I wondered about including those 2. Whether 10 or 8 vs. 4 it seemed significant to me, but I guess I don't know how that works when it comes to these studies. That makes sense, though I guess this study is still going to leave me with unanswered questions about hcq which is annoying. 😋 Do either of you (or anyone) have thoughts on remdisivir? That drug seems to be quite popular even though the study results seemed fairly insignificant to me.

I have been looking for results on the U Of MN hydroxychloroquine study. It had 2 arms - 1 was looking at taking hcq after a covid exposure. This showed little benefit, although there were some limitations because they weren't able to test most patients. The 2nd arm was looking at taking hcq early on in the covid progression. These results were just published here. They concluded that hcq had little benefit for these patients too. However, I am confused. 10 patients in the placebo group were hospitalized and 4 patients in the hcq group were hospitalized. That seems significant to me. What am I missing?

But to be clear, the CDC is specifically talking about having a household member test positive - a situation where your odds of becoming infected are far higher than a healthcare worker on the job taking precautions. They are then being told to go ahead and go to work where they could infect others. And this guideline is for all critical workers which is a very broad term.

Ugh, that's infuriating!

In an absolute, no other choice, emergency I can see this. As standard operating procedure, it seems like bad guidance to me.

This is where the right answer may vary. We have a very small school. In my two closest districts the graduating classes run around 20 kids. Most grades have one class, but I know the current 6th grade is "big" with 25 kids so they have split that grade into 2 classes. I forget sometimes how different this decision is for others.

Right, they should keep working until they develop symptoms. Considering what we know about asymptomatic spread this seems like horrible advice. But what do I know?

It is a gamble. 🙁 I feel like it is a risk worth taking to get kids back in school, but I don't love either option.

I'm not defending it, but this has been the CDC guidance since the beginning. Critical workers should continue working even if they have been exposed to a positive case. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/community/critical-workers/implementing-safety-practices.html

Yeah, that was eyeroll worthy. Another example of someone who does not want to admit mistakes may have been made. It is hard to know, but while schools struggle with this decision I think it means there isn't one clear right answer here. I wouldn't want to open schools in a hotspot. However, it might not be that risky in areas that are not experiencing an outbreak.

Sweden says its open school policy (school was open to <16 yo) did not lead to covid spread. The report also apparently showed that teachers were not at any more risk than any other profession. https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN24G2IS The report, which has not been peer-reviewed, found that during the period of February 24 to June 14, there were 1,124 confirmed cases of COVID-19 among children in Sweden, around 0.05% of the total number of children aged 1-19. Finland recorded 584 cases in the same period, also equivalent to around 0.05%. "In conclusion, (the) closure or not of schools had no measurable direct impact on the number of laboratory confirmed cases in school-aged children in Finland or Sweden," the agencies said in the report, published last week. The report showed that severe cases of COVID-19 were very rare among both Swedish and Finnish children aged 1 to 19, with no deaths reported. A comparison of the incidence of COVID-19 in different professions suggested no increased risk for teachers.

Well, my opinion is that the vast majority of news stories I read involve intentional whipping up of worry and anxiety, so that's my vote... ETA: I'll amend this to say this immunity stuff is new to me, so it is very possible that they also don't understand the science. However, I would never write a piece or report on a topic I didn't understand. So whether intentional or not, it doesn't speak highly to the current state of the news.

Here is a really great article looking at the Moderna vaccine. One tidbit I found iinteresting - European countries wanted to be involved in this study, but Moderna had to turn them down. They have so few cases that the results Moderna is hoping to get in a few months in the U.S. would take years in Europe. It is a very grim silver lining that our inability to get cases under control could benefit vaccine development.

My complete layman understanding, so anybody feel free to correct me here... memory cells will give protection but it is hard to test who has these memory cells and it is also possible for their effectiveness to wane over time. So while we hope immunity stays even after antibodies wane, we don't know for sure. When a person shows antibodies we know they are immune. The half life on tetanus antibodies is 11 years, the half life on measles antibodies is 200 years. There was originally hope that we'd be looking at something like measles, where you can almost guarantee a "one and done" situation. Between the waning antibodies and reports of reinfection, it is starting to look like that is unlikely with covid. Immunity may very well last past the life of the antibodies, but it gets murkier to be sure when antibodies aren't present. That does cause some concern for the effectiveness of vaccines. We aren't even sure yet whether they will trigger an effective immune response, though I'm sure we'll find one that will. The secondary question will be how long does that immune response last, i.e. every 6 mos boosters is going to be a hard sell. I have mostly heard optimism that we will find a vaccine, but I have heard a few experts muse that 4-10 years might be a better timetable than the 18 mos we were told at the start.

Good idea! I don't know if my dd will want to do this for her senior pics, but I'm going to suggest it to her.

This is an out there suggestion but... N95s are in stock at my dh's electrical supply store. You might try calling around to a place like that or other contractor supply stores.

Was that where the security guards were um, mingling with the guests? I remember hearing about it, but didn't realize that was at the root of the Melbourne outbreak. How frustrating!

Gotcha, that's good to hear though. It seems it would be inevitable for this to happen occasionally if they were housed together. At least they are taking the right steps to prevent spread in quarantine itself. And like you said there could be other reasons this case wasn't caught in the 14 days.

That's unfortunate. 🙁 Do you know, are positive and negative cases quarantined in the same building?

But this is already happening, right? I mean the CDC has absolutely no pull right now anyway. The administration is clearly going to continue to minimize them regardless of this database.

I see where this could potentially be very problematic. The NHS agreement is very clear that they cannot use the data and must destroy it after a certain time. Do we know that the U.S. won't have the same deal? Won't states still be releasing data? Where are you seeing that these numbers won't be made public? Fwiw, I have huge problems with the fact that politicians give these deals to their buddies. But it is not only one party that does this and it happens at every level of government. That doesn't factor in on my thoughts on this database because I have come to believe that almost every person in power does this. I hate it, but it seems to be the norm. I'm trying so hard to not be political, but I have to say... do you have any clue how uncomfortable I am defending this administration in any way? Lolol, it is killing me... I just don't have enough information yet to determine this new database is an attempt to fudge the numbers.

It looks like Palantir is already doing covid data collection for the NHS. I guess that makes them a logical choice, tho I admit I never know what to make of these no-bid contracts. I believe the UK is being transparent with their data. For now, I am holding out hope that the U.S. will also be transparent with the data.

Thank you! That must be it 👍

Yes!! I have heard they'll eat mice but I've never seen it. I have witnessed them eating a frog. Blech!

No paywall for me