time, chore time, and time to do another lesson here or there. Why not leave your mindless chores for the afternoon, so you're not trying to do the hard teaching stuff when you're already so tired? Also, my theory on schedules is that they are what we'd like to do if we were robots. We're not robots. When I schedule things like "spelling, 10-10:30" that often happens 9:45-10 or 10:20-10:40. They're just one step up from a checklist for us- not set in stone, they just offer a little shape to our day. Some of this balancing-act we call homeschool is, for me, psychological and emotional. It's daunting to have it looming over our heads all day. And scrambling as you are at the end of the day probably makes you feel like you're never rested. I am a huge proponent of figuring out how to not be staring at the clock thinking, "Go, go, we only have and hour before I collapse!" As a fellow non-morning person, I know this probably makes you cringe. ;) But, as I said before, leave the stuff that doesn't need as much of your brain for the afternoon, get the hard stuff done first. And set yourself a cut-off- no school after 3:30. Anything that didn't get done- too bad. As you ease back slowly into school, you can be tougher about this. But now, while you're still recovering your strength- give yourself firm start and end times. There's ALWAYS more that can be done, always. But you cannot get healthy and get consistent if you are working in such extremes. You'll just perpetuate this cycle of over-work, crash, over-work, crash until everyone is pooped. Hang in there! I admire how much you get done, I'm tired just reading your post! And I hope you feel more like yourself soon.

My kids are NOTORIOUS for this kind of stuff. "But, Mom, you never said I couldn't put blue fingerpaint into my sister's shampoo. I wanted to see if turned green, since the bottle is yellow."

We love our main-floor master and won't live any other way, if we can help it. BUT- we also only like open-floor-plan homes where the upstairs aren't really closed off from the main floor. I can stand in the doorway of my bedroom and look up to see both doors of my kids' rooms. In some ways, I'm closer to them than I would be if we were on the same floor, because some of their upstairs overlaps our bedroom. I have to go upstairs, sure, but it's still fewer steps than if I had to go down a hall across a whole house. Smoke alarms and fire wouldn't be as big an issue in these homes, as there really isn't a separation between the floors. The way we're set up, the kids' two bedrooms, a full bath and a large loft/landing are all upstairs, and all open to the main floor. The best part of this- the mess. No one has any reason to go up there but my kids and their friends. So they get to be a little messier, and I get to let their bathroom get a little dirtier. Not that I want to live like a slob. But there are definite benefits to knowing that ALL toys go upstairs at the end of the night. They don't always get put away- but one of their morning chores is to pick up their rooms. So I can go to bed each night, blissfully unaware of the mess. And I put a couch on the landing/loft area, so I can sleep there on the nights I want to be closer to my kids. And we can have friends over later and not keep the young ones awake. We're working with a builder to start on our new home, to be built in two years. A main-floor master, with laundry on the main floor, and a laundry chute, were all on my list of must-haves.

I don't think my daughter gets her underwear on right more than once a week. Every morning she comes out and asks "Is this right?" and 6 days out of 7- no. No, it's not right. We still need to put the writing in the back. ?!??!?! This is my child that taught herself to read when she was 4, a week before she snuck one of my "for the future" school books off a shelf and taught herself how to add two-digit numbers. Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on there. Here's where I sheepishly admit that I was exactly the same way as a little girl. As my parents are all too happy to remind me at least twice a week.

:iagree: I'm wondering how you're all doing as well!

:iagree: You also figure out what can be done independently but together, if that makes sense. My kids both do ETC- I have one do it on the computer while the other does it in the workbook, then they switch. So we're all doing phonics and they each get some of my undivided attention. I also purposely pick as many things that aren't "lessons" as we can. I'm drawn to curricula that start with a reading and go from there. So we do SOTW for history- I read a history text, they do a narration. They can listen to the same text and then produce very different things for their narration. I am not drawn to curricula that are very specific (boxed curricula) because I would get overwhelmed trying to figure out how to modify things for each kid. It's just my preference. All that to say- I have two kids that are 16 months apart and very close to the same level in most things. The only time I have seen the actual challenges is when I had two toddlers three times a week this past fall. That is when I realized they could just sit and "participate" in their own way- what changed was just my expectations for each child.

Definitely not a bad mom! Some kids need reassurance more than others- that's just because we're all different people. I would agree that counseling could help, but that's because I pretty much think every person on the planet could benefit from counseling. One thing I'd check on- her sleeping habits. My kids get really really attached to me when they are under-slept. My daughter started night-terrors, lost potty training, etc. from a bad switch in our sleeping schedules. I don't think this will fix an anxiety issues. But i do think lack of sleep or poor sleep can exacerbate an already present anxiety issue. And by the way- a bad mom would be a mom that taught her daughter to behave a certain way despite her feelings. That her feelings were insignificant, that she should feel differently. Good moms listen to their kids when they try to express their feelings. I will always get behind the mom who validates her kids' needs. This may make us more likely to get manipulated, but that's much easier to fix. It's easier for an adult parent to figure out how to draw some boundaries than for a child to grow up repressing their emotions and then try to figure that out as an adult. I have my own dysfunctional family I'd love to offer up as proof. ;)

I do live in a very home-school-friendly community and things still start late. Shoot, our monthly home-school family get-together starts at 6:30. That doesn't bother me so much because it is for the whole family. But, like you, I want as much family time as we can get and it just doesn't feel right to start our activities so late. The other issue for us is that we have to be pretty consistent with bedtimes. When we started dropping out of everything, from praise team rehearsals (for me) and AWANA and dance and sports, everyone kept telling me to push bedtimes later, then they'd sleep in. Nope. My kids just don't. And then my daughter started with the night-terrors and sleep-walking, along with separation anxiety and loss of potty training... all traced to late night activities. No social benefits or diverse interests are worth that. I get that, for some families, making the times later actually makes it more family oriented, as dads getting off work can be coaches or whatnot. But for us, it just doesn't work right now. I'm hoping things will change as my kids get older. But, like mentioned before, we're on the road to isolation here...

:iagree: Oy vey, the hurt that has sprung up in our marriage around this very issue. It's a total roll-reversal. There really no easy way to say, or hear, "I just need to be away from everyone, including you, for a while." Especially when said to someone who can barely go to the bathroom without picking up the phone to call someone. He calls it multi-tasking, I call it fear of silence. :D

:iagree: This is exactly what was in my head, thank you for putting it into words. Modifying phrase also works.