CM people - new resource

[bwdiaz]

Nadine from the Up Above the Rowan Tree blog just posted about this new secular CM resource in one of the FB CM groups and I'm impressed and wanted to share over here. It's called Ursa Minor Learning and it's for kids who need a bigger STEM emphasis in high school than some of the other CM guides provide. It seems like it's very creative about tying its upper level science living books in with the MIT open courseware programs.

 

https://ursaminorlearning.com/

 

One thing that bugs me about a lot of CM programs is a lack of inclusion of people of color, as if nothing ever written by a POC could be considered a classic or a living book, but this curriculum has much more diversity while still adhering to both what I think counts as classic and living. The literature section itself isn't diverse but scroll down to the free reads to find it.

 

It seems to still be a work in progress, they have grades 9-12 posted and are working on their middle years stuff now. I'll be interested to see how things go.

[maize]

Looks interesting and ambitious

[LMD]

Oooooooh, thanks for posting!

[Alte Veste Academy]

I have to say that this is the best thing I've seen in a long while! Those book choices are awesome! Truly a modern CM. I am very interested in seeing the weekly schedule when it is released.

[HomeAgain]

I have to say that this is the best thing I've seen in a long while! Those book choices are awesome! Truly a modern CM. I am very interested in seeing the weekly schedule when it is released.

 

Same.  I clicked on the link expecting to be more critical of their choices.  But I'm really impressed!  I have it bookmarked for when we get to the upper levels.

[scbusf]

Oh wow. I love this!!!!! My kids are younger than high school, but I will definitely be keeping an eye on this.

[Above The Rowan]

Nadine from the Up Above the Rowan Tree blog just posted about this new secular CM resource in one of the FB CM groups and I'm impressed and wanted to share over here. It's called Ursa Minor Learning and it's for kids who need a bigger STEM emphasis in high school than some of the other CM guides provide. It seems like it's very creative about tying its upper level science living books in with the MIT open courseware programs.

 

https://ursaminorlearning.com/

 

One thing that bugs me about a lot of CM programs is a lack of inclusion of people of color, as if nothing ever written by a POC could be considered a classic or a living book, but this curriculum has much more diversity while still adhering to both what I think counts as classic and living. The literature section itself isn't diverse but scroll down to the free reads to find it.

 

It seems to still be a work in progress, they have grades 9-12 posted and are working on their middle years stuff now. I'll be interested to see how things go.

Ha! This made me laugh - I was scrolling around in here and saw the title of this post and thought "ooooh I like hearing about new CM stuff", and when I clicked in to read the post I lol'd a little.

 

I told my 6th grader that this is *most probably* going to be our high school plan. I just love it. I love the computer programming as a foreign language, I love the focus on science, and I love love love the lit/citizenship stuff they have picked.

 

I keep going to the site to see if magically the middle school years will be up. I can't wait to see what they recommend as a lead up to their high school curriculum. It's been a long while since I've been *this* excited about a CM curric!

[Bluegoat]

This looks great.

 

It's nice that they started with high school.  There really are lots of good options for earlier years, but so little for hs - often it seems like kind of an afterthought.

 

I did notice they are suggesting dual enrolment for math for the upper years - something which I don't think is available here.

[maize]

This looks great.

 

It's nice that they started with high school. There really are lots of good options for earlier years, but so little for hs - often it seems like kind of an afterthought.

 

I did notice they are suggesting dual enrolment for math for the upper years - something which I don't think is available here.

They have AOPS Calculus scheduled in level 11, then propose dual enrollment for level 12. I think even most mathematically gifted children would be OK with AOPS calculus for year 12, it is a rare child who is best served by completing higher level math while in high school.

 

The AOPS folks themselves don't recommend rushing to/through calculus.

[LMD]

I'm super interested to see their middle school choices. I looked at the subject sequence for math and I LOVE the expanded learning book titles. I especially like the inclusion of more women in the books!

 

Middle school may be out in Dec. I'm hoping so, we might just try it for 7th...

