College Kid with Reading Speed/Comprehension Problems

[goldberry]

Hi!  I've never posted in Learning Challenges before, but someone recommended I try!  DD is a freshman in college.  Her slow reading speed and comprehension are causing her problems.  She is not able to get through the material in the time she has.  This is happening both with getting through the textbook material and also reading test questions, which are sometimes a paragraph long.  

 

She has ADD with low short term memory, low working memory and slow processing speed.  She has very high long term memory ability, much higher than average.  She was on medication for several years but stopped due to some adverse reactions.  She is investigating other medications right now.  She was tested at a learning center many years ago (6th grade), so we didn't apply for accommodations at college, although we are considering if that might be helpful now.  We would probably have to obtain a new, more recent diagnosis.

 

She is a math/science kid who hates reading and never reads for pleasure.  We worked on reading comprehension before she took her SAT test and were able to improve quite a bit at that point.  So she is able to GET the information, but just not fast enough to keep up with the school schedule and sometimes the test times.  

 

So, I'm looking for adult resources that can improve reading speed and reading comprehension. Any assistance is appreciated!

 

Adding, her problem classes are Bio-Chem and Cell Biology, so the reading is scientific and not fiction.

Edited March 15, 2018 by goldberry

[OneStepAtATime]

(OP, hope you don't mind me adding to your post...)

 

Added point of detail that may matter to respondents, these classes are in her major so are doubly important.  I assume dropping is not an option or desirable (she also enjoys these classes).

Edited March 15, 2018 by OneStepAtATime

[suenos]

Hi Goldberry - I teach part-time at a university. Can't help with resources to help her improve her reading speed.  But can offer suggestions for her strategy now.

 

Contact (or have DD contact) the school's Disability Resource Center (or some such name). Don't wait.  Do it today. Finals will be here before she knows it. 

 

Tell them that DD has not formally used accommodations for her diagnosed disability - ADHD -  but is finding out she needs to now.  Find out what their process is for registration with their DRC.  Once she's "registered" she should go through their process for identifying her accommodations - they will likely include the option to take any and all exams (it will always be her choice) at the DRC testing center.  Taking it there could include a range of options - more time, ability to type her responses, even perhaps oral reading to her of test questions - depends.  Registration with a DRC is good - they communicate to profs that a student has needs and profs are required to find out from the student what needs they have and make a plan (can be as informal as an email...) to accommodate them. 

 

Also, she should ask the disability center people about audio resources for her class materials - there may be an audio version of her textbook and even assigned PDFs of articles, etc. Not sure if hearing the material would be better than reading - but there are tons of resources now that she can use to listen to materials, even train herself to listen at higher speed.  Check out the website Headstrong Nation - and the video on speed "ear reading": Saving Time with Superfast Speech .

 

Good luck!  There's no good reason for her not to get hooked up with her school's resource center....

[lmrich]

I second the advice of suenos. She will need to advocate for herself. Most universities have great resource centers with skilled workers who really want to help. 

[ElizabethB]

I recently made a video about that!

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XtKN6j1apDs

 

Basically, train your brain with nonsense words; my syllables program folllowed by nonsense word daily fluency drills to improve reading speed, fluency, and accuracy.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

Many of my students who are slow readers do best when they take notes every few lines or every paragraph to help them remember what they have read.

Edited March 15, 2018 by ElizabethB

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

 

 

Taking notes! and bumping post!

[goldberry]

I recently made a video about that!

 

 

 

Basically, train your brain with nonsense words; my syllables program folllowed by nonsense word daily fluency drills to improve reading speed, fluency, and accuracy.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

Many of my students who are slow readers do best when they take notes every few lines or every paragraph to help them remember what they have read.

 

She actually does the notetaking, but again, it just takes so much time.

 

I will check out your video!

[ElizabethB]

She actually does the notetaking, but again, it just takes so much time.

!

You can also work on faster, legible writing and common abbreviations to use in note taking, such as w/ for with. There is also a series of videos about visual note taking that may be faster and may help, I will look for them and add the link.

