How much of a baby should I be about this?

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

My van is 15 years old. For the last few months I've had this very strong feeling that I'm pushing my luck with it. The brakes make a noise, but our trusted mechanic has looked twice and says it's just brake dust. The airbag warning light is on, but that came on a few years ago after I accidentally ran out a battery, and the mechanic says there's no way to know whether it's really just a glitch without expensive work at the dealership. So I may or may not have airbags. One of the third-row seats broke 6 months or so--it's hard to describe, but the mechanism that controls the seat back going up and down sort of separated and one part was overlaying the lower part. I somehow managed to pop it back into place, but now I don't want anyone sitting in that seat. And I can't roll down my driver's side window anymore, because once it goes down, it won't roll back up. I've been able to Fonzie it a couple of times and now just don't roll it down anymore. Oh, and the locks randomly lock on their own occasionally. There's definitely some kind of weird electrical connection thing happening in my driver's side door.

 

None of this was overwhelming, but we've been setting aside a certain amount each month for a new car for me (DH had to get a new car last year). We were thinking we'd have a decent down payment by the end of next year. However, in the last week, my passenger seat has started to make a noise and be more wiggly than usual, so now I don't want anyone sitting in THAT seat either. AND we got ever-so-gently rear-ended on the highway a few nights ago, which is the first accident either of us has had in...22 years! (No damage at all, everyone went on their way, but still!)

 

We have a decent down payment for a car, but we're nowhere near where we wanted to be. Plus we'll have the insurance increase on a car that will presumably have a Blue Book value of more than $400 :lol:

 

I really love my van, but I think the universe is trying to tell me something! However, we also have braces going on on Monday, taxes to pay in Q1, etc. Would you keep trying to limp this car along until next year when we'll probably have half a car's worth of down payment? Or would you just accept that the time has come and prepare to belt tighten in the name of safety? 

Edited December 9, 2017 by ILiveInFlipFlops

[regentrude]

The air bag would be the deal breaker for me. If it is not worth it financially to find out whether the airbags work or not, it is time to get a new vehicle if you are financially able to, which sounds like you are.

Friends of mine were just in an accident last week where their car was totaled, and the airbags saved their lives.

[wendyroo]

It sounds to me like the time has come.

 

Yes, insurance will go up, but hopefully so will fuel efficiency.

 

Wendy

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

It sounds to me like the time has come.

 

Yes, insurance will go up, but hopefully so will fuel efficiency.

 

Wendy

 

Oh, that's a great point! Yes, it will. I get something like 16 MPG on my van now, so I'm definitely looking for better. 

[Granny_Weatherwax]

We just went through something similar. DH's 16 year old truck was rusting through and chunks were falling off. One of the seatbelts no longer worked.The windshield molding was cracked and began leaking and the person sitting in the front passenger seat would get wet if it rained. The light control switch would sometimes turn off the lights; if it didn't work the lights would stay on indefinitely. We had to put seat covers on the front seats because the material had worn through in multiple places and the stuffing was falling out. People were cutting themselves on the jagged metal between the running boards and the doors; one incident required stitches. We struggled with replacing the truck because there was nothing wrong mechanically (the engine was a beast and it had a rebuilt transmission) and we liked not having a car payment. But the stitches incident really made us think about the safety of the vehicle. Some things we could overlook but the safety of anybody who rode in the vehicle was key.

 

We went ahead and traded it in and bought a used truck. We're not happy about having a payment but not having to worry about safety issues when going somewhere has been nice. 

[Granny_Weatherwax]

And I don't think it's being a baby. It's a big decision.

 

If you do choose to purchase, I hope you can find the best possible vehicle for your family in your price range. It's fun to look and dream.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

And I don't think it's being a baby. It's a big decision.

 

If you do choose to purchase, I hope you can find the best possible vehicle for your family in your price range. It's fun to look and dream.

 

 

Thanks, I appreciate that. I felt like I was being whiny until the front passenger seat thing started. And DH seems to think it's not really a big deal, so I just don't know. We went to our local dealership last night looking for deals and basically got the rug pulled out from under us (oh, that vehicle isn't actually on our lot; oh, that cash incentive is only for select cars; oh, the price on the corporate site is just a starting point--the dealer costs add thousands of dollars; UGH). So we had to go back to the drawing board, and it has me second guessing myself, because like you said, the actual mechanics of the car are great. So I could either spend all the down payment we've accumulated repairing stuff on a very old car, or use it for its intent, but much earlier than we'd planned. Gah!