[Hunter]

I'm curious to see how all that can gets squeezed into weekly schedules.

 

Thumbs up to anyone that starts with the high school years.

[....]

I'm curious to see how all that can gets squeezed into weekly schedules.

 

Exactly what I was thinking.  Honestly, my teens would mutiny if I scheduled that much for them.

[KeriJ]

(trying to overlook the typos....)

[maize]

(trying to overlook the typos....)

Well, since it is a free curriculum plan, perhaps you could volunteer to provide proofreading services?

Edited October 30, 2017 by maize

[Hunter]

Exactly what I was thinking.  Honestly, my teens would mutiny if I scheduled that much for them.

 

I firmly believe that homeschooled students should not be held to volume standards higher than brick and mortar. And for some that don't want it, higher difficulty standards either.

 

My oldest did not homeschool high school for academic reasons. Eighth grade was non-option and academic to fix the mess of the charter school. But high school was all his plan.

 

High school complete curricula with a realistic checklist is a wide open market right now.

[Above The Rowan]

I actually don't think it looks like *that* much more than any other high school student would have to do.

Many of the history resources are used throughout all 4 high school grades, there's literature and the riches which aren't that time consuming individually, really. Free reading and science don't seem to be more than a high school student could manage.

 

When I was in high school, I had 6 60-minute classes each day. Typically, CM would have scheduled about 4 hours of lessons by Form IV (9th grade), with the majority of the rest of the day left for independent readings, art, etc.

 

Obviously, once the weekly schedules are released in December for the high school grades, we'll get a better view of how the Ursa Minor folks have spread it out - but nothing in there seems over the top in terms of expectations or scheduling. So far, just looking at the resource lists, this seems to be the first truly secular and modern version of CM that I've seen yet.

[Alte Veste Academy]

Also, it's easy enough to leave out those portions that don't work for your student. And, of course, you might even use other resources entirely for certain subjects.

[maize]

I agree that it is easier to cut down a rigorous plan than to beef up a less rigorous one.

[Bambam]

This looks wonderful! Thanks for sharing. I really like seeing the more rigorous and thought provoking science options!

[Above The Rowan]

They sent out an email newsletter today, just a little update on their Years 6-8 that they are working on. It looks like they're planning to deconstruct BFSU and break it down into an easy to follow schedule. I cannot wait to see what they do with this middle school curriculum. Exciting!!

[bwdiaz]

They sent out an email newsletter today, just a little update on their Years 6-8 that they are working on. It looks like they're planning to deconstruct BFSU and break it down into an easy to follow schedule. I cannot wait to see what they do with this middle school curriculum. Exciting!!

I agree. Although I read that email to mean they were making BFSU the spine of their whole pre-high school curriculum so not just 6-8 but that the 6-8 portion is what they are close to releasing.

 

I've said it on other threads on this forum that I don't get why others find BFSU so difficult to manage, but since so many others find it so then I'll be glad they are making it more accessible. It really is a quality science education. I used the whole K-2 book with my older daughter and she's doing 3-5 now, and my younger daughter is a year into the K-2 book.

[Above The Rowan]

I agree. Although I read that email to mean they were making BFSU the spine of their whole pre-high school curriculum so not just 6-8 but that the 6-8 portion is what they are close to releasing.

 

I've said it on other threads on this forum that I don't get why others find BFSU so difficult to manage, but since so many others find it so then I'll be glad they are making it more accessible. It really is a quality science education. I used the whole K-2 book with my older daughter and she's doing 3-5 now, and my younger daughter is a year into the K-2 book.

That's how I read it too - but I was just saying I'm excited to see the rest of the middle school curric from UM. If they are putting forth this much work into it, I can't wait to see what else is on the plan for Years 6-8.

 

I've tried a couple of times to use BFSU but I could never stick with it or figure it out - so I think its very cool that UM is trying to make it more user-friendly.

