[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

This week's New Yorker has an article about the novelist Marilynne Robinson. I read Gilead a few months ago and had mixed feelings about it -- I remember feeling it too subdued and self-contained. This article reminded me that I used to dislike Robert Frost for the same reasons, so maybe I'll change my mind about her one day. Anyway I think the article is really good, and it's always a pleasure to read about authors and their lives:

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/10/05/marilynne-robinsons-essential-american-stories

 

[Ideas for geography workbook and similar]

2 hours ago, Lori D. said:

Totally just a thought:

Since you're looking for more of a supplement for your DS to do solo, and because he has stepped up in rigor and volume for Writing, you might consider something that requires less writing/rigor for the supplement. I totally see that you are specifically requesting something where DS fills in names of geographic items, BUT... Maybe have your DS look at the samples for the various resources and get his input about which would be of most interest to him for a solo-working resource in a subject area he loves?

Esp. since you guys already are using and studying your atlases, you might not really need a fill-in-the-name resource workbook... Maybe online geography games might be something that would be more interesting?? (Check out the free online Sheppard Software geography games (capitals; locations of countries; regions; rivers). Again, just a thought!

It would DEFINITELY have been a good idea to have him look at samples and give input about what he wanted to use. That is a good point. Of course I was way too impulsive and have already ordered one of the Maps Charts and Graphs books. In the past, he's really liked filling in blank maps with country names, so I'm thinking he'll enjoy this, but I'm also ready to set it aside if not : )

[Ideas for geography workbook and similar]

1 hour ago, Lori D. said:

LOVE the Complete Book of Maps and Geography! Colorful, interesting, tons of geography topics -- even a whole section on each of the 50 U.S. states. In general, my DSs didn't care much for workbooks, but they both *really* enjoyed this one a lot. 

We also enjoyed the Maps Charts & Graphs series mentioned above. Both the MCG workbooks and the Complete Book... workbook are pretty independently done by the student.

Not colorful, and more analytical are the Mark Twain Discovering the World of Geography books. We did the gr. 6-7, and gr. 7-8 books when DSs were in middle school. Here is the grade 4-5 one. This series required a bit more parent involvement for explanations and guidance from time to time.


I have to confess, the Memoria Press materials always look like real joy-killers to me, but I know they are a good fit for many families. 😄 

Thank you!! I especially like the look of the Mark Twain series. 

[Learning Foreign Languages Thread - October]

1 hour ago, Matryoshka said:

I'm not advanced enough to know if a character that means 'beauty' can be used as both a noun and an adjective, but my guess is that it could.  But the pronunciation and character would remain identical for adjective or noun.  No adjective or adverb endings to indicate the changed part of speech.

The issue is that each character represents one syllable, which is usually one word (sometimes two go together to make a new concept, like 'hello' is the characters 'you' and 'good' together, but the pronunciation for each doesn't change - you literally say 'you good' for 'hello'.  "how are you" is basically 'you good /question particle/')  The character for, say, the pronouns, never changes to subject or object or possessive.  There's first person, second person, third person, singular and plural.  In the spoken language, third person isn't even differentiated by gender (there is a gender marker in the written character, though).  Verbs never conjugate.  I think there are time markers added to the sentence to indicate past or present.  No perfect tenses or subjunctive or any other moods or such - those ideas I'm guessing are indicated by adding new words.

This is so fascinating; thank you for explaining!,

I remember working with Chinese speakers who were learning English; they had a lot of trouble with verb tense, with -ed and -ing endings, and with articles and prepositions. Now I can see why 🙂

I didn't know that each character represented a syllable; I thought it was always a whole word. I had read somewhere that the character system made it possible for Cantonese and Mandarin speakers to use the same written language -- I guess that means that both languages combine syllables similarly into new concepts.

[Ideas for geography workbook and similar]

1 hour ago, acresoft said:

You might like Memoria Press Geography Student Workbooks.

https://www.memoriapress.com/curriculum/american-and-modern-studies/geography-iii-exploring-and-mapping-the-world-student-workbook-second-edition/

Thank you! This does look really interesting. 

I couldn't tell from the sample pages what "Robinson maps" are but I guess that's explained in the book?