 

The dealership did at least offer us a very low interest rate, so that was good. 

[Junie]

About the random locking:  some cars lock the doors when the speed of the vehicle reaches a certain speed (20 mph on my car).  So maybe that isn't a problem.

 

It is probably time for a new vehicle, regardless.  :(

[Ottakee]

Can you look at good used vehicles? Another option is looking at a 2017 as the 2018 are rolling out.

[lllll]

nm

Edited December 12, 2017 by _______

[Lanny]

I suggest that you look into buying or leasing a new vehicle. If that's not possible, look for a good used vehicle.  Avoid dealerships with scum who told you what they did. The Used Car Manager, if offered a deal, has much more "wiggle room" than the New Car Manager does.  There's a huge amount they can come down and still make a profit. Obviously, New or Used, the dealership wants to make the maximum profit possible, but you don't want to be paying thousands of dollars, on a New car or a Used car, for a Wax job or Undercoating or something that costs them almost zero and does not increase the value of the vehicle one cent.   Buy a copy of the latest Edmunds or Kelly( spelling? Used Car price book to see what the wholesale price of the vehicle is.  Try to pay as little above that price as you can. Same thing for a New vehicle. You can probably do that online and get more up to date prices.   Do not look at cars at night or when it is raining...

[kiwik]

Can you look at good used vehicles? Another option is looking at a 2017 as the 2018 are rolling out.

Funny I just assumed she was looking at used vehicles.

[JFSinIL]

Is there a Car Max nearby? Otherwise be specific at dealerships that you want to see gently used cars with 30,000 or fewer miles on them. Most of our cars have been that - usually former rental cars so only a year old.

[Zebra]

It's always hard to be caught in this situation where you know it's almost time, but you're not quite ready.   

 

A 15 year old vehicle is pretty old, and it seems like it's time to get a new one to me.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Tough one.  My last car had a similar issue with the air bag, but I personally hoped the air bag really never would work because I have to practically sit on the steering wheel when I drive!

 

I think you could go either way really.  Sounds like you'd enjoy having a new car and that I can understand!

 

 

[Angie in VA]

I don't think wanting to be safe, especially while driving - yourself, others in your vehicle, and there are others on the road! - is ever being a baby!

Edited December 10, 2017 by Angie in VA

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

About the random locking:  some cars lock the doors when the speed of the vehicle reaches a certain speed (20 mph on my car).  So maybe that isn't a problem.

 

No, this happens in the garage. I'll open the door to get out of the car and all the doors will lock, or I'll unlock the car to get in and it will relock instantly. Definitely a problem. I used to leave the keys on the driver's seat if it was in the garage--had to break that habit fast!

 

Can you look at good used vehicles? Another option is looking at a 2017 as the 2018 are rolling out.

 

We were looking for a 2017 or something used. The 2017 was the one that "an old listing," so they tried hard to sell us a 2018. We're looking at used now. 

 

It sounds like a lot of electrical stuff going wrong.  Our 1999 Suburban began having problems like that - locks, windows, air bag lights, etc. - and we got all of it fixed.  The locks on the doors were a big deal.  But my kids used the car as a 'locker' on campus, so really needed it to lock.  Some of the windows were getting stuck, too, and the mechanic fixed those, too.  We just had to replace the battery and battery cable, which, btw, runs all the way from the front of the VERY long car to the back of it.  That cost a lot.  And there was lots more I can't recall at the moment.  

 

Honestly, I was ready to cut the losses and sell it along with the trailer.  We've spent SO much on repairs over the last 3.5 years.  But dh wants to hold on to it for now.  And it's running really well - for now.  What I don't like is not knowing what's going to break next and who's going to be driving it and where they'll get stuck.  Especially concerned about a dd driving it out in the middle of nowhere and it dying.  