[Bluegoat]

I am not sure I'd be very keen on BFSU for elementary science - I'm not convinced it's the most in line with a CM approach in those years.  It's always seemed a little too directed and artificial, maybe?

[HomeAgain]

I am not sure I'd be very keen on BFSU for elementary science - I'm not convinced it's the most in line with a CM approach in those years.  It's always seemed a little too directed and artificial, maybe?

 

What would you pick instead, for an organized study that is not simply nature? 

[Bluegoat]

What would you pick instead, for an organized study that is not simply nature? 

 

For elementary school?  I don't know that I would pick anything.  I think that kind of study starts to be more appropriate in middle school.  

 

Reading books and nature study - botany, animal study, weather, astronomy, geology etc. - pretty much can fill up the elementary school years without much effort.

[HomeAgain]

Nothing organized at all. Just good things... Books and direct observation and experience. They didn't even advise using models of things, but were Keen to let kids freely explore with magnifying lenses and things.

 

https://www.amblesideonline.org/PR/PR14p721PNEUManifesto.shtml

 

But I think Junior high is an appropriate time to do something with some structure, such as with a "deconstructed bfsu."

 

I don't see it as against what was written in 1903.  The example in the article, of understanding torpedos, fits in well with BFSU.  The entire premise of the program is based on conversation mixed with simple experiments and observations of day to day items.  And it wasn't just letting kids explore freely.  Ms. Mason's P.N.E.U. had a curriculum, based on living books that were scheduled.  I will have to think about it further, but I see a difference in favor of BFSU's lesson on energy vs. only scheduling a book to read together on energy when talking about CM's idea of lessons. 

[Bluegoat]

I don't see it as against what was written in 1903.  The example in the article, of understanding torpedos, fits in well with BFSU.  The entire premise of the program is based on conversation mixed with simple experiments and observations of day to day items.  And it wasn't just letting kids explore freely.  Ms. Mason's P.N.E.U. had a curriculum, based on living books that were scheduled.  I will have to think about it further, but I see a difference in favor of BFSU's lesson on energy vs. only scheduling a book to read together on energy when talking about CM's idea of lessons. 

 

I do't think I'd have said that was the essence of BSFU.  To my mind the unique aspect of the program is really that it lays out the scientific principles in a logical way, in order to build up an explicit sense of scientific principles.

 

It is meant to be fairly experiential, but not so much directly experiencing the things in nature, but in a sense artificially creating opportunities to observe verty direct demonstrations.

 

To me that tends to work against what I'd like to do in a CM approach to science, which it to simply provide a lot of opportunities for children to observe nature - yes, they will see and perhaps notice these principles at work, but I want kids to see and experience that in nature before we isolate it in a systematic way. When we do the demonstration when they are a bit older, I'd like them to be able to relate it back to a real experience, maybe even make a guess about what will happen.

 

Teasing out laws or scientific principles from those experiences should be a project that is associated more with the ages where children are making more abstractions, and when they won't be substituting the abstract learning from the natural experiences.

 

I likely wouldn't be scheduling a book about energy, either.  But even if I did, I'd want to spend my science time actually looking at the world, not doing artificial demonstrations of it.  

[Above The Rowan]

While I agree that something like BFSU in early elementary years wouldn't necessarily be something that would be "purist CM", or what Mason would do - - it's worth noting that UM isn't attempting to recreate what the PNEU did. And they have stated that their focus is science-heavy, secular, and CM-inspired. So, BFSU fits what Ursa Minor are trying to create. I'm happy that there will be a CM-inspired curric out there with a focus on science and modern resources. I'm also happy to see they aren't trying to recreate the original programmes - there's already enough of that on the market, in my opinion.