[Learning Foreign Languages Thread - October]

20 hours ago, Animula V. Blandula said:

I love Chinese, and

Chinese will be the end of me.

The language lures us in with the simplicity of its grammar, and then launches an attack on our spirit with its impossibly rich vocabulary, with our faithful friends, Greek and Latin roots, completely unable to lend us a helping hand. 

Just last night it took me half an hour to get through a few pages of a kids'adventure story.

But I love Chinese. 😄

I'm in awe of those of you studying Chinese! it's really interesting seeing these snippets of information : ) 

I don't know if this question is too vague to answer but -- what does it mean that Chinese has a very rich vocabulary? Do you mean that the sheer number of words is greater? If the grammar is almost non-existent, does that mean that you can't transform a noun into an adjective (like beauty and beautiful) and you just have to learn a totally separate word for each? 

 

[Ideas for geography workbook and similar]

2 hours ago, perky said:

Maps Charts Graphs.  My dd did the whole series during her grades 5-7, I want to say.  (I didn't discover them until then.)  They are leveled by letters on the cover, not grade numbers.  We started with book A and continued on in order.  

https://www.rainbowresource.com/hSearch.jhtm?keyword=maps+charts+graphs

Thank you! These look like something he'll love.

[Ideas for geography workbook and similar]

Hi all,

I'm looking for a few fun and relatively easy things for my fourth grader to work on, while I'm working with my second grader.

His work has gotten more difficult this year -- I'm expecting more from him in terms of writing, note taking, his math has obviously gotten harder, etc. He's doing well, and it's nice to see him stretching. But I'd also like to give him some simpler work that he can just pick up while he's waiting for me. I don't mean busy work, I just mean something he can enjoy and learn a little something from, without having to be operating at maximum, if you know what I mean.

Anyway, he really loves geography and is good in it. I'd like to find him a book where he can learn mountain ranges and rivers in the US and around the world. We already have a lot of atlases and spend time studying them; what I want is a workbook where he fills in names. Or even a coloring book. Does anyone have any ideas? Or any ideas about similar kinds of projects? I know workbooks get frowned on a lot, but we use them rarely enough that my kids seem to find them relaxing!

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

20 minutes ago, vmsurbat1 said:

Reading Poe's essay on writing The Raven turned me on to seeking such things out...

I've never read that; I'll have to look for it!

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

5 hours ago, vmsurbat1 said:

I'm back, too!  I think I accidentally posted on last week's thread--an old username was resurrected when resetting the password--but then this last time getting on the forum, I've been checked back in under my most recent username.  SO strange.  To repost some of my recent readings:

Finished: 

Becoming by Michelle Obama, which I found very helpful as we were already living in MNE when Obama made his appearance on the national scene.

a Retirement book for those in their 50s+ (title forgotten) by Suze Orman, also found very helpful.  We are playing catch-up (pastoral salary, not debt) and this book didn't depress me like so many others.....

The Simple Art of Murder, by Chandler--a collection of short stories, hard-boiled detective genre, suitable for small reading windows

A Marriage Under the Terror by Wentworth--quite different from her Miss Silver series.  Less predictable than I expected, so I finished it, but not one I'd particularly recommend or ever reread.

Currently Reading:

The Vanishing Half by Brit Bennett.  I have to say, that my reading of The Warmth of Other Suns has greatly contributed to my understanding and appreciation of books like Becoming and The Vanishing Half.

I like Raymond Chandler a lot, and the title essay in "Simple Art of Murder" is my favorite. I just took out my copy again to skim -- I love the part at the end of the essay where he talks about redemption!

[Delphi Complete Works of Mark Twain]

I don't know that particular collection, but I wouldn't give the complete works of Twain to a nine year old. Some of Twain's essays are quite dark -- he was deeply critical of Christianity, for example, loved talking about nudity, and some of his writing is written in what's supposed to be Satan's voice. (He uses that voice to critique earthly hypocrisy. but still. It is not light hearted.) Maybe a collection of short stories would make sense instead of the collected works?

[Recommendations for stories by Plato and Aristotle]

You could read Narnia -- especially the Silver Chair. If nothing else, it'll probably make it way easier when it comes time to read Plato later on.