 

So I don't know what to tell you.  If you could get all the electrical stuff fixed, and the engine is sound, would you feel better about it?  If not, I might try to sell it.  But it is definitely possible to get most of that stuff fixed.  It just might cost an arm and a leg.  Good luck.  :)

 

 

I could get all the electrical stuff fixed, but like you said, it's $$$$ and it doesn't include the two seats that also need fixing or replacing. So then I've used up all the money I had saved as a down payment on a new car, and I still have an old, rusting, rundown car that will likely continue to need repairs going forward. Add to this that the car dealership covers routine maintenance for a period of time (depends if you buy new or used), and it's starting to look less practical to put any money into keeping the old car. 

 

Thank you, that was a good mental exercise! It's looking like a pretty simple decision, really. 

[Rachel]

Couldn’t the bolts attaching the seats to the floor be tightened? That would at least give you peace about something.

[J-rap]

Do you need to use the two seats that are broken?  What do you use the car for?  If it were me and we were really short on money, I'd check further to see if there was a way I could get the airbags checked out.  It seems like there should be a way to easily tell if they are working or not.  Maybe bring it to a dealership?

 

Otherwise, if it seems to run well and you don't need those two seats, AND you mainly use it to run the kids around short distances and errands, I might wait it out.

 

I know a lot of people are telling you to just buy a new car, but if you don't have the money and the car's engine is still strong, etc., I might hold off depending on the airbag situation.

[ktgrok]

Check out Enterprise rental's used cars. We were really happy with our experience buying from them. Higher milage per year, but have been well maintained. 

[gardenmom5]

My van is 15 years old.

 

 

r. AND we got ever-so-gently rear-ended on the highway a few nights ago, which is the first accident either of us has had in...22 years! (No damage at all, everyone went on their way, but still!)  did you actually have the car checked out?   a lot of damage can be underneath the bumpers - and it will look just fine on the outside. - if there is -find out how much it would cost to fix it - becasue the other guys insurance is paying for it.  you'll get something out of it, even if you dont' fix the van.

 

 

 

Would you keep trying to limp this car along until next year when we'll probably have half a car's worth of down payment? Or would you just accept that the time has come and prepare to belt tighten in the name of safety? 

 

 

I'd listen to mom gut and start looking.

I've had good luck with private party used sales - but I live in a heavily populated area, and what is available and dependable used varies according to location.  so, I can be very picky.

[Zinnia]

My mechanic told us to start looking when ours hit 240,000 miles. We replaces at 250,000, though I think we could have gone much longer. Made my anxious dh happy, though, so it was worth it.

[solascriptura]

I think it’s time for a new car. Take out the loan you need and pay it off as aggressively as you can manage.

[Garga]

When is your next inspection due? I'm pretty sure it won't pass inspection without a working driver's side window.

 

If you're in an accident, will the lose passenger seat come undone and fly around the car, crushing people?

 

 

I was going to write, "Until fairly recently, no cars had airbags, so I guess you can live without them," but that's the rub isn't it? Sometimes you literally don't live without them.

[Tap]

You are already saving for a new car, so just take that money and make a payment on one.  Call a few Credit Unions and Banks to find out what current rates are and for what years of vehicles.

 

Then when you go shopping you can compare the interest cost of the loan with the car. There are calculators online that you can play with to get an instant idea of true cost of the vehicle loan with interest. Sometimes when calculating the interest, a newer car can actually cost less than an older one, especially if they start at a similar cost overall.

 

If you narrow it down to a few cars, call the insurance company and find out the rates between them.  There are several factors that increase/decrease the average cost of insurance...it isn't just KBB.  Safety features decrease rates, high theft risk raises them. Etc.  Newer cars will be closer in rates, used cars can vary quite a bit.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Tap

[Sandwalker]

I prefer used cars for the financial aspect and the environmental one. Be careful of used cars, though. There are a lot of cars out there that were flooded out in Houston, fixed up, and spread around the country to be sold.

[SparklyUnicorn]

When is your next inspection due? I'm pretty sure it won't pass inspection without a working driver's side window.

 

If you're in an accident, will the lose passenger seat come undone and fly around the car, crushing people?

 

 

I was going to write, "Until fairly recently, no cars had airbags, so I guess you can live without them," but that's the rub isn't it? Sometimes you literally don't live without them.

 

They don't check for that here. 

[Carrie12345]

It's time.

 

I wanted to drive my last van forever, but I became so worried about potential safety issues that I basically stopped going almost anywhere but the grocery store for several weeks.  (And was anxious while doing that.)

