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R&S English


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#1 Paradox5

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Posted 04 February 2018 - 06:19 PM

With so many other options available now, is this still a good option to use for grammar and writing? If you do, do you use all the parts: text, wkshts, TM, and tests? 



#2 2_girls_mommy

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Posted 04 February 2018 - 09:49 PM

I don't know why it wouldn't be still good just because other things exist. It is thorough, inexpensive, and reusable, easy to use. How I have used it: from 2nd grade through about 5th or 6th we used the texts, the tests, and did all components, including the writing portions. Around 6th grade or so I added the workbooks, eliminating some of the daily written work from it, having them complete the workbooks on pages there were some, and just working orally many of the other days. And ftr, we always wrote across the curriculum ala WTM. Around that time, we began really slowing down the english. We were down to about 3 x a week because of so much other work in the curriculum. So we ended up skipping 7th grade, and doing 8th grade english as our 9th grade text, still doing all writing exercises in addition to WWs and other writing assignments which is why we slowed down the grammar to 1-3 x a week. But we always kept up the tests at the end of each chapter, no matter how long it took us to complete the chapter. For high school, finally, I am just having dd read through the 9/10 texts, complete the workbook and tests only- no written grammar work whatsoever from it. There is still a lot of great info in the high school books. We are not about to drop them. 

 

I have saved my R&S texts from 10 years ago and plan to put my youngest through them again when she is ready to start school. I don't see the need to get something new and shiny for the core subjects when I am familiar with these, we already have them, and they get the job done. We can supplement with new and fun things here and there, but the everyday get the job done stuff is just done so well with R&S. No need for us to switch.


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#3 Ellie

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Posted 04 February 2018 - 11:38 PM

It will always be good. :-)

 

Of course, the text. And I recommend doing the writing, all of it, in all assignments. Writing counts as writing, whether it's grammar, dictionary work, actual writing assignments. All of it.

 

The teacher manual is very helpful, so I would always recommend that. However, the worksheets are purely optional; I don't recommend them. Not the tests, either.


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#4 KeriJ

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 11:14 AM

No matter what I have tried, I always come back to R&S English.
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#5 BearWallowSchool

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 12:28 PM

We’ve used R&S, Abeka, and CLE.

I ❤️ Rod and Staff. It’s my favorite. We are currently using Grade 4. You will not find better TMs.

Edited by BearWallowSchool, 05 February 2018 - 12:30 PM.

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#6 freesia

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 12:34 PM

I have used it and will use it.  Only one of mine is not using it b/c he couldn't handle copying from any text in fifth grade when I start it. He has used Climbing to Good English, which is okay, but I like R&S better.  He may switch next year b/c I think he can handle it now.  It is excellent and thorough and has great review.


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#7 Tibbie Dunbar

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Posted 05 February 2018 - 02:00 PM

I am saving my R&S English for the grandchildren!

I always use the TM (for teaching, suggested oral drills and quizzes, and the answer key), and my students always use the student book. We do the oral drill together, and they do the written practice and review exercises on their own.

I never use the worksheets or the tests.

Edited by Tibbie Dunbar, 05 February 2018 - 02:00 PM.

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#8 Paradox5

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 05:52 PM

Thank you for the reassurance! I have been driving myself and my dh crazy trying to decide.

 

I think we will skip the worksheets because there is already SO much practice in the books! (unless they add a certain something. Do they?)

 

Definitly getting the TM and tests. My kids need the motivation of a test to pay attention.

 

Book 5 is still the place to start for older kids, correct?

 

I would love some advice as to where to start my daughter-- whether in Book 3 or Book 4. She will have gone through BJU Eng 3 (grammar only)  and done some WWE 2 by the end of March. Any advice?


Edited by Paradox5, 07 February 2018 - 05:56 PM.


#9 SilverMoon

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 06:22 PM

The worksheets are just extra practice of what's already in the textbook, and often only cover a portion of what the lesson itself did.

A kid who's completed BJU 3 would be fine in R&S 4.

5 is the recommendation for an older kid with weak/no grammar background. If they've done BJU 5 I'd put them in R&S 6.


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#10 SilverMoon

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 06:33 PM

Fwiw, my current 4th grader has only done most of JAG (11 week program) and Khan Academy for grammar this year. She is my stubborn, most prone to wailing and gnashing of teeth child; it was our turn to keep my mother in law for an extended visit; we dance a lot; okay, I plead the fifth. LOL When she finishes her current writing book I'm going to start her in R&S 5 (this month). It's easy to slow down if needed, but I expect she'll do fine. (I've used 5-8 with older siblings and already know what's in there. ;) )


Edited by SilverMoon, 07 February 2018 - 06:34 PM.


#11 Ellie

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 07:10 PM

Thank you for the reassurance! I have been driving myself and my dh crazy trying to decide.

 

I think we will skip the worksheets because there is already SO much practice in the books! (unless they add a certain something. Do they?)

 

Definitly getting the TM and tests. My kids need the motivation of a test to pay attention.

 

Book 5 is still the place to start for older kids, correct?

 

I would love some advice as to where to start my daughter-- whether in Book 3 or Book 4. She will have gone through BJU Eng 3 (grammar only)  and done some WWE 2 by the end of March. Any advice?

 

If she completes BJUP's 3rd grade book, she should be able to do Building With Diligence (4th).

 

The worksheets don't add anything. Feel free to skip them. :-)


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#12 Paradox5

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 08:05 PM

Thank you!



