Funerals, what religion..the living or the dead?

[G5052]

It's up to whoever is organizing it, but I've always gone with the wishes of the deceased even if it wouldn't be my way of doing things. Both of my parents had their wishes written out. I didn't know what my uncle wanted, but I went with what I thought he would like.

 

I have a relative in her 80's who wants lots of organ music in a particular cathedral. Not my style at all, but I've assured her that we'll do it if I'm in charge.

[IsabelC]

I think that generally, a funeral should be as close to what the deceased person would have wanted as can practically be done, without causing undue distress to their closest family members or friends who will be in attendance. But if it's going to be massively upsetting to somebody important, it might be better to have an ecumenical religious funeral, or even a secular funeral. It is up to the family members organizing the funeral to do their utmost to make it about their loved one, and not make it about disputes or point-scoring. Families can be difficult, but a funeral is not the place to air grievances or try to get one up on your relative.

[catz]

I'm sorry, this sounds incredibly hard.  Your sister sounds awful, but she has also been face to face with her dying mother for months which is also hard.  If you weren't in touch, it's hard to know what her final thoughts were on something like this.  If having a token there brings another very close relative comfort during a difficult time, I would let it go.  If the person was close enough to the situation to help plan the funeral, I don't necessarily think it is out of line to add touches that are meaningful to them.  I hope you are able to heal and find peace.  :grouphug:

 

ETA - I do have several elderly relatives that just started rolling with whoever was a caretaker for them the last years of their life.  My grandmother was a life long Catholic and earlier would never attend a UU service with us, but in her last 5 years did many times and grew to enjoy it.  She died Catholic and had a Catholic service.  But it actually was not 100% traditional Catholic funeral - my mom did the planning.  But I can see that if lives become intertwined in someone's final years it can be hard to puzzle this out if someone didn't leave direct instructions about their funeral.  Especially when there may be dementia involved. 

Edited September 20, 2017 by WoolySocks

[HS Mom in NC]

I think it's disrespectful to have a funeral in a religion the deceased didn't practice or identify with if the deceased's religious views are known.

 

I think everyone should write their wishes down and let their spouse and direct decedents know where it is in addition to telling them about it. If it's realistic to do what the deceased wanted, then do it. 

My husband's grandmother didn't want an open casket funeral.  Her son (my FIL)  was executor and medical power of attorney. He let his sister bully him into an open casket funeral because of her imagined need to connect open casket and closure.  It's entirely possible to have closure without an open casket funeral.  If it was so hard for her, she should've called a psychiatrist to help her deal with it and respected her mother's wishes.

 

 

[HS Mom in NC]

No, the RECEPTION is for the survivors. The funeral is a religious sacrament that should be done in the deceased's house of worship if he/she belonged to a faith.

 

My mom is Protestant and it wouldn't matter if the only surviving family members were Catholic, we would have the funeral at her church and not ours.

Not all churches are large enough to accommodate everyone who attends a funeral so sometimes it's at the funeral home.  Some people prefer graveside services. Some people are buried a long distance from where they lived and worshiped.   Some people aren't into the whole funeral thing, even religious people, and they have a memorial gathering/party at another location (a person's home, in nature, a bar etc.) before or after the body is buried or cremated.

 

[Audrey]

I think it should honor the deceased. As an atheist I think it would be incredibly dishonest and show a lack of care on the part of my religious loved ones if they had a religious ceremony for me. I realize that I could do nothing about that seeing as I was dead.

 

I agree.  I would hope that my loved ones will honour my very clear and specific wishes that no funeral be held at all.  I find even the "nicest" funerals to be hypocritical farces at best and my loved ones know that.  They also know that if they had anything to say to me, it won't matter one twittle when I'm gone. 

 

But, you know... if they'd even have me and if my dh wanted to go full on Catholic mass all over my carcass, then I can't do a thing about it.  Good luck with that.  I'll bear no responsibility for any spontaneous combustion that occurs.  Sadly, I'll also miss out on the delicious schadenfreude that would go along with that. But, hey.... have at 'er if you must. 

[Janeway]

I'm sorry, this sounds incredibly hard. Your sister sounds awful, but she has also been face to face with her dying mother for months which is also hard. If you weren't in touch, it's hard to know what her final thoughts were on something like this. If having a token there brings another very close relative comfort during a difficult time, I would let it go. If the person was close enough to the situation to help plan the funeral, I don't necessarily think it is out of line to add touches that are meaningful to them. I hope you are able to heal and find peace. :grouphug:

 

ETA - I do have several elderly relatives that just started rolling with whoever was a caretaker for them the last years of their life. My grandmother was a life long Catholic and earlier would never attend a UU service with us, but in her last 5 years did many times and grew to enjoy it. She died Catholic and had a Catholic service. But it actually was not 100% traditional Catholic funeral - my mom did the planning. But I can see that if lives become intertwined in someone's final years it can be hard to puzzle this out if someone didn't leave direct instructions about their funeral. Especially when there may be dementia involved.

my sister is not Catholic. And since she went out of her way to withhold the information that my mom was dying, which was the last few weeks, and went to great lengths to hide it, she wins no bonus points for being there while preventing me. Her cutting me off when asking the relative to state my mom was Catholic when she was not was just rudeness to add to her already evil actions. She also walked up today after the burial to cut me off. I was talking with a long distance relative and showing her my toddler she had not met and my sister made a snide remark about not wanting me there. The relative and I just stayed quiet until she was done walking away.

 

Her behavior has been over the top evil and just, I don't even have the words for how bad and evil.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Janeway

[catz]

It sounds like there is a lot more baggage and background than maybe many of us are aware of and this is deeper than just asking if a single token object in a casket is acceptable.  Again, I'm sorry for your loss.  Funerals and death bring out the worst in many. 

