Talk me down or push me over

[Chrysalis Academy]

Guys, I'm really struggling with my dd11. As a lot of you know, dd14 has been sick for a year, was recently diagnosed with Lyme, and faces a long road to (hopefully) recovery. A lot of time is taken with doctor's appointments, physical therapy, and cooking meals for her (restrictive diet). I'm stressed pretty close to the max.  Dd11 is solidly in the midst of puberty, and it's a doozy - way more intense and difficult than her sister at this age. Which isn't surprising, that's how she rolls. But it's getting so difficult, and the conflict between us is escalating.  I don't think we've had a day this week without tears - hers and mine. 

 

I really don't know what to do with her. She flips back and forth between maturity and immaturity. She does the minimum, with bad grace. She doesn't take criticism well (writing) and nothing I try seems to work. When I'm demanding, it backfires. When I'm flexible, it backfires. 

 

I'm just sick at my stomach about all this. I don't want to do this anymore. I'm afraid it's damaging our relationship. I don't know whether to push harder or ease off or give up or . . . what. I don't have the energy and the headspace to figure out what to do.  

 

Talk to me gently? About getting through a kid's tough puberty, getting through a family's tough season, whether it's worth it to persist or whether to throw in the homeschooling towel? No choice feels right or easy at this point. I need some help.

[Another Lynn]

Rose, before I comment one way or the other, I'm curious - is any of her work outsourced?

[Jean in Newcastle]

Throwing out a couple of ideas:

 

1.. you could put the 11 year old in school for now. You could then concentrate on the daughter who is sick.

 

2.. You could do more of an unschooling approach this year. Let it be interest led. I actually did this with my daughter at that age.

 

 

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[Another Lynn]

Throwing out a couple of ideas:

 

1.. you could put the 11 year old in school for now. You could then concentrate on the daughter who is sick.

 

2.. You could do more of an unschooling approach this year. Let it be interest led. I actually did this with my daughter at that age.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I was going to ramble on for about 5 paragraphs to say about the same.  

[Lori D.]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

For both reasons (older DD's extra needs due to health, and younger DD's rocky puberty and strong personality), you might try a middle ground step first. I'm thinking what about outsourcing all but 1-2 subjects, and only save those 1-2 subjects to do at home as ones that you and DD#2 can also "bond" over.

 

I know it's too late to register for most semester-long classes, but what about local options:

- tutor

- university model school

- homeschool co-op classes

 

Even better, is there a "retired" homeschool mom in your area who could be hired to come in 3 days a week to do teaching, grading, and tutoring?

 

You might also try scaling school back to just the basics (math, writing, reading, plus a little grammar & spelling), and then scheduling time for helping DD#2 pursue a subject of personal passion -- even if it's something non-academic, like cake decorating, jewelry making, gymnastics, or whatever.

 

 

On the other hand, am I recalling that 11yo DD is 5th grade this year, and you had a decent small school she could go to? And it was the following year that would be the move to a middle school that was undesirable? If the local small school is still an option, then that might be great for DD#2 -- accountable to outside teachers, gives her a predictable routine, and gives DD#2 her own "thing" or circle of friends that isn't about big sister and her successes/illness.

 

Because, just a thought, but a lot of DD#2's emotion and drama might also be due to all the "attention" and focus big sister has received for months of "being sick". Also, DD#2 may unconsciously be reacting with jealousy or feeling left-out about all of the positive things that have been going on in older sister's life in the past few years -- her successes with creative writing and theater.

 

Just brainstorming. :) Hugs and best wishes for a good recovery for DD#1, peace for DD#2's stormy times, and clear thinking and insight for you and DH as you think through options and make decisions. Warmest regards, Lori D.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Lori D.

[Lori D.]

I was going to ramble on for about 5 paragraphs to say about the same.  

 

Lol. which I just did.  :laugh:

 

 

Yes -- Jean In Newcastle's idea of unschooling. Or maybe keep is super simple and outsource for this semester to Time4Learning -- get done what you get done, and don't worry about keeping up with anyone's schedule. Melt-down -- set school aside and go for a hike together, walk the dog around the block together, or cook dinner together. Tomorrow is a new day.

 

And just keep moving forward. Love that phrase -- it's what we say at the foster kid summer camp that I volunteer with; the kids have melt-downs and rages or issues, we calmly sit with them and let them have their moment, and when they are ready, we keep moving forward -- we don't let those moments define the whole week at camp.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Lori D.