 

It'll be interesting to see how this all gets laid out in the scheduling.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

You can't study science without studying nature. Everything is made of the *stuff* of nature.  *Stardust*  (eta nod to Carl Sagan)

 

My concerns aren't because it's not "purist" or what Mason would do, but rather it doesn't seem to be ideal for that age. You can absolutely be science-heavy, secular, and CM-inspired and still be in the woods or at the water's edge (or backyard or local park) for much of elementary school science.  I recently read an article lamenting that some scientists are becoming too far removed from the very science they are studying.  Some scientists I know bemoan that so much of their work is in front of a computer instead of in the wild.

 

These carefree years spent in the wild discovering and learning about nature -- IN nature --  are priceless. My teen's mentors (scientists!) are frequently telling their students to put down the books (even science books) and get out to experience whatever it is they are studying.

 

So often discoveries are made just by observing. Mason said, "The flowers aren't new, it is true; but the children are; and it is the fault of their elders if every new flower they come upon is not to them a Picciola, a mystery of beauty to be watched from day to day with unspeakable awe and delight."  Shouldn't they experience the flowers and make these discoveries and embrace wonder while they are young? 

 

“A child’s world is fresh and new and beautiful, full of wonder and excitement. It is our misfortune that for most of us that clear-eyed vision, that true instinct for what is beautiful and awe-inspiring, is dimmed and even lost before we reach adulthood. If I had influence with the good fairy who is supposed to preside over the christening of all children, I should ask that her gift to each child in the world be a sense of wonder so indestructible that it would last throughout life, as an unfailing antidote against the boredom and disenchantment of later years…the alienation from the sources of our strength.†

― Rachel Carson, The Sense of Wonder

Edited November 2, 2017 by Woodland Mist Academy

[Soror]

I can't figure out what they are doing, it seems to me the formating needs work. It seems there is 2 full credits as written or is it meant that you pick just one? 

 

On history is The Story of American Freedom for the whole year or just Term 1? Are there supposed to be biographies listed for all terms or just 2?

 

The organization doesn't make sense to me.

 

I am anxious to see the weekly plans to see how they put it all together and BFSU deconstructed for the Middle Grades sounds promising.

Edited November 2, 2017 by soror

[Soror]

I love nature studies for the younger years and agree with others that I don't want a highly structured science plan for elementary. Although I think it is great they are going science heavy I think you can do that is best done with nature studies in those grades. I'd love updated nature study that doesn't use 100 year old books or books that are heavily religious. We'll see what they put out.

[Bluegoat]

While I agree that something like BFSU in early elementary years wouldn't necessarily be something that would be "purist CM", or what Mason would do - - it's worth noting that UM isn't attempting to recreate what the PNEU did. And they have stated that their focus is science-heavy, secular, and CM-inspired. So, BFSU fits what Ursa Minor are trying to create. I'm happy that there will be a CM-inspired curric out there with a focus on science and modern resources. I'm also happy to see they aren't trying to recreate the original programmes - there's already enough of that on the market, in my opinion.

 

It'll be interesting to see how this all gets laid out in the scheduling.

 

I don't think they should try and recreate anything.  I don't think it's actually ver Mason-friendly to try and do that anyway, so I'm certainly not wedded to that sort of thing.

 

However - experiencing things in context before taking them apart intellectually is a pretty foundational concept in CM.  It's the basic logic she uses in her approach to every subject with the elementary ages.

 

I think for me the problem is - what do they mean by CM if they pretty much dispose of the basics of her educational philosophy, as well as the basics of her philosophy of the person?  It makes me feel very unsure of the basis of their choices.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

 

I think for me the problem is - what do they mean by CM if they pretty much dispose of the basics of her educational philosophy, as well as the basics of her philosophy of the person?  It makes me feel very unsure of the basis of their choices.

 

I was wondering the same thing.

[Bluegoat]

To be more specific - "CM inspired" sometimes seems similar to calling using natural wax crayons Waldorf inspired.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

 I love the computer programming as a foreign language, 

 

Will colleges love computer programming as a foreign language?

 

ETA: Thankfully they are not trying to count this as the only foreign language. My question is why count it as a foreign language at all? The website states "We feel that the best adaptation of this for current students is to replace the second modern foreign language with a computer programming language, spreading the feast even wider."

