I don't think anyone here thinks education is not important. I actually do support unschooling even though I don't do it. I think it's the parents rights to decide how to raise their own kids as they see fit, as long as there is no abuse or true neglect going on. So do you think that getting CPS involved (OP HAS said she would call as a last resort), is a reasonable thing to do?

I have read of people like that who don't believe in forcing their kids to do anything. I do not agree with that at all but there has to be a line drawn between parental freedom and neglect to the point of involving any authorities. where should that line be drawn? and who decides where to draw it? ETA: it concerns me that the OP is working for the system because I feel her views of where these kids "should" be will be compared to what she does for a living and probably agrees with. I think speaking with BOTH parents about her concerns is enough, if nothing changes from that, just let it go. Going any further than that will cause unneeded pain for this family. If the only wrong thing the parents are doing is not educating their kids in a manner that the OP agrees with, that really isn't her business.

Is there a difference in the books and the pdf sequence you can download on the Core Knowledge web site?

Have you looked into Bill Nye the Science Guy. Or look for videos on youtube? Reading books about different topics from the library and look for dvds there.

Yep. She has said that. Also, educational neglect does exist, I've seen it, read about it, etc. I never said it didn't but I also know a little about the foster care system and I do know that sometimes all it takes is one phone call from a person and one case worker or guardian who disagrees with homeschooling to get kids pulled from their homes, taken from their parents, separated from their siblings, losing their friends and all that is familiar and comfortable, because someone disagrees with how they are (or are NOT) being educated. Is this particular family neglecting their kids educationaly? Possibly. The OP said the kids were eager to learn with her. My kids would be too because they like to please people they aren't familiar with. You've heard of kids who behave great with a sitter but the second the parents arrive they behave horrible? Mine are like that. Maybe these kids are. The point is without KNOWING there is true neglect happening, not even a suspicion of abuse, but just a possibility of educational neglect, or maybe just a difference in opinion on how a child should be educated, calling in CPS can damage these kids for their whole lives AND it could set an presidence on changing the homeschooling laws for all the peoplein that state. Once you take away someone's freedom to raise their own children how they see fit, you put ALL homeschoolers freedoms at risk. Obviously, I am NOT speaking of when a child is actually abusedor neglected.

But that's just it, if the child has no desire to learn these things, then some unschooling famiilies do NOT teach them until the child DOES show interest because believe it or not, that is actually what they believe unschooling IS. You don't have to agree with it but calling CPS sure will not help those kids!

We don't actually know if the 13 yo does have LDs or not ad honestly, the more of the OP posts I read the more I feel as if she doesn't approve of the way the kids are being raised and even though I may agree with her that it's not the way "I" raise my kids, calling CPS even as a "last" resort because the mom won't do what the OP thinks she should is far beyond what needs to be done. The OP has already said it's her JOB to asses kids in the ps system so it seems to me, she has a ps mentality. Which is fine, she's allowed. But obviously not all homeschoolers share that mentality.

I don't think there is a difference. Unschooling, IMO, is basically allowing your child to learn things on their own, as they choose to. I know of at least 3 families who would never identify themselves as unschoolers but they ARE.Their kids want to take an art class, they take an art class. They want to play football, they play football. They want to raise pigs, they raise pigs. And I don't mean throwing a football around in a yard, or raising a pig on a video game. They play on teams. They show the pigs. They eat them. They write plays and perform them in church or at scouts or wherever. They spend hours building the solar system because they want to. They ride horses in shows, they fix cars, etc. Can/will/did these kids take algebra at grade 9? No. Neither did I and I went to PS! Maybe these kids that the OP knows are knowledgable in things like alternative meds, cooking meals from scratch, making their own clothes, fixing electrical appliances. Maybe they've learned those things by doing them and not by reading them. Who knows? The above examples are from families that I actually KNOW, not just ones I've read about or pulled out of my head.

Not ideal, I admit, but also not abusive. The dad is there for breakfast and dinner, she said. Sounds like he doesn't have long work days.

