Would you recommend Skype language lessons for a dyslexic child?

[summerreading]

I am looking into Homeschool Spanish Academy for 14yo DS and have a trial lesson lined up. I know DS is not loving the idea b/c the idea of maintaining a face to face conversation for almost an hour is intimidating. He already can be a little tongue-tied in English, so I understand. He wants Spanish not something else, so I think any class will eventually involve a Skype call. 

 

Thoughts? Advice? It'll probably be good for him?

He has outside activities where he has chances to socialize and talk with others, but is always hesitant about new things. 

 

Thanks!

 

[PeterPan]

I can't remember, has he had psych evals to get that diagnosed? When my dd was eval'd (ending up ADHD, not dyslexic), she had a terribly low word retrieval score. Poor word retrieval is common in dyslexia and apraxia, both of which my ds, ironically enough, is diagnosed with. Anyways, when she did spanish online, the actual conversation was VERY, VERY, VERY hard for her because she has very low processing speed *and* the low word retrieval. You pair them, and it's torture.

 

So me, I'm reading what you wrote, and I'm not blowing that off. If you could make evals happen, you'd have data to quantify how significant this is. Between the potential for processing speed issues, word retrieval issues, and just the fact that he's dyslexic (which typically makes language acquisition harder), you ALSO have the high probability (60%) that he's also ADHD. So when he's saying he's going to wilt if he has to talk for an hour like that, he may literally be correct. It may be neurologically EXHAUSTING for him.

 

And if you want to add to the list "hesitant about new things" can also be some anxiety. And I'm not saying he has those things, but I'm just saying he really could be judging the situation accurately.

 

Have you attempted a foreign language with him in the past? How did it go?

 

If you get evals and the psych gives documentation for scratching foreign language from the grad requirements, that would be one path. Another would be to wait and do it only the last two years. Another would be Pudewa's suggestion that you send them overseas for the summer. ;)  Another would be to do it entirely written, like with a really straightforward written text. Another would be to do something accessible but not terrifically hard, like Rosetta Stone. (shhh, I know it's controversial)

 

If he has no long-term goals with the language, and if he KNOWS it's going to be torturously hard, and if he has NO WAY around it, then proceed with the absolute most gentle plan possible. It's better to do a slap job, not very good, get through it, and put his energy into other things that WILL be strengths. Far better than wearing himself out with something not within reach.

 

You could also consider doing a course in-person. He's correct that an hour online, where it's just you, is really putting him on the spot. A co-op class might work better and give him structure, games, etc., less pressure. The online spanish courses with 1:1 tutors like that can be very hard for a kid who is slow. We tried some with my dd and gave up. The situation would be great for the right student, just not for a low processing speed, poor word retrieval student who gets anxiety and feels on the spot.

[summerreading]

I can't remember, has he had psych evals to get that diagnosed? 

 

If he has no long-term goals with the language, and if he KNOWS it's going to be torturously hard, and if he has NO WAY around it, then proceed with the absolute most gentle plan possible. It's better to do a slap job, not very good, get through it, and put his energy into other things that WILL be strengths. Far better than wearing himself out with something not within reach.

 

You could also consider doing a course in-person. He's correct that an hour online, where it's just you, is really putting him on the spot. A co-op class might work better and give him structure, games, etc., less pressure. The online spanish courses with 1:1 tutors like that can be very hard for a kid who is slow. We tried some with my dd and gave up. The situation would be great for the right student, just not for a low processing speed, poor word retrieval student who gets anxiety and feels on the spot.

 

No eval yet. I know he is dysgraphic and dyslexic. After being through diagnosis and tutoring with his brother, I can see how this one slipped under the radar now and I have a consult with a neuropsychologist next week. Inattentive ADD would not surprise me either. I cannot tell if he has slow processing speed or is just a deep thinker who doesn't want to be rushed. This is what I'm hoping the dr will tell me.

 

He does have a goal with the language in that he thinks it would be fun to talk in Spanish with relatives more. My goal is wanting it done this year vs next is that I feel pressure to get it on the transcript and over with early. I was planning on 10th to start but now I feel pressure thinking 9th, 10th is what colleges what to see. All the group classes I know of have started and are closed for this year. But I do see what you are saying now in how awful this would be for a kid like this.  Do you think it is really important to have the first year of FL be in 9th?

 

I think I am getting too anxious with the transcript thing. I should not torture my kid for a benchmark.

 

Thank you!

[summerreading]

I think I feel a little light at the end of this tunnel. Could I go over this book with him Madrigal's Magic Key to Spanish: A Creative and Proven Approach https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004FGMD8W/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I3R2Y4RBQZBHIJ&colid=LT93KGQOOK9

 

pair with DuoLingo and have his grandmother, a native Spanish speaker, check his pronunciation?

 

Does that seem like enough?

[Pen]

eta my paragraphs are having trouble again. If it comes out as a jammed together block again after trying to edit it 3X already, I am just leaving it.

 

 

 

 

I don't know anything about the Madrigal book. Or, wait, maybe I got it once upon a time, but in that case think it was not as helpful as title suggested.