[Kuovonne]

Rose,

 

Oh my, you have so much on your plate.

I saw in your signature that your DD14 does as much as she has spoons for each day.

You have more spoons than she does, but you too have a limited supply and can do only so much.

 

None of the choices feel right, but that doesn't mean that they are wrong.

I don't know what choices you've already explored, but I suggest you put relationships ahead of high academics.

This is not to dismiss academics completely, but middling academics with a solid relationship

is better than trying for high academics and having a disasterous relationship and probably not getting the

high academics anyway. If you are already getting so much pushback that both of you are in tears every day,

pushing harder won't do any good.

 

My older DD and I constantly butted heads until we sent her to school.

After she went to school, our relationship improved. There is a *lot* that

I didn't like about sending her to that school, but the change in our relationship made it worthwhile.

 

My younger DD is in 6th grade, and we are starting to butt heads as well.

I think part of our conflict over writing is that she struggles with writing much more than her older sister did.

However, she is a different person, and sending her to school now isn't the right decision for her.

Outsourcing classes (some online, some at a local co-op) also helps.

[Lori D.]

PS -- sorry to keep pestering you!

 

Also, what about 11yo's health / lifestyle?

 

Eating nutritiously and getting enough protein and healthy fats?

Possibility of mood swings being triggered by food sensitivities -- maybe try cutting out dairy, wheat, sugar, and corn to see if that helps?

Getting regular aerobic exercise? -- that was a HUGE help here

Getting enough deep sleep and REM sleep -- maybe she needs melatonin? Sleep deprivation can lead to major melt-downs.

[Chrysalis Academy]

Wow, guys, thank you so much - this is just the conversation that I needed.

 

Dd11 is doing a nature class one day a week - some writing, some drawing, working with plants, crafts.  Very non-academic but out in nature and with other kids. She loves it and I love it, and we really like having that break from each other one day a week!  She also does riding once a week, vaulting once a week, and theater, which keeps her busy several afternoons a week when a play is going.

 

Nothing else is outsourced.  And I don't have the time to take her on a lot of outings other days - too much juggling between work and appointments, and I won't leave dd14 home alone while we go out and do fun things she can't. Dh says he will step up and do more outings with her on the weekends - they went camping together this summer - and we try to make sure she has the chance to get together with friends on the weekends - she's slept over at a friend's the last two weekends.

 

We don't really have a good option for putting her in school this year - the local schools do junior high 6th-8th.  The school is not great and for a variety of reasons we don't think it would be a great environment for her this year. And it wouldn't actually relieve much stress, I don't think - just compress it into the hours of the day when she's home and we're both tired and I'm trying to make sure she gets her homework done.

 

Man, I would love to mostly unschool this year. I would love to feel like I had permission to do that. I am concerned with making sure she is ready for b&m high school - there is a good Arts magnet high school nearby that I think she'd love. She's a much more social person and I think she would not be happy doing high school at home. We know lots of kids from theater who go to this program and they love it. So there's that. 

 

At the same time, I have the sense from my experience with dd14 that high school readiness is almost as much about maturity and about surviving puberty as it is about the specific things you study in junior high. Especially 6th grade. 

 

Health behaviors: Not very good I'm afraid. She's always been a picky eater. I spend hours a day cooking tasty stuff she won't touch. She doesn't eat well at all. Not a lot of junk, we don't keep any in the house, but not very balanced - not enough protein or vegetables for sure. I don't really know what to do about that. It's always been a source of conflict between us (if I let it) and I don't feel that trying to wrestle her into a more restrictive diet - avoiding potential inflammatory foods - would work at this point. I feel like it would backfire.

 

Ok, got to go take her to Vaulting but I will be back soon. Thank you all again for listening and sharing your wisdom.

[....]

I was going to ramble on for about 5 paragraphs to say about the same.  

 

Me, too, actually.

 

I would choose to do a year of unschooling.

[Chrysalis Academy]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

 

Because, just a thought, but a lot of DD#2's emotion and drama might also be due to all the "attention" and focus big sister has received for months of "being sick". Also, DD#2 may unconsciously be reacting with jealousy or feeling left-out about all of the positive things that have been going on in older sister's life in the past few years -- her successes with creative writing and theater.