 

Here it is:

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eZQ7ILUAsek

Edited March 15, 2018 by ElizabethB

[PeterPan]

Yes, you're going to need to update her evals and pronto. When you have her evals updated, then you can take that info to the disability services at university and get accommodations set up. She'll definitely qualify. Meanwhile, she needs to contact them herself and ask for services that she has access to even without a diagnosis. For instance, they may have study groups. Reading comprehension is 80% prior knowledge, so having a group she can read, discuss with, etc. can be a strong strategy. My dd with ADHD uses these kinds of services at her university. It's a preferred way for her to learn, in a group. To me, that's really odd, but for her it's a strong strategy. By discussing the material, they're hearing it and processing it lots of ways. 

 

She definitely wants to start asking for help. Ask professors and ask with the disability/student services. Typically they WANT to do things for students and can't because the students don't ask. I'm sure anything they can do without evals, they'll go ahead and set up. 

 

She should also consider genetic testing to see if she can determine why she reacted to the meds and what meds would do better for her. If she had depression with the ADHD meds, she might need to stack them with an anti-depressant. There's a company doing genetic testing to predict which meds someone will do well on. I think it was Gene Insight or some such thing. We've had threads on it here in the past. You can also get her data through 23andme and run the results through Promethease. Then you can take those results and compare them to the GeneSight site sample reports. Or the 23andme testing might reveal what else was going on that was being unmasked or made worse by the meds. 

[PeterPan]

Btw, reading speed and processing speed don't necessarily connect. It would be good to get her screened for dyslexia by the psych and to get her eyes checked by a developmental optometrist. My dd has nasty low processing speed and ADHD, and she reads like the wind. We did VT. We also worked on retained reflexes. But really, it's mainly the VT. 

 

To find a developmental optometrist, you go through COVD. That would be more of a project to start this summer. Like get the evals as practical and then begin therapy in May when school gets out and push hard, doing homework 2-3 times a day, to make serious progress over the summer. 

 

You can find videos online to test for retained reflexes.

 

I'm not saying it *is* a vision problem, but it certainly could be. The other explanation, dyslexia, is usually accompanied by low RAN/RAS=rapid naming. Happily, rapid naming is something super super easy and FREE to intervene on. In fact, she could make noticeable progress just working on it over spring break! I've shared RAN/RAS dot pages here in the past. She can read them aloud, several times a day. Good RAN/RAS scores are STRONGLY correlated with good readers.

 

The other explanations of the reading comprehension (difficulties with inferences, gestalt, etc.) are more complex to deal with. Let's hope the explanations are simple.

 

Does she enjoy what she's studying? Is staying the major a definite or are other majors on the table?

Edited March 15, 2018 by PeterPan

[goldberry]

 

 

Does she enjoy what she's studying? Is staying the major a definite or are other majors on the table?

 

She loves the information and often calls me spontaneously to tell me cool things she is learning.  Never heard of RAN/RAS before, I will look it up!

[goldberry]

Btw, reading speed and processing speed don't necessarily connect. It would be good to get her screened for dyslexia by the psych and to get her eyes checked by a developmental optometrist. My dd has nasty low processing speed and ADHD, and she reads like the wind. We did VT. We also worked on retained reflexes. But really, it's mainly the VT. 

 

To find a developmental optometrist, you go through COVD. That would be more of a project to start this summer. Like get the evals as practical and then begin therapy in May when school gets out and push hard, doing homework 2-3 times a day, to make serious progress over the summer. 

 

 

 

What is VT? She was screened for dyslexia in 6th grade, the same time we did the other testing.

[PeterPan]

Vision Therapy. So dyslexia is a phonological processing disorder, now diagnosed SLD Reading in DSM5. SLD Reading can be broader than dyslexia. One can have vision problems *and* reading disability, or one or the other. A developmental optometrist can *screen* for developmental vision issues and tell her if she needs the larger developmental vision eval. The screening can be part of a regular eval with a developmental optometrist. Regular optometrists aren't able to do it. COVD is where you find a developmental optometrist. So you'd be looking for tracking and convergence issues, that kind of thing.

 

Vision is a logical thing to screen, and it's easy to get into and inexpensive. If you started now, you could get her an appointment typically in just a couple weeks, and they could up/down yes it's a trail to go further on or not. So it would definitely be wise to do. Should be around $100 for that basic appointment with a COVD eye doc and asking them to screen. 