 

I think Duolingo plus working on conversational Spanish with his grandmother (if she can be gentle and supportive with him on it), would be great!! Go for it!

 

If he can get short dialogues to work on--I don't recall how to do accents or upside down ?, but along lines of:

 

Hola. Me llamo Juan. ?Como te llamas?

Hola, Juan. Me llamo Maria.

Mucho gusto, Maria.

Igualmente, Juan.

 

 

(His grandma might be able to come up with some such that would make sense. Or you could get a book with such dialogues.)

 

That is about where 9th grade Spanish would start--not a whole hour having to talk one on one with someone.

 

 

I recommend getting the book (maybe Audible form) Fluent Forever and going through that with your ds as a way to help learn how to learn another language.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 20, 2017 by Pen

[PeterPan]

Yes, let anything that you think is enough be enough! Count hours spent, not material covered, and make it REAL. Don't forget that in a 1st year class they're also doing culture, so your native speaker could have him over for spanish lunches once a week. They could eat spanish food and work on phrases and sentences. Absolutely picking up spanish by being with a native speaker is a good thing! It's going to be REAL.

 

Book spanish, where they go through conjugations, etc. doesn't really translate over well to speech. There's something charming about people who maybe have less book learning of the language and make more errors but who are actually able to engage. I think your DuoLingo idea is an interesting way to balance it. But mainly, put in the hours to call it a unit (not credit, unit, google this) and boom done. He can also do children's books with audio, etc.

 

Look, on the college thing, we don't have to be really nebulous about this. There are colleges where doing AP classes and getting 5s your freshman year is the norm on transcripts, and there are colleges that just want your warm body walking in the door, and everything in-between. There's going to be a place for him, and the place that doesn't want him because he couldn't do something that didn't fit him his freshman year might not be the place for him. 

 

My dd had that kind of Ivy wanderlust, whatever you want to call it. And there are kids with SN who get accepted to Ivys too, sure. But her reality is that she does better in a place with supports. She's at a school where she's in the top percent. Like you can look at scores and go ok, I'd be in the bottom 25%, the middle, the top 25%. When you're a "B student" and you want scholarships, you go to a place where you're more toward the top. Now my dd had some pretty good ACT scores! Really, she did. But she needed the supports that some schools give. So she's at a small-ish university and has amazing supports. Study groups for any subject, weekly academic coach, EVERYTHING. Getting accommodations is easy peasy, all set up, nothing embarrassing at all. It really works for her.

 

So my point is, when you get honest about where he's probably going, maybe that school won't give a rip what year he did spanish, kwim? And I think your plan is GREAT. I think if he's enthused about it, you should do it! But I think for your fears about high schooling, about transcripts (which I get and I had even though I clerked for transcripts at a university), I think just know there's going to be a place for him. The right place will want him and just be true to him and what fits him. It will work out. My dd had a great experience in her classes (spanish, etc.), but they left her pretty stressed and wiped. I think some other paths could have been just as good and she'd be going to the same school she is now, with the same scholarships.

[Pen]

I think even though Duolingo is more translation oriented than conversational, it is still very helpful because it introduces lots of words and sentence patterns, and for many of them it does it with association with a picture.  It also gives some sentences that may themselves be silly for most people.  In German, my ds came to  "I have a cow."  which does not fit most urban students.  But it can then form a pattern that the student can say. ( I have a dog. I have a pencil. I have 2 brothers ) Based on the same start, and putting in other words instead of cow.

 

 

Also learning some sentences in Spanish like: How do you say this in Spanish)  and then pointing at things in his native speaker grandmother's presence, and then repeating the word back to her to work on pronunciation, could be a low- key start.

 

 

His goal of actually being able to communicate in Spanish with others is, IMO, is the true goal for foreign language learning and one that most students in USA don't manage.

 

[Pen]

Yes, let anything that you think is enough be enough! Count hours spent, not material covered, and make it REAL. Don't forget that in a 1st year class they're also doing culture, so your native speaker could have him over for spanish lunches once a week. They could eat spanish food and work on phrases and sentences. Absolutely picking up spanish by being with a native speaker is a good thing! It's going to be REAL.

 

Book spanish, where they go through conjugations, etc. doesn't really translate over well to speech. There's something charming about people who maybe have less book learning of the language and make more errors but who are actually able to engage. I think your DuoLingo idea is an interesting way to balance it. But mainly, put in the hours to call it a unit (not credit, unit, google this) and boom done. He can also do children's books with audio, etc.

 

 

 

I agree with this, with one caveat. The native speaker has to be someone where a beginner with fears about speaking up can do so comfortably.  My grandmother was a native French speaker and between the fact that she was not a teacher and that the French are notorious for being critical of people who do not speak their language well, trying to learn anything from her, or practice from my in school French with her ended up a negative experience.

 

This is why I was trying to suggest some simple set dialogues that could be learned and practiced for pronunciation, or asking how to say a word in Spanish, etc.