 

 

 

Yes, this is definitely part of the package. And we all talk about it, pretty openly. She has permission to feel jealous, which she has shared that she does, and dd14 shares that she feels jealous that her sister can do all the things they both love that she can't.  M has always felt that she was the "little sister" in activities. Now S feels replaced by her little sister, as she does many of the same activities with the same friends. There is a lot of open discussion of all this, which is healthy, but hard - there are a lot of very painful emotions involved on all sides, and I just can't fix any of this stuff. Or make it go away.

 

We had a talk about how this week went (after my first post) and agreed that we didn't like it and we'd like it to be different. We talked about how puberty can turn your emotions into a scary roller coaster. We also talked about why it's not a good idea to "go nuclear" - use always and never language, and make things about more than they really are. We didn't come up with any solutions on the school front, but at least we cleared the air on the relationship side a bit. That felt good.

 

She also copped to the fact that she's been manipulative and out of line in trying to get what she wanted (to get to go to school) and she doesn't want that now. She just feels a bit trapped, as we all do in our current situation.

[....]

I don't know if this helps at all, but one of my dds basically took a year off from "school" because of a brain injury.  She had migraines and was just in a ton of pain all the time.  We don't regret it at all.  And we just picked up right where we left off.  

[Lori D.]

Actually sounds like a lot of GOOD things going for DD#2 -- yea!

 

The Nature group sounds great -- I'd count that as science for the year and call that subject good -- *maybe*, from time to time, throw in a few books to compliment the nature studies IF it works out.

 

Sounds like you're getting writing in with the Nature group, so not sure I'd sweat too hard to do a formal program on top of that -- or rather, if a program is working for you both, then just give yourselves permission to work at half speed through it.

 

Really, math would be the only thing I'd worry about trying to slowly keep moving forward with. Do you have a program that is working for her this year?

 

I was looking at Time4Learning -- looks like it is very student-directed for 6th grade, and you can use as much/as little as you want. So that might be ideal for your DD right now. Schedule a few hours each morning (or whatever works for everyone), that are school hours, and DD does some math, picks some topics to do through Time4Learning, and then enjoys her vaulting, theater, and Nature group. easy peasy! :)

Edited September 29, 2017 by Lori D.

[Lori D.]

Yes, this is definitely part of the package. And we all talk about it, pretty openly. She has permission to feel jealous, which she has shared that she does, and dd14 shares that she feels jealous that her sister can do all the things they both love that she can't.  M has always felt that she was the "little sister" in activities. Now S feels replaced by her little sister, as she does many of the same activities with the same friends. There is a lot of open discussion of all this, which is healthy, but hard - there are a lot of very painful emotions involved on all sides, and I just can't fix any of this stuff. Or make it go away.

 

We had a talk about how this week went (after my first post) and agreed that we didn't like it and we'd like it to be different. We talked about how puberty can turn your emotions into a scary roller coaster. We also talked about why it's not a good idea to "go nuclear" - use always and never language, and make things about more than they really are. We didn't come up with any solutions on the school front, but at least we cleared the air on the relationship side a bit. That felt good.

 

She also copped to the fact that she's been manipulative and out of line in trying to get what she wanted (to get to go to school) and she doesn't want that now. She just feels a bit trapped, as we all do in our current situation.

 

That is awesome! I know those blow-outs and melt-downs are hard, but what fantastic and mature thinking from everyone, which is going to lead to a stronger and emotionally/relationally healthier school year. It will just take some time to get there. HUGS!

[Miss Tick]

Is dd11 onboard with the Arts magnet school? Can you use a path toward that end to get more buy-in from her along the way?

 

Can you all afford, say, a 2 week morning school only (or something) as a reset? Can you outsource math to Khan Academy until Thanksgiving? Switch writing to Killgallon or journaling or a Faltering Ownership-type project?

 

What about an exchange program? That is probably too extreme a change, though. Plus, what if you get her karmic Russian twin. ;)

 

Sorry this is so hard!

Edited September 29, 2017 by SusanC

[Another Lynn]

Actually sounds like a lot of GOOD things going for DD#2 -- yea!

 

The Nature group sounds great -- I'd count that as science for the year and call that subject good -- *maybe*, from time to time, throw in a few books to compliment the nature studies IF it works out.

