The queer discussion prompted a talk with youngest tonight. They are non binary and identify as queer. That word has been spoken quite a bit here and with both of my dc’s peer group and I haven’t experienced a negative reaction in so long, so I asked. They have zero problem with the use of the word by anyone as long as it’s not being used negatively. It’s how they view themselves so they definitely don’t see it as bad.

I’ve been sad about this and honestly don’t understand why. I mean it’s usually sad whenever I hear about someone dying, but ugh. I guess it’s because I watched Full House some growing up and then watched it with my dc. It seems he’s been on my tv for a number of years so it’s sad.

Yes! Someone freely offering up their pronouns really help my non binary ASD kiddo, especially people in authority. It helps them feel safer in whatever setting they’re in when it happens. They don’t think anything one way or the other if someone doesn’t do it, though. It just makes those people stand out differently to dc if they need something in the future.

I actually agree. I do think some of the talk regarding trans youth is too close to conversion therapy for my liking, but professionals should have some leeway to figure out for sure what’s going on. I’m not in support of laws in either direction that make it difficult for health professionals to do their jobs.

I’m honestly not sure, but my state actually submitted a bill just this month hoping to make it illegal for health care professionals to be affirming so it’s the exact opposite. It’s just one of the reasons we’re leaving as soon as oldest graduates this May. ETA: That same bill in my state says health professionals shouldn’t be allowed to affirm/reinforce a minor’s sexual attraction either so I’m not sure how far they’re hoping to go. Sounds like it would also affect kids in therapy trying to work out any LGBTQ+ issues. So, no help for any of these minors here I guess.

I took your court reference to mean courts would interfere in regards to treatment, not lawsuits. That’s why we’re moving. I don’t feel ok with courts deciding what treatments are allowed or not. I’ve always been fine with lawsuits against doctors and letting the courts decide if cases are legit for that particular individual.

The court theory is definitely an interesting one and one I for sure don’t agree with. It is a big reason we’re moving to a blue state this summer though. Conservatives are running the courts here and I know how they feel about my Ds. Mine are both adults now but I just don’t want to live somewhere that would do want some want in this regard. Many of these kids actually need more options than some think they should have.

I’m quoting again because I don’t want it to seem to anyone that Ds doesn’t still struggle at times with anxiety and depression. He just doesn’t need medication for it now. Not that long ago we were doing something and he looked at us and said the body dysphoria was hitting him hard. It was his way of letting us know he was struggling and to be patient. It still happens but he’s better able to cope these days.

I’ve already said I definitely don’t have all the answers but I strongly disagree with stopping treatments completely, which seems to be what many want. I do think we have a lot to still figure out but I knew when my kid hit his point of no return and we had to do something. I know I’m not the only one. I feel for those who have different experiences but I just disagree the answer is no treatment for anyone until we figure it out. There needs to be some way to treat these kids as we figure it out and therapy alone just doesn't work for many. I do think a common theme is that therapy isn’t done well in the beginning and we’re too focused on affirmation first. That needs to change but we need to come up with a point when they can move forward from therapy alone and I don’t agree that point is only adulthood.

I did recently have a chat with Ds about how if all we’ve done thus far ended up being to just give him the space and time he needed to be comfortable and he changed course that we would 100% support him. I let him know that we wouldn’t regret anything because it was obviously what he needed at that time. He was receptive but let us know he has no second thoughts. I think most parents know their kids best and some of us realize at some point that giving weight to some of those long term consequences people throw at us won’t matter if the kids won’t actually be here to experience them. Ds didn’t get excited about going to college until the last minute and he told us it’s because he just never pictured himself doing so because he didn’t think he’d still be here. After social transitioning, he was off all anxiety and depression meds and he’s been good since. I know it’s not the same for everyone but I hate to think of the kids like him that would be ignored by some the thoughts expressed here.

Yes. Some say they feel it’s like conversion therapy and that many of these kids would be gay, not trans. It feels kind of like conversion therapy to deny trans kids treatment such as socially transitioning because some would just rather them be gay, not trans. There is so much we don’t know which is why we definitely need more research but, again, I don’t think in the interim we quit giving treatment to trans kids that work for many. There’s no easy answers. ETA: FTR, my Ds is trans and gay so it’s a moot point for us. He’s now engaged to a sweet girl but he’s dated both males and females. He wasn’t trying to escape being gay by becoming trans.

Yes, there were no trans students (that we know of) in his high school when he came out. It’s a very conservative area but thankfully no teachers or staff pushed back on using his preferred name and pronouns. Many students were nasty in the halls and such but none were violent. He has some trans friends now he’s met at college and through groups but it’s not a large group. I do feel more around here are coming out as non binary, but not wanting any hormones or surgery like some of you are experiencing. Youngest is non binary but doesn’t want either of those things nor do they want to change their gender markers on any documents, so I think I’ve gotten lucky with all of that.

