Reading Program Help for Dyslexia

[Melody1]

I am feeling overwhelmed by options and I am having a hard time figuring out which program to try. My son just turned 9 and we are pretty sure he has dyslexia. We haven't had testing done yet, but we are in the forms and waiting stage. I would like to get a program to help him along while we wait. He is reading, but he has trouble with phonological awareness, so it is slow and frustrating for him. From what I can tell, he is about a year behind "normal" for his age.

 

The programs that I have been looking at are All About Reading, Reading Horizons and Saxon Phonics Intervention. I have looked at Barton, but I think that might be too in-depth for his needs. Do any of these sound right for his needs? Are there other suggestions that I might not have looked at?

 

And as a side note, through all of my recent research, I think I have dyslexia too. While I have a degree from college and see that he can succeed too, I would love to be able to help him overcome some of the issues that I had as a child (and adult) with reading, so that his options aren't limited in the future!

 

Thank you in advance for your help!

[Pen]

If he has very great phonological awareness trouble he may need something like LiPS, or some help from a speech and language pathologist in addition to a reading program

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www.talkingfingers.com might also help since the program (speaks to student) tells the child to type a sound rather than a letter, like type "/d/" giving a d phonetic sound not "dee".

 

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We used, and I love, love, High Noon Reading Intervention Program along with the HN Sound Out Chapter books. This was a great program for us! It is very incremental and controlled making step by step progress, but not so long and drawn out as Barton. And no nonsense words etc. are used. It should be much easier for a parent with some dyslexia to implement. My son started at age 9 as a non reader and was reading at 4th grade level or above after one year of intensive work. We did not limit ourselves to just HN and he could read (with help) regular type simple books (not yet on age/grade/interest level after 4 months of HN.

 

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I posted more specifics on this in the Throwing in the Barton Towel thread, including a link to the main program.

 

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www.highnoonbooks.com

[rebbyribs]

What have you tried so far? (Or what sort of approach did his school use?) How is his reading now?

 

If he has previously been taught with a sight words or "balanced literacy" approach and is doing okay with easy readers, then your thoughts of what to try sound right on to me. You could also take a look at Ordinary Parents' Guide to Teaching Reading.

 

If he has been taught with a primarily phonics approach and is really struggling, then he might need Barton.

 

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[Melody1]

What have you tried so far? (Or what sort of approach did his school use?) How is his reading now?

 

If he has previously been taught with a sight words or "balanced literacy" approach and is doing okay with easy readers, then your thoughts of what to try sound right on to me. You could also take a look at Ordinary Parents' Guide to Teaching Reading.

 

If he has been taught with a primarily phonics approach and is really struggling, then he might need Barton.

 

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I taught both of my kids to read with a whole language/sight word approach. I did a little phonics at the beginning, but not much. My theory was to emphasize lots of reading to build proficiency in spelling and vocabulary. This approach worked great for my first son, but apparently it isn't what my second son needed. He needs the phonics base in order to help with sounding out long, unfamiliar words and for spelling.

 

He is reading pretty well. (100 page chapter books, still lots of illustrations, multiple paragraphs per page, around 2nd grade level) He just needs some some phonics help.

 

Also, I feel bad for not realizing he needed help in this area sooner, but at least I figured it out and have started trying to help. I have printed some things that I have found free online and some apps, while I have been researching curriculum that I could use.

Edited February 28, 2018 by Melody1

[Pen]

You might also want to read something like Overcoming Dyslexia by Sally Shaywitz to understand more about it.

[Melody1]

You might also want to read something like Overcoming Dyslexia by Sally Shaywitz to understand more about it.

I actually requested it from the library a few days ago and I am waiting for it to come in. Hopefully it will be insightful.

[rebbyribs]

I taught both of my kids to read with a whole language/sight word approach. I did a little phonics at the beginning, but not much. My theory was to emphasize lots of reading to build proficiency in spelling and vocabulary. This approach worked great for my first son, but apparently it isn't what my second son needed. He needs the phonics base in order to help with sounding out long, unfamiliar words and for spelling.

 

He is reading pretty well. (100 page chapter books, still lots of illustrations, multiple paragraphs per page, around 2nd grade level) He just needs some some phonics help.

 

Also, I feel bad for not realizing he needed help in this area sooner, but at least I figured it out and have started trying to help. I have printed some things that I have found free online and some apps, while I have been researching curriculum that I could use.

 

That sounds great, and lots of kids really do take off reading from there with little extra help.  When my daughter was stuck around that level, I used level 4 of All About Reading with her, which was really helpful for learning to spot prefixes and suffixes to break down longer words. 