 

How is that wider? It's just different. 

 

Why not just do Latin and a modern foreign language for foreign language credits and computer programming as part of the computer science progression or something of that nature. It almost does a disservice to both foreign language AND programming/computer science to try to blend them. What purpose does it serve?  (Other than trying to make it sound CMish.)

Edited November 3, 2017 by Woodland Mist Academy

[Bluegoat]

Will colleges love computer programming as a foreign language?

 

ETA: Thankfully they are not trying to count this as the only foreign language. My question is why count it as a foreign language at all? The website states "We feel that the best adaptation of this for current students is to replace the second modern foreign language with a computer programming language, spreading the feast even wider."

 

How is that wider? It's just different. 

 

Why not just do Latin and a modern foreign language for foreign language credits and computer programming as part of the computer science progression or something of that nature. It almost does a disservice to both foreign language AND programming/computer science to try to blend them. What purpose does it serve?  (Other than trying to make it sound CMish.)

 

My guess is that it might be a time issue.  But still, in that case, I'd say I'm dropping language 2 for coding.  I'd tend to think of coding as computer science, math, or logic, and I can see leaving room to swap a second language for coding or symbolic logic.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

My guess is that it might be a time issue.  But still, in that case, I'd say I'm dropping language 2 for coding.  I'd tend to think of coding as computer science, math, or logic, and I can see leaving room to swap a second language for coding or symbolic logic.

 

Right. I absolutely understand dropping the second modern foreign language for coding. What I don't understand is having it under the foreign language heading. I agree -- I think of coding as computer science, math, logic etc.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

My main concern is that it's understood that probably very few colleges will accept programming to fulfill foreign language requirements. When I first read the post up-thread about programming, that's what I thought they were doing -- using programming for the foreign language credit requirements. Once I went to the website, I was relieved to find out that isn't exactly the case -- it is just for the 2nd modern foreign language. So, programming would most likely fulfill an elective credit. It may seem like splitting hairs, but these things matter on college apps. 

 

I'm still curious to know what they mean by CM and their goals in that regard. Just looking at the page about foreign languages, it does seem they are trying to recreate/update what the PNEU did. They even said it on that page. "By the time they graduated, PNEU students were working on Latin and two modern foreign languages. We feel that the best adaptation of this for current students is to replace the second modern foreign language with a computer programming language, spreading the feast even wider. "

Edited November 3, 2017 by Woodland Mist Academy

[Above The Rowan]

 

I'd have to wait and see their K-8 schedules, etc, but I do think you can have structured science in tandem with nature study. We do it in my house. There's a time on the schedule for natural history/special studies - and we also have a structured middle grade science curric for my 6th grader in addition to our nature studies (he's doing RSO Astronomy 2). I don't necessarily use a structured science curriculum for my kids in earlier elementary though - just books to introduce topics by interest. Nature study is our prime science in those early years, but we do schedule readings and books about other science areas.

 

I definitely agree that I'd love to see updated nature study resources. That is something that is definitely lacking on the market right now. We recently started a Botany course from Sabbath Mood, and basically changed all the recommended readings because we wanted something more current. I'll be curious to see what they include for nature study/natural history.

 

The programming in a language slot makes sense to me if we're sticking to a 4-6 hour school day, including the riches. Finding a way to include a programming language without ADDING one more thing to a high schooler's schedule seems great to me. College (well, university here) admissions may be different here, but foreign languages are not necessarily something they have to see on their credits. So I wouldn't feel like I'm losing out if I replaced one modern language with a programming language. I like that they have given computer programming importance in the curriculum and not just as an elective or bonus subject.

 

I'm sure once we see the weekly schedules and how they've laid it out - "how cm inspired" they are will be a lot clearer. All I'm seeing now is a resource/booklist, but it's a booklist that actually got my middle schooler fired up for high school. We scrolled through a lot of the Year 9 stuff and he LOVED it.