[Learning Foreign Languages Thread - September]

A question for @Matryoshkaand all of you other Spanish grammar experts:

I passed a Spanish-language sign today urging people to become organ donors. It said in big letters "Sea considerado." (Be considerate I guess. I didnt know "considerado.")

I thought it was interesting that it used "ser" rather than "estar." If I'd had to guess, I would have guessed that "estar" was correct, since the sign was urging people to take a specific action. I guess it's "ser" because it's talking about a profound character trait? 

[Read-aloud help for sensitive listener]

My daughter, also 7, is like this too. She loves books in which families/siblings have adventures together-- they feel really safe and secure, I think. She loves Farmer Boy and all the Little House books. She loves Mary Poppins too. And Ramona and Henry Huggins, and the Moomintroll books. 5 Children and It. 

She's also loved books like Around the World in 80 Days and Journey to the Center of the Earth (abridged versions). I think there is something fun but just a little silly about them which makes them feel safe.

For what it's worth, I think the Emperor's New Clothes is a scary story! I was horrified by that kind of thing as a kid too 🙂

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

17 hours ago, Penguin said:

I read a play this weekend:  The Trial of the Catonsville Nine by Daniel Berrigan. The Catonsville Nine were a group of Catholic Vietnam War activists. In 1968, they forced their way into a Selective Service draft board office just outside of Baltimore. They stole draft cards and burned them in the parking lot with homemade napalm. It was broad daylight, and they waited around for the police to show up. Berrigan's play is of course a work of art, not a recitation of a court record. But it was a good piece of art. I really liked reading it. Here is a link to Maryland's Public Library resource on The Catonsville Nine if anyone is interested in the straight-up history. 

The Berrigan brothers (Daniel and Philip) were well known Catholic activists back in their day, and I have been curious about them for a long time.  I knew of them but not about them. I have a slew of books lined up by and about Fr. Daniel Berrigan, but the play he wrote was my entry point. Daniel Berrigan was a priest, an activist, and a prolific author.  Philip Berrigan (also one of the C. Nine) was also a priest, but he left the priesthood in 1969 to marry a nun and fellow activist. I am also discovering that the other members of the Catonsville Nine have interesting stories. 

Rabbit trails led me to find out that Philip Berrigan's widow, Elizabeth McAlister, participated in a 2018 anti-nuclear action at King's Bay, GA. Now in her 80s, She was sentenced this summer to time served plus probation. From what I can tell, several of the defendants, including Dorothy Day's granddaughter Martha Hennessy, have sentencing dates coming up in early October. Current events make The Trial of the Catonsville Nine feel not like a footnote to history but more like one piece of a much bigger historical narrative - admittedly a niche one.  @Little Green Leaves You might be interested to know that about D. Day's granddaughter, if you didn't already. Were her granddaughters part of the biography you read? It is a different granddaughter (Kate Hennessy) who wrote the fairly recent book about her.

 

Daniel Berrigan came up in the Dorothy Day biography a lot! I think she disapproved of some of his methods but obviously agreed with his beliefs? I completely missed that he was also a writer. 

Her granddaughters were part of the biography, yes, Tamar and her whole family were. There was a lot of tragedy there and I found that part of the book pretty painful, honestly. But possibly that particular biography played up the problems in the family.

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

13 hours ago, Dreamergal said:

Astrix ?? In French or English ? I grew up reading them in English too. Whatever little "Latin" I know is thanks to Astrix..😊

Oh I do, diligently. I discovered my french understanding of spoken language was at tragic levels in Paris  after confidently assuming I could understand, just not speak.🙄.  I can laugh now but then I was mortified.

I learned a lot from Asterix too! I had some in English and then for the rest I had to read my father's old French copies. I'm sure I missed out on most of the jokes and all of the puns,  but those books were so good.

I am totally misguided about my French because for years now, I've only used it to speak with people who know me very very well. They understand even my most incoherent phrasing, and they don't mind when I shift into English. It's been nice working a bit harder on my French lately!

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

12 hours ago, Violet Crown said:

Texas is just background in La Rabouilleuse; one character comes back from the Bonapartist colony, that's it. Like Algeria in Cousine Bette, which I remember now with your prompt. 

