[Virginia public colleges and universities; also, academic ratings of schools]

3 hours ago, Innisfree said:

Thanks again, this is all helpful. 

Can anyone else speak to the degree of academic pressure at any of these schools? (Thanks, Mom0012.) I know this is experienced differently by different students, but does it seem more intense at particular schools, or is this really just impossible to measure? Has anyone gotten a sense for it by visiting?

I guess, to get a little more specific: if a student's stats put them above, maybe even well above, the middle range accepted at a given school, would you expect that to mean classes might be too easy? We have that tension where we're looking for "just right", neither too easy not too stressful. High academic ability, but enough pressure is already applied internally. We don't need more. But then there's a current CC class which is really frustrating dd because she knows how to do what they are teaching already, and because she's at that level now, she isn't getting any help with learning more. We don't want that experience repeating itself over and over in college.

The only one that I’m aware of on your list that I think of as a pressure cooker is W&M. I haven’t investigated UVA enough yet to know, but I don’t think that is as much of an issue there. We are visiting at the beginning of October and my dd will sit in on a class. 

We have had the same concerns about the classes being too light at certain schools but, again, I’m not thinking you will find that to be the case either, My dd will be sitting in on an upper level Latin class at CNU in a couple of weeks to see what she thinks. Part of the draw for her is the honors program which will get her into upper level class more quickly.

I would suggest making visits and sitting in on classes. At every school we go to, dd sits in on an upper level Latin class. She gets a feel for the students and the academics by doing so that she thinks is helpful.

Someone mentioned University of Richmond. It is a private school and expensive but the aid is supposed to be good. Same thing with Washington & Lee. Those are both schools we’ve looked at closely.

ETA: Just remembering a friend of mine said some of the majors at tech were very difficult to do well in. Of course, she attended many years ago and things may have changed, but I would look into it if I were considering it.

[Virginia public colleges and universities; also, academic ratings of schools]

3 hours ago, Chris in VA said:

Ds went to VCU for cinema/film. Dd is at JMU for Music Education. 

I think what you want to study should be the first thing you look at when choosing a college. Dd could have had her pick, but only JMU had the size to have a decent orchestra/music ed program, and it had an excellent reputation in that area as well. VA Tech is gorgeous, prestigious, and a great school--but didn't have a good program in her major. Same with W&M and UVA. VCU was ok, but we hated Richmond and the campus is ugly, downtown and has crappy dorms (although they have been renovated so that may be different now). Agreeing with other posters that you can find partiers ANYwhere. It is a personal choice not to party. We love JMU--the campus is really pretty, it is set in a friendly, mid-sized town (so there are options for shopping and plenty of off-campus housing), the vibe is friendly and she has had excellent professors (but she takes 10 classes, and they are mostly all music or education related at this point). A LOT of people are from the Northern VA area, but that area is racially diverse, and people come from many different places there, so it didn't bother us. There is a great deal of community involvement--2 examples--There is Duke Ukes program (it's something like that name...) where the music ed students hold a day long workshop teach ukelele to city kids, with great joy! And when an apt building housing mainly students burned down last year (student error), the whole community came together, both on campus (they were allowed more time for assignments, offered dorm housing, etc) and in the town (fundraiser started, people donated items, restaurants gave certificates, etc). Everybody cared. It was really amazing. 

We looked at Christopher Newport and I have to disagree a bit with the previous poster--Newport News is NOT a "nice city"--it is awful, in my opinion. The campus itself is gorgeous, with tons of columned, marble-floored buildings, lovely gardening, etc. The music dept was very friendly but they only graduated one viola the year we looked, and that was too small for dd. Students are required to live on campus, which we think, honestly, is partly due to safety concerns. They are also allowed cars Freshman year, again, because the school doesn't want kids milling around "downtown" because it is not a very safe area. My dd's best friend goes there and loves it, so I think it depends, again, on the program. 