 

As a side note: they did mention that they're working on Canadian substitutions for some subjects. This is also a nice touch, as most new curricula sort of forget about us up here lol.

Other note about their science choices: they do mention somewhere on their site that while they aren't making this to be a gifted or advanced curriculum, THEIR students are I think. So it may be that they have a group of children who ASK for more than nature study (my oldest does, for sure) so they're likely creating the curriculum they'll use for their own students.

[....]

Other note about their science choices: they do mention somewhere on their site that while they aren't making this to be a gifted or advanced curriculum, THEIR students are I think. So it may be that they have a group of children who ASK for more than nature study (my oldest does, for sure) so they're likely creating the curriculum they'll use for their own students.

 

I spent a big chunk of time looking at their blog when you first posted it.  I'm trying to say this without sounding like I'm a jerk just ripping it apart...  Yes, it looks to me like a curriculum for advanced kids who are not asynchronous and don't mind their entire day scheduled for them.  This curriculum is also the opposite of a multum non multa approach (IMO) - but I think newer homeschoolers are probably not looking for that, anyway.   

 

AOPS Calculus by 11th grade?  And only one year per book?  I just feel like there are going to be a lot of frustrated parents out there.   :001_unsure:  It took us 2 years just to get through the AOPS pre algebra book and we school year-round (even more embarrassing - Lol!).

 

And Latin + 2 foreign languages.  OK, realistically, this is really, really hard to pull off in a homeschool setting.  My oldest teen is studying Latin + 1 foreign language in high school and even that is overwhelming.  I tried to talk her into dropping the 2nd language several times, because she is not reaching the same level of fluency that I reached in high school with just 1 language.  

 

A lot of the items on the booklist are very expensive.  We dropped MCT's LA at one point, because we could no longer afford it.  The books about different religions are very expensive.  I clicked on the amazon link for one of them and it was $45.  

 

American Politics Today is 800 pages.  I would have to threaten my teens with horrible punishments to get them to read that.   :tongue_smilie: There would be a massive mutiny.  I'm pretty sure Distant Mirror is a college text, which is fine for some kids, but some might have a hard time with it.

 

This curriculum looks like something that's so much easier to pull off in a mini-private school or a co-op setting - which actually explains where they're coming from (a co-op).

 

I'm not trying to be mean or rip their blog apart, I've just seen new homeschooling parents IRL buy curriculum and then just throw it at the kids, expecting them to do it...and then get upset when the kid can't do it.  I've witnessed that firsthand here...   :glare:  (And I'm not saying you would do that)

 

If you want to know what I do like:

• the literature lists are great - I even like the Free Reading lists
• I love the living math book selection (I'm a sucker for living math books)
• Art/Music appreciation - Yep, Wonderful!
• Handiwork, life skills, PE - Yay!  Those are very important.
• Their blog seems to be really well put-together.  The more blogs like this out in the homeschooling world, the better.

And if your kids are really wanting to do this curriculum for high school, I say, "Go for it!!"  I'm sure this curriculum is a great fit for some kids.  And I'm sure their co-op is wonderful.  They obviously put a lot of work into it.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

I'd have to wait and see their K-8 schedules, etc, but I do think you can have structured science in tandem with nature study. We do it in my house. There's a time on the schedule for natural history/special studies - and we also have a structured middle grade science curric for my 6th grader in addition to our nature studies (he's doing RSO Astronomy 2). I don't necessarily use a structured science curriculum for my kids in earlier elementary though - just books to introduce topics by interest. Nature study is our prime science in those early years, but we do schedule readings and books about other science areas.

 

I definitely agree that I'd love to see updated nature study resources. That is something that is definitely lacking on the market right now. We recently started a Botany course from Sabbath Mood, and basically changed all the recommended readings because we wanted something more current. I'll be curious to see what they include for nature study/natural history.

