Biology and AP Biology

[crazyforlatin]

Is it very helpful or even necessary to do a biology course before taking AP Biology? I'm not sure how to fit both biology courses into DD's schedule. For 9th grade, I’m quite sure we will be taking AP Chemistry since she will have finished Honors Chemistry with Dicentra in 8th grade. For 12th grade, I plan on AP Physics; Dd has had algebra-based physics with Jetta.

 

I was thinking AP Biology in 11th grade or just biology with SAT 2.

 

Any suggestions for science in 10th grade? Is it odd to do biology in 10th and AP Biology in 11th? As of now, DD has not shown any particular interest in biology. She loved physics with Jetta and chemistry using Ellen McHenry

[CAJinBE]

AP Biology is a hard class, but obviously your dd does well in science if she is doing AP Chemistry in ninth grade. My dd did middle school biology and ninth grade regular biology. She has an interest in medicine and decided to do AP Biology as her first science AP as an eleventh grader. She still spends two to three hours a day on it. The pace is fast to get done before the exam in May. There is a ton of memorization that really wouldn't interest me at all. I'm more of a chemistry and physics person. I think she would be lost without prior biology.

 

Maybe you could take a look at one of the AP Biology textbooks to see if it's something your dd would want to tackle. 

[SoCal_Bear]

AP Chemistry and AP Biology are the two that are assume a prior basic chemistry and biology course and are built on that base knowledge. 

If you are trying to avoid any possible boredom or disinterest in the subject doing two years in a row, you could do 8th chem, 9th bio, 10th AP chem, 11th AP bio, 12 AP Physics.

[Roadrunner]

I would do bio in 8h and keep two Chem courses back to back.

[crazyforlatin]

I would do bio in 8h and keep two Chem courses back to back.

Ideally I would like back to back Chemistry, just so that there is still the momentum for AP Chemistry. I'm also thinking of biology and chemistry in 8th grade since it's less pressure on grades. Is that too much work?

[Roadrunner]

Ideally I would like back to back Chemistry, just so that there is still the momentum for AP Chemistry. I'm also thinking of biology and chemistry in 8th grade since it's less pressure on grades. Is that too much work?

With Lukion and AOPS? If would be death for my kid, but that’s so individual.

[crazyforlatin]

With Lukion and AOPS? If would be death for my kid, but that’s so individual.

Cicero doesn't have a live class and I would push Greek to 9th grade, if she even wants to continue. We're just going to use the AoPS book, no live class. The ideal bio class would be very little labs with only a couple of hours per week of homework, so more middle school level of work than high school but using a high school textbook lol, does that exist?

[Roadrunner]

Cicero doesn't have a live class and I would push Greek to 9th grade, if she even wants to continue. We're just going to use the AoPS book, no live class. The ideal bio class would be very little labs with only a couple of hours per week of homework, so more middle school level of work than high school but using a high school textbook lol, does that exist?

You could probably just do it at home.

[Arcadia]

Ideally I would like back to back Chemistry, just so that there is still the momentum for AP Chemistry. I'm also thinking of biology and chemistry in 8th grade since it's less pressure on grades. Is that too much work?

Miller Levine Biology and Thinkwell Chemistry is light. We were using it as an intro course though and my kids aren’t interested in AP Biology but might take SAT Biology since the ML textbook plus test prep is sufficient for UC a-g cut off score of 540. We also have an older edition of Campbell Biology AP edition which my kids just use as reference.

 

I don’t know how much work Dicentra’s honors chemistry is going to be but if your daughter self study biology or audit an online biology class, the workload may not be too heavy. Our time sucker for science was the labs even though they were generally fun to do.

[Roadrunner]

 

My kids are unlikely to take AP bio as well. It’s just too much work. We will do an honors bio course at some point though.

[crazyforlatin]

I actually don't envision DD doing AP Biology (and that's probably my view of bio) but I’m preparing now in case of that possibility. I emailed Dr. Kanner, https://debrabell.com/product/biology/ , who uses Miller and will look into FundaFunda. I know DD will love labs but her lab work just have to be in chemistry. Reading through Miller on our own without any teacher support or classmates will be boring for her.

