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News to me: No more subs at local school


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What's with the ads?

#1 lulubelle

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:05 PM

My oldest ds just started public high school. It's been about 2 weeks and he's had 3 teachers not be there. They have a designated proctor in a large 2 story science hall where they send the classes to do something. Today they showed a documentary on bottled water. I think the district is just trying to save money. Does your district still have subs in high school?

#2 creekland

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:16 PM

Our does.  I'm working again tomorrow.  I suppose if they stop I definitely know it's time for me to retire.

 

TBH, with what most subs do, they might as well watch a decent documentary instead (not me - I get to teach and do exactly what the regular teacher would have done as long as it's science, math, or French).


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#3 OH_Homeschooler

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:20 PM

Our local district has subs, but they seem to have a hard time filling all the positions. Maybe if they could pay more than the local fast food joints they'd have more luck. But I wonder if that's a more widespread problem, so schools are looking for solutions like proctors.
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#4 Arcadia

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:29 PM

Yes but I don't know how many
Yesterday's job opening posting from a nearby district, deadline to apply is 9/22/2017
"Long Term Substitute Teacher ($260.00per diem)- Math (AP Comp Sci, Computer Programming Java, AP Calculus BC)
Valid Appropriate Secondary Credential or a 30-day sub permit."

#5 Mimm

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:46 PM

Yeah definitely. That sounds like a pretty lame cost cutting measure.



#6 DeainUSA

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:53 PM

In our district there is a major sub shortage.  It may not be due to just cost cutting.


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#7 DawnM

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 08:59 PM

Ours has subs, but they can't always get them, so they have something called a "dispersion" sheet.  So, for example if there are 4 Science teachers for 7th grade, the class will split 3 ways (aprox. 10 per group) and push into the other classes.  Technically with Common Core they are all supposed to be on the same lesson, so it isn't as big of a deal.


Edited by DawnM, 12 September 2017 - 08:59 PM.

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#8 Artichoke

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:00 PM

Our does.  I'm working again tomorrow.  I suppose if they stop I definitely know it's time for me to retire.

 

TBH, with what most subs do, they might as well watch a decent documentary instead (not me - I get to teach and do exactly what the regular teacher would have done as long as it's science, math, or French).

 

 

I also sub for our local district.   Like Creekland, I work with secondary students and am able to teach several subjects.   At the high school  level we're almost always short of subs.  You also see a higher number of subs who sit back and let the kids run the classroom.   It may be a cost cutting measure for your district, or it may be a lack of available subs.  



#9 Artichoke

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:05 PM

Ours has subs, but they can't always get them, so they have something called a "dispersion" sheet.  So, for example if there are 4 Science teachers for 7th grade, the class will split 3 ways (aprox. 10 per group) and push into the other classes.  Technically with Common Core they are all supposed to be on the same lesson, so it isn't as big of a deal.

 

 

I liked your post to agree, but in reality I absolutely hated this practice as a teacher.  Hopefully it works better now than it did years ago.   


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#10 heartlikealion

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:09 PM

I imagine for some people it's hard to sign up to be a sub because it's not stable work. I mean, sure, in some cases it could be steady work but not in all. That could be a deal breaker for someone looking for a FT job. I once took a test and applied to be a sub but the district was not hiring (this was before I had my own family).

 

When I worked fast food I was always getting offered hours on my days off. Not sure they are losing subs to jobs like fast food, but just commenting due to the reference up thread.



#11 Tanaqui

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:12 PM

Ours has subs, but they can't always get them, so they have something called a "dispersion" sheet.  So, for example if there are 4 Science teachers for 7th grade, the class will split 3 ways (aprox. 10 per group) and push into the other classes. Technically with Common Core they are all supposed to be on the same lesson, so it isn't as big of a deal.

 

We used to do that in our elementary school, but I never heard of anybody else doing it until now! (And we mostly ended up in classes a grade up or down, and were expected to simply read during the school day.)


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#12 JanOH

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:13 PM

My dd is working as a tutor in a local school district.  They do not hire subs as a normal routine.  If a teacher is absent for a short period of time (one or two days), the class missing a teacher is split up among other classes of the same grade if it is at all possible.  There were times last year, where they hired my dd as a sub for certain situations but it was basically because she was already familiar with the classes because of her tutor work.

 

editing to add:  I didn't see the previous post outlining the same situation.  