 

The programming in a language slot makes sense to me if we're sticking to a 4-6 hour school day, including the riches. Finding a way to include a programming language without ADDING one more thing to a high schooler's schedule seems great to me. College (well, university here) admissions may be different here, but foreign languages are not necessarily something they have to see on their credits. So I wouldn't feel like I'm losing out if I replaced one modern language with a programming language. I like that they have given computer programming importance in the curriculum and not just as an elective or bonus subject.

 

I'm sure once we see the weekly schedules and how they've laid it out - "how cm inspired" they are will be a lot clearer. All I'm seeing now is a resource/booklist, but it's a booklist that actually got my middle schooler fired up for high school. We scrolled through a lot of the Year 9 stuff and he LOVED it.

 

As a side note: they did mention that they're working on Canadian substitutions for some subjects. This is also a nice touch, as most new curricula sort of forget about us up here lol.

Other note about their science choices: they do mention somewhere on their site that while they aren't making this to be a gifted or advanced curriculum, THEIR students are I think. So it may be that they have a group of children who ASK for more than nature study (my oldest does, for sure) so they're likely creating the curriculum they'll use for their own students.

 

 

I might not have made myself clear in my other posts. I'll try to clarify a bit. I am not saying that the typical high school plan should always include Latin and two modern foreign languages. I think having some sort of computer science instead of a second modern foreign language is a fantastic plan -- especially if the student has no interest in foreign languages. You are correct that my comments regarding credits are relevant only to those applying to US colleges/universities. I should have clarified that. Thanks for pointing it out. 

 

Regarding electives: This may be another term that varies based on location. Electives are not viewed as frivolous bonus subjects. A certain number of electives are required by most schools. They are called electives because the students can pick which ones they take, not that they aren't important. It's recommended that a student's choice of electives showcase a student's interests and show progression and depth. 

 

Regarding gifted students:  I can safely say that giftedness and nature study are fast friends. Much depends on how nature study is approached.

[....]

These are good points and I feel like they kind of tie in to the recent 'oldschool' thread. These aren't really problems with the suggested curriculum as presented, but with parents who think they can just plug their kid into a plan--any plan-- and everything will be hunky-dory.

 

I feel bad even mentioning it, but I've seen it several times here where we live and it's kinda heartbreaking to watch.  And everyone becomes frustrated - the kid and the parents.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

I've always seen CM as having two sides -- the principles and the details. 

 

I have always focused more on the principles. This program seems to be more focused on the details.

[Bluegoat]

I'd have to wait and see their K-8 schedules, etc, but I do think you can have structured science in tandem with nature study. We do it in my house. There's a time on the schedule for natural history/special studies - and we also have a structured middle grade science curric for my 6th grader in addition to our nature studies (he's doing RSO Astronomy 2). I don't necessarily use a structured science curriculum for my kids in earlier elementary though - just books to introduce topics by interest. Nature study is our prime science in those early years, but we do schedule readings and books about other science areas.

 

I definitely agree that I'd love to see updated nature study resources. That is something that is definitely lacking on the market right now. We recently started a Botany course from Sabbath Mood, and basically changed all the recommended readings because we wanted something more current. I'll be curious to see what they include for nature study/natural history.

 

The programming in a language slot makes sense to me if we're sticking to a 4-6 hour school day, including the riches. Finding a way to include a programming language without ADDING one more thing to a high schooler's schedule seems great to me. College (well, university here) admissions may be different here, but foreign languages are not necessarily something they have to see on their credits. So I wouldn't feel like I'm losing out if I replaced one modern language with a programming language. I like that they have given computer programming importance in the curriculum and not just as an elective or bonus subject.

 

I'm sure once we see the weekly schedules and how they've laid it out - "how cm inspired" they are will be a lot clearer. All I'm seeing now is a resource/booklist, but it's a booklist that actually got my middle schooler fired up for high school. We scrolled through a lot of the Year 9 stuff and he LOVED it.

 

As a side note: they did mention that they're working on Canadian substitutions for some subjects. This is also a nice touch, as most new curricula sort of forget about us up here lol.