Edited February 20, 2018 by crazyforlatin

[Arcadia]

Reading through Miller on our own without any teacher support or classmates will be boring for her.

We used Labpaq biology kit and DS12 puked over the dissection despite adequate ventilation :lol:

 

What we did was to have my current 8th grader take outsourced classes for fun since we aren’t using them for high school credits. Then we didn’t need to worry about maintaining As for any of his classes. At least now we know for sure he has no desire to be a chemist despite being good (but not great) in chemistry.

 

ETA:

DS13 is a jack of all trades so being able to “classify†some subjects as good at but not interested in helps for high school planning.

Edited February 20, 2018 by Arcadia

[crazyforlatin]

We used Labpaq biology kit and DS12 puked over the dissection despite adequate ventilation :lol:

 

What we did was to have my current 8th grader take outsourced classes for fun since we aren’t using them for high school credits. Then we didn’t need to worry about maintaining As for any of his classes. At least now we know for sure he has no desire to be a chemist despite being good (but not great) in chemistry.

 

ETA:

DS13 is a jack of all trades so being able to “classify†some subjects as good at but not interested in helps for high school planning.

I wish we could take a biology class in the city, but I haven't found anything here. And, some of the classes I’ve seen seemed to be for their own students at private schools. But yeah, taking some science classes in middle school will help us figure out what to take in high school. I mean, my views on bio doesn’t mean DD won't take a liking to it, but if she is truly my daughter, I believe she'll lean more towards chem or physics, lol. I saw on one of the online schools a marine biology class; now I can see DD liking that.

[eternalsummer]

We are doing Prentice Hall's Dragonfly book for Bio in 7th in prep for AP Bio in 10th.  It's a high school level book, but we're doing it fairly gently - over the course of 12 months or so.  It's the book I used for honors (Pre-IB) bio in 9th in prep for HL IB Bio in 11th/12th, but it was easy then.  DD is doing okay with it and it doesn't take a ton of time - she is definitely doing it as a more middle-school level course  in terms of output.

 

Our tentative plan is 7th Bio, 8th Clover Creek Physics, 9th Intro. Chem, 10th AP Bio, 11th AP Chem, 12th AP Physics.  

[SeaConquest]

I actually don't envision DD doing AP Biology (and that's probably my view of bio) but I’m preparing now in case of that possibility. I emailed Dr. Kanner, https://debrabell.com/product/biology/ , who uses Miller and will look into FundaFunda. I know DD will love labs but her lab work just have to be in chemistry. Reading through Miller on our own without any teacher support or classmates will be boring for her.

 

But, no discussion evolution in that class, or in their pre-AP biology. :(

[crazyforlatin]

We are doing Prentice Hall's Dragonfly book for Bio in 7th in prep for AP Bio in 10th. It's a high school level book, but we're doing it fairly gently - over the course of 12 months or so. It's the book I used for honors (Pre-IB) bio in 9th in prep for HL IB Bio in 11th/12th, but it was easy then. DD is doing okay with it and it doesn't take a ton of time - she is definitely doing it as a more middle-school level course in terms of output.

 

Our tentative plan is 7th Bio, 8th Clover Creek Physics, 9th Intro. Chem, 10th AP Bio, 11th AP Chem, 12th AP Physics.

May I ask what is the output you require? Are you relying on a teacher's manual? I've not seen the inside of the book so no idea of there are questions contained in the book.

 

Also, do you mind sharing why Intro Chem in 9th and then AP Chem in 11th? My plan was back to back Chemistry but I’m open to suggestions that I may not have thought of.

[crazyforlatin]

But, no discussion evolution in that class, or in their pre-AP biology. :(

Also it's so much more expensive that I am leaning towards FundaFunda anyway. What I want is some accountability for us. I can easily see based on experience that we let the classes with due dates overtake everything else, pushing away subjects like history (now only while driving) or geography (not been happening for some time). Our science for this year has been reading science mags. It's a far fall from Clover Creek.

[eternalsummer]

May I ask what is the output you require? Are you relying on a teacher's manual? I've not seen the inside of the book so no idea of there are questions contained in the book.