I got rid of Said in the great "not returning to grad school" purge. I remember when I read it, feeling guilty as I realized how much I unapologetically loved 'Arabian Nights' sorts of literature and art. But I really should track down a copy and re-read it. If only the library at Big State U. would reopen.

Yes. I remember feeling guilty over how much I loved Baudelaire. 

I sometimes think I'd do better at grad school now that I'm older and a little steadier, but who knows 🙂 

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

3 hours ago, Dreamergal said:

If you don't mind graphic novels, Manga (Japanese comics) is one of the best forms of reading French. I did not know until recently. It is apparently the biggest market in Europe for Manga. I plan to do so as it involves two things I love.

The Bible for some reason is difficult in French for me even with English right beside, I am thinking there is a subtle message from God here. 😂

I definitely don't mind graphic novels. I grew up reading old French comics like Asterix and Lucky Luke, but I'd love some more modern suggestions. Maybe I can get my kids interested in them too.

I love your project of reading the Bible in French, and I also see how difficult it must be : ) Do you ever listen to French? Sometimes when I'm cooking I put on French radio -- rfi.fr/fr and I don't stress over every word, I just soak in what I can. They also have podcasts.

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

4 hours ago, Violet Crown said:

I didn't remember that at all! Now I'm wondering if I should re-read Said and see if he had anything interesting to say about this. Or does North Africa count as "Oriental"?

Texas is surprisingly present in 19th-century French consciousness. As well as Champ d'Asile, there was a Fourierist commune on the Trinity (briefly: they soon discovered that Texas Plains weather consists of alternating blizzards and droughts). The French were the first to recognize the Republic as a nation, and the French Legation is one of our city's most prominent historical buildings. The Republic maintained an embassy in Paris from 1836. Even today we have a substantial French ex-pat presence, which made hiring a French tutor very easy.

I had no idea about the French-Texas connection! that's really fascinating. I want to learn more. Maybe my next Balzac will be La Rabouilleuse.

Algeria in Cousine Bette is basically treated as a cash cow -- Hulot sends one of his relatives there to try and embezzle money from the (French) war department. It doesn't end well. So it felt really weird -- the country is not orientalized, it's just treated as an extension of French bureaucracy. Zero local color. Not a single scene is actually set in the country.  (In general, I'd say North Africa counts as "oriental." Delacroix had already painted his Femmes d'Alger when Cousine Bette was written. I should get a copy of Said.) 

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

9 hours ago, Violet Crown said:

I've read Cousine Bette, Père Goriot; and La Rabouilleuse (The Black Sheep). I feel that there's one more that I'm not recalling.

Texas features obliquely in La Rabouilleuse via the Champ d'Asile, a failed Bonapartist colony on the Trinity River, where one of the characters is a colonist. It's less well-known but I enjoyed it.

Have you read Les Contes drolatiques?

I did not know that he had written about Texas! Do you remember that there's a subplot about Algeria in Cousine Bette? I found that fascinating. He was one of the very first to put Algeria into fiction. 

I have not read contes drolatiques, no.

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

19 minutes ago, Dreamergal said:

The second book I read is

Now this came with a lot of recommendation, hype and controversy.

https://www.vulture.com/article/american-dirt-book-controversy-explained.html

Relevant topic as in an undocumented mother and son displaced by violence and escaping the cartels after the father a journalist is killed. They are solidly middle class so they leave for safety not economic reasons. The author is sincere but her researched vs lived experiences comes across clearly. It is not personal at all and it is clearly seen even with of the very light and fluffy Pride and Prejudice Pakistani version I read. But that voice of the author has an authenticity this book lacks.

It is like the author went through a checklist of things train jumping, sexual assault, the middleman and eventually reaching the US. I've read more personal stories told by the reporters of CNN that followed the migrant caravans. 

I also listened to 

 which is a true story of a boy's journey from Honduras to find his mother. I heard it in Spanish and because it is very weak I double checked my comprehension with this news story

https://www.latimes.com/nation/immigration/la-fg-enriques-journey-sg-storygallery.html

Even with my weak Spanish what rang true was the authenticity of the experience. I had to pause and listen to many times, but this touched me on a different level, American Dirt did not.