 

OTOH, OP's son's grandmother may be more user-friendly than mine was, and Spanish speakers are not so notoriously critical.

[freesia]

I think Homeschool Spanish Academy would work because it goes at the student's pace.  Also, it is not constant conversation.  Some of it is lesson teaching, some of it is completing workbook exercises together, etc.  The teacher's are very patient and calm and were never frustrated with my ds even when he wasn't as prepared as he should be or he wasn't making super fast progress.  (I dealt with that, but was glad that they were patient b/c he had a lot of social anxiety about the process.  It was *so* good for him, though).  They just kept on plodding on with him and he make great progress. 

 

(Now, I know that you asked specifically about dyslexia and, if he is, he is only slightly dyslexic--we are a family with many, many diagnosed dyslexics in the extended family.  I am planning on using HSA for my second ds, who is dyslexic for the reasons stated above.)

[Julie of KY]

My dyslexic daughter has been doing Homeschool Spanish Academy for the past few months and it is going great. She is very happy that Spanish pronunciation seems to follow more rules than English.

 

If you do HSA, talk to the teacher if he needs more review or to slow down.

[CadenceSophia]

I don't know homeschool Spanish academy so I am not saying anything against it. I know I'm butting in a little bit here but I do French conversion over skype to keep up my level. When I need to try lessons with a new tutor and even for a while after until I get comfortable, I find the whole thing terribly stressful. I basically freak out and regret scheduling it for the entire day before and I am completely fried at the end. And this is a language I speak comfortably every day. Face to face with a stranger is just so stressful for introverted me.

 

So I just jumped I to suggest maybe Glossika with Duolingo? There are lots of ways to get pronunciation help that duolingo isn't good for without it being face to face live. You can definitely get to pretty decent level without having to talk to people if that's what he prefers.

 

You could also check out Language Transfer which is a great method. And it's free so that's plus :)

[summerreading]

I don't know homeschool Spanish academy so I am not saying anything against it. I know I'm butting in a little bit here but I do French conversion over skype to keep up my level. When I need to try lessons with a new tutor and even for a while after until I get comfortable, I find the whole thing terribly stressful. I basically freak out and regret scheduling it for the entire day before and I am completely fried at the end. And this is a language I speak comfortably every day. Face to face with a stranger is just so stressful for introverted me.

 

So I just jumped I to suggest maybe Glossika with Duolingo? There are lots of ways to get pronunciation help that duolingo isn't good for without it being face to face live. You can definitely get to pretty decent level without having to talk to people if that's what he prefers.

 

You could also check out Language Transfer which is a great method. And it's free so that's plus :)

 

Thanks for all the replies.

 

Yes, this level of anxiety wouldn't be worth it. I rescheduled the trial lesson and am kind of bribing him a little to do it saying I need him to test it out for his brothers down the line, which is kind of true. Maybe he'll love it and it will be great therapy. Maybe he'll hate it and I think I feel a little more confident now to piece together something myself. 

[Pen]

Also some libraries will have Mango for free, and or Pimsleur tapes or other materials to help with some aspects of language learning.

[Storygirl]

You might do some research to see what really might be required on a transcript for college. I assume it varies by state, and likely by university as well.

 

DD12 attends a private dyslexia school that goes through high school. They do not offer foreign language classes. Evidently, around here, if a student's school does not offer foreign language classes, the students are exempt from fulfilling the college foreign language entrance requirements.

 

This is both an advantage and disadvantage for students at this school. The advantage: they can attend college without having taken foreign language. The disadvantage: students who would like to take it do not have the opportunity at our school.

 

It's great that your child has the goal of learning Spanish to communicate with family. I think it's possible for him to pursue that goal personally without doing it as a class that would show up on his transcript. I also think it would be possible to find a way for him to learn Spanish without doing a Skype class.

 

Could he, for example, do some book work (we found Getting Started with Spanish to be a good intro, though not enough to be a full Spanish 1 course) and Skype or FaceTime with his Spanish speaking relatives? Would they be on board with having some basic, simple conversations with him as he begins to learn? I know some relatives may not be able, but others might be thrilled. The goal of that interaction would be to develop the conversation skills, so you could let the relative know some of the conversational phrases he is learning, and they could just practice a bit.

 

I do think that after that, it would be totally fine to list that as a credit on the transcript. You could call it Beginning Spanish or Spanish 1, and you wouldn't have to sign up for an official course or go through the anxiety of one-on-one time with an instructor.

 

You'd have to then evaluate to see what he might do for Spanish 2.

 

Another idea is following the Easy Peasy Homeschool schedule for learning Spanish. https://allinonehighschool.com/spanish-1/

[PeterPan]

Lee Binz is your go-to source for info on transcripts. She does tons of free workshops, and they're usually pretty fun to boot. If you get on her email list, you'll get the notifications. 

[summerreading]

Lee Binz is your go-to source for info on transcripts. She does tons of free workshops, and they're usually pretty fun to boot. If you get on her email list, you'll get the notifications. 

 

Thanks, I just bought some of her coffee break books :)