Other note about their science choices: they do mention somewhere on their site that while they aren't making this to be a gifted or advanced curriculum, THEIR students are I think. So it may be that they have a group of children who ASK for more than nature study (my oldest does, for sure) so they're likely creating the curriculum they'll use for their own students.

 

Past elementary, I think you are getting into territory where it is completely appropriate to have a systematic science curriculum of some kind, and by high school I think it's necessary.

 

It was the talk of BFSU for elementary grades I found questionable.  I think it would be a nice program for middle school - a good link between nature study and really abstract, processing math based textbook work.

[EmilyGF]

What I see lacking in CM elementary/middle school curricula is understanding of what special studies should be and how that is carried out. I think a lot more science value can be added by actually guiding parents in leading special studies well than by introducing an elementary science program. 

 

Special studies is sort of a targeted nature study that borders on a simple science fair project. It is keeping it real (real things the child actually interacts with and observes) while building scientific thinking, observation, and analysis skills. This is tricky to do, and implementing it well can be amazing. One should get this right before adding something like BFSU, realizing that clutter in the schedule prevents doing important things. 

 

Emily

[Woodland Mist Academy]

 realizing that clutter in the schedule prevents doing important things. 

 

 

:001_wub:

[Above The Rowan]

Past elementary, I think you are getting into territory where it is completely appropriate to have a systematic science curriculum of some kind, and by high school I think it's necessary.

 

It was the talk of BFSU for elementary grades I found questionable. I think it would be a nice program for middle school - a good link between nature study and really abstract, processing math based textbook work.

I agree with you here, then. I never really introduced a formal science curriculum until 4th grade ish. I'll wait and see how they "deconstruct" it and what it looks like before I either rant or rave about it. I know in some CM circles, a lot of parents are doing this very same thing - taking BFSU and chopping it up to be more CM-friendly. I haven't, but I do love the look of BFSU. So if UM has found a way to do this, then I'm interested to see what that would look like.

 

UM may not be right for every kid, but it will fill a need for quite a few families I think. I'm excited to see it all finished.

[Above The Rowan]

What I see lacking in CM elementary/middle school curricula is understanding of what special studies should be and how that is carried out. I think a lot more science value can be added by actually guiding parents in leading special studies well than by introducing an elementary science program.

 

Special studies is sort of a targeted nature study that borders on a simple science fair project. It is keeping it real (real things the child actually interacts with and observes) while building scientific thinking, observation, and analysis skills. This is tricky to do, and implementing it well can be amazing. One should get this right before adding something like BFSU, realizing that clutter in the schedule prevents doing important things.

 

Emily

It took me a long while to figure out HOW a special studies lesson looks in real every day life. I understood it in concept, but it's only just recently that I've really 'gotten it'. We are just starting to feel good about our special studies, and we've been at this for a few years now.

 

I think you're right, that helping parents help their children through their special studies would be a great thing. Particularly sources that would be secular-friendly. I find the Sabbath Mood lady has some great info about nature study and CM science, but I have to do a fair bit of screening and weeding through her choices and recommendations, as a secular family.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

 - taking BFSU and chopping it up to be more CM-friendly. 

 

 Do you mean making short lessons? Does that make it more CM?  

 

(ETA: CM is so much more than short lessons, thus the question. I was trying to determine how chopping it up makes it more CM.)

Edited November 4, 2017 by Woodland Mist Academy

[Woodland Mist Academy]

I think evaluating a new program does several things beyond helping us decide whether or not it's a good it for our family. Sometimes in learning about other approaches, we are given a chance to see our own approach in a new light. Also, hearing other people's thoughts about a program can help us make an informed decision. Further, sometimes the best way to make a decision about a program is to try to find all the faults, in addition to finding all the strengths.

 

I say this in case anyone thinks we are being overly critical. Thinking critically and skeptically is something I hope a solid, secular, Charlotte Mason-inspired education would promote. Science is built on trying to prove itself wrong.