Edited by JanOH, 12 September 2017 - 09:14 PM.


#13 Deb in NZ

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:22 PM

I work as a relief teacher (substitute teacher) here in NZ.  Schools all over NZ are finding it very hard to get subs.  Classes are split up or teachers have to work when sick in many schools.  I have turned down work heaps because I was previously booked in another school.  Yesterday I could not work as I was sick in bed & they had 6 different teachers give up their prep time to cover the class through out the day.  Today I went in sick with no voice to work as they just could not get anyone.  I only work in the primary schools at the moment (age 5-12), but I believe high schools are struggling as well to find subs.

 

 



#14 Daria

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:49 PM

Ours has subs, but they can't always get them, so they have something called a "dispersion" sheet.  So, for example if there are 4 Science teachers for 7th grade, the class will split 3 ways (aprox. 10 per group) and push into the other classes.  Technically with Common Core they are all supposed to be on the same lesson, so it isn't as big of a deal.

 

Your school has 4 periods of 7th grade science going on at the same time?  Every period, or do all the 7th graders have science at the same time?  I can't imagine. 

 

If your school district is scripting to the point where teachers are on the same page, that has nothing to do with Common Core.

 

At our school, teachers are expected to sub for pay during their planning periods, if the need arises.  It's in your contract that you can't really say no.

 

But the expectation is that the teacher who is out will provide an extra homework type assignment, and the kids will work silently the whole period, so the teacher can still prep.  


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#15 Ottakee

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 10:05 PM

I work as a sub and can work almost every day of the school year if I wanted. I work with the severely impaired students....many non verbal, non ambulatory, feeding times, trachs, etc.

I would love to get the $260)day mentioned above. I get $90/day.

#16 Momto2Ns

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 10:09 PM

We still have substitutes, but they are only paid $80/day. I don't know if there is a shortage, but I would assume it is tough to get anyone who is any good for that rate. I know I'm not willing to work for that.



#17 Deb in NZ

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 10:20 PM

Subs in primary school are paid up to NZ$313.79 / day (before tax) here in NZ.  That rate is 1/190 of a teacher's pay capped at step 8, with holiday pay included.  From what I've read on an Aussie FB page for relief teachers, I think their rates are similar to NZ's.  I remember years ago when I subbed just after graduating uni getting paid only $40 / day.  NZ's rates are better.

 

 



#18 Arcadia

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 10:20 PM

I would love to get the $260)day mentioned above. I get $90/day.


The district office is in CA 94087. The K-8 rate is $160/day. The high schools in that district are in three bordering HCOL cities.

#19 MEmama

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 04:31 AM

Ours do.
DS had a sub in one of his classes on Freshman Orientation day, which we thought was hilarious.

#20 meganrussell

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 04:55 AM

The rate for a sub in my home parish in Louisiana was $40 a day and a free lunch. Wow, I can't image $90 or more a day! That would definitely bring in more subs where I'm from.

#21 creekland

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:07 AM

I make $75/day take home.  At least I think I do.  I just started for this school year (due to family commitments) so haven't seen if they've raised that this year.  Officially it is/was $95 day, but they take out for taxes and retirement.

 

There's no way I could do this for a living if I had to provide the income.  I do it because I enjoy it and the extra money I bring in is extra (almost always for restaurants, travel, and/or charity) in our budget.  It's higher than minimum wage, but not a living wage.  I enjoy working part time with high school students, so getting paid is a bonus.

 

When it's a long term assignment, the pay goes up x 1.5, so just shy of $150/day, then subtract taxes and retirement.


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#22 heartlikealion

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 07:06 AM

I make $75/day take home.  At least I think I do.  I just started for this school year (due to family commitments) so haven't seen if they've raised that this year.  Officially it is/was $95 day, but they take out for taxes and retirement.

 

There's no way I could do this for a living if I had to provide the income.  I do it because I enjoy it and the extra money I bring in is extra (almost always for restaurants, travel, and/or charity) in our budget.  It's higher than minimum wage, but not a living wage.  I enjoy working part time with high school students, so getting paid is a bonus.

 

When it's a long term assignment, the pay goes up x 1.5, so just shy of $150/day, then subtract taxes and retirement.

 

That's not great, but it's more per hour than what I was quoted for a teacher assistant job. I don't know who normally makes more, subs or assistant teachers.