[Pen]

You could look at the online samples of this and see if you think it would help your son. http://www.highnoonbooks.com/detailHNB.tpl?eqskudatarq=S8271-8 I was surprised to learn when we started it that my son did not actually know the basic English sounds made by each letter of the alphabet, so he needed his phonics from the ground up even though I'd worked with him and he'd had reading in 2 different schools using various approaches and programs. Your son may be farther along, or you also might find starting right at the beginning useful. I've not used the other programs you mentioned.

[Melody1]

You could look at the online samples of this and see if you think it would help your son. http://www.highnoonbooks.com/detailHNB.tpl?eqskudatarq=S8271-8 I was surprised to learn when we started it that my son did not actually know the basic English sounds made by each letter of the alphabet, so he needed his phonics from the ground up even though I'd worked with him and he'd had reading in 2 different schools using various approaches and programs. Your son may be farther along, or you also might find starting right at the beginning useful. I've not used the other programs you mentioned.

That's helpful! I have been looking at their site and trying to figure out exactly how the books worked. The curriculum looks great!

[Melody1]

And just fyi, his troubles aren't just with phonics, but he also struggles with rhyming, rote memory and flipping syllables. These things combined are why I am pursuing dyslexia testing and help for him in these areas.

[ElizabethB]

I would work through my syllables course and order Recipe for Reading, the cheapest OG out there, you can do the entire thing from a white board with the manual.  

 

If he has a slowdown on the MWIA, he may have problems from sight word teaching and not true dyslexia, but the Recipe for Reading manual is cheap and the extra kinesthetic work is not going to harm anyone but is needed for most dyslexic students.

 

http://thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

https://www.amazon.com/Recipe-Reading-Revised-Expanded-Traub/dp/0838805051/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1519861734&sr=8-1&keywords=recipe+for+reading

 

Before getting the full, expensive (but good!) LiPS program, you can try some of these cheaper ideas for phonemic awareness:

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/582944-phonemic-awareness-resources/?hl=%2Bphonemic+%2Bawareness

 

[ElizabethB]

Here are some videos about how reading works in the brain, I also recommend Dehaene's book "Reading in the Brain," has a chapter or two about dyslexia.

 

 

 

And here is one about blending, designed for younger children, but useful to understand for anyone with a problem with phonemic awareness.

 

 

 

 

[Melody1]

I would work through my syllables course and order Recipe for Reading, the cheapest OG out there, you can do the entire thing from a white board with the manual.  

 

If he has a slowdown on the MWIA, he may have problems from sight word teaching and not true dyslexia, but the Recipe for Reading manual is cheap and the extra kinesthetic work is not going to harm anyone but is needed for most dyslexic students.

 

http://thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

https://www.amazon.com/Recipe-Reading-Revised-Expanded-Traub/dp/0838805051/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1519861734&sr=8-1&keywords=recipe+for+reading

 

Before getting the full, expensive (but good!) LiPS program, you can try some of these cheaper ideas for phonemic awareness:

 

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/582944-phonemic-awareness-resources/?hl=%2Bphonemic+%2Bawareness

Wonderful! Thank you for all of this! I actually got the Phonemic Awareness for Young Children from our library about a week and a half ago and I have been working through the "first grade" schedule with him. I can already see improvement in his rhyming ability.

 

I will order Recipe for Reading. Looks like a good, inexpensive place to start.

 

I feel bad that the way I taught him may have caused issues, but I guess all I can do now is go back and fill in the gaps.

[Storygirl]

If he truly has dyslexia (and I agree there are some red flags, so it's good that you are seeking testing), your teaching methods did not cause it. If he has dyslexia, it is highly likely he would have struggled, even with a phonics-based program.

 

Have you read Dyslexic Advantage or other materials about dyslexia? It's a good thing to do, while waiting for the testing date. If it is dyslexia, I think you will find that he will need something more intense than a typical phonics program.

 

You can work on teaching with phonics while you wait for the evaluations -- it's a good idea! But I will say that I used only phonics-based reading programs with DD12, who has dyslexia, and she just couldn't learn to decode properly. She did learn to read around third grade age, after a long hard slog, but I knew something was at the root of her difficulties, and we finally had her evaluated.

 

I think you are really wise to get the testing and switch to a phonics based reading approach. I just want you to be prepared for remediating dyslexia to be tougher than you anticipate.

 

If you work through some phonics and find that he picks it up quickly and just needed to be taught, that's great! ElizabethB always posts very helpful information about her phonics program, and it may be just what you need.

 

But if it is truly dyslexia, he likely will need more intense help. Reading programs that help dyslexia are usually based on the Orton-Gillingham method, which is an intense multi-sensory approach. You can google O-G to get an idea what can be involved.