 

RAN/RAS is Rapid Naming. Testing it is included in the CTOPP, the typical tool they run for dyslexia. The CTOPP will look at rapid naming of numbers, colors, I forget. They have several ways. And if that score is low (a lagging indicator of dyslexia), then it's something you can bring up by working on it.

 

[exercise_guru]

Good recomendations above. 

 

I think the very best strategy is to tape her lectures. Then listen to them. I had a very intensive academic program and would use an old fashion recorder and listen to the lectures during my work hours. It will help with recall and she won't have to focus on notes in class but can focus on retaining the most important information. you could look into livescribe as well. She could just make bullet points and speak into the phone the important facts and then listen to them over and over instead of notecards. 

 

For recording conversations I like voice recorder ( for apple) if there is a way to just record directly . I also just lay my phone on the counter and use boldabeast recorder in android. 

 

Also can you afford an ipad for her? She could use many of the apps to help speed up note processing  for example she could just use dictation to text in a good note program. Evernote is popular she could youtube it but I really like notes plus app  and the myscript Stylus app with my son. You can create notebooks for each subject. My son can switch from dictation to handwriting to typing.  I have thought about looking into panther hearwell, writer and graph apps. she could just dictate her notes into the ipad as she finds important information. Also if she can afford to just highlight and write in the margins that's fine. Honestly my husband and I both have advanced science/engineering degrees. The most important aspect of university was focusing on what was stressed in the lecture and the reading elements the teacher stressed. 

 

If the university teaches an effective study methods class or seminar I would highly recomend it. Also reduce her workload to less credits. Let her focus on less and work on being successful. She could fill the extra class with PE or Art if financial aid is an issue. 

 

 

Over the summer she could try BrainHQ because they claim that their science improves both processing speed and working memory but it needs intense 45 minutes to an hour for 4-5 days a week for 8 weeks. Its not a good use of her nuerons while she is in university. also its affordable at 14 dollars a month.  For medication the very best strategy is concerta or aderall because they do improve access to working memory in most people. For anxiety intuniv helps but It has mixed results with attention. If she doesn't want to try that you could look up Daniel Amen's work on ADD he has supplement recommendations.https://www.additudemag.com/slideshows/7-types-of-add-adhd-amen/

 

For her building automaticity and long term storage is key so she would benefit from learning how to be an efficient student. Focus on learning how to learn and how to key into important details. That makes the best use of the processing speed and working memory she has.  This is the hardest thing about university. Working Smarter not harder. For example with math work on understanding one problem really well and then work on pushing it into long term memory.  Reciting things to herself. Making personal audio notes and listening to them. Mind maps are really helpful she could use lucid chart on the ipad and I am working to learn inspiration. But even on a paper if she used livescribe she could just write a topic and on a mindmap and then record the important facts associated with it on the livescribe. I have heard their new dictation software is good to.

 

Edited March 16, 2018 by exercise_guru

[1shortmomto4]

These are all great ideas but please note that most colleges won't accommodate without the documentation.  It sounds like you need to find some quick solutions to get through this semester and get appointments lined up to put documentation into place for next semester.  Unfortunately, recording in college classes is not allowed any more unless you have documentation.  You can ask the professor if it would be okay but don't be surprised if they say no. What you might try now, that doesn't require the paperwork trail - do they have a tutoring center?  This may help her absorb the info quicker without having to read all the text. Has she made friends in these classes where she could ask one who might be willing to give her a copy of their notes (which when you have the note taker accommodation this is what you have to do anyways). Another option is finding a text reader or the text read out loud but you're going to have pay for that because it isn't covered - until you get the accommodation.  Depending on the university size will depend a lot on what they might be willing to do to help her right now and later down the road.  My ds has a severe hearing impairment and obviously all the documentation and at the CC level  they were awesome to work with and bent over backwards to help him succeed but his new university - not so much.  Disability counselor actually told him that if he just tried harder to listen that he'd do better.  Uh, ok.  Really?  Try talking with the disability office and maybe they can help with some accommodations to get through the semester with the understanding that you'll be providing updated documentation.  Typically schools require the paperwork to be no more than 3 years old but they might use temporarily or you could call the provider that gave the original diagnosis to provide documentation quickly. It doesn't hurt to ask. 