 

Sounds like you're getting writing in with the Nature group, so not sure I'd sweat too hard to do a formal program on top of that -- or rather, if a program is working for you both, then just give yourselves permission to work at half speed through it.

 

Really, math would be the only thing I'd worry about trying to slowly keep moving forward with. Do you have a program that is working for her this year?

 

I was looking at Time4Learning -- looks like it is very student-directed for 6th grade, and you can use as much/as little as you want. So that might be ideal for your DD right now. Schedule a few hours each morning (or whatever works for everyone), that are school hours, and DD does some math, picks some topics to do through Time4Learning, and then enjoys her vaulting, theater, and Nature group. easy peasy! :)

 

Agreed.  

 

As far as writing goes - whatever additional writing she does (besides nature class), I would not worry much about editing.  Just let her write a lot - whether it's free writing or creative writing or whatever.

 

Aside from that let her read.  Hopefully a lot.  And be consistent with math.  

[LMD]

You don't have to do complete unschooling but me 11/12year old dd does much better with more control over her work.

So I wrote a list of books for each subject for her to choose from, wrote minimum chapter numbers per week and a list of suggested reaponses.

She picks what to work on each day and how to respond to it.

She made a Google slides presentation for chemistry (she had Ellen McHenry and What Einstein told his cook as choices - she's still working through Einstein for fun) She is drawing pictures with captions for her new science book (The Naming of Names)

 

She's doing character sketch maps for A Man For All Seasons (history option) and a word cloud design for her geography book (one girl one dream)

She keeps a math notebook and works through resources of her choice (Jousting Armadillos, life of fred, khan, Russian math...)

 

Non negotiables are LA and our morning time stuff. She is actually doing really well with this. One of Regentrude's posts inspired me to try.

[Arcadia]

I would unschool for this academic year, look at what the Art magnet high school requirements are and plan how to proceed to meet those requirements in three years. Is there any math requirement? I don’t know any local selective high schools with requirements other than math. My kids did unschool for a year and there is no harm done.

 

When I was helping out as a volunteer in children cancer ward, the parents were telling me how their other children feels neglected while the sick child just wish to be healthy again. Take care of yourself too, it’s emotionally hard on everyone.

[ElizabethB]

I got an IEW subject package and used it with my daughter for the grading scale when she was in the midst of all that. I really hate how formulaic it is, and never planned on using IEW, but it was what we needed for a clear grading scale for a bit, that way it’s not mom criticizing or nitpicking, it is just part of the assignment, very clear guidelines. I never bought or used the full IEW, just a subject package.

Edited September 30, 2017 by ElizabethB

[lmrich]

You could outsource to Brave Writer for writing. Perhaps use Teaching Textbooks for math to give her more independence. I would let the nature class count as her science. Can you find a book club for her to join at the library? They might even meet on the weekends or evenings? If your library does not have one, talk to the librarian. I would watch history videos together and talk about them. Not exactly 'unschooling' but you could take a lot of pressure off your relationship. 

 

And lots of hugs. This too shall pass. It just does not seem this way now. When my middle daughter was this age and had a problem with school work, her first instinct was to be defensive and angry. She matured and learned how to ask for help with grace and kindness. It just takes time. Hang in there. 

[Chrysalis Academy]

I don't know if this helps at all, but one of my dds basically took a year off from "school" because of a brain injury.  She had migraines and was just in a ton of pain all the time.  We don't regret it at all.  And we just picked up right where we left off.  

 

Yes. we haven't managed more than 10 hours a week of school with dd14. We're chipping away at an Econ credit (mostly videos & docos), Psychology (a Coursera class plus reading when she feels up to it) and English (reading + a GC, no writing yet). Any writing energy she has goes to her creative writing. Luckily our math this year is Geometry - we're doing Videotext, so we did Alg 2 last year and Geometry now. The Geometry is all review so far, so it's not taxing. But we may only make it halfway through this stuff, or complete a couple of half credits. I just can't worry about it, we can only do what we can do. She's on the young end - started school at 4 - so if we end up doing 2 years of 10th grade, she'll still graduate at 18. And we just can't sweat college or the future right now, we just have to focus on getting through each day and treating her illness.

 

Actually sounds like a lot of GOOD things going for DD#2 -- yea!

 

The Nature group sounds great -- I'd count that as science for the year and call that subject good -- *maybe*, from time to time, throw in a few books to compliment the nature studies IF it works out.