[Storygirl]

The reason for my previous post is that "just needing some phonics" and "dyslexic" really don't equate with each other. You said you think he has dyslexia but that he just needs some phonics help. Those are really two different scenarios. It's important to sort out which it is.

 

 

[Melody1]

The reason for my previous post is that "just needing some phonics" and "dyslexic" really don't equate with each other. You said you think he has dyslexia but that he just needs some phonics help. Those are really two different scenarios. It's important to sort out which it is.

True, I shouldn't have said he just needed help with phonics. I did mention later that he has trouble with rhyming, rote memory and flipping syllables while reading. I have also found out recently that dyslexia runs in my family.

 

Please forgive me for my inconsistencies. I am sick and have had a fever for two days. I am emotional and my brain isn't running at full capacity.

 

Everything I have read over the past couple of weeks seems to indicate to me that he has dyslexia, with his weaknesses and his strengths. I could be totally wrong though! That is why I am pursuing testing. I just want to do something to help him while I wait, which is why I came here to try to get some thoughts and opinions on different programs.

 

I don't have any presumption that it will be easy for me to help him if he does have dyslexia. I realize that I may need to get outside assistance on this one.

 

I have read about the Orton Gillingham method and I thought all of the ones that I listed were OG. Although now that I go back and look, I don't think Saxon program is.

[Storygirl]

No need to apologize for anything!! Not knowing how much you know about dyslexia, I thought I should make the distinction.

 

I can't advise about the programs you mention, because we did not use them. I did use several reading programs with DD12 in our years of homeschooling, but after she was diagnosed, we hired an OG tutor. And now she attends a private dyslexia school. I hope others are able to chime in about their experiences.

 

The programs that seem to be mentioned most on the LC board by those who have children with dyslexia are Barton, High Noon, and Dancing Bears. Of those, we tried Dancing Bears, but it did not work for DD (and is not an OG approach). If I had continued to teach DD myself after her diagnosis, I would have chosen Barton, because DD's phonological impairment was severe, and she needed an intense approach.

Edited March 1, 2018 by Storygirl

[Storygirl]

Hope you feel better soon, Melody.

[ElizabethB]

Wonderful! Thank you for all of this! I actually got the Phonemic Awareness for Young Children from our library about a week and a half ago and I have been working through the "first grade" schedule with him. I can already see improvement in his rhyming ability.

 

I will order Recipe for Reading. Looks like a good, inexpensive place to start.

 

I feel bad that the way I taught him may have caused issues, but I guess all I can do now is go back and fill in the gaps.

 

:grouphug:

 

I have remediated hundreds of students, some of them with dyslexia.  Don't feel bad, a lot of people use the sight words and don't realize, and with catching it that young and doing a lot of nonsense words it is easy to overcome, the longer you wait the harder. 

 

I would give the MWIA, you can get an idea from that if it is dyslexia or just problems from sight words and a bit of phonemic awareness difficulties.  Also, you can get an idea from working through my syllables program, which takes about 1 hour a day for 2 weeks (best to break each lesson up into 2 shorter sessions for a boy that age, though.)  My dyslexic students gain on average 0.2 grade levels each time they work through it and are generally reading less than 20 WPM on both sections of the MWIA.  My students with trouble from sight word teaching are generally reading 40 to 90 WPM at that age and generally gain 0.5 to 1.5 grade levels after one time through my syllables program, then an average of slightly less than this each subsequent time they work through it, I have them repeat it until they are at grade level, working on higher and higher level Webster passages each time while reviewing the basics.

 

I would give the MWIA 3 short, it is linked at the end of my syllables page, link #5 at the end.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

Here is the direct link to it and a document about MWIA scores, including one student with dyslexia:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/The%20MWIA%20Version%203%20new.pdf

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/UnderstandingMWIAscores.pdf

 

I would also be curious to see his scores on the nonsense word test, although that test alone does not really turn out that much different for students with dyslexia vs. students without dyslexia, students who have done at lot of sight words will struggle with it as well as students with dyslexia.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/NonsenseWordTest.pdf

 

If you don't tell the correct answers, you can use the 40L quick screen reading grade level test before and after remediation to measure progress.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/40L%20Test.pdf

Edited March 1, 2018 by ElizabethB

[mamamoose]

:grouphug:

 

I have remediated hundreds of students, some of them with dyslexia. Don't feel bad, a lot of people use the sight words and don't realize, and with catching it that young and doing a lot of nonsense words it is easy to overcome, the longer you wait the harder.