 

Of course I was also worried about the financial impact but, knowing it was tight but doable, it was an enormous relief overall.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate it. I still haven't decided, but I think I'm leaning toward just going for it. DH got an insurance quote, and it was only $100 more per year for the newer car, which really shocked me. And the fuel efficiency will definitely be better, plus the savings on not having to make repairs for awhile. The peace of mind is really the big thing, though. I can stop listening for every tiny noise and watching every tiny change in my steering or brakes or whatever. Just the difference in the responsiveness of the brakes in the new car vs my van was totally surprising, so it makes me wonder just how effective mine are!

 

Again, when I start really thinking about it, the decision does seem easy. DH will be home with me tomorrow night, so we'll probably make some decisions then.

 

Thanks again!

[SparklyUnicorn]

Thanks everyone, I appreciate it. I still haven't decided, but I think I'm leaning toward just going for it. DH got an insurance quote, and it was only $100 more per year for the newer car, which really shocked me. And the fuel efficiency will definitely be better, plus the savings on not having to make repairs for awhile. The peace of mind is really the big thing, though. I can stop listening for every tiny noise and watching every tiny change in my steering or brakes or whatever. Just the difference in the responsiveness of the brakes in the new car vs my van was totally surprising, so it makes me wonder just how effective mine are!

 

Again, when I start really thinking about it, the decision does seem easy. DH will be home with me tomorrow night, so we'll probably make some decisions then.

 

Thanks again!

 

We bought 2 new cars within a year of each other and I was so surprised that our insurance barely went up!   It's a bit painful to have 2 car payments though.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Couldn’t the bolts attaching the seats to the floor be tightened? That would at least give you peace about something.

 

 

What scares me most about the seats is that the problem seems to be in the mechanism that raises and lowers the back of the seats. When you sit in it and wiggle around, you can feel the back of the seat moving much more than it should. So it's not that the seat isn't tight to the floor, it's that the back is unstable and could possibly disengage in an accident. Not a big deal in that rear seat, but a huge deal in the front passenger seat. Especially for kids who no longer want to sit in the back if they don't have to!

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

We bought 2 new cars within a year of each other and I was so surprised that our insurance barely went up!   It's a bit painful to have 2 car payments though.

 

 

Yeah, that's going to be us. We didn't even have one car payment for years, and now we're going to have two. I'm feeling a little tantrum-y about it. But like someone else said above, we'll just pay them down aggressively. DH works on commission, and my income varies monthly, so I ran the budget on the lowest likely monthly incomes for both of us, and while it will be extremely tight, it's doable. And then when I have a good month and DH has some closings, we can hit the loans harder. 

 

It's such a leap of faith though!

[SparklyUnicorn]

Yeah, that's going to be us. We didn't even have one car payment for years, and now we're going to have two. I'm feeling a little tantrum-y about it. But like someone else said above, we'll just pay them down aggressively. DH works on commission, and my income varies monthly, so I ran the budget on the lowest likely monthly incomes for both of us, and while it will be extremely tight, it's doable. And then when I have a good month and DH has some closings, we can hit the loans harder. 

 

It's such a leap of faith though!

 

Same here.  We went nearly 10 years without a car payment.  We bought our cars close together so we ended up having to buy new ones close together.  I mean we could probably live with one if we had to...but it's just not as nice.  So it is a bit of a splurge for sure. 

 

We got super awesome rates on the loans thankfully.

[Alessandra]

I haven't read all the responses, but I can share an emotional reaction. I had an old Volvo wagon that I loved, but it had problems that no mechanic could seem to fix. I thought about car payments and higher insurance and kept the old car. Finally I decided to get a new car. Absolute bliss. Everything worked! I hadn't realized how much progress in safety and convenience had been made in the past 18 years. It was a joy to get in the car and not worry about whether the car would make it. Pure joy.

[Carrie12345]

Yeah, that's going to be us. We didn't even have one car payment for years, and now we're going to have two. I'm feeling a little tantrum-y about it. But like someone else said above, we'll just pay them down aggressively. DH works on commission, and my income varies monthly, so I ran the budget on the lowest likely monthly incomes for both of us, and while it will be extremely tight, it's doable. And then when I have a good month and DH has some closings, we can hit the loans harder. 

 

It's such a leap of faith though!

 

Our plan is similar.