#23 Bluegoat

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 07:10 AM

We do here.  But, in a lot of cases they are more or less doing something like showing the kids a movie anyway - if it's just a day or two thing.  So, I'd be inclined to wonder if it is really worth spending extra money for that.



#24 Diana P.

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:10 AM

The rate for a sub in my home parish in Louisiana was $40 a day and a free lunch. Wow, I can't image $90 or more a day! That would definitely bring in more subs where I'm from.


Isn't that less than minimum wage? What kind of people are subbing for that rate?
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#25 meganrussell

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:34 AM

Isn't that less than minimum wage? What kind of people are subbing for that rate?


It may be more now, but when my mom was subbing that's what she got paid. Even less if it was half a day.

#26 QueenCat

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:55 AM

The rate for a sub in my home parish in Louisiana was $40 a day and a free lunch. Wow, I can't image $90 or more a day! That would definitely bring in more subs where I'm from.

 

Recently? That is well below minimum wage.



#27 meganrussell

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:59 AM

Recently? That is well below minimum wage.


I'm trying to find the current rate but I can't. It wasn't long ago at all.

#28 eagleynne

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:46 AM

Where I'm at (southwest Indiana) the pay is $70/day before taxes for assignments less than 15 days and $125/day before taxes for days 15+. Retired, licensed teachers get $10 - $15 more per day.



#29 Arcadia

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:42 AM

I'm trying to find the current rate but I can't. It wasn't long ago at all.


For Lafayette Parish School System for this school year
"Non-Degreed $55/day
Degreed**4-year degree or higher $65/day
Certified $80/day"
https://www.lpssonline.com/substitute

For Calcasieu Parish in 2013/14 which pays higher
"Substitute teachers with a certificate are paid $80 a day for 10 consecutive days. On the 11th day, they'll receive $214.

Teachers without a certificate are paid $65 a day for 10 days and then bump up to $100.

But teachers who are non-degreed receive $58 a day no matter how long they're subbing."
http://m.kplctv.com/...uid=od:hmAm2ZpH

#30 heartlikealion

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:53 AM

Isn't that less than minimum wage? What kind of people are subbing for that rate?

 

My guess. People that don't need the money. I did the math and the rate I was told for an assistant teacher job worked out to be around min. wage but I guess you have to factor in that you get paid in summers, too when you aren't working. Still, it was quite low.
 



#31 Library Momma

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 11:20 AM

In our town in CT the rate is $85 a day non-certified and $95 a day certified.  You must hold a Bachelor's degree at minimum to sub.  I know from friends that sub, that there is a large list of names so even if you wanted to sub everyday you might not get called. 



#32 Margaret in CO

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 11:33 AM

Our district hired two extra full-time teachers that do nothing but sub. They get regular teacher pay + benefits. They have one for each building. They hold K-8 and 9-12 licenses. 



#33 meganrussell

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 11:52 AM

For Lafayette Parish School System for this school year
"Non-Degreed $55/day
Degreed**4-year degree or higher $65/day
Certified $80/day"
https://www.lpssonline.com/substitute

For Calcasieu Parish in 2013/14 which pays higher
"Substitute teachers with a certificate are paid $80 a day for 10 consecutive days. On the 11th day, they'll receive $214.

Teachers without a certificate are paid $65 a day for 10 days and then bump up to $100.

But teachers who are non-degreed receive $58 a day no matter how long they're subbing."
http://m.kplctv.com/...uid=od:hmAm2ZpH


Thank you! I'm talking about west Carroll parish, and maybe my mom meant after taxes it's about $40.

#34 Arcadia

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 12:05 PM

I'm talking about west Carroll parish, and maybe my mom meant after taxes it's about $40.


It really could be $40 before tax though. Their pay for regular teachers aren't high.

West Carroll Parish
Bachelors Degree $30,240 to $38,990
Specialist Ph.D./Ed.D. $31,290 to $40,040
Source: http://www.wcpsb.com...13-14 9 mo.xlsx

#35 creekland

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 02:40 PM

That's not great, but it's more per hour than what I was quoted for a teacher assistant job. I don't know who normally makes more, subs or assistant teachers.

 

If an assistant is the same thing as an Instructional Aide, then at our school they make $10/hour which works out to $60/day or $75/day before taxes pending which school they are working at.  It's less than a sub makes.  