When I hear these things, it is weird. My trans Ds pushes gender roles all the time. He’s trans but has long hair, sometimes wears make up, sometimes paints his nails, wears a lot of pink and purple, the list goes on. Him being transgender has absolutely nothing to do with any of that so it’s always weird to hear it. ETA: This also reminded me of talking with youngest around the time Ds came out. I told them it was ok to like boys, girls, both, or none. They told me if that had to choose then (at 13), it would be girls because boys their age were dumb. 🤪

I, obviously, don’t agree but thank you for answering. I know these discussions can get really heated (and some of that has been my fault for sure) but I’m honestly trying to understand better where everyone is coming from.

We never did an allowance. When they were in high school, we opened bank accounts and I’ve just always made sure there was some money in it. That’s continued through college as well as adding a credit card. I might have done things differently if either were big spenders but they’re both rather frugal.

I totally agree that the mental health care for all of these kids needs to be overhauled and better. I also completely agree that therapy shouldn’t start with instant affirmation and drugs. I just disagree with those that feel drugs and social transitioning shouldn’t be a part of the process for minors at all because there are those who truly need those things.

I think we’re both at the same place. I do think there are things to be researched regarding how many are coming out. Where I have issues is with those who want no treatments for minors other than therapy. Ds had years and years of therapy but it was socially transitioning that made the difference. He’s now decided, at 22, not to pursue surgery at this time but is still on hormones. He’s also legally changed his name and gender markers. I’m ok with how things have worked out for him, but can also realize not everyone has had the same level of care and I know that’s a problem. I really hope things work out well for your dc.

So, no treatment for any trans kids until this is figured out? Asking honestly and want to know what you mean.

They’re not mutually exclusive but what’s usually said when these pieces come out is how no minor should be allowed puberty blockers, hormones, or surgery(completely agree with this one). There was a thread on this board not long ago about how calling trans kids by their preferred names and pronouns was harmful so not even social transitioning should be allowed for minors according to some. What treatment should they be allowed? What seems to be said is many are worried there are too many trans kids now and the only answer is no decent treatment for any to spare the truly non trans kids who might slip through the cracks, which is harmful to those who are trans. We definitely need better access to mental health care but that’s across the board for everyone. I do think there needs to be a discussion on how to distinguish between those truly trans and those who aren’t but I have no answers on how to do so. I do know the answer isn’t to stop treating all of these kids with things that work for many. This isn’t really directed at you, goldberry, but a jumping off point for how I’m feeling about it at the moment. I’m so tired of it all.

I’m only going to reply once and then not come back to this thread because I know too well how they go here, but I’m linking a Twitter thread for anyone interested in my own thoughts. I’ll also say that I don’t think non trans kids are more valuable than trans kids, and I don’t feel the answer to any of this is to deny trans kids affirming care. Forcing my own trans child to wait until an adult would have killed him - not an exaggeration. He’s now a healthy, happy, still trans adult. I would have been one of those parents who didn’t think he showed any signs until he came out and I was wrong. I can clearly see now that wasn’t the truth. https://twitter.com/mavenofmayhem/status/1478773646327836676?s=21

Um, I was actually taught the Civil War was not about slavery. I was also taught the Black Panthers were as bad as the KKK. It was my education and research as an adult that made me realize I had been lied to. It’s horrific that for a period of time I believed that garbage. Honestly, anyone still trying to say the Civil War was about anything other than slavery are the ones still trying to believe in Santa Claus, and it’s these kinds of posts that show why things like the OP should be posted and discussed.

I’m from small town Texas and have known many people (some in my family) that had Confederate flags and felt it was about Southern pride. Most of those people don’t have those flags anymore because they know what it means today and it has everything to do with racism. The ones that still do have made it very clear that’s what it’s about as well. I don’t buy people are flying them in today’s times for any other reason.

I haven’t commented because I’ve been trying to figure out how I feel. I do feel it’s wrong to remove something from a grave, but it’s also not working to just let people be wrong and to be “nice” in regards to racism. I think we have to do things now that make us uncomfortable if we ever hope for it to get better. I think that realization is even more difficult right now because I assume all these racist, Confederate flag flying people are also carrying guns.

Our older kitty was also mostly just a gravy licker until I found these. She really loves these pouches but we do have to switch up the flavors for her daily because she is picky about eating the same one twice in a row. 🙃 I suggestions find them at the pet stores here but I usually just order from Chewy.

We’re planning on NYC in early June. It’s a trip that was planned as a graduation gift for youngest two years ago but obviously canceled due to Covid. Everything is booked and we’re hoping it works out this year.