We went from 2 car payments to 1 car payment to no car payments to 1 car payment and are about to go back to 2 car payments.  Fortunately, the second one is just dh going from a company vehicle to a car allowance, which should be high enough to pay off relatively quickly.  It's still scary, because we're personally responsible for the loan!

[hornblower]

I'd swap out asap.
For financial constraints, I would consider going to a smaller car, perhaps a sedan or hatchback instead of a van and perhaps a few years older than originally planned but I'd look at safety ratings and make a short list of possible vehicles and start shopping right now. 

I'd sacrifice comfort if necessary, and let finances take a hit, in return for safety and reliability. 

 

[SKL]

A year sounds long if you don't *have* to wait.  Perhaps you could trade it in and downsize and end up not taking a huge hit that way.

 

You don't have to have comprehensive / collision insurance if you don't have a loan.  So if you could take a small loan or pay cash for a used vehicle, your insurance rates might not be a big factor in the long run.

[Miss Peregrine]

If your dh doesn't think it's a big deal maybe you can trade cars?

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

If your dh doesn't think it's a big deal maybe you can trade cars?

 

 

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:  If you could see how that man loves his car... It's like his mistress. But, no, seriously, he's very happy for me to have whatever I want for a car. He poses no obstacle at all and tells me to just pick whatever I want and we can afford. I just meant that he knows how much I love my van, so he thinks that the seat thing isn't a big deal if I wanted to try to keep the van for awhile. But I'm way less risk-tolerant than he is, so while he would keep taking the chance on a passenger in that seat, I won't.

[Alicia64]

Just my .02, but my van is 14 years old -- and I stopped reading when your mechanic said "brake dust" and "would have to go to the dealership."

 

I'm truly not trying to be mean: I don't think you have a great mechanic.

 

My mechanic -- in GA -- worked for a NASCAR driver for years. He's incredible and priced fairly. He would never send me to a dealership. That's a ridiculous comment your mechanic made.

 

It's possible that my mechanic may know of a good mechanic by you. If you'd like me to make some calls, PM me.

 

Alley

[Alicia64]

I had dh read your OP and he said, "By telling her that your only way to find something out is to go to a dealer is saying he doesn't have answer. He sounds like a nut."

 

I'm seriously not trying to be rude. And if you really want a new van -- go for it. I love the Nissan vans in cranberry.

 

But we're keeping our '03 van going for about two more years. It has 155,000 miles on it.

 

Alley

 

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

I haven't read all the responses, but I can share an emotional reaction. I had an old Volvo wagon that I loved, but it had problems that no mechanic could seem to fix. I thought about car payments and higher insurance and kept the old car. Finally I decided to get a new car. Absolute bliss. Everything worked! I hadn't realized how much progress in safety and convenience had been made in the past 18 years. It was a joy to get in the car and not worry about whether the car would make it. Pure joy.

 

 

Even though I adore my van, I am really looking forward to not having to worry about who's sitting where, whether I'll forget and roll my window down and then not be able to get it back up, whether some tiny thing will break and leave us stranded somewhere, etc. 

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Just my .02, but my van is 14 years old -- and I stopped reading when your mechanic said "brake dust" and "would have to go to the dealership."

 

I'm truly not trying to be mean: I don't think you have a great mechanic.

 

My mechanic -- in GA -- worked for a NASCAR driver for years. He's incredible and priced fairly. He would never send me to a dealership. That's a ridiculous comment your mechanic made.

 

It's possible that my mechanic may know of a good mechanic by you. If you'd like me to make some calls, PM me.

 

Alley

 

 

He only said we should go to the dealership about the airbags because he didn't feel comfortable dealing with something like that. He's taken care of everything else very well for years. I am conflicted about the whole brakes thing though! I personally think my brakes are making a weird noise, but no one else seems to agree with me. And he says that when he opens up my brakes, he always sees a ton of residue (I can't remember exactly what he said--maybe my DH's translation was "brake dust"?) that he has to clean off, even though the pads and rotors still have plenty of life.

 

He thinks I ride my brakes, but I personally think my brakes aren't especially effective anymore. I couldn't believe the difference between the car I test drove and my old van. So I don't know about that. It's the one complaint I have about him. Otherwise, he's been our mechanic for 15 years and has always been upfront with us, including in situations where he could have charged us for work that we expected but that turned out wasn't needed. 