 

I would just say if people have strong feelings they should leave written instructions with someone they trust who will make it happen.  I personally don't care a whole lot.  If my adult child would find comfort in mourning or celebrating my death in a particular way, I would likely be fine with it even if it didn't exactly align with my world view. 

[poppy]

I've seen many people put tokens in coffins at visitations.

 

Where is the jaw drop emoji?

 

Are the tokens intended to be buried with the person? That seems so very intimate.

Or are people expecting family to fish their stuff out of the casket??    That seems so intrusive.

 

 

 

OP, I'm so sorry for your loss.

My dad was Catholic, I am not. I am very  glad that he had a full Catholic funeral.  It was a powerful experience and I think it is exactly what he would have wanted.

[QueenCat]

Where is the jaw drop emoji?

 

Are the tokens intended to be buried with the person? That seems so very intimate.

Or are people expecting family to fish their stuff out of the casket??    That seems so intrusive.

 

They are normally buried with the person. It is intimate. I don't think it's intrusive at all. It is comforting to those left living. That is probably why people do it. It is relatively common in at least 3 of the 4 states we've lived. I see it more when the person who died was young (think under 30).

[Tanaqui]

I'm kind of surprised, Poppy, that you're so surprised at this! I thought this was fairly widespread.

[dsmith]

The funeral should reflect the beliefs of the deceased. It is common for immediate family members to place items in the casket although it would be odd to place a rosary in the casket of someone who hated the Catholic church. I doubt it was placed there to be malicious but perhaps it gave the person comfort to place it there. 

[nancy_drew]

This.

 

I had to plan a funeral for someone who had made several religious changes over the last few years of her life. It was horrible. Two different sides were sure that they were the ones who knew what she really wanted. I worked out a compromise (pastor from church A officiated at the funeral home, but only gave a general eulogy and then the luncheon after the burial was hosted by church B). My goal was to do whatever brought the most comfort to the most people so I thought it was a good compromise, but neither side was completely happy with the outcome.

 

OP, I am so sorry you are dealing with this. I don't know the family situation, but I think it helps if you think that people are probably trying to do what they think she would have wanted. They may be wrong about what she wanted, but their intentions are probably good.

 

For everyone else, please let your family know your wishes, especially if you have made religious changes over time. You may think you're avoiding conflict by not saying, "Hey, I'm done with religion x, I want a secular memorial service," but the kinder thing is to let people know what you want in advance and - better yet - put it down in writing.

[HS Mom in NC]

I've heard of people putting items in a casket, but I've never seen it done before.

[Guest]

I had never heard of putting things in the casket until a friend of mine told me she put $5 in her Mom’s because while Mom hadn’t lived to see it, she had won the bet on the Michigan/Ohio football game. 🙂

[marbel]

I had never heard of putting things in the casket until a friend of mine told me she put $5 in her Mom’s because while Mom hadn’t lived to see it, she had won the bet on the Michigan/Ohio football game. 🙂

 

That made me laugh, mostly because while I know/believe that the deceased person is not the least concerned with what people put in their caskets, and aren't in a position to do anything about it anyway, if someone had done that with my mom, she would have been so mad!   :-)  She would be all "What are you doing? You've got so much money you can throw it away now? Go put it in the bank, or buy groceries with it!"   :-)

Edited September 20, 2017 by marbel

[Reefgazer]

This is my thought. My dad was Catholic and mom is Protestant. When dad died, my mom intended to have a Protestant minister preside over the funeral, but I suggested a Catholic priest who was a friend of the family, and mom agreed. So dad had a Catholic ceremony. I doubt mom would have agreed to that had the priest not been a friend of the family; it would have made her too uncomfortable.

 

I think a funeral should be in the religious traditions of the deceased.

[Reefgazer]

I hung back and I put a note sealed in an envelope in my dad's casket just before it was closed.

 

 

I had never heard of putting things in the casket until a friend of mine told me she put $5 in her Mom’s because while Mom hadn’t lived to see it, she had won the bet on the Michigan/Ohio football game. 🙂

[poppy]

I hung back and I put a note sealed in an envelope in my dad's casket just before it was closed.

 

 

 

Oh, please don't think I meant it was odd that people put things into caskets.... just, for people not in the immediately family, without express permission, to do so.

 

I helped my mom prepare for my dad's funeral.   We picked a suit & tie he liked.  He wore his glasses. She put a handkerchief in his pocket because he always liked that. She fretted over a half-dozen rosaries for him to be holding .... his childhood rosary? the one from the honeymoon? the one he got when he visited the Vatican?   

 

Later his mom (who is in her 90s) asked my mom if she'd mind adding a second rosary, and mom said "of course".

 

The idea of some friend of his just plopping in other STUFF in the casket to be buried with him forever makes me feel a little invaded. 

[Reefgazer]

Oh no, I didn't take it that way at all; and I do also think it odd that someone who was not of the immediate family would pop something in the casket.

 

Oh, please don't think I meant it was odd that people put things into caskets.... just, for people not in the immediately family, without express permission, to do so.

 

I helped my mom prepare for my dad's funeral. We picked a suit & tie he liked. He wore his glasses. She put a handkerchief in his pocket because he always liked that. She fretted over a half-dozen rosaries for him to be holding .... his childhood rosary? the one from the honeymoon? the one he got when he visited the Vatican?

 

Later his mom (who is in her 90s) asked my mom if she'd mind adding a second rosary, and mom said "of course".

 

The idea of some friend of his just plopping in other STUFF in the casket to be buried with him forever makes me feel a little invaded.