#13 2_girls_mommy

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 09:45 PM

Agree, there is plenty without the worksheets. We only went to them after years of doing all of the writing, and we now do them for convenience sake instead of the actual written work just because we are doing enough writing and grammar in other places. I think you will love the oral work in the TM if you are new to R&S.



#14 Paradox5

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 07:43 PM

I think I asked this somewhere else but I cannot find the answer now. Is the writing instruction in R&S enough on its own? My kids do not do cross-curricular writing. The responses I have seen seem to indicate that if they are not doing other outlining, etc. in other subjects, then R&S is NOT enough alone.



#15 SilverMoon

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 09:43 PM

If they're writing out the written exercises and doing the writing lessons it's plenty of writing.

Loads of people do the lessons primarily orally; they need cross curricular writing because writing out the grammar exercises is *part* of the writing instruction.
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#16 Paradox5

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 09:52 PM

So just doing R&S English, as written, is enough and will prepare kids for college writing then?

I'm also thinking of the essays and things in History of the World guides.


Edited by Paradox5, 09 February 2018 - 09:53 PM.


#17 SilverMoon

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 10:01 PM

Not in books 3 and 6.. lol ;)

Fwiw, my kids who used primarily R&S transitioned into high school level writing books seamlessly. R&S only goes up to grade 9/10, and we didn't use that last level. It's probably a fine book! We just needed a change by that point. :)

Edited by SilverMoon, 09 February 2018 - 10:02 PM.

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#18 Paradox5

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 10:05 PM

I guess I should have added 'eventually'. :laugh:



#19 Ellie

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Posted 09 February 2018 - 11:55 PM

So just doing R&S English, as written, is enough and will prepare kids for college writing then?

I'm also thinking of the essays and things in History of the World guides.

 

Yes. Absolutely.


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#20 Paradox5

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 12:26 AM

Thank you both! Maybe now I can stop driving myself batty over grammar and writing! But no worries...I'm sure I will find something else to fret over like science.


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#21 purduemeche

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Posted 10 February 2018 - 11:59 PM

We use R&S English and love it.  We skip the writing portions and have the kids enrolled in Schole Academy online for their writing program.


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#22 Paradox5

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Posted 11 February 2018 - 12:36 AM

... 

 


Edited by Paradox5, 11 February 2018 - 12:51 AM.


#23 ALB

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Posted 11 February 2018 - 04:01 PM

I love Rod and Staff and even like the writing exercises!  We are using Classical Composition as well for the progymnasmata, but honestly I'd be fine with just R&S along with copywork, dictation, and writing about other subjects.  It is such a good, thorough program. 

 

My kids adore the books as well and love to compare the covers each year to see what progress is being made on the building.  We feel like we are growing up with those kids!



#24 Tibbie Dunbar

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 04:00 PM

They'll be enough for college writing if the kids don't mind hanging out in the writing lab to learn other forms, and risking their GPA during their learning curve!

I love R&S for grammar, and it's pretty good for elementary and middle school writing. But the curriculum does not even begin to address history and social studies essays, literary response, essays of definition, or research papers! And much, much more. Students preparing for college will need to write across the curriculum in high school.

I'm talking about four year degree programs, here. It's possible that your child could take remedial English, at community college or at university prices! What are your goals?

I disagree with Ellie, because if I recall correctly, her homeschooled teens went to community college to finish their high school education, or after graduating from homeschool at young ages, and that was many years ago. CC is a terrific option for dual enrollment, early college, or remediation, but to answer your question about *university* prep today, R&S on its own is insufficient for high school.

#25 Ellie

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 08:01 PM

They'll be enough for college writing if the kids don't mind hanging out in the writing lab to learn other forms, and risking their GPA during their learning curve!

I love R&S for grammar, and it's pretty good for elementary and middle school writing. But the curriculum does not even begin to address history and social studies essays, literary response, essays of definition, or research papers! And much, much more. Students preparing for college will need to write across the curriculum in high school.

I'm talking about four year degree programs, here. It's possible that your child could take remedial English, at community college or at university prices! What are your goals?

I disagree with Ellie, because if I recall correctly, her homeschooled teens went to community college to finish their high school education, or after graduating from homeschool at young ages, and that was many years ago. CC is a terrific option for dual enrollment, early college, or remediation, but to answer your question about *university* prep today, R&S on its own is insufficient for high school.

 

Although it is true that my children did community college instead of high school, I am capable of reading and evaluating textbooks. :-) I have no doubt that children who work through the R&S English texts would be prepared for college. R&S teaches children how to write. It does not need to address history and social studies essays specifically; children who know how to write can write for any subject.

 

Have you seen the scope and sequence for the English texts? It is more comprehensive than any other English series I have seen.



#26 Tibbie Dunbar

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 09:06 PM

Although it is true that my children did community college instead of high school, I am capable of reading and evaluating textbooks. :-) I have no doubt that children who work through the R&S English texts would be prepared for college. R&S teaches children how to write. It does not need to address history and social studies essays specifically; children who know how to write can write for any subject.

Have you seen the scope and sequence for the English texts? It is more comprehensive than any other English series I have seen.


Yes, I use them, through grade 10! I do know them well. I think WTM recommendations, or TOG's Writing Aids, or Write Shop, or Writers Inc. and Write for College by Patrick Sebranek give the needed practice in writing for history, literature, and social sciences. R&S lacks the lessons that my current college students are thankful they learned by other means, although R&S is second to none for grammar.
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