I have 7 kids, 2 have graduated. So that leaves me with 5 still schooling at home. My 15 yo dd does her stuff independently. Her schedule: Life of Fred Bible Devotional English Lessons through Lit written narration reading animal journal marine animals zoology spanish drawing history on Fridays (our light day) she does: geography art nutrition reading Freewrite Fridays My youngest 4 do the same as my 15 yo on Fridays except I am involved in doing all of it with them because they can't work without direct supervision. The other days their schedules are: (all together) Devotional History English lessons through Lit (all are in the same level, I adjust as needed for my youngest 2) Song School Spanish Science Their independent work consists of math, reading or phonics, written narration for the older 2, reading to me for the younger 2. What I do is combine as much as possible! When teaching about proper nouns, for example, my 12 and 10 yos will underline them in the ELTL copywork, then I do it orally for my 9 and 8 yos, while the other 2 check their answers. With science, we use Sciencein the beginning (lOVE this!) and we all do the experiments, the 12 and 10 yos draw and write more detailed than the 9 and 8 yos. We do the stuff together first, then I have them do their other stuff. But I have to stay close because they won't stay on task if idon't. I throw in a load of laundry, go back to the school room, warn tjhem to be quiet and keep working, go walk the dogs, go back to the school room, sweep the floor of the room they are in, check a math page, sweep the kitchen floor, check a phonics page, throw laundry in dryer, start another load, start my 9 yo on TT math on the computer, check more math, clean the half bathroom, check written narration, start lunch, etc. You get the picture. Basically I go back and forth all day and do what needs to be done. But I do not have them do hours of school work. My 15 yo does an hour of math but she is doing algebra. If she doesn't daydream (which she DOES often!) all her work would take no more than 4 hours. I see no reason for her to do more than that. My 12 yo, also 7th grade, and the rest do school all day because it's impossible for us to just sit and get it all done at once but if they did, it still wouldn't take more than 3 hours. But they don't work that way, they needlots of breaks so we do stuff together, then they play outside for awhile. Btw, we adopted our youngest 4 so I've BTDT also! Do what works for YOUR family, even if it's not an hour per grade or whatever.

Where did you get the one hour per grade level idea?

post 21, not 16.

According to post #16 she said the mom is a fun mom and they travel a lot.

Does that mean it's been removed? With no explanation?

I'm thinking the OP really needs to just let it go. She may not like the way the kids are being educated but really, if there is no actual abuse going on, calling CPS will traumatize these kids and their parents way more than not reading at the level that they "should" be at. The kids are clean, cared for, the OP says they travel a lot, are in art co-op type classes, maybe the parents are unschoolers but haven't accepted that about themselves. I know famiies like this. One in particular that I know has 5 kids kids and NONE of them were at the level, academically, where "they" say they should be yet the oldest 3 are all productive adults. 2 own their own houses, all 3 own their own cars, one is married, etc. The 2 still at home have caught up. The family did travel a lot, moved a lot, did a lot of sport oriented activities. Is that the way "I" would educate my kids? No. Does that mean I should have butted in and called CPS? NO!!! If you have talked the parents (there are two parents that should be involved in this, not just one) and told them your concerns but don't see any changes, then maybe you should just MYOB and worry about your own kids.

I've read through this and a couple things stick out for me. 1. why isn't that dad being in on any meetings of concern? These kids do have two parents, not just one, so if you're meetng and talking with one, why not both? 2. Could the kids have LD's? 3. This exact question gets asked about twice a year and it always turns into a debate.

Thanks for all these suggestions. This actually sounds like something I could give her high school credits for if she does it long enough. Any clue what I would call it?

That's ok. We school year round so this would be a summer thing anyway. High school won't start till August. :-)

My 14 yo loves fairy tales so I'm trying to come up with something she can do besides just reading them. I was thinking of having her read original fairy tales, then the modern ones, or watch the movies, like Disney. And write something, maybe different endings? Modern endings? Comparing the originals with newer versions? My brain is half dead because we are decluttering our house and cleaning and getting ready to put it up for sale but school must go on! If anyone knows of any resources, I'd appreciate it.

You were way nicer than I would have been!

I don't understand why they would make an arcade for adults? Really? I mean I'm not the most mature 42 yo on the planet but that seems a little bizarre to me. ETA: I wasn't all that into arcades as a kid either so maybe that;s why it seems weird. lol

I can't even imagine. Praying for you!

I have been there about 4 times and I don't get the appeal of it either.

I used to have a Rottweiler mix (pre-kid days!) and my dh wouldn't let her sleep or even get on the bed. But when he would leave early in the am to go to work, I'd stay in bed, and as soon as he was out the door, up she came. :-) It was our secret and she never did it when he was there. ;-)

5 now. :-) We have 5 dogs and 3 cats. 2 cats are independent and only want food from us. One thinks he is a dog and meows ALL the time for various reason, but he doesn't sleep with anyo ne. Our 98 lb border collie mix sleeps on the floor. Our coon hound would love to sleep on a bed and used to, curled up in a ball. Now she sleeps on her own blankets and if somebody forgets to give them to her she paces and whines. Our terrier mix sleeps on a bed, under the bed, wherever she chooses that night. Our weenie dog sleeps with my 18 yo dd, under the covers, behind her legs, or his butt in her face. lol My Chihuahua sleeps with me.