 

ETA (because it posted before I wanted it to!):  I make a little more than $13/hour if it's still $95/day base rate.


Edited by creekland, 13 September 2017 - 02:41 PM.

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#36 DawnM

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 03:19 PM

Current district pays 

 

$80.00 – Non–licensed substitute teacher with a college degree

$86.00 – Non–licensed substitute teacher who have participated in a Substitute Effective Teacher Training

$103.00 – Licensed substitute teacher

 

Former district pays:

 

$180-day and if you work over a certain number of days you can also get retirement and health insurance



#37 kiwik

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 02:35 AM

I work as a relief teacher (substitute teacher) here in NZ. Schools all over NZ are finding it very hard to get subs. Classes are split up or teachers have to work when sick in many schools. I have turned down work heaps because I was previously booked in another school. Yesterday I could not work as I was sick in bed & they had 6 different teachers give up their prep time to cover the class through out the day. Today I went in sick with no voice to work as they just could not get anyone. I only work in the primary schools at the moment (age 5-12), but I believe high schools are struggling as well to find subs.


Yes but sometimes my kids seem to have relievers more often that their teachers - head of syndicate release, professional development, writing programmes. It is really hard on ds8 and causes him major anxiety which can come out as agression. I am sure when i was a child it was rare to have a reliever - luckily as i found it stressful too.
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#38 wilrunner

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 08:59 AM

I'm paid $80/day (non certified teacher with a bachelor's) or $100/day if it's a long term sub job (more than 10 days.) My teen dd works at Chipotle and earns more/hour than I do.


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#39 DawnM

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 09:06 AM

I am teaching a counseling lesson in a teacher's class for the first 30 min. of each of his class periods today.  The tardy bell rings at 8:45am.  The sub showed up at 9:10am and I saw her slowly walking down the hall and then finding the bathroom to go in first, and then finally getting to the class by 9:20, 35 min. after the tardy bell and 45 min. after she was supposed to be here.

 

Good thing I was in there, but sheesh.....don't hurry or anything.



#40 Arctic Mama

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 09:19 AM

For Lafayette Parish School System for this school year
"Non-Degreed $55/day
Degreed**4-year degree or higher $65/day
Certified $80/day"
https://www.lpssonline.com/substitute

For Calcasieu Parish in 2013/14 which pays higher
"Substitute teachers with a certificate are paid $80 a day for 10 consecutive days. On the 11th day, they'll receive $214.

Teachers without a certificate are paid $65 a day for 10 days and then bump up to $100.

But teachers who are non-degreed receive $58 a day no matter how long they're subbing."
http://m.kplctv.com/...uid=od:hmAm2ZpH


My goodness that's low! I made that as a barista more than a decade ago (granted, I made great tips).

Got it - substitute teaching isn't worth the time or effort. That's criminally low.

#41 FaithManor

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 10:02 AM

Our local district pays $77 a day. Subs report at 7:30 am and cannot leave until 4 pm after writing their reports for the classroom teacher they subbed for but no extra pay if it takes longer than that to write the reports. That is 7.5 hours or essentially $10 an hour. It is a lot of responsibility and bureaucratic nonsense to deal with for that level of pay. On top of which subs must have an associate's degree or sixty hours of college classes within certain subject matter categories to get the out of profession subbing license and pay for their own background checks and fingerprinting with this district. People with that much college can usually do better than $10 an hour especially if they are willing to drive more than fifteen or twenty miles to the job. So they cannot attract people to the job.

In the Battle Creek/Kalamazoo area there are billboards along I 94 advertising for subs which if the state is paying for ads, tells me they are rather desperate for subs.

I will not work for the local district for $77 but if they offered $100 I would take that and do only high school so I am not dealing with all of the young child classroom stuff, and supervising bathrooms, and cafeteria which the elementary and middle school teachers are required to do. I love high school and the subject matter and can actually accomplish what is on the lesson plan so if the pay were a little better, it would be worth it for the flexibility of the job. I have benefits through dh's job and am trying to earn to help pay for college. With an elderly mother and mother in law who need me at their medical appointments, the ability to to control my schedule would be very nice. But I simply will not teach AP Physics or Algebra 2, sub for Marching band practice, etc. for $10 an hour. Even at $100 a day it is not decent pay, however for the flexibility I would consider it. I am sure that the lack of subs is due to the low pay, high responsibility ratio.