 

Also, do you mind sharing why Intro Chem in 9th and then AP Chem in 11th? My plan was back to back Chemistry but I’m open to suggestions that I may not have thought of.

 

I'd always viewed Chem as harder than Bio (this was the general consensus when I was in HS) so I thought we'd leave it for later.  I can see the value in doing it back to back, though.  I didn't take Chem after 10th grade - the IB Program has you doing 2 years of the same science for 11th and 12th.  

 

There are review questions, sample lab/demonstration things, questions for thinking ("what if this" or "how would this apply to this other idea" kind of thing), chapter tests, etc.  She does all of those more or less on her own, although I discuss them with her if she has a problem and after I read her chapter test answers.  It is pretty straightforward.  I don't make her do the fancier things we did in school with this book - making a cell structure out of a cake, or putting on a play to demonstrate photosynthesis, or whatever.   We don't have the teacher's manual, but I remember most of it from school; if I didn't (like with Chem, I remember not very much of that), I'd have to either have a teacher's manual or enroll her in a class online with someone who knows what they're doing.

[AEC]

saw  Dr Tanner (https://debrabell.com/product/biology/ ) referenced for providing an online bio course.

We don't have any direct experience w/ this specific class. She teaches AP bio at PAH, however, which we've had.  That's based on Campbell. AP Bio is a huge amount of information.

 

Overall, Dr Tanner did a solid job of presenting the material and providing guidance.  DS found the class itself frustrating because she was pretty disorganized...assignments would get moved (or removed) after they'd been assigned, or weren't assigned by the dates the syllabus said they would be, it took ages for things to get graded, etc.  It's probably fine for many students, but it was a source of anxiety here.

[daijobu]

My dd took AP chem in 9th and AP bio in 10th, both with the corresponding SAT subject tests at the end of the year.  It was fine.  

[Roadrunner]

My dd took AP chem in 9th and AP bio in 10th, both with the corresponding SAT subject tests at the end of the year. It was fine.

Which one did she find more challenging?

[daijobu]

It's tough to say as both were fairly challenging, but only in the sense that you need to not fall behind and take responsibility for your own understanding.  i.e., if you don't understand something, then ask the teacher!  In our case, AP chem was a prereq for AP bio, so the sequence worked out well.  

[pinkelement]

But, no discussion evolution in that class, or in their pre-AP biology. :(

My daughter is in PreAP Bio with Dr Kenner. No evolution. She said she will provide some guidance, if needed, but students will do it on their own.

[London]

Are there any LIVE SYNCHRONOUS secular AP biology classes? I just don't understand that there is no demand for this. Just want to make sure I am not missing something out there?

[daijobu]

Are there any LIVE SYNCHRONOUS secular AP biology classes? I just don't understand that there is no demand for this. Just want to make sure I am not missing something out there?

Stanford online high school.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[London]

Stanford online high school.

 

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

 

Ouch. My checking account is limping already :)

[ccolopy]

DS took AP Biology without having taken a regular biology course. I had hoped to have him take the class through our public high school, but they refused because he didn't have the prerequisite biology class (and junior standing). In retrospect, taking the class at home is likely the reason he did so well - he was able to take as long as he needed to grasp topics that were new and confusing to him. He put in many more hours than we anticipated, and ended up having complete several of the labs after the AP exam. For DS, it was worth the extra effort just to "get it over with" and move on to sciences that he finds more interesting. He had previously studied high school level chemistry in 8th grade, algebra-based physics in 7th, and a mix of life and Earth science topics in 6th. 

 

If your DD is interested in opening up space in 11th/12th grade to take advanced courses, and/or thinks that two years of biology sounds horrific, it is definitely doable to "get AP Bio over with" by 10th. AP Chem in 9th and AP Bio in 10th can work, as long as you account for the extra time AP Bio will take. You might also consider having her take both AP Chemistry and a light biology course in 9th, then AP Bio in 10th. Otherwise, taking AP Chem in 9th, regular biology in 10th, and AP Bio in 11th is completely fine, and I can't see it raising any eyebrows. Kids at our local high school routinely take chemistry/AP Chem in 10th/11th. 

Edited February 19, 2022 by ccolopy