[exercise_guru]

Professors want to help. I think it's worth emailing and asking to go with your child for a meeting.

Ask for advice? Send your concerns ahead of time. I had some pretty horrible teachers and I can tell you everyone of them would atleast have given me advice and helped me grow.

 

Edited March 19, 2018 by exercise_guru

[PeterPan]

For college?? No, the parent doesn't go unless it's a prospective student. This is all on the student. Over 18, they don't want to hear from you.

[exercise_guru]

I actually know that........ but I think it depends on where you live and the college. A community college or a state college they will not freak out if a freshman parent emails a short email and explains the situation and asks if the professor might provide some tips or advice if the student comes in? Ofcourse the student can go and ask for advice but it is very hard for them to explain their situation or how they are struggling.  It can vary by the school. Honestly no professor at the university I worked at cares if you record the lecture and many actually broadcast their lecture so at the very least this would help a lot to listen to the lecture later. Also you are not asking for help with a grade the student is just asking for some advice on how to be a better student in the class.   

 

Is this student at a point where they are failing? Are they handing in the assignments and getting a reasonable score? Is financial aid on the line?  How many credits is the student taking? Sometimes it is important to triage the situation to finish the semester. Some classes might be better to withdraw and some energy is better to focus on exclusively what is working. 

 

Improving reading and processing speed as well as comprehension is not something that can be intensively worked on in the middle of a semester but in the summer there may be a college success class that would help or a seminar. Even the best of students struggle with the transition to university. 

[1shortmomto4]

Important to note - you can not just record a teacher's lecture without permission - it is no longer something that you can just do like you could say 15 years ago.  Check your state laws and tread carefully.  It is important that the student work through these issues - we can help from behind the scenes.  Yes, at the CC the counselors are probably more willing to let mom help navigate the system and be sure the MOA is put into place, the student eventually takes over.  It is a little trickier at the University level.  You might be paying the bill but you are no longer welcome at the table, so to speak. My ds has a hearing impairment and doesn't process the language quickly or efficiently and I've been his translator over the years but once we hit the CC I went to 1 meeting and then he took over. Not the case at University but I've been able to help my ds from behind the scenes and encouraging him on who to talk to, what to say, etc.  They have to learn to advocate for their needs but don't always know what to say because they get very frustrated and overwhelmed.  You may find some professors willing to help but the bottom line is without documentation they don't have to do anything.  And some professors who should be doing the right thing and has the MOA telling them what they should do - don't. 

[Heathermomster]

On 3/19/2018 at 8:07 AM, 1shortmomto4 said:

Important to note - you can not just record a teacher's lecture without permission - it is no longer something that you can just do like you could say 15 years ago. Check your state laws and tread carefully. It is important that the student work through these issues - we can help from behind the scenes. Yes, at the CC the counselors are probably more willing to let mom help navigate the system and be sure the MOA is put into place, the student eventually takes over. It is a little trickier at the University level. You might be paying the bill but you are no longer welcome at the table, so to speak. My ds has a hearing impairment and doesn't process the language quickly or efficiently and I've been his translator over the years but once we hit the CC I went to 1 meeting and then he took over. Not the case at University but I've been able to help my ds from behind the scenes and encouraging him on who to talk to, what to say, etc. They have to learn to advocate for their needs but don't always know what to say because they get very frustrated and overwhelmed. You may find some professors willing to help but the bottom line is without documentation they don't have to do anything. And some professors who should be doing the right thing and has the MOA telling them what they should do - don't.

Amen!

 

My DS will attend uni orientation in June, and the school’s literature specifically states that parents are not to be present.

 

If you want to help, pay for np testing and guide your student through the accommodation process at the uni’s disability services office.