 

Sounds like you're getting writing in with the Nature group, so not sure I'd sweat too hard to do a formal program on top of that -- or rather, if a program is working for you both, then just give yourselves permission to work at half speed through it.

 

Really, math would be the only thing I'd worry about trying to slowly keep moving forward with. Do you have a program that is working for her this year?

 

I was looking at Time4Learning -- looks like it is very student-directed for 6th grade, and you can use as much/as little as you want. So that might be ideal for your DD right now. Schedule a few hours each morning (or whatever works for everyone), that are school hours, and DD does some math, picks some topics to do through Time4Learning, and then enjoys her vaulting, theater, and Nature group. easy peasy! :)

 

Yep, I'm letting the Nature class be science, for sure. For math, we abandoned MM6 - we were both hating it - and we're using the Math Essentials workbook, which is just about perfect at this point - some review and one new topic each lesson, covers everything you need before algebra. We're also doing Hands-On Equations and some Zaccaro, on good days.

 

Writing is a bit of a challenge because a) she's very sensitive to criticism and b) she's at that stage where we can have a really great discussion, about a book for example, but then when she goes to write her paragraph, none of the great thinking translates to the page. It's a normal stage, I just need to be patient and gentle and realize we have a whole year to practice this skill. Or as long as it takes, really.  I realize that part of my stress about writing is that I tend to mentally compare what she's doing with what her sister was doing in 6th grade, and feel that it's inadequate, but I have to remember that her sister is an exceptionally gifted writer and that comparisons are not fair. And not helpful. She's really pretty much where SWB suggests a 6th grader should be in her MG writing lectures. 

 

Is dd11 onboard with the Arts magnet school? Can you use a path toward that end to get more buy-in from her along the way?

 

 

Yes, she is super excited about it, so definitely "getting ready for high school" is a motivator.

 

Agreed.  

 

As far as writing goes - whatever additional writing she does (besides nature class), I would not worry much about editing.  Just let her write a lot - whether it's free writing or creative writing or whatever.

 

Aside from that let her read.  Hopefully a lot.  And be consistent with math.  

 

Yep, math every day - she's also doing Dreambox - and reading every day.  Right now I read aloud to her, and she reads aloud to me, and then she reads a historical fiction book she chooses from a large stack I provide, roughly correlated to history (which is really just reading aloud and discussing the texts, no output). That all is going pretty well, and is as much as I can handle.

 

I did look at Time 4 Learning. I will keep that in mind if things get more challenging. She does do Dreambox, Sheppard Geography, and Easy Peasy Spanish online on her own each day. She enjoys working online.

 

Thinking about it, our main stress areas are math and writing, and our main conflict is over her getting her work done each day without me having to nag, and her being ready to work with me when I'm ready to work with her. My days are pretty tightly scheduled, and when I have a time slot open to work with her, I need her to be ready to go, not reluctant or sulky or resistant. That's really my biggest issue, her attitude can throw my whole day into a tailspin as my carefully constructed plans to get it all done fall apart. I need to practice detachment on that one. 

Edited September 30, 2017 by Chrysalis Academy

[bethben]

I outsourced with online classes when I started getting kickback from my ds. It gave him someone else to be accountable to and worked very well for us. For my dd with whom homeschooling started to get contentious and every day resulted in me not wanting to be near her anymore, she went to school. I'm not thrilled with it and know I could do better,but we have a better relationship. I chose that path because she just needs me to be her mom.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Peaceseeker]

It sounds like the area you could (and possibly should) let go of a little is her writing. Maybe whenever it comes time to look at her writing that should be the time to think- relationship first. She may just not be ready for the feedback yet honestly. Have that really great discussion about the book, and just let her write her paragraph without a lot of commenting from you about the quality of the writing this year. You can spend more time later on these skills, when the hormones settle down and your other daughter gets stronger. There is still so much time to work on writing if she is only 11. The goal for writing this year could simply be that she does some without a battle or meltdowns. The goal next year or the year after can be to sharpen her skills.

 

If she has strong communication skills and can discuss books amd topics with you, that is half the battle. I think I would let off the gas in this one area (from your past posts I can tell this is an area of strength in your homeschool so it may be difficult for you to let go here). If she just did free writing or simple paragraphs for a year, will that really hurt her? Will it help your relationship if you back off from critiquing her writing this year? Seems like a small give and it may free you up both emotionally and time wise to focus on other things this year.