 

I would give the MWIA, you can get an idea from that if it is dyslexia or just problems from sight words and a bit of phonemic awareness difficulties. Also, you can get an idea from working through my syllables program, which takes about 1 hour a day for 2 weeks (best to break each lesson up into 2 shorter sessions for a boy that age, though.) My dyslexic students gain on average 0.2 grade levels each time they work through it and are generally reading less than 20 WPM on both sections of the MWIA. My students with trouble from sight word teaching are generally reading 40 to 90 WPM at that age and generally gain 0.5 to 1.5 grade levels after one time through my syllables program, then an average of slightly less than this each subsequent time they work through it, I have them repeat it until they are at grade level, working on higher and higher level Webster passages each time while reviewing the basics.

 

I would give the MWIA 3 short, it is linked at the end of my syllables page, link #5 at the end.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/syllablesspellsu.html

 

Here is the direct link to it and a document about MWIA scores, including one student with dyslexia:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/The%20MWIA%20Version%203%20new.pdf

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/UnderstandingMWIAscores.pdf

 

I would also be curious to see his scores on the nonsense word test, although that test alone does not really turn out that much different for students with dyslexia vs. students without dyslexia, students who have done at lot of sight words will struggle with it as well as students with dyslexia.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/NonsenseWordTest.pdf

 

If you don't tell the correct answers, you can use the 40L quick screen reading grade level test before and after remediation to measure progress.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/40L%20Test.pdf

You posted something similar on my thread but honestly the acronyms and links were overwhelming. It’s hard to decide where exactly to start.

[ElizabethB]

You posted something similar on my thread but honestly the acronyms and links were overwhelming. It’s hard to decide where exactly to start.

 

I'm sorry to have overwhelmed you, I was just trying to be helpful!

 

I would start with the "Miller Word Identification Assessment," the MWIA.  It compares the reading speed in Words per Minute (WPM) of sight words vs. phonetic words.  

 

Here it is, give the MWIA 3, it is the easiest and shortest that gets you a lot of information.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/The%20MWIA%20Version%203%20new.pdf

 

Then, I would give the nonsense word test.  It has age norms and is really short.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/NonsenseWordTest.pdf

 

The last test to give is a simple grade level test, here it is:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/40L%20Test.pdf

 

My syllables program page has a lot of links, but after those 3 tests, to work through the program you can just watch the movies and use the printed material to work through.  I'll post direct links to exactly what you need to do the program in a second post.  I recommend the program for anyone reading below 12th grade level, it is quick and powerful, you learn a lot in 10 lessons.  My students who are more then 1 grade level behind sometimes need to work through the program a few times, they gain reading grade levels each time and I just add in additional Webster's Speller readings for them the second time as they progress.

[ElizabethB]

Here is what you need to do the syllables program.  Print the one page Black and White vowel and consonant chart, page 5 of the following document:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/40LChartsCombined.pdf

 

Print the one page vowel chart in color:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/OnePageVowelChart.pdf

 

Either order the workbook from Amazon ($5.99), that price is rounded up to the nearest dollar and the excess goes to our nonprofit, or print the following 57 page document with the same info as the workbook, you can print it in black and white.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/SyllablesSpellSuccessStudentPacket.pdf

 

https://www.amazon.com/Syllables-Spell-Success-Student-Workbook/dp/1976403057/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1510602643&sr=8-1&keywords=syllables+spell+success

 

For the first 5 lessons there is an optional nonsense word game and non-optional daily nonsense word drills (25 words, very painless, and motivational as they see their speed and accuracy of reading them improve.)

 

Here is the nonsense word game:

 

https://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Phonics/concentrationgam.html

 

Here is the nonsense word document for the daily drills:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/NonsenseWordsbyLesson.pdf

 

Here is the tracking sheet for the nonsense words to help make it motivational:

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Reading/Resources/NonsenseWordTrackingSheet.pdf

 

For the last 5 lessons, there is an optional Greek and Latin word root bingo game, I won't link that now, you don't need it until later.

 

Here is the link for the movies to watch.  All you have to do is watch each movie and work through exactly what it tells you to do!  The how to teach videos are optional, you just need the purple videos, lesson #1 to lesson #10, the titles show what you are learning each lesson.

 

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLJLxBWdK_5l2xN78qeGDDB1Lr5lyP6CHO

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[suenos]

Melody1 - hope you are feeling better! 

 

Not sure I can help with a program rec - but since you said you have started trying some new activities with some success (working on phonological awareness/rhyming) - here's an idea of an activity you can do with your DS (got it from AAS / reading programs I've done with my DS) that might help with multisyllable word reading, especially:

 

Count syllables - use counters, beans, fruit, M&Ms, whatever - You say a word "elephant" or "table" or "help" - DS repeats it, moving 1 counter for each syllable into a line. Then says the word again and the # of syllables. 

 

Count sounds (this is really helpful to practice periodically with my DS) - Again, you say a word - DS repeats it, "sounding it out" and moving 1 counter for each sound. "T - e - n - 3 sounds."