[exercise_guru]

Yes the key is as we transition these kiddos through the teen years and early twenties is working behind the scenes to help them navigate who to ask, who to see and how to go about it, and how to problem solve. Even if a child does not have issues the transition to college is brutal even if you are a very independent and bright individual. I look back on my 1st year and it was a lot of figuring out the the street smarts of things. How to study, what is important, How to approach teachers and peers. My daughter who is only 12 is being pushed to handle these things because we know that we have more influence now with her than when they get older. If your child had a mentor or someone in the university who can give advice that is the very best place to start. Its important for your child to play to their strengths. The best advice I would give is to take less classes. Go slow and steady, ask around and get the good professor, Form friends to study with ( especially in the science fields) Engineers have a strategy called "cooperate to graduate". I would check your professors policy because I am sure that if approached in our area recording lectures with permission will help significantly. I will ask our kids who are in university if anyone records lectures but really it is dependent on the need, the university and many times the professors discretion. Professors like hard working students who are trying to improve and take advice not students who are looking for an easy grade or a shortcut. That is important to explain to students because they have to go to the professor with the right frame of mind to get questions answered. They also benefit from getting questioned answered from other students.

 

Also consider if they have tutoring services. Yes you can try to address the slow processing and reading through accommodations but you are going to need student services to get involved to do that. Still I had a double major and I had to be careful to balance the load at all times because it was the "one more" class that took me out. Dianne Craft talks about this as students who take a D size batter to do the work that another student would take an AAA battery. This is true for my youngest so I have to stay in front of that and not overload him. He needs good sleep and a lower class load. He needs to work at the times that he is fresh and learn to navigate doing things when he has high energy and move easy things to the down part of the day. All that executive function stuff that is tough for so many kiddos and it all piles up in college for sure.

 

My other advice is to make sure that you try to help set your child up for success. If this school isn't working maybe one closer to home or a junior college or community college. I would not send my youngest to the same college I sent my kiddos. I have to take that into account. I also would start him out slower with just a few classes so he could learn the ropes and stay steady on his feet. That's a pain when financial aid is involved but It is the reality of his learning style.

 

The very best advice I could give is look at what has worked for this kiddo in the past and then look for ways to help them behind the scenes improve their efficiency and learning plan. Truly its to bad that all college freshman don't have a life coach mentor to get them on their feet and through that first year of school. Sort of like a bridge between parent and Adulthood.

 

Editing to add

 

I went back and read your original first post the key with biochem and cell physiology is making your own flow chart and memorizing the important information. It's knowing which pathwaya ate important and stresses in lecture. Even if she cant record lecturea she can uae hee phone to make audio note cards to quiz herself. My technique is to say it out loud as I'm reading . I play ir over and over as I review the flowchart mind map I made. The other aspect I think that is important to address for those two classes specifically is that the textbook IS incredibly information dense. Everything in the book is not necessarily all covered in the class or on the test at the level. So the key is to pre read before the lecture what is assigned maybe highlight the most important thing or put a star by paragraph that are interesting then hopefully the teacher is good and provide class notes

Then ad soon after the lecture as possible review the information from class and then again an hour before bed. This pushes it into longterm memory. In study sessions always review previous info for 10 minutes that helps push it in deeper.

 

The add is most definitely coming it play if she can try any medication or she is old enough to look into supplements by Daniel Amen. She definitely needs to work on getting up and studying when she is fresh.

 

Biochem is one of the hardest classes because it's almost pure memorization and not mathematical

 

What are her strongest classes? If it's math and chemistry she could go on and do analytical chem which is more process driven and mathematical. System engineering or software even because it is more linear than conceptual and less memorization.

 

If there are classes she is good at then shape a degree around her strengths. She can always specialize at a masters level so the key is finding or making a degree that plays to where she has high interests (due to the add) can persevere because she can see the end goal and feel successful.

 

If cell physiology isn't working it's probably because it is incredibly detail oriented and takes a lot of reading and listening and remembering your inner voice and what the teacher felt was important.

 

That's not a freshman course so has she done well in the past but just hitting the rocks now? Pm me if you don't want to post here but I know quite a bit about those classes and career paths.

 

I have a nephew who wanted to pursue pharmacy but has similar issues. I told him he would have to go slow and really work to get stuff into longterm memory. That field is almost completely so not a good fit for him.

 

I also have a son with issues and I have found if it means a lot to him he can persevere but it has to play to his strengths focus on two things and not three. When we overload or got at a normal load everything collapses so be mindful of that.

 

I read somewhere on additive magazine about trying to increase interest of the subject to engage those synapses and increase memory.

Edited March 19, 2018 by exercise_guru

[AStableBeginning]

Following! I feel like you are talking about my 9th grader...