 

Hang in there! I hope you can find some time in all of this to take a moment for yourself and your own self care as well. Sounds like a tough year is coming, so I would try and pace myself for a marathon instead of sprinting ahead and hitting a wall.

Edited September 30, 2017 by CaliforniaDreaming

[maize]

At the same time, I have the sense from my experience with dd14 that high school readiness is almost as much about maturity and about surviving puberty as it is about the specific things you study in junior high. Especially 6th grade.

I agree 100% with this.

 

I would do a relaxed year, work to maintain a positive relationship, and let that maturation happen.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

  :grouphug:  Health (both physical and mental) and relationships first. Always.  :grouphug:

[OneStepAtATime]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

1.  Outsource writing to a local tutor that maybe meets with her once a week (possibly in your home if you are comfortable so you don't have to worry about driving her) and then assigns her work to do during the rest of the week (light, not heavy) and the tutor grades the writing assignments.  Not you. (You might look on Wyzant)

 

2.  Or stop worrying about any formal writing instruction right now.  Maybe ask her to keep a journal/diary and just drop it otherwise.  No feedback from you.  She still has two years after this year to get more solid on writing.  Just get through this year with relationship in tact.  

 

3.  Or see if outsourcing to an on-line writing source would work.  With an on-line teacher.  Who does all the grading.  Not you.  Let them be the bad guy for now.

 

As for math, you might look at something like CTC Math.  It is usually on sale through Homeschool Buyer's Co-op.  The student has access to all levels of math from Kindergarten through Pre-Calculus.  I find it easier to use and better laid out than Khan Academy.  On hard days just have her do some lessons on there.  You can log on to see how she did and where she needs work and can assign lessons in specific areas without you being the one that has to work with her directly.  

 

 

[fralala]

Thinking about it, our main stress areas are math and writing, and our main conflict is over her getting her work done each day without me having to nag, and her being ready to work with me when I'm ready to work with her. My days are pretty tightly scheduled, and when I have a time slot open to work with her, I need her to be ready to go, not reluctant or sulky or resistant. That's really my biggest issue, her attitude can throw my whole day into a tailspin as my carefully constructed plans to get it all done fall apart. I need to practice detachment on that one. 

 

I think I can't be the only one who reread this several times because it felt so good to have someone voice my own feelings so cogently.

 

And I am not dealing with the health issues your family has, which add an extra burden. But I think so many of us can relate to this in general.

 

I have no idea how to be detached about it; it makes me feel really upset. But are those feelings of anger and sadness and resentment really bad, or in a way do they help bring us closer to the feelings our kids must have about the fact that we can often be unavailable in a multitude of ways when they want or need us for something? In truth, I am often sulky and resistant when I am in the middle of an activity (including that wonderful called thinking) and another person interrupts and expects something from me without taking into account what I am doing. Even if they're talking about something that would normally excite me or interest me, it just feels intrusive not to have that respectful, "Are you busy?" or, "When you get a chance, could I tell you something?"

 

This is not at all helpful, I realize, in terms of getting the work you've set off to do done, but I've found that when I have to frequently say "Not now, I'm in the middle of something" to my kids, they are more likely to say "Do I have to? Right now?" to me. And that kind of season is a good time to become a little more flexible and unschool-y.

[Kfamily]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

From all that I know of you, I sincerely believe that your daughter will be more than just fine with a year of relaxed schooling. The nature class, reading and keeping math consistent would be enough, and then keeping the independent geography and Spanish adds even more to this.

 

With regard to writing, I think the discussions you have about the books you are reading will help in this area too. Part of writing is thinking and organizing your thoughts, so she's probably growing in writing just because of this.

 

At around this age, I transitioned both of my daughters to a commonplace book. Usually I give them a lot of freedom with this, so it can handled independently. In their commonplace book, the girls could copy any excerpt from a book or poem that they found interesting or particularly moving (from any of the books that we were currently reading for school) and copy this into their book (a simple composition book would be fine....I found some decorative ones at a bookstore that were blank, large and spiral bound). I asked that they include the name of the book or poem from which they took it and the author.