 

Thanks for the offer of help. The dealership we're looking at is just minutes from our house, and they include all maintenance and loaner cars for at least a year when you buy a car from them, so I'll be covered for awhile. I'll be sure to get in touch if I do need some names though.

Edited December 10, 2017 by ILiveInFlipFlops

[SparklyUnicorn]

I had a mechanic tell me the same thing about squeaky breaks.  I brought it somewhere else and they told me the same thing (dirt...).  So either we both encountered quackery or there is something to it. 

 

 

[luuknam]

I had a mechanic tell me the same thing about squeaky breaks.  I brought it somewhere else and they told me the same thing (dirt...).  So either we both encountered quackery or there is something to it. 

 

 

I'm sure they would've happily fixed it for you if they were quacks - fixing stuff is how they make money, telling you it's fine is how they don't make money (I'm not saying it can't happen that they'll miss something that should be fixed, but between you and the OP, that's 3 different mechanics claiming it's nothing).

 

But anyway... yes, it sounds like it's time for drastic action. Whether that's spending big money to fix the van, or buying something new/gently used, is none of my business, but I wouldn't leave the situation as-is. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

I'm sure they would've happily fixed it for you if they were quacks - fixing stuff is how they make money, telling you it's fine is how they don't make money (I'm not saying it can't happen that they'll miss something that should be fixed, but between you and the OP, that's 3 different mechanics claiming it's nothing).

 

But anyway... yes, it sounds like it's time for drastic action. Whether that's spending big money to fix the van, or buying something new/gently used, is none of my business, but I wouldn't leave the situation as-is. 

 

That is what I figured!  And the first guy was so nice he even didn't charge me for checking! 

[Rachel]

He only said we should go to the dealership about the airbags because he didn't feel comfortable dealing with something like that. He's taken care of everything else very well for years. I am conflicted about the whole brakes thing though! I personally think my brakes are making a weird noise, but no one else seems to agree with me. And he says that when he opens up my brakes, he always sees a ton of residue (I can't remember exactly what he said--maybe my DH's translation was "brake dust"?) that he has to clean off, even though the pads and rotors still have plenty of life.

 

He thinks I ride my brakes, but I personally think my brakes aren't especially effective anymore. I couldn't believe the difference between the car I test drove and my old van. So I don't know about that. It's the one complaint I have about him. Otherwise, he's been our mechanic for 15 years and has always been upfront with us, including in situations where he could have charged us for work that we expected but that turned out wasn't needed.

 

Thanks for the offer of help. The dealership we're looking at is just minutes from our house, and they include all maintenance and loaner cars for at least a year when you buy a car from them, so I'll be covered for awhile. I'll be sure to get in touch if I do need some names though.

Brake pads are pieces of metal with what is essentially metal or ceramic shavings stuck to them. Every time you push the brake petal, the pad touches the rotor creating friction. During that process some dust comes off. When you have completely worn down the pad it will make an awful metal on metal sound. You can tell if someone rides their brakes hard because their wheels are black from the break dust. I don’t like ceramic brakes, I think they squeak a lot and the noise drives me crazy. So when I get new pads I’ve requested that my husband not use them.

 

If your brake petal isn’t as responsive, you may need your brakes bled to build up the pressure. It’s a pretty simple process, not that I’ve done it, but I’ve helped my husband do it a hundred times.

 

Anyway, it sounds like you are ready for a new vehicle. Good luck finding one, I always dread the process!

Edited December 10, 2017 by Rach

[Alicia64]

Just like when moms sense that a child is acting differently (and nobody else can yet tell) . . . drivers should be strongly encouraged to trust their guts re: unusual sounds coming from their car.

 

I think it's super important that unusual sounds not be ignored.

 

Alley

[KatieJ]

Dealerships. So frustrating. We bought a new vehicle last year as did my son. ohh of us had dealerships tell us over the phone, yeah that car is here, I’ll have it up front and never was it the car we wanted.

 

Just wanted to add that when we finally found a vehicle, we bought it thru Costco pricing. Costco sets the price, dealership agrees to that price. We still got free financing, which we didn’t need, and when we feel,the need we will pay it off.

We also got a 700.00 Costco gift card.

 

I trust you will figure out what the best solution is.