This whole week and the three books I read in e-book and audio form threw up interesting questions and made me reflect that I want to write a little more about.

I remember the controversy around American Dirt. It's really interesting that the book's limitations come through so clearly.

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

Double post

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

9 minutes ago, Dreamergal said:

Happy Sunday that is almost over ! 

Thanks Robin for this thread.

Well, my reading week has been interesting. I felt like I climbed a never ending mountain by foolishly choosing to read two books and listen to one, that too in Spanish, a language I do not have much of a grasp. But surprisingly as often happens I found unexpected parallels between two unrelated books which made me take a whole new look at things.

First up

Pakistani take on Pride and Prejudice. 

Short version: Absolutely wonderful book , faithful to the original but with unique takes. Many cultural references of food, fashion, weddings and sprinkled with Urdu and Hindi words with a hefty glossary. The characterization has much of the original yet unique elements like both Lizzy (Alys for short) and Jena (Jane) work in an "English medium" school teaching English literature. Darsee (Darcy) a clever take on the tendency of the subcontinent to have last names of family professions, in this case tailors.  Darcy and Bngley in this case are younger than the girls and most of all both Lizzie and Jane of this version are in their 30s and unmarried. 

 Personally though and unexpectedly what hit me on a deeply personal level had nothing to do with the book but a character.

I have always looked for books in English that have people who look like me, experiences I could identify with and that is why I read Desi (India, Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Srilankan mainly) lit a lot. While I have always found commonality in food, ritual, culture and customs, what I have never found is someone who matched my life experience in books. 

Alys (Lizzie) is a bibliophile who teaches English literature in a girls only school and the way she begins each school year is the ask the girls to personalize the first line of Pride and Prejudice to get to know them better. The book is set in 2000 and thus there are so many references to books and magazines I read growing up like Reader's Digest, Enid Blyton, Daphne Du Maurier. She discovers them just like I did in various libraries and I just about cried when the book referenced the British Council library which was such an influential one for me and which I had lovely memories of. 

Alys and Darzee also have book discussions throughout the book, the famous dining room scene for instance when Jane was injured has a book discussion. Alys does this thing called Analogous literature which I do too but did not know it had a name where you pair books by western and eastern authors of a similar feel for instance Train to Pakistan by Khushwant Singh and Grapes of Wrath by Steinbeck. There is a whole bunch of them like that, some which I discovered and some unexpected which will set me up for a nice re-read of books I have already read, but in a new light.

An absolutely lovely read, highly recommended.

Thank you for this review! I love the idea of analogous literature.

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

1 hour ago, Violet Crown said:

Still working on The Ambassadors. And Gatsby still on my must-read-now plate, together with Swift's A Modest Proposal. I sneaked in a re-read of Thomas Day's 1990 classic (in certain circles) Why Catholics Can't Sing, which I last read when it came out and was raising eyebrows by saying the things that everybody thought but wasn't saying. 

From last week: I'm in awe of you ladies tackling books in French. I can fight my way through French literature, but a quick subtraction of my age from my probable life-span convinces me to stick to translations. @Little Green Leaves, are you planning on reading much of the Comédie humaine in French? I keep meaning to read through more of it -- I've read some of the novels in a desultory way -- but haven't yet. 

 

Good question. I'll probably read more, and if so, it'll definitely be in French. After all, I did spend years studying the language, and I have French family, so I feel obliged. But it'll be out of order and with long gaps in between books. I've read  La Cousine Bette, and then years went by before I picked up Le Pere Goriot. I'm curious to read Eugenie Grandet, but I'm in no rush. 

Editing to add -- which of the novels have you read? Is there one you'd recommend?

[Book a Week 2020 - BW39: Banned Book Week - Freedom to Read]

I just googled "banned books" and found that Maurice Sendak's "In the Night Kitchen" was banned by various library systems, apparently because of the little boy being naked in one scene. That was one of my kids' favorite picture books.

I've finished no books this week. Still reading Le Pere Goriot, very slowly but with a lot of delight. I started reading Robinson Crusoe to my kids, which is really refreshing. I had gotten used to hearing it described as a book about capitalism, which may well be true, but reading it with kids makes me realize that it's also a book about adventure, danger, dealing with emotions, and so much more.