 

They also kept a narration notebook (again a composition book) where they wrote all of their narrations over the course of the year. I would read them (when I got to them) and write notes in the margins. I made sure to include a lot of positive comments and then carefully constructed comments on areas they might improve. My younger daughter has a thing with commas (LOL... :)), so I sometimes will write that she's been a bit too "comma happy". Since our communication is through writing, I think it removes some of the feelings that are stirred up when mom critiques the writing.

 

Just some little ideas...but in the end you really have to do what's best for your family. I think you are handling this so beautifully. We've had enough of our own issues for me to sense how hard this must be sometimes.  Sending you hugs!  :grouphug:

Edited October 1, 2017 by Kfamily

[Woodland Mist Academy]

. I would read them (when I got to them) and write notes in the margins. I made sure to include a lot of positive comments and then carefully constructed comments on areas they might improve. My younger daughter has a thing with commas (LOL... :)), so I sometimes will write that she's been a bit too "comma happy". Since our communication is through writing, I think it removes some of the feelings that are stirred up when mom critiques the writing.

 

We started a similar process of written comments around the same age. Sometimes she would even write a note back asking for clarification. Written communication made a big difference. 

[Kfamily]

Yes, my daughters both love/ed this arrangment. My younger daughter will drop everything that she's doing just to read my comments when I hand it back to her. She loves the positive feedback. :) And she too will sometimes write me back. Once I asked further questions about a point she was trying to make in her narration of a chapter from David Copperfield. I only wrote the questions to give her something to think about (not expecting a written response), but she added to her narration to clarify this part. I think it also showed her that from my perspercive as the "reader", she had left out some pertinent information. :)

Edited October 1, 2017 by Kfamily

[BlsdMama]

As a mama with a rough kiddo, I'd be wary of offering a year of unschooling a hard child and this is why:

 

Next year.

 

 

Next year you will have to *fight* a resistant child who had it her way for a year.

 

 

And this is especially true of a child who isn't easier with flexibility and isn't easier when she has her way and isn't self motivated.  It is going to take a lot of out you to attempt to cajole and police her without structure.

 

I'd suggest having "these things we do" (the bare minimum) and then a lot of you picks within structure.

 

 

For example:

 

My hill to die on is Barton, grammar, and math.  (No one tell me I'm not supposed to do a separate grammar program with Barton.  I already know it.  I don't care.) 
My flexibility is his reading list.  We come up with that together.
I require he read SOME but the majority?  Audio.  No quizzes, no reviews, casual conversation of, "So, hey, what did you think of that book?"  No papers to write.

 

For now, we skip writing entirely.  I'm happy with my grammar (Rod & Staff) and minimal writing is in there.

History - I'm good with working it in via video.

Science - meh.  He is going through a text because he doesn't fight me on it but it's no hill to die on for me.

 

The only other thing is (usually) no TV through the week.  Because then he has to find something useful to do.

 

It's some structure without being something I have to babysit all the time.  I feel less guilty (and that's a valid reason to do anything) knowing we covered the minimums.  I do a lot out of alleviating guilt.  It works for me.
I also try to look forward - what foundation am I laying and will it later make my life easier or harder?  I think the year of unschooling for a regular child?  FUN!  I think a year of unschooling for a difficult child?  The pathway to torment next year.

[Chrysalis Academy]

I decided to do a set of standardized tests with her, just to see where she is at. We're not required to test, and it's not something we've done regularly before, but under the circumstances I thought it might either ease my mind, or point out where we were falling short.

 

She did the Stanford 10. She did very, very well. I'm thinking I can relax a little bit this year. Keep up with math, reading, discussing. Keep working on spelling & mechanics. Other than that, I think we're in really good shape. Meaning, she's met and exceeded requirements, for her grade level and many grade levels to come. So we can focus on what we think is important. And I think I can ease up on us both a bit. If she ever does need to re-enter school, she will be fine. So I'm feeling better . . . 

[Another Lynn]

I decided to do a set of standardized tests with her, just to see where she is at. We're not required to test, and it's not something we've done regularly before, but under the circumstances I thought it might either ease my mind, or point out where we were falling short.

 

She did the Stanford 10. She did very, very well. I'm thinking I can relax a little bit this year. Keep up with math, reading, discussing. Keep working on spelling & mechanics. Other than that, I think we're in really good shape. Meaning, she's met and exceeded requirements, for her grade level and many grade levels to come. So we can focus on what we think is important. And I think I can ease up on us both a bit. If she ever does need to re-enter school, she will be fine. So I'm feeling better . . . 