 

Okay, so I know there are areas of NN that aren’t nice. However, I have never actually seen those areas in all my trips down to CNU and much of the surrounding area is nice. There’s a B&N, a Costco, a Target, a Lidl, and a lot of clean, bright northern-VA type stores about 10 minutes from the campus. There are shops right across from campus that the students go to frequently. There is a 5 mile hiking trail. The Mariner’s Museum is right next to the campus. There is a hospital right near the campus.  When we go, we stay at a Holiday Inn Express, literally less than 5 minutes from the campus and the place is brand new and the people that work there are friendly and nice. I’ve also stayed at the Hampton Inn near the B&N, which is a few minutes farther away.

My ds has seen the rougher area because I think he and my dh got a bit turned around, but he knows not to go in that direction. I honestly wasn’t even thinking about it and it never concerned us or weighed in on our decision to send our ds there. I was just talking to my dd about what a nice area it is when we were deciding where she would apply. Plus, you are very close to the beach and not far from Williamsburg. I completely forgot there even was a bad area.

 

[Virginia public colleges and universities; also, academic ratings of schools]

I don’t know how to interpret the niche ratings, but I like reading the school newspapers to get an idea about the feel of the school. They are usually online, but I always look for one whenever we do visits.

I attended George Mason many years ago and it was largely a commuter school. I know they have really built the campus up and have a lot more residential students, but there is still a large population of commuters. 

I visited Mary Washington with my son and William and Mary with my daughter. Both are beautiful campuses. I really like the location of Mary Washington in Fredericksburg. Classes seemed small and when we visited the historic preservation department, the professors we met seemed very involved and helpful. MW also gives automatic scholarships based on test scores (or they did as of a couple of years ago). William & Mary is pretty but is basically in a swamp. It poured the day we were there and we were literally standing in two inch deep water on the sidewalk. When our tour guide said, “Well, it an issue but it is swampland.”, I suddenly knew why I had never really liked W&M, lol! Very serious students though and I know people that absolutely love it. My dd says the main negative she reads about it is the social scene, or lack thereof. My SIL went there and felt it was a bad choice for her because everyone there was a top student and she fell in the middle and was unable to go on to graduate school because she didn’t do well enough. She did make lifelong friends there, though.

Take a look at Christopher Newport maybe? They also give scholarship money to students who participate in the leadership and/or honors program. Usually about $5,000 - $10,000 a year. The campus is very pretty and bright and in a nice location. My ds is there and has been happy. I had never heard of it until a few years ago and then once I started hearing about it, it was nothing but positive reviews. The classes are smallish and discussion based. The academics have been challenging for my ds, but definitely not overwhelming or a pressure cooker. Their honors program allows you to streamline the general education requirements and knock them out quickly so that you can get to the upper level classes earlier. My dd is going to apply for it.

ETA: Some dorms at W&M and UMW are not air conditioned. Same with UVA. My kids both have pretty bad allergy issues so that is something I really pay attention to.

 

 

[The 'I Hate CollegeBoard' bandwagon....]

A friend of mine told me that she called the college board and they told her the local school was no longer offering AP exams to homeschoolersI. I told her I doubted that was true. I emailed the administrator at our school and she told me that they are figuring things out, but homeschoolers absolutely will be able to take her exams there. Never believe the college board! 

This thread has inspired me to make sure to write a sincere thank you with a gift card to the lady at the school who handles AP exams in our area. 

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

12 hours ago, FriedClams said:

I did both and provided my scale for weighting. On the Coalition App there are 500 questions about the grading scale so it'll be covered. 

Oh my gosh, yes. I am using the common app, but the section on the courses the student is taking has a drop down box for what type of class each one is, So, honors, advanced accelerated, college level, AP, regular and about 10 more options that I can’t remember but that made me wonder if I was picking the *right* thing.

[Early Decision I and Early Decision II]

When did the ED II trend start? It seems that it eliminates the early action option from many schools that are going this route. Which means you have a choice between making a binding commitment with your application or waiting to find out until April to see if you have been accepted. I am happy we still have some early action options, but there are a number of schools that would be high on my dd’s list if her first and second choices don’t work out that I don’t feel like we can rely on as our safeties or backups because April notification is so late. 

[NM]

Nm

[Common App Course Descriptions -- are they essential?]

3 hours ago, RootAnn said:

Frequency of class (once per week, twice per week) and size of the class (under 10 for foreign languages, for example or one-on-one) were common inclusions, yes.

