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May we apply literature we read for history towards English credt?


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I have searched a little on the boards but I am not finding a clear answer which answers my question . . .

 

I understand how SWB combines history and Great Books, but my rising 9th grader is not at that level. I have decided to use BF's Ancient History for History next year as I already own many of the books and I think the level will be good for her . . . she is not at the rhetoric level by any means.

 

But I am confused about English credits . . . could any of the items we read in our history study be counted as lit for English? Or do I need to come up with another reading/lit list for English class? I already have a grammar, writing and vocabulary program and many excellent poetry books.

 

Thanks much!

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I don't. My daughter reads certain books for literature studies (English), and for those we focus on literary devices, genre, theme, plot, vocabulary, etc. She also reads books which go along with our history studies, but we don't focus as much on the literary aspect of the book, as we do the historical context.

 

Here are a couple of examples from her history studies this year:

She read The Scarlet Letter and then wrote a paper on Puritanism.

She read Sister Carrie and did some supplemental reading on city life, industrialism, etc. We *briefly* discussed Dreiser's naturalism, but if this had been for English class instead of history, I might have had her do some more research on naturalism vs. realism, for example.

 

At the high school level, a certain volume of reading is expected for both English and history classes. (if you are separating them and not doing great books studies). So I just try to schedule enough for each class.

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We read works written during the period we're studying and works written about the period we're studying, and these count as both literature AND history. We discuss what we read in terms of both literary analysis (character, plot, setting, theme, & literary devices employed) AND the historical context (societal and moral themes, etc.), and I assign essays and/or research writing that delves into any or all of the above.

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Well, let me put it this way. Our public school doesn't assign ANY reading, except from the text, for history.

That leaves everything for lit, right? :D

 

I used Speilvogel's Western Civ for a spine, then we read lit that corresponded to the time period for lit and for history.

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A super clear answer may depend on the state in which you reside. Many states do not have set criteria for what constitutes a credit. The accepted norm is 120 hours or 120 days/entries or 3/4th of a textbook.

 

If you use this norm then you need to decide where to log the literature book - under English time or history time. If, however, you live in a state like PA, they have one diploma program that has odd requirements for what constitutes a credit in English and you can actually count the literature book toward the reading list and log the hours under history - but I'm guessing this state is the exception and not the rule.

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We read works written during the period we're studying and works written about the period we're studying, and these count as both literature AND history. We discuss what we read in terms of both literary analysis (character, plot, setting, theme, & literary devices employed) AND the historical context (societal and moral themes, etc.), and I assign essays and/or research writing that delves into any or all of the above.

:iagree:

This is what we do also.

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We count literature very similarly to what OC Mom described above, BUT -- as Catsluvsushi pointed out, be sure to check if your state has any specific guidelines.

 

High school English *usually* includes:

- Literature

- Grammar

- Writing (Composition)

 

Vocabulary in usually included as part of the literature. I have a student who struggles with spelling, so spelling is still part of his high school English credit, and I somewhat combine his spelling with vocabulary. Here is an "overview" of what those 3 components of English tend to look like over the 4 years of high school:

 

 

Literature:

At the high school level, you read classic works and begin analyzing them. In 9th-10th grades, you introduce a lot of literary terms or elements (metaphor, symbolism, setting, alliteration, irony, etc.), and look for how they are used in the literature you're reading. You also begin to discuss themes in the literature.

 

By 11th and 12th grades, you read, discuss, analyze and *write* about the works: compare/contrast essay; character analysis essay; essay on how literary elements are working to support a particular theme; etc. You look for themes and how they are connected with and help explain the culture/times in which the work was written, but also how the themes are relevant (or not) in today's culture/times, and also look at applying these themes and meanings to your own life. The student is also becoming able to express these ideas to others.

 

 

Grammar

In 9th-10th grades, you finish solidifying grammar instruction (parts of speech, noun functions, clauses and phrases as modifiers, diagramming or parsing, etc.) and grammar mechanics (capitalization, punctuation, word usage, editing, etc.).