 

:hurray:  :hurray:  :hurray:   (This needed more than a "like!")

[Reefgazer]

Well, you have just described my DS, who turned 13 on the day of your post.  He has been like this since he was 12, and most days I just want him in school and to stop hassling me.  I threatened him with military school the other day, LOL.  My DD was like this at that age, as well.  My honest advice:  Hang on until it passes.  With DS, all his privileges are revoked when he hasn't done his assignments and until they are caught up.  It might not work to change behavior, but he sure isn't getting rewarded for it.  I basically have to tomato stake him to get him to do any work.  Unschooling would not work with this one - he would sit and do nothing for literally all day before he would do anything but play computer games.  I am not kidding, all day.

Guys, I'm really struggling with my dd11. As a lot of you know, dd14 has been sick for a year, was recently diagnosed with Lyme, and faces a long road to (hopefully) recovery. A lot of time is taken with doctor's appointments, physical therapy, and cooking meals for her (restrictive diet). I'm stressed pretty close to the max.  Dd11 is solidly in the midst of puberty, and it's a doozy - way more intense and difficult than her sister at this age. Which isn't surprising, that's how she rolls. But it's getting so difficult, and the conflict between us is escalating.  I don't think we've had a day this week without tears - hers and mine. 

 

I really don't know what to do with her. She flips back and forth between maturity and immaturity. She does the minimum, with bad grace. She doesn't take criticism well (writing) and nothing I try seems to work. When I'm demanding, it backfires. When I'm flexible, it backfires. 

 

I'm just sick at my stomach about all this. I don't want to do this anymore. I'm afraid it's damaging our relationship. I don't know whether to push harder or ease off or give up or . . . what. I don't have the energy and the headspace to figure out what to do.  

 

Talk to me gently? About getting through a kid's tough puberty, getting through a family's tough season, whether it's worth it to persist or whether to throw in the homeschooling towel? No choice feels right or easy at this point. I need some help.

 

Edited October 7, 2017 by reefgazer

[Woodland Mist Academy]

Well, you have just described my DS, who turned 13 on the day of your post.  He has been like this since he was 12, and most days I just want him in school and to stop hassling me.  I threatened him with military school the other day, LOL.  

 

I remember discussions of boarding school around that age... 

[Pen]

DNRAPP (did not read all prior posts)

 

suggestion:

 

if her school option is really terrible (drugs, violence, bullying...) continue to homeschool for her safety. If it is only not a particularly good school, but not especially dangerous, give her the option of whether to continue to homeschool or go to the BMS. Whichever she chooses, make clear that it will be her choice, but can be changed by parental decision, if things are not working out well with the choice she makes.

 

If M goes to the BMS, let her deal with homework etc. on her own, unless she specifically asks you for help, in which case demand that she act with good grace (never mind the doing the minimum part--this is a year to get through for everyone's over all health and an 11yo does not need to do more than the min of schoolwork). At age 11 even if she gets all F's it won't matter in the long run, and may help her as a learning experience -- unless she is prone to depression and that would cause her to fall apart. Ds says the best student in his class this year is a boy who didn't do enough assignments to pass last year, was held back, and, apparently, now has got his act together (plus he was smart in the first place). If her school would have a study hall option, sign her up for that so most homework can get done at school with someone else than you to help.

 

If M home schools, do math with her, or find an outsource that will work for math (it is the only thing likely to make a difference if it gets behind or rusty in terms of going into high school). Or, at the very least, tell her what level of math she "should" ideally be at by 9th grade, and the levels between where she is and there, and let her decide how she is going to handle that.

 

Let her unschool everything else, where you will be willing to help her if she needs materials or other assistance, but only if her grace is good, and only in so far as you are able to given other demands. Or if unschooling is too much of a reach for you, let her determine her own course of study and approach you with it as a negotiated decision with a contract (as in Montessori) and then at each completion period go over the contract with her and decide jointly how well she has succeeded with it in her own opinion and yours.

 

 

A good military school would actually likely be a good option, but you probably don't have one near you. We used to as a charter option, but it moved away to a bigger campus. They have busses, but the leaving time is 5:30AM, which I consider ridiculous and unhealthy for teen sleep needs. Still something like that might be worth your seeing if your area has something similar with a bus to get her there and back.

[Pen]

paragraphs not working, sorry.