Though I will admit to not including any grading criteria in my descriptions like some people do. 🙂

I have a little blurb after each class taken by an outside provider that tells whether it was an in-person or online class, how often it met, how many other students were in the class and how frequently my student interacted with the other students and with the teacher.

I was reluctant to add all this info after many of my course descriptions, but in the end, I decided it was info that would be beneficial to my student. I *think* stereotypes about homeschooling are waning, but I wanted to make it obvious that my student can work with others.

 

[Italics look wrong in 'preview' on the common app essays]

I would try to upload it as a pdf. I had trouble with this though with my school profile because the document then wound up being too large as a pdf. But I’m not that great with all the tech stuff.

[Common App - Transcripts]

8 hours ago, daijobu said:

In addition to my main transcript with all her courses documented, I also had extra unofficial transcripts from Stanford OHS, PAH, and the local CC.  I appended those into one big pdf and uploaded it separately.  I believe there is space in the Common App to upload more than one transcript.  

Later after she was admitted I had an official transcript from the CC sent directly to the admissions office.  

Okay. I was thinking this would be more convenient for whoever looks at her application. And save me the expense of sending official transcripts before admissions. So my transcript will be document 1, course descriptions doc 2 and then one file with the other transcripts as document 3. 

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

10 hours ago, Calming Tea said:

Why not calculate weighted and unweighted and put both on transcript?

But, IMO if you had to choose and your child took a lot of HOnors classes, or AP or DE, I think you do do them a disservice by not including weighted GPA.  The last college I spoke with regarding my daughter said GPA is the number one determining factor over and above the type of class, with SAT's a close second factor.  She explained that in my dd's case the fact that she does NOT have many honors and AP doesn't affect her too poorly because she got mostly A's and therefore her GPA is close to 3.8 right now...(junior year is much harder so we will see how that changes things.)  But of course, if she had gotten mostly A's in AP classes her GPA would be above 4.0.  But they said that they do take above-4.0 weighted GPA's kind of in one go-round, and then look at the SAT scores, and then the classes.  ...so in this circumstance a 4.5 doesn't get you too much farther than a 4.1....but a 4.1 gets you a lot farther than a 3.8...

BUT since you have control over your transcript just include both and make sure that you save the website calculator, or the math that you used in case anyone asks..but- they won't.

Okay, I will include a weighted gpa. That’s an easier decision for me than figuring out whether to label certain classes as honors. But, I think I’m going to go with labeling the Lukeion classes and the Great Books classes that way and then just add a little explanation about how I defined honors classes to my school profile. And then just let it go.🎈

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

9 hours ago, Corraleno said:

At most schools, the point of labeling a course as "Honors" is to distinguish it from the non-honors version of the same course, so in that sense there's no point in Lukeion labeling their classes as Honors, because ALL of their courses are Honors level — they don't have an Honors Greek I class and a non-honors Greek I class to choose from. However, the courses were clearly referred to as Honors level in the letters of recommendation that DS received from Lukeion. If you saw what passes for "Honors" at most public schools these days, you would not hesitate to label them as Honors.

This is what I listed on the Common App as the criteria I used in determining which courses counted as Honors:

"Courses designated as Honors were those that (1) used college-level materials, (2) required significantly more work and deeper analysis than would normally be expected at a high school level, and (3) covered subjects in which standard high school courses could provide a basis for comparison."

ETA: I provided both a weighted and unweighted GPA, with DE weighted 1 point and Honors weighted a half-point. Some schools will recalculate a weighted GPA according to their own formula, but others will just look at whatever GPA they are given. And even the ones that reweight grades themselves are going to go by the labels you provide, so if their formula includes weighting honors classes and you haven't designated any honors classes, your student will be at a disadvantage compared to students whose transcripts include honors. 

I really like your wording for your honors course designation.  

I did just find something on the Lukeion website that said their Latin 5 and 6 was paced like a college 300/400 level class. I am sure that the Barrs consider them honors level. My concern is not whether they are honors or not, but whether it will be perceived that I am padding.    My dd’s Transcript looks a little over the top since she already had 5 language credits and 3 math credits by the end of middle school. I have scores and outside classes that validate her achievements, but I am concerned about giving the perception that I am not being 100% honest, even though I am trying to be very accurate. So, it’s this subjective stuff that’s throwing me. She has worked so hard, I feel a huge responsibility in documenting everything correctly. Thanks.