 

In 11th-12th grades, there tends not to be formal grammar, but rather the grammar principles are put into use daily in the student's writing. In 11th-12th grade, you may want to do a "lite" grammar review in preparation for standardized testing (ACT, PSAT and SAT tests).

 

 

Writing (Composition)

Similar to the grammar, in 9th-10th grades, you solidify writing instruction (paragraph structure (topic sentence, supporting facts/examples/details, concluding sentence); making a key-word outline for a paragraph or for a five paragraph essay; complete sentences, varied sentence structure, use of vivid verbs and modifiers, etc.; how to research and how to cite a source; what goes into an essay; etc. And, of course, you're putting these things into practice.

 

In 11th-12th grades, the writing becomes longer and tends to be research papers and analysis essays. A helpful idea at this point is to practice "timed essays" from past SAT essay prompt questions to prepare for "the real thing."

 

 

 

So what's the difference between literature and history? In short -- for us -- it breaks down like this:

 

- Literature is about reading classic literature, seeing, literary elements, and analyzing themes within the work or comparing the work to other works of literature.

 

- History is covered with a textbook; bits and pieces of other resources; and historical fiction (which is different from classic literature). Our history may also include a few classic works of literature. Our history focus is reading for the culture, context and workview of the times/countries.

 

*However*, if a book we are reading falls into both categories above, then we count it for both history AND literature. We also do more literature than many, as we do some specific classic literature to count specifically towards the literature portion of the English credit -- AND we do a separate full credit "Great Books" course as an elective, using a completely different list of classic literature. If a piece of literature from either the English or the Great Books credit overlaps with history, then we "double dip" and count it as both literature and history.

 

For example, this year we are doing 20th Century World History. Among the literature we read were: All Quiet on the Western Front (WW1) and The Diary of Anne Frank (WW2). I counted them towards literature AND history. On the other hand, the boys also read some historical fiction to go with various decades, which we did NOT count as literature because it the works were not classic literature, were not always of high school level, and we did not use them to analyze them as literature -- we used them to get a "flavor" of the times. These works included things like: The Great Brain (1900s); The Road From Home (WW1); Cheaper By the Dozen (1920s); After the War (formation of Israel); etc.

 

 

In case it is helpful, below is a specific example of that from what we are doing this year for English; History; and Great Books elective -- each worth one full credit. BEST of luck as you chart your history and literature courses! Warmest regards, Lori D.

 

 

English = 1 credit

 

1. Grammar program

*2. Writing (history research papers; practice timed essay writing; and responses to the literature below)

* 3. Literature (reading various types of works; discussing; using lit. guides; some writing/response)

 

- Younger DS English Lit. = Lightning Lit. 8

(includes 3 units on poetry; 3 short stories; 1 novella; and 5 novels from various genre -- 2 of which can also count towards 20th Century History: A Day of Pleasure; My Family and Other Animals)

 

- Older DS English Lit. = "Worldviews in Sci-Fi and Gothic Lit"

(includes 1 novella; 3 short stories; and 6 novels -- 1 of which we'll count towards 20th Century History: Animal Farm)

 

 

History = 1 credit

1. Textbook (Spielvogel Human Odyssey)

2. Various Resources = (bits from other books; films; documentaries; etc.)

3. Timeline Entries (20 per decade)

*4. "Decade" Reports: 4-6 history research papers (also counts for writing portion of English credit)

5. Solo Read: 6-8 historical fiction books

* 6. Together Read: 3 works of literature (also counts for lit. portion of English credit)

 

 

Great Books elective = 1 credit

Read, discuss, use lit. guide, analyze, write about a variety of works:

 

- Beowulf (epic)

- Macbeth (drama)

- "The Most Dangerous Game" (short story)

- "Gift of the Magi" (short story)

* All Quiet on the Western Front (novel)

* Diary of Anne Frank (novel/autobiography) -- also counted towards history

* To Kill a Mockingbird (novel) -- also counted towards history

- Much Ado About Nothing (drama) -- also counted towards history

 

* = "double dip" credit

Edited by Lori D.
fixed typo
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