Edited by FaithManor, 15 September 2017 - 11:37 AM.

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#42 Diana P.

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 10:55 AM

Our local district pays $77 a day. Subs report at 7:30 am and cannot leave until 4 pm after writing their reports for the classroom teacher they subbed for but no extra pay if it takes longer than that to write the reports. That is 7.5 hours or essentially $10 an hour. It is a lot of responsibility and bureaucratic nonsense to deal with for that level of pay. On top of which subs must have an associate's degree or sixty hours of college classes within certain subject matter categories to get the out of profession subbing license and pay for their own background checks and fingerprinting with this district. People with that much college can usually do better than $10 an hour especially if they are willing to drive more than fifteen or twenty miles to the job. So they cannot attract people to the job.

In the Battle Creek/Kalamazoo area there are billboards along I 94 advertising for subs which if the state is paying for ads, tells me they are rather desperate for subs.

I will not work for the local district for $77 but if they offered $100 I would take that and do only high school so I am not dealing with all of the young child classroom stuff, and supervising bathrooms, and cafeteria which the elementary and middle school teachers are required to do. I love high school and the subject matter and can actually accomplish what is on the lesson plan so if the pay were a little better, it would be worth it for the flexibility of the job. I have benefits through dh's job and am trying to earn to help pay for college. With an elderly mother and mother in law who need me at their medical appointments, the cavity to to control my schedule would be very nice. But I simply will not teach AP Physics or Algebra 2, sub for Marching band practice, etc. for $10 an hour. Even at $100 a day it is not decent pay, however for the flexibility I would consider it. I am sure that the lack of subs is due to the low pay, high responsibility ratio.


7:30 am to 4pm is 8.5 hours, not 7.5. Do they get an hour off for be lunch.

#43 creekland

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 11:06 AM

We get half an hour (more like 25 minutes) for lunch.  I was counting that as paid time in my breakdown earlier.

 

We also usually have a prep that lasts an hour +/- (pending duties).  If they are short subs, that gets pulled and we need to cover another teacher - no additional pay, but tons of "thanks" from the admin and teacher.  The admin here really appreciates good subs.



#44 transientChris

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 11:33 AM

Over here, the pay is 70/day.  I think that probably works out to 10/hour.  I had considered that a few years ago before I saw what the wages are.  Too low for the trouble and now I have even stopped volunteer tutoring at school because I was getting ill too often including a serious bout with pneumonia.  I have noticed I don't get sick very often and would get sick even less if my own adult children didn't sometimes bring the illnesses to me.



#45 FaithManor

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 11:40 AM

7:30 am to 4pm is 8.5 hours, not 7.5. Do they get an hour off for be lunch.

Some do, some don't. It depends on the building and class schedule. The high school teachers are tight, but the elementary kids have PE, music, and art after the half hour lunch and go to different rooms for that. So they would have a break.

#46 Diana P.

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 11:46 AM

Some do, some don't. It depends on the building and class schedule. The high school teachers are tight, but the elementary kids have PE, music, and art after the half hour lunch and go to different rooms for that. So they would have a break.


I noted the time because you said it was a 7.5 day.

8.5 hours of contract time is long even with lunch break. Subs here are only expected during contract time (7.5 hours I think).

Side note : I don't know any teacher who only works 7.5 hours a day. Those are just the hours in the contract.
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#47 foxbridgeacademy

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 03:16 PM

I'm paid $80/day (non certified teacher with a bachelor's) or $100/day if it's a long term sub job (more than 10 days.) My teen dd works at Chipotle and earns more/hour than I do.

I "liked" your post, not because I like it but because subs make $70/per day in my area and the local Mc-Donald's pays almost $10 for day shift.  



#48 QueenCat

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 04:21 PM

I subbed up until late August. Now I'm a permanent teacher. Schools definitely have a hard time getting good subs here. They hate it when they have to go with an "unknown" as they don't know what will happen (chaos, sub not following plans, etc).



#49 Melissa in Australia

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 04:29 PM

I sub primary school here in Aus. I earn take home of $260 day
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#50 kiwik

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 04:36 PM

If they only pay $80 a day I am not surprised. Once exchange rate is taken into account that less than $120 US which for 8 hours is less than our minimum wage. In a very low COL area it might be OK as long as you had no childcare costs but it is not much considering the responsibility.