[Common App - Transcripts]

When it asks how many official transcripts I am uploading, I assume this is just for my homeschool transcript? I wouldn’t load community college transcripts here, right? Just have them sent directly from the community college?

I am planning to send a PAHS “transcript”. Should I upload this here or have it sent separately as well?  TIA!

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

22 minutes ago, Kassia said:

 

My dd says that her homeschool classes were way more work than any of her DE classes!  I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing!  

Same here. The DE classes have actually been easier than any other classes she’s taken anywhere. My ds took two DE classes this summer and was quite shocked at how easy they were.

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

I am uploading my dd’s Course descriptions and transcript to the counselor portion of the common app either tomorrow or Tuesday. Then, we are submitting her first round of applications. So, I am going to make a decision soon and be done with it.

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

2 hours ago, JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst said:

If you choose not to include a weighted GPA beside to mark it as unweighted.  Do not assume that an admissions committee will know that automatically.  FWIW I included both. For weighted courses I chose to use those indicated by the curriculum provider as honors, college level, or AP courses.  In the case of Lukeion, I believe that beginning with Latin 3 they were considered honors courses.

I can’t find anything on Lukeion’s website that says “honors”. My dd started with them halfway through Latin 3 in 9th grade and I’m not even including Latin I and II in her gpa.

 

 

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

2 hours ago, katilac said:

Not all - in our district, standard honors classes also get weighted. My kids had both honors and DE classes that were weighted in line with our local school district. And we did have colleges specifically tell us that the weighted GPA was used for scholarship qualifications, so not weighting could definitely cost a considerable amount of money. At one preview event, some students were from a district that did not weigh grades at all, which pushed some of them to a lower scholarship category.  

Having weighted grades will never hurt you, unweighted grades might. Many schools will recalculate, and that's fine. But if you wind up with one school on the list that accepts weighted grades for scholarships, you might be in for a world of monetary hurt if your GPA is unweighted. 

Schools are not cross-checking every outside provider simply to see if classes are listed as honors. If a school goes to the trouble of checking out your outside providers for admission purposes, they will not disagree about Lukeion being honors. Only competitive colleges and/or programs would possibly even delve that deep, and even then it's not likely. They are going to look at your course description first. Absolutely no one is going to go, hmm, Wheelock's as a text and translations in third year, this honors class is clearly bogus, lol. 

Mom0012, if a class would be considered honors within your local school district, then it should be marked that way on the transcript and weighted accordingly (however your local district would do it). The only exception would be if your outside provider has an honors option that you choose not to take; in that case, do not mark it honors even if it ranks that way locally. 

That does kind of put it in perspective. I feel quite confident that the Lukeion and CLRC Great Books classes are honors level. The CLRC teacher recommends three credits for one year of GB — Lit, history and composition.

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

3 hours ago, teachermom2834 said:

My dc apply mostly to schools that use a weighted GPA for automatic scholarships. Some just take whatever weighted GPA you give at face value. Others recalculate a GPA according to their own formula. I used to not want to deal with designating courses Honors or weighting but after going through it twice I am making sure that failing to designate courses or weight grades does not hurt my student with automatic aid.

How it is playing out in my house is that I still don't designate Honors.  My ds has taken mostly online courses and I'm really not sure how to determine Honors and I'm not that invested in finding out.  My dc all have had enough de courses that get weighted to make up for not using an Honors designation. So after two years of courses my 16 yo has a 4.0 GPA. Now that he has started de he will have a higher weighted GPA (assuming good grades).

If your dc has a 4.0 it really doesn't matter. I've never seen a scholarship require higher than a 4.0. But there are some scholarships and honors programs that require a 4.0 or very close. My older boys had a sprinkling of Bs on their transcipts so that weighting made up for that. 

So I've kind of come down in the middle. I don't do Honors because I'm not sure what my ds has done would be considered Honors level and I'm not really interested in trying to prove it is. But there still is weighting because quite a bit of de goes into the equation and that is weighted even more heavily. If my next child does not do de I will probably go to the trouble of designating Honors courses. 

The large public universities we have had our dc apply to just look at the transcript and apply a formula. They are not digging into it and assessing the level on their own. Maybe they do for the big competitive scholarships but not for admission or automatic merit aid.

Okay, so the bolded takes some of the pressure off.

I feel like I know which of my dd’s classes should be labeled honors. Those classes were, by far, more challenging than anything taken at the cc, which gets weighted like AP classes. It’s just bugging me that these particular providers don’t label their classes that way on their websites, probably because it’s just not on their radar or it’s not important to them. And I am sharing links for these providers in my school profile.

[Weighted GPA Necessary?]

 Am I hurting my student by not including a weighted GPA? A lot of the classes she has taken I would consider honors-level classes such as Lukeion (because of the pace) and CLRCs Great Books courses (because of the content). However they are not explicitly labeled honors on the website so I’m going back-and-forth on what classes to label honors or not. I’m thinking I will call them honors on my course descriptions but not on the transcript so I don’t have to think about it anymore. This reduces her weighted gpa, so I’m thinking of just reporting a regular unweighted gpa. Good idea or bad?

My biggest concern with labeling them honors classes is that they are not labeled that way on the Lukeion website or the CLRC website. Now I am pretty sure if I contacted the individual teachers they would say that they are honors level classes. I just don’t want it to look like I’m trying to pad her transcript or be dishonest in any way..

[Never Pay Retail for College — Book Recommendation]

Once my dd has been accepted to college, I would be happy to pass my copy along to anyone who would like it.

[Never Pay Retail for College — Book Recommendation]

 I’m finishing up this book right now and highly recommend it. It’s a great overview about the college selection process and how to select colleges that make financial sense for your family based upon your student’s profile. I had my daughter take the career assessment that was recommended in the book and that was also helpful. It seemed right on target for her strengths and interests.

There was a lot of information in it that I had already picked up from these boards and elsewhere in dribs and drabs. It was nice to read something straight through from beginning to end that confirmed some of the information that I already knew but it gave me a different perspective about some things and introduced me to a few helpful resources such as the career assessment.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1619615339/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[Common App walk=through]

2 hours ago, daijobu said:

 

I've heard this as well.  For example, you can change the essays you upload, which may be helpful if a college asks for something on a secondary application that is already covered in your main essay.  In an effort to not duplicate information, you can provide them with a different essay.   I'm guessing this might be an issue if you are applying to regular colleges and then some more specialized colleges like conservatories.  

But I think there is a limit to how many versions of the CA you can submit.  Check with their help desk to see what the current rules are.

We did not take advantage of this, probably either because it wasn't an issue for us, and it also would have taxed my brain!  

Interesting! I didn’t think about changing the essays. That could be really useful. Though I probably won’t attempt it because of the brain taxation issue.😊

[Disappointed in TPS Algebra 1– other class options?]

I’ve also used Lial’s with the videos with great success here. Some don’t like it because it’s not conceptual, rigorous enough, but it sure was great for my ds. He has rock solid math skills and a great number sense from all his years of Rod & Staff and then Lial’s. It was a perfect foundation for him. He earned an A in Business Calculus at college and he’s now studying to be a CPA. Might not be as good for someone who is headed towards engineering or the sciences and needs more focus on trig though since you only get trig in the precalculus book versus the initial exposure in algebra 2 that many programs offer. 

 

[Disappointed in TPS Algebra 1– other class options?]

22 hours ago, SusanC said:

Have you looked at Derek Owens or myhomeschoolmathclass? Both have algebra, mhsmc has live, online classes if you need that. DO has tape delay classes with assistance available by email.

I like Derek Owens, but only with the self-grading option. It is half the price and he’ll give you an answer key. My ds tried myhomeschoolmathclass and what I found with it and every other class that is structured like it, is that it just isn’t a great setup for learning math for us. There was way more time spent on class time than doing problems. And doing problems, and lots of them, is what solidifies math skills here.

[transcript question]

I tried printing mine, signing it and then scanning it in as a pdf. But then my document size was slightly too large. I wound up just uploading the original document without a signature. I don’t know how